CDZ Robert E. Lee is Not Our Heritage

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by midcan5, Aug 16, 2017.

  1. JoeMoma
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    JoeMoma Gold Member

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    Let see, it was 1969 and a war over the right for states had just been fought. 600,000 dead. Can you imagine the Supreme Court saying at this time... oh, never mind!

    For all practical matters, this issue was settled by the civil war.
     
  2. JimBowie1958
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    JimBowie1958 Old Fogey

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    Robert E Lee was fighting an entirely defensive war to stop a Northern invasion of their homes and towns. Stalin and Hitler launched offensive wars entirely unprovoked at Poland, Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Norway, Denmark, Belgium, Netherlands, Yugoslavia, Greece and more nations by the dozens.

    Lee was a general who led his men in battle. Stalin and Hitler were dictators who led from the safety and comfort of desks hundreds of miles from the conflicts that they began.

    Lee loved democracy and had respect for human rights. He despised slavery and wanted to be rid of his ownership but at the same time recognised that simply freeing unskilled human beings into an economy not set up for free black labor was not a responsible and humane thing to do. Stalin and Hitler believed that human beings have no intrinsic value and are simply assets of the state to be used as needed. Both men are responsible for ordering literally millions of innocent people to be murdered by their governments.

    Penelope, you are not only hysterical and ignorant about history, you have no sense of right and wrong.
     
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  3. Penelope
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    Penelope Gold Member

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    Don't make him out to be something he is not. Loved democracy and had respect for human rights, one did not need to own slaves, all the southern plantations needed to do was pay them as workers but they would dip into their bottom line , wouldn't it? Freedom does not mean they would not work, but they just would not be owned and could go and find a high paying plantation owner.

    No Stalin and Hitler wanted more land and most of their beefs were due to Jews. Wonder what would the US be like if the south had won, I hate to think of it.
     
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  4. hunarcy
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    hunarcy Gold Member

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    That sounds like the Taliban asking who was Buddha. Funny how these censor types all end up sounding the same.
     
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  5. hunarcy
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    hunarcy Gold Member

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    I don't remember where Lee executed millions of his own people in gulags and concentration camps. He WAS on the wrong side of the issue, but don't overstate things.
     
  6. Penelope
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    Penelope Gold Member

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    Millions died in the civil war, they didn't take prisoners. I take that back I guess they did.
    read about the POW's prison camps.
    American Civil War prison camps - Wikipedia
    Camp Sumter / Andersonville Prison - Andersonville National Historic Site (U.S. National Park Service)
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2017
  7. Picaro
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    Picaro Gold Member

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    We know what Lincoln's idea of 'freedom' for slaves was; his military governors ordered them to stay on the plantations and work ... for $3 a month, since they weren't 'slaves' but 'free'; he even set their 'free' wages for them, he was such a wonderful 'freedom fighter'. They also couldn't leave without written permission from the new plantation owners, Republican carpet baggers, of course, who bought them for pennies on the dollar. 'Freedom' for blacks according to Republicans didn't resemble 'freedom' by modern standards, or even contemporary ones. See also the draconian Black Codes passed in the Midwestern states after 1850, including the ones Lincoln advocated for Illinois as a pol there, making it impossible for blacks to immigrate into many of the states, or earn a legall living, and then there were the debtor laws applied against blacks that had them sentenced to forced labor. There were a lot of black slaves in the northern states, they just didn't call them slaves, is all; they called them 'criminals' and 'prisoners'...

    Those that did jump off the plantations and flee were herded into 'property camps', to keep them from fleeing into northern states; hundreds of thousands of them died from starvation and disease epidemics, as many as were killed in battle, maybe more.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2017
  8. Staidhup
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    Staidhup Gold Member Supporting Member

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    Time to move on, the Civil War was fought to purge the country of a stain which blanketed and tarnished the country. From the moment all men are created equal was adopted, the founding fathers turned a blind eye toward slavery, it was dictated, the time would come when this blight would be paid for with blood.
    Let us never forget!
     
  9. hunarcy
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    hunarcy Gold Member

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    The Civil War was fought to hold the union together. If that could have been accomplished without freeing slaves, they would not have been freed. If the preservation of the union could have been accomplished by freeing some, but not all slaves, that would have been done. I’m glad slavery was wiped out in the United States, but don’t over state the motivations of the Northerners.
     

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