Sean Hannity and Oliver North Head Military Charity Mired In Scandal

[edthecynic]

The legal effect of a reversal of a conviction is to vacate that conviction. It becomes void. A nullity. At the instant that happens, the person is restored to his status quo ante: i.e., he once again is presumed innocent in the eyes of the law.

This isn't a controversial notion, either. It is ancient stuff. Edthesickdick is simply too vastly ignorant to grasp it.

After a conviction, a person can often be sent back to the trial court for RE-trial. That wouldn't happen if he was already deemed "convicted." A conviction erases the presumption of innocence. But upon a re-trial, the accused once again HAS the presumption. Why? Because he has been RETURNED to the status he had prior to the previous trial.

Edthesickdick cannot be tracking this part of the discussion. It is wrecking his universe.

Of course, sometimes the case cannot be sent back for a retrial. Sometimes, the basis for the reversal was an error that had permitted invalidly obtained evidence to be used, for example. And if the government cannot prosecute the accused without that evidence, and it has just been ruled to be inadmissible, then the government will be unable to try the defendant. Oops. IF he has a presumption of innocence and cannot be tried ever again, then nothing can remove that presumption of innocence and that means -- he not only has no criminal conviction, but can never be convicted. His presumption of innocence in the eyes of the law will be inviolate forever.

Felons cannot run for office (although they can petition to have their rights restored in some cases) in Virginia. After his conviction got reversed, Ollie did run for the U.S. Senate. He lost the race. But he was legally allowed to run. Edthesickdick will be unable to appreciate the import of that historical fact.

Traitor North's conviction was DISMISSED not because he was innocent, but because he was IMMUNIZED. He could not be retried because he was IMMUNIZED. His conviction was DISMISSED, not reversed.
If Traitor North gave up his IMMUNITY he could have been tried and convicted yet again.

wrong dipshit
it was VACATED

look it up you fucking idiot

It was DISMISSED,

Why don't YOU look it up.

The conviction was vacated FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS!!!!!
The conviction could have still stood up after the Appeals Court decision if Walsh could then prove in court that none of the witnesses who testified before the grand jury at Traitor North's trial were influenced by his IMMUNIZED testimony. Walsh tried to do this, but Traitor North's co conspirator Robert McFarlane, who was Traitor North's boss as the national security adviser at the White House, covered North's traitorous ass by then testifying in the review of the trial record that watching Traitor North before the committees affected his trial testimony. Judge Gerhard Gesell then had no option but to dismiss the conviction. Traitor North was IMMUNE, not innocent!!!!!

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Summary of Prosecutions
Oliver L. North -- Indicted March 16, 1988, on 16 felony counts. After standing trial on 12, North was convicted May 4, 1989 of three charges: accepting an illegal gratuity, aiding and abetting in the obstruction of a congressional inquiry, and destruction of documents. He was sentenced by U.S. District Judge Gerhard A. Gesell on July 5, 1989, to a three-year suspended prison term, two years probation, $150,000 in fines and 1,200 hours community service. A three-judge appeals panel on July 20, 1990, vacated North's conviction for further proceedings to determine whether his immunized testimony influenced witnesses in the trial. The Supreme Court declined to review the case. Judge Gesell dismissed the case September 16, 1991, after hearings on the immunity issue, on the motion of Independent Counsel.

 

[DiveCon]

Traitor North's conviction was DISMISSED not because he was innocent, but because he was IMMUNIZED. He could not be retried because he was IMMUNIZED. His conviction was DISMISSED, not reversed.
If Traitor North gave up his IMMUNITY he could have been tried and convicted yet again.

wrong dipshit
it was VACATED

look it up you fucking idiot

It was DISMISSED,

Why don't YOU look it up.

The conviction was vacated FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS!!!!!
The conviction could have still stood up after the Appeals Court decision if Walsh could then prove in court that none of the witnesses who testified before the grand jury at Traitor North's trial were influenced by his IMMUNIZED testimony. Walsh tried to do this, but Traitor North's co conspirator Robert McFarlane, who was Traitor North's boss as the national security adviser at the White House, covered North's traitorous ass by then testifying in the review of the trial record that watching Traitor North before the committees affected his trial testimony. Judge Gerhard Gesell then had no option but to dismiss the conviction. Traitor North was IMMUNE, not innocent!!!!!

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Summary of Prosecutions
Oliver L. North -- Indicted March 16, 1988, on 16 felony counts. After standing trial on 12, North was convicted May 4, 1989 of three charges: accepting an illegal gratuity, aiding and abetting in the obstruction of a congressional inquiry, and destruction of documents. He was sentenced by U.S. District Judge Gerhard A. Gesell on July 5, 1989, to a three-year suspended prison term, two years probation, $150,000 in fines and 1,200 hours community service. A three-judge appeals panel on July 20, 1990,vacated North's conviction for further proceedings to determine whether his immunized testimony influenced witnesses in the trial. The Supreme Court declined to review the case. Judge Gesell dismissed the case September 16, 1991, after hearings on the immunity issue, on the motion of Independent Counsel.

the fuck it was, asshole

you fucking idiot, you even highlighted it and got it WRONG

 

[edthecynic]

wrong dipshit
it was VACATED

look it up you fucking idiot

It was DISMISSED,

Why don't YOU look it up.

The conviction was vacated FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS!!!!!
The conviction could have still stood up after the Appeals Court decision if Walsh could then prove in court that none of the witnesses who testified before the grand jury at Traitor North's trial were influenced by his IMMUNIZED testimony. Walsh tried to do this, but Traitor North's co conspirator Robert McFarlane, who was Traitor North's boss as the national security adviser at the White House, covered North's traitorous ass by then testifying in the review of the trial record that watching Traitor North before the committees affected his trial testimony. Judge Gerhard Gesell then had no option but to dismiss the conviction. Traitor North was IMMUNE, not innocent!!!!!

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Summary of Prosecutions
Oliver L. North -- Indicted March 16, 1988, on 16 felony counts. After standing trial on 12, North was convicted May 4, 1989 of three charges: accepting an illegal gratuity, aiding and abetting in the obstruction of a congressional inquiry, and destruction of documents. He was sentenced by U.S. District Judge Gerhard A. Gesell on July 5, 1989, to a three-year suspended prison term, two years probation, $150,000 in fines and 1,200 hours community service. A three-judge appeals panel on July 20, 1990,vacated North's conviction for further proceedings to determine whether his immunized testimony influenced witnesses in the trial. The Supreme Court declined to review the case. Judge Gesell dismissed the case September 16, 1991, after hearings on the immunity issue, on the motion of Independent Counsel.

the fuck it was, asshole

you fucking idiot, you even highlighted it and got it WRONG

Even after capitalizing it in one place and underlining it in another you STILL got it WRONG.

 

[DiveCon]

It was DISMISSED,

Why don't YOU look it up.

The conviction was vacated FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS!!!!!
The conviction could have still stood up after the Appeals Court decision if Walsh could then prove in court that none of the witnesses who testified before the grand jury at Traitor North's trial were influenced by his IMMUNIZED testimony. Walsh tried to do this, but Traitor North's co conspirator Robert McFarlane, who was Traitor North's boss as the national security adviser at the White House, covered North's traitorous ass by then testifying in the review of the trial record that watching Traitor North before the committees affected his trial testimony. Judge Gerhard Gesell then had no option but to dismiss the conviction. Traitor North was IMMUNE, not innocent!!!!!

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Summary of Prosecutions
Oliver L. North -- Indicted March 16, 1988, on 16 felony counts. After standing trial on 12, North was convicted May 4, 1989 of three charges: accepting an illegal gratuity, aiding and abetting in the obstruction of a congressional inquiry, and destruction of documents. He was sentenced by U.S. District Judge Gerhard A. Gesell on July 5, 1989, to a three-year suspended prison term, two years probation, $150,000 in fines and 1,200 hours community service. A three-judge appeals panel on July 20, 1990,vacated North's conviction for further proceedings to determine whether his immunized testimony influenced witnesses in the trial. The Supreme Court declined to review the case. Judge Gesell dismissed the case September 16, 1991, after hearings on the immunity issue, on the motion of Independent Counsel.

the fuck it was, asshole

you fucking idiot, you even highlighted it and got it WRONG

Even after capitalizing it in one place and underlining it in another you STILL got it WRONG.

thats not talking about the conviction you fucking moron
that was talking about if he could be TRIED AGAIN
you are a complete fucking moronic idiot

 

[edthecynic]

the fuck it was, asshole

you fucking idiot, you even highlighted it and got it WRONG

Even after capitalizing it in one place and underlining it in another you STILL got it WRONG.

thats not talking about the conviction you fucking moron
that was talking about if he could be TRIED AGAIN
you are a complete fucking moronic idiot

No it wasn't!!!! It had NOTHING to do with a retrial!!!! It was all about what constituted IMMUNIZED TESTIMONY!!!!! If co conspirator McFarlane didn't cover Traitor North's lying ass, the convictions would have stood.

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Chapter 2 United States v. Oliver L. North
The North Appeal

North appealed his convictions on all three counts on a variety of grounds. North's most serious appeals issues related to Judge Gesell's application of the Kastigar decision in keeping North's trial free of taint from his immunized congressional testimony and the application of the Classified Information Procedures Act during the trial.
The appeals were argued at the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit on February 6, 1990. The court ruled on July 20, 1990.
By a 2-1 vote, the Appeals Court set aside North's convictions. The divided court ruled that Judge Gesell erred in failing to hold a full hearing as required by Kastigar to ensure that the prosecution witnesses made no use of North's immunized congressional testimony.


The Court of Appeals disagreed sharply with the Independent Counsel and Judge Gesell's definition of ``use'' under the federal use-immunity statute. The Court of Appeals determined that the statute, as interpreted in Kastigar, prevented ``evidentiary'' uses of immunized testimony including ``the use of immunized testimony by witnesses to refresh their memories, or otherwise to focus their thoughts, organize their testimony, or alter their prior or contemporaneous statements. . . .'' The court observed that Judge Gesell never inquired into these uses of immunized testimony, and it held that warnings to witnesses not to testify to anything they did not know or recall first-hand did not insure against such uses.

The Court of Appeals did not reject Judge Gesell's Kastigar rulings in their entirety. The court upheld his determination that Independent Counsel did not present any of North's immunized testimony to the Grand Jury or trial jury. The court also affirmed the District Court's holdings that Independent Counsel did not use the immunized testimony to guide its prosecutorial or trial decisions, and that Independent Counsel had proven untainted leads to all of its witnesses.
Nevertheless, the court remanded all three convictions to the District Court for a ``witness-by-witness [and,] if necessary . . . line-by-line and item by item'' inquiry into the content as well as the sources of grand jury and trial witness testimony.

Independent Counsel decided to return for additional Kastigar hearings in Judge Gesell's court, as prescribed by the Court of Appeals. In two days of remand hearings, McFarlane testified that his trial testimony was ``colored'' by, and that he was deeply affected by, North's immunized congressional testimony.

 

[DiveCon]

Even after capitalizing it in one place and underlining it in another you STILL got it WRONG.

thats not talking about the conviction you fucking moron
that was talking about if he could be TRIED AGAIN
you are a complete fucking moronic idiot

No it wasn't!!!! It had NOTHING to do with a retrial!!!! It was all about what constituted IMMUNIZED TESTIMONY!!!!! If co conspirator McFarlane didn't cover Traitor North's lying ass, the convictions would have stood.

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Chapter 2 United States v. Oliver L. North
The North Appeal

North appealed his convictions on all three counts on a variety of grounds. North's most serious appeals issues related to Judge Gesell's application of the Kastigar decision in keeping North's trial free of taint from his immunized congressional testimony and the application of the Classified Information Procedures Act during the trial.
The appeals were argued at the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit on February 6, 1990. The court ruled on July 20, 1990.
By a 2-1 vote, the Appeals Court set aside North's convictions. The divided court ruled that Judge Gesell erred in failing to hold a full hearing as required by Kastigar to ensure that the prosecution witnesses made no use of North's immunized congressional testimony.


The Court of Appeals disagreed sharply with the Independent Counsel and Judge Gesell's definition of ``use'' under the federal use-immunity statute. The Court of Appeals determined that the statute, as interpreted in Kastigar, prevented ``evidentiary'' uses of immunized testimony including ``the use of immunized testimony by witnesses to refresh their memories, or otherwise to focus their thoughts, organize their testimony, or alter their prior or contemporaneous statements. . . .'' The court observed that Judge Gesell never inquired into these uses of immunized testimony, and it held that warnings to witnesses not to testify to anything they did not know or recall first-hand did not insure against such uses.

The Court of Appeals did not reject Judge Gesell's Kastigar rulings in their entirety. The court upheld his determination that Independent Counsel did not present any of North's immunized testimony to the Grand Jury or trial jury. The court also affirmed the District Court's holdings that Independent Counsel did not use the immunized testimony to guide its prosecutorial or trial decisions, and that Independent Counsel had proven untainted leads to all of its witnesses.
Nevertheless, the court remanded all three convictions to the District Court for a ``witness-by-witness [and,] if necessary . . . line-by-line and item by item'' inquiry into the content as well as the sources of grand jury and trial witness testimony.

Independent Counsel decided to return for additional Kastigar hearings in Judge Gesell's court, as prescribed by the Court of Appeals. In two days of remand hearings, McFarlane testified that his trial testimony was ``colored'' by, and that he was deeply affected by, North's immunized congressional testimony.

no shit, dipshit
but North's conviction were VACATED
just as i said, not overturned

 

[DiveCon]

and once again all you fucking do is copy and paste and dont have a fucking clue what you are actually talking about

 

[GWV5903]

When conservative commentators begin eating their own, you know that something is up.

Debbie Schlussel is a reasonably well-known conservative commentator with a large radio and online following. While I have always found her to be over the top – particularly with her anti-Muslim rhetoric – she certainly has the respect of the conservative community. So when she broke a story a few days ago accusing Sean Hannity’s charity of being a ‘scam’, this naturally got my attention.

Schlussel claims that the Freedom Concerts conducted by Hannity and the Freedom Alliance (whose chairman is Oliver North) have been an unconscionable con. The concerts are supposed to be raising money to pay college tuition for the children of soldiers who have died in our foreign wars and to provide needed funds to help out soldiers severely injured in battle. Clearly, a noble goal and a charity well worth helping out.

Or is it?

Check out what Schlussel has discovered in researching the organization for the past year-

But it’s all a huge scam.

In fact, less than 20%–and in two recent years, less than 7% and 4%, respectively–of the money raised by Freedom Alliance went to these causes, while millions of dollars went to expenses, including consultants and apparently to ferry the Hannity posse of family and friends in high style. And, despite Hannity’s statements to the contrary on his nationally syndicated radio show, few of the children of fallen soldiers got more than $1,000-$2,000, with apparently none getting more than $6,000, while Freedom Alliance appears to have spent tens of thousands of dollars for private planes. Moreover, despite written assurances to donors that all money raised would go directly to scholarships for kids of the fallen heroes and not to expenses, has begun charging expenses of nearly $500,000 to give out just over $800,000 in scholarships.

Via debbieschlussel.com

Sean Hannity in serious military charity scandal - Rick Ungar - The Policy Page - True/Slant

Oliver North involved in something shady? Who could have predicted that?

Maddie, you need to dig a little deeper, it's not that hard...

There is no evidence of any impropriety on Hannity (BTW he has been exonerated on the expenses, he pays his own way) or on North....

Charity Navigator shows 2008 assets in excess of $19MILL, not to shabby at all....

This is pure partisan hyperbole, I learned a long time ago, whats important is to give, it's not for me to judge what they do with it, God knows my heart, the rest will take care of itself...

 

[edthecynic]

thats not talking about the conviction you fucking moron
that was talking about if he could be TRIED AGAIN
you are a complete fucking moronic idiot

No it wasn't!!!! It had NOTHING to do with a retrial!!!! It was all about what constituted IMMUNIZED TESTIMONY!!!!! If co conspirator McFarlane didn't cover Traitor North's lying ass, the convictions would have stood.

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Chapter 2 United States v. Oliver L. North
The North Appeal

North appealed his convictions on all three counts on a variety of grounds. North's most serious appeals issues related to Judge Gesell's application of the Kastigar decision in keeping North's trial free of taint from his immunized congressional testimony and the application of the Classified Information Procedures Act during the trial.
The appeals were argued at the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit on February 6, 1990. The court ruled on July 20, 1990.
By a 2-1 vote, the Appeals Court set aside North's convictions. The divided court ruled that Judge Gesell erred in failing to hold a full hearing as required by Kastigar to ensure that the prosecution witnesses made no use of North's immunized congressional testimony.


The Court of Appeals disagreed sharply with the Independent Counsel and Judge Gesell's definition of ``use'' under the federal use-immunity statute. The Court of Appeals determined that the statute, as interpreted in Kastigar, prevented ``evidentiary'' uses of immunized testimony including ``the use of immunized testimony by witnesses to refresh their memories, or otherwise to focus their thoughts, organize their testimony, or alter their prior or contemporaneous statements. . . .'' The court observed that Judge Gesell never inquired into these uses of immunized testimony, and it held that warnings to witnesses not to testify to anything they did not know or recall first-hand did not insure against such uses.

The Court of Appeals did not reject Judge Gesell's Kastigar rulings in their entirety. The court upheld his determination that Independent Counsel did not present any of North's immunized testimony to the Grand Jury or trial jury. The court also affirmed the District Court's holdings that Independent Counsel did not use the immunized testimony to guide its prosecutorial or trial decisions, and that Independent Counsel had proven untainted leads to all of its witnesses.
Nevertheless, the court remanded all three convictions to the District Court for a ``witness-by-witness [and,] if necessary . . . line-by-line and item by item'' inquiry into the content as well as the sources of grand jury and trial witness testimony.

Independent Counsel decided to return for additional Kastigar hearings in Judge Gesell's court, as prescribed by the Court of Appeals. In two days of remand hearings, McFarlane testified that his trial testimony was ``colored'' by, and that he was deeply affected by, North's immunized congressional testimony.

no shit, dipshit
but North's conviction were VACATED
just as i said, not overturned

FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS.
In those further proceedings McFarlane claimed that North's IMMUNIZED testimony refreshed his memory and the case was DISMISSED over the IMMUNITY issue, not because North was innocent. There was enough evidence to convict the felon North, but he was found to be IMMUNE.

 

[DiveCon]

No it wasn't!!!! It had NOTHING to do with a retrial!!!! It was all about what constituted IMMUNIZED TESTIMONY!!!!! If co conspirator McFarlane didn't cover Traitor North's lying ass, the convictions would have stood.

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Chapter 2 United States v. Oliver L. North
The North Appeal

North appealed his convictions on all three counts on a variety of grounds. North's most serious appeals issues related to Judge Gesell's application of the Kastigar decision in keeping North's trial free of taint from his immunized congressional testimony and the application of the Classified Information Procedures Act during the trial.
The appeals were argued at the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit on February 6, 1990. The court ruled on July 20, 1990.
By a 2-1 vote, the Appeals Court set aside North's convictions. The divided court ruled that Judge Gesell erred in failing to hold a full hearing as required by Kastigar to ensure that the prosecution witnesses made no use of North's immunized congressional testimony.


The Court of Appeals disagreed sharply with the Independent Counsel and Judge Gesell's definition of ``use'' under the federal use-immunity statute. The Court of Appeals determined that the statute, as interpreted in Kastigar, prevented ``evidentiary'' uses of immunized testimony including ``the use of immunized testimony by witnesses to refresh their memories, or otherwise to focus their thoughts, organize their testimony, or alter their prior or contemporaneous statements. . . .'' The court observed that Judge Gesell never inquired into these uses of immunized testimony, and it held that warnings to witnesses not to testify to anything they did not know or recall first-hand did not insure against such uses.

The Court of Appeals did not reject Judge Gesell's Kastigar rulings in their entirety. The court upheld his determination that Independent Counsel did not present any of North's immunized testimony to the Grand Jury or trial jury. The court also affirmed the District Court's holdings that Independent Counsel did not use the immunized testimony to guide its prosecutorial or trial decisions, and that Independent Counsel had proven untainted leads to all of its witnesses.
Nevertheless, the court remanded all three convictions to the District Court for a ``witness-by-witness [and,] if necessary . . . line-by-line and item by item'' inquiry into the content as well as the sources of grand jury and trial witness testimony.

Independent Counsel decided to return for additional Kastigar hearings in Judge Gesell's court, as prescribed by the Court of Appeals. In two days of remand hearings, McFarlane testified that his trial testimony was ``colored'' by, and that he was deeply affected by, North's immunized congressional testimony.

no shit, dipshit
but North's conviction were VACATED
just as i said, not overturned

FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS.
In those further proceedings McFarlane claimed that North's IMMUNIZED testimony refreshed his memory and the case was DISMISSED over the IMMUNITY issue, not because North was innocent. There was enough evidence to convict the felon North, but he was found to be IMMUNE.

no shit moron
VACATED MEANS VACATED
dipshit
then the case to see if they could RETRY was dismissed
thus there were NO CONVICTIONS

damn you are fucking PIGHEADED and WRONG
"

 

[edthecynic]

no shit, dipshit
but North's conviction were VACATED
just as i said, not overturned

FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS.
In those further proceedings McFarlane claimed that North's IMMUNIZED testimony refreshed his memory and the case was DISMISSED over the IMMUNITY issue, not because North was innocent. There was enough evidence to convict the felon North, but he was found to be IMMUNE.

no shit moron
VACATED MEANS VACATED
dipshit
then the case to see if they could RETRY was dismissed
thus there were NO CONVICTIONS

damn you are fucking PIGHEADED and WRONG
"

THERE WAS NO CASE TO RETRY!!!!!
They held a KASTIGAR hearing to determine if any IMMUNIZED testimony tainted the trial. If it would have been decided in the KASTIGAR hearing that no immunized testimony tainted the trial, then the conviction would have stood. But McFarlane covered North's ass and the ORIGINAL case was DISMISSED.

One more time:

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Chapter 2 United States v. Oliver L. North
The North Appeal

North appealed his convictions on all three counts on a variety of grounds. North's most serious appeals issues related to Judge Gesell's application of the Kastigar decision in keeping North's trial free of taint from his immunized congressional testimony and the application of the Classified Information Procedures Act during the trial.
The appeals were argued at the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit on February 6, 1990. The court ruled on July 20, 1990.
By a 2-1 vote, the Appeals Court set aside North's convictions. The divided court ruled that Judge Gesell erred in failing to hold a full hearing as required by Kastigar to ensure that the prosecution witnesses made no use of North's immunized congressional testimony.


The Court of Appeals disagreed sharply with the Independent Counsel and Judge Gesell's definition of ``use'' under the federal use-immunity statute. The Court of Appeals determined that the statute, as interpreted in Kastigar, prevented ``evidentiary'' uses of immunized testimony including ``the use of immunized testimony by witnesses to refresh their memories, or otherwise to focus their thoughts, organize their testimony, or alter their prior or contemporaneous statements. . . .'' The court observed that Judge Gesell never inquired into these uses of immunized testimony, and it held that warnings to witnesses not to testify to anything they did not know or recall first-hand did not insure against such uses.

The Court of Appeals did not reject Judge Gesell's Kastigar rulings in their entirety. The court upheld his determination that Independent Counsel did not present any of North's immunized testimony to the Grand Jury or trial jury. The court also affirmed the District Court's holdings that Independent Counsel did not use the immunized testimony to guide its prosecutorial or trial decisions, and that Independent Counsel had proven untainted leads to all of its witnesses.
Nevertheless, the court remanded all three convictions to the District Court for a ``witness-by-witness [and,] if necessary . . . line-by-line and item by item'' inquiry into the content as well as the sources of grand jury and trial witness testimony.

Independent Counsel decided to return for additional Kastigar hearings in Judge Gesell's court, as prescribed by the Court of Appeals. In two days of remand hearings, McFarlane testified that his trial testimony was ``colored'' by, and that he was deeply affected by, North's immunized congressional testimony.

 

[DiveCon]

holy shit
what the fuck are you actually arguing now?
i said the conviction were VACATED
i was right, and you even proved that
you are so fucking dense its unfuckingbelievable

 

[DiveCon]

in other words, you fucking pedantic moron, Oliver North remains and UNCONVICTED person

 

[edthecynic]

in other words, you fucking pedantic moron, Oliver North remains and UNCONVICTED person

No, Traitor North remains CONVICTED but IMMUNE.

 

[DiveCon]

in other words, you fucking pedantic moron, Oliver North remains and UNCONVICTED person

No, Traitor North remains CONVICTED but IMMUNE.

look up what it means to have a conviction vacated, moron
you remain WRONG

 

[DiveCon]

here, you fucking moron

Vacate Law & Legal Definition

 

[edthecynic]

here, you fucking moron

Vacate Law & Legal Definition

Vacate is a term subject to different meanings. In the context of a court order or decision, vacate means to overrule or void. A decision may be vacated for error, however, the error must be significant enough that it affected the outcome. Vacating a conviction for a crime sometimes refers to when a court determines you have met certain conditions and orders the conviction removed from your criminal history record.

The 3 judge panel said that the conviction was vacated FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS. They overrule you!

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Summary of Prosecutions
Oliver L. North -- Indicted March 16, 1988, on 16 felony counts. After standing trial on 12, North was convicted May 4, 1989 of three charges: accepting an illegal gratuity, aiding and abetting in the obstruction of a congressional inquiry, and destruction of documents. He was sentenced by U.S. District Judge Gerhard A. Gesell on July 5, 1989, to a three-year suspended prison term, two years probation, $150,000 in fines and 1,200 hours community service. A three-judge appeals panel on July 20, 1990,vacated North's conviction for further proceedings to determine whether his immunized testimony influenced witnesses in the trial. The Supreme Court declined to review the case. Judge Gesell dismissed the case September 16, 1991, after hearings on the immunity issue, on the motion of Independent Counsel.

 

[Liability]

these werent just reversed, they were vacated, maybe you can explain the difference to edthemoron in words he might understand

The legal effect of a reversal of a conviction is to vacate that conviction. It becomes void. A nullity. At the instant that happens, the person is restored to his status quo ante: i.e., he once again is presumed innocent in the eyes of the law.

This isn't a controversial notion, either. It is ancient stuff. Edthesickdick is simply too vastly ignorant to grasp it.

After a conviction, a person can often be sent back to the trial court for RE-trial. That wouldn't happen if he was already deemed "convicted." A conviction erases the presumption of innocence. But upon a re-trial, the accused once again HAS the presumption. Why? Because he has been RETURNED to the status he had prior to the previous trial.

Edthesickdick cannot be tracking this part of the discussion. It is wrecking his universe.

Of course, sometimes the case cannot be sent back for a retrial. Sometimes, the basis for the reversal was an error that had permitted invalidly obtained evidence to be used, for example. And if the government cannot prosecute the accused without that evidence, and it has just been ruled to be inadmissible, then the government will be unable to try the defendant. Oops. IF he has a presumption of innocence and cannot be tried ever again, then nothing can remove that presumption of innocence and that means -- he not only has no criminal conviction, but can never be convicted. His presumption of innocence in the eyes of the law will be inviolate forever.

Felons cannot run for office (although they can petition to have their rights restored in some cases) in Virginia. After his conviction got reversed, Ollie did run for the U.S. Senate. He lost the race. But he was legally allowed to run. Edthesickdick will be unable to appreciate the import of that historical fact.

Traitor North's conviction was DISMISSED not because he was innocent, but because he was IMMUNIZED. He could not be retried because he was IMMUNIZED. His conviction was DISMISSED, not reversed.
If Traitor North gave up his IMMUNITY he could have been tried and convicted yet again.

Col. North's conviction was reversed. Vacated. Made void. The prosecution elected not to try again and dismissed the case. Col. North's presumption of innocence remains inviolate forever as a consequence.

He wasn't even CHARGED with being a "traitor," you imbecile. And what he did wasn't traitorous, either, in any event.

In short, as is so frequently the case with you and your sub-imbecile postings, you are entirely wrong in all regards yet again, edthesickdick.

 

[Liability]

here, you fucking moron

Vacate Law & Legal Definition

Vacate is a term subject to different meanings. In the context of a court order or decision, vacate means to overrule or void. A decision may be vacated for error, however, the error must be significant enough that it affected the outcome. Vacating a conviction for a crime sometimes refers to when a court determines you have met certain conditions and orders the conviction removed from your criminal history record.

The 3 judge panel said that the conviction was vacated FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS. They overrule you!

Walsh Iran / Contra Report - Summary of Prosecutions
Oliver L. North -- Indicted March 16, 1988, on 16 felony counts. After standing trial on 12, North was convicted May 4, 1989 of three charges: accepting an illegal gratuity, aiding and abetting in the obstruction of a congressional inquiry, and destruction of documents. He was sentenced by U.S. District Judge Gerhard A. Gesell on July 5, 1989, to a three-year suspended prison term, two years probation, $150,000 in fines and 1,200 hours community service. A three-judge appeals panel on July 20, 1990,vacated North's conviction for further proceedings to determine whether his immunized testimony influenced witnesses in the trial. The Supreme Court declined to review the case. Judge Gesell dismissed the case September 16, 1991, after hearings on the immunity issue, on the motion of Independent Counsel.

LOL.

It is frequently the case that a conviction reversed on appeal gets remanded back to the trial court for further procxeedings. Indictments can be refiled. A reversal -- standing alone -- doesn't bar re-prosecution.

In Col. North's case, the matter WAS sent back for further proceedings to determine whether or not the immunized testimony could be adequately snipped from the prosecution's case. U.S. District Judge Gerhard A. Gesell determined that it was very problematic.

Judge Gesell dismissed the case September 16, 1991, after hearings on the immunity issue, on the motion of Independent Counsel.

-- Iran-Contra Affair Prosecutions, Convictions and Pardons - List of Prosecutions, Convictions and Pardons in Reagan's Iran-Contra Affair

When the case in which the conviction had been reversed (vacated) got sent back for further proceedings, in short, there WERE further proceedings and the ultimate determination was that the case got dismissed.

Presumption of innocence thus remains intact forever. Col. North has exactly ZERO criminal convictions on his record.

No matter how often you repeat your glaringly ignorant, arrogant and erroneous assertions, therefore, edthesickdick, the FACTS prove you wrong. It doesn't even matter what font type or size of color you use. The FACT that you are wrong stands, triumphantly, over this discussion.

 

[Liability]

Back in April of 2009, Col. North made sure he disseminated* THIS little piece authored by the United States Government:

http://www.fas.org/irp/eprint/rightwing.pdf

A disgusting tract. Shameful shit by the US Government. Of course, the crap, itself, SAYS the following:

(U) LAW ENFORCEMENT INFORMATION NOTICE: This product contains Law Enforcement Sensitive (LES) information. No portion of the LES information
should be released to the media, the general public, or over non-secure Internet servers. Release of this information could adversely affect or jeopardize
investigative activities.

(U) Warning: This document is UNCLASSIFIED//FOR OFFICIAL USE ONLY (U//FOUO). It contains information that may be exempt from public release under the
Freedom of Information Act (5 U.S.C. 552). It is to be controlled, stored, handled, transmitted, distributed, and disposed of in accordance with DHS policy relating to
FOUO information and is not to be released to the public, the media, or other personnel who do not have a valid need-to-know without prior approval of an authorized
DHS official. State and local homeland security officials may share this document with authorized security personnel without further approval from DHS.​

​

Col. North should be getting kudos from the left wing uber libs who love it whenever any of our classified materials (or other "secret" materials) get wide-spread public airing.

______________________
* See, I Am an Extremist - Page 1 - Oliver North - Townhall Conservative