- Moderator
- #41
Or everyone could just get out and start working.
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Or everyone could just get out and start working.
What product does Wall street produce?
Once the stock is sold by a corporation then all the money from there on out is just made by stock trades which produce nothing except more money for more stock trades.
So mostly Wall Street just produces more money to trade more stock and no real product.
Or everyone could just get out and start working.
What product does Wall street produce?
Once the stock is sold by a corporation then all the money from there on out is just made by stock trades which produce nothing except more money for more stock trades.
So mostly Wall Street just produces more money to trade more stock and no real product.
Instead of cutting the federal deficit, put more money into the pockets of average working families by expanding the Earned Income Tax Credit to include people earning up to $50,000 per year and reduce their income taxes to $0.
Exempt the first $20,000 from payroll taxes.
Pay 10% on incomes between $50,000 - $90,000/year.
Pay 20% on incomes between $90,000 - $120,000/year.
Pay 30% on incomes between $120,000 - $250,000/year
Make up the missing money by increasing the taxes on those responsible for causing our Great Recession:
"Make up the revenues by increasing taxes on incomes between $250,000 to $500,000 to 40 percent; between $500,000 and $5 million, to 50 percent; between $5 million and $15 million, to 60 percent; and anything over $15 million, to 70 percent.
"And raise the ceiling on the portion of income subject to payroll taxes to $500,000.
"Its called progressive taxation."
Robert Reich
Is your daily lead intake high enough to believe the US economy is still lousy because government's too big?If the richest 1% of Americans have increased their share of national income by 2% during the greatest economic downturn since the Great Depression, it is NOT because of "equal treatment by government."
Who gives a shit?? It is a free society (except less so because of the policies supported by your ilk)...
But you, and your ilk, call for equal treatment by government ONLY when it suits you, and you fully support unequal treatment, when it suits you.... I.E. selective equal treatment...
Go up your daily intake of lead by about .357... right thru the palate... you'll do the world a favor and increase the average IQ in your neighborhood
Are you that suicidal? (and stupid)
Maybe your ilk think cutting heating oil for low income Americans over the next five years will bring more freedom to big American companies sitting on almost $2 trillion in cash because there aren't enough customers to buy additional goods and services.
Shit like you should have been aborted thereby increasing the national IQ and the quality of debate on USMB.
Do you prefer a Dooh Nibor (Robin Hood backwards) mentality?Instead of cutting the federal deficit, put more money into the pockets of average working families by expanding the Earned Income Tax Credit to include people earning up to $50,000 per year and reduce their income taxes to $0.
Exempt the first $20,000 from payroll taxes.
Pay 10% on incomes between $50,000 - $90,000/year.
Pay 20% on incomes between $90,000 - $120,000/year.
Pay 30% on incomes between $120,000 - $250,000/year
Make up the missing money by increasing the taxes on those responsible for causing our Great Recession:
"Make up the revenues by increasing taxes on incomes between $250,000 to $500,000 to 40 percent; between $500,000 and $5 million, to 50 percent; between $5 million and $15 million, to 60 percent; and anything over $15 million, to 70 percent.
"And raise the ceiling on the portion of income subject to payroll taxes to $500,000.
"It’s called progressive taxation."
Robert Reich
Robin Hood mentality, take from the evil rich and give to the
poor downtrodden?
So why would anyone WANT to make more money, above $250,000?
No incentive for me.
I'll stay poor and let the OTHER rich guy pay my way to entitlements,
give a aways, and freebies.
You want fair?
Abolish the IRS first. Reduce the tax code to one page, flat
tax, done.
From Phil's Stock World:
"As this chart shows, the US is cranking out multimillionaires at a record pace with super-rich (more than $10M) households doubling in the past decade.
"What’s scary is that doubling the amount of people who have more than $10M per household (from 300K to 600K) means there’s $3,000,000,000,000 less available for the other 98% of the of the households as MONEY IS A COMMODITY and can only be possessed by one person OR another.
"Another 5M households gathered up $1M of wealth for another $5T and our nation’s 1,000 Billionaires added another Trillion desperately needed dollars to their household budgets to pay for, according to travel and liesure; Yacht Rentals, Villa Rentals, 'Experimental Excursions', Luxury Cruises, Vacation Home Rentals, Spa Services.. (and have you seen the price of Cristal these days?).
'The cost of the AVERAGE high net worth individual’s summer spending on these luxury items was $1.2M."
Before you claim the high net worth individual has the right to spend her money on any damn thing she pleases, consider the possibility she only has that much money because of campaign bribes paid to Republicans AND Democrats to write tax codes that benefit the richest 1% of Americans at the expense of everyone else.
The richest 1% of Americans have increased their share of national income by two percent during the last two years and you think I'm the one with my hand in your pocket?Is your daily lead intake high enough to believe the US economy is still lousy because government's too big?Who gives a shit?? It is a free society (except less so because of the policies supported by your ilk)...
But you, and your ilk, call for equal treatment by government ONLY when it suits you, and you fully support unequal treatment, when it suits you.... I.E. selective equal treatment...
Go up your daily intake of lead by about .357... right thru the palate... you'll do the world a favor and increase the average IQ in your neighborhood
Are you that suicidal? (and stupid)
Maybe your ilk think cutting heating oil for low income Americans over the next five years will bring more freedom to big American companies sitting on almost $2 trillion in cash because there aren't enough customers to buy additional goods and services.
Shit like you should have been aborted thereby increasing the national IQ and the quality of debate on USMB.
Maybe I'd like to keep my money in my own pocket?
Live like the rest of us, within your own means.
You stick your hand in my pocket you liberal shit, I'll cut it off.
Liberals need to get a job, make a living and stop taking handouts.
You want my resources, you will be met with gunfire.
Wall Street Produces InequityWhat product does Wall street produce?
Once the stock is sold by a corporation then all the money from there on out is just made by stock trades which produce nothing except more money for more stock trades.
So mostly Wall Street just produces more money to trade more stock and no real product.
"There is also the serious matter of equity.
"When people, who pay 6 percent to 8 percent in sales taxes on necessities every day, learn that there is zero sales tax on daily purchases of billions of shares, bonds and derivatives, they understandably get upset.
"It doesnt matter whether they are conservatives or liberals, or whether it is during normal years on Wall Street or the recent massive collapse and bailout.
"If anything, the political climate for a financial transactions tax has never been better.
"It is time for a robust public initiative to replace the stagnant taboos now plaguing Congress and the White House.
(Ralph Nader is the founder of Public Citizen and author of the book Only the Super-Rich Can Save Us! The opinions expressed are his own.)"
Instead of cutting the federal deficit, put more money into the pockets of average working families by expanding the Earned Income Tax Credit to include people earning up to $50,000 per year and reduce their income taxes to $0.
Exempt the first $20,000 from payroll taxes.
Pay 10% on incomes between $50,000 - $90,000/year.
Pay 20% on incomes between $90,000 - $120,000/year.
Pay 30% on incomes between $120,000 - $250,000/year
Make up the missing money by increasing the taxes on those responsible for causing our Great Recession:
"Make up the revenues by increasing taxes on incomes between $250,000 to $500,000 to 40 percent; between $500,000 and $5 million, to 50 percent; between $5 million and $15 million, to 60 percent; and anything over $15 million, to 70 percent.
"And raise the ceiling on the portion of income subject to payroll taxes to $500,000.
"Its called progressive taxation."
Robert Reich
What if government and Wall Street have no intention of allowing Main Street revival? What if it's in the class interest of those who fund 90% of Republican AND Democrat election campaigns to continue widening the class divide in America.I'd prefer to let Main Street revive itself by the government Getting The Hell Out Of The Way via lower taxes for everyone, less onerous regulation, and much much much lower government spending.
IOW, I'd prefer to implement F.A. Hayek's Top 10 Dos and Don'ts in a Recession.
1. Recessions are bound to happen: Shifts between periods of economic growth and periods of stagnation or decline are a necessary and unavoidable part of a free-market monetary economy. Downturns are not aberrations but rather painful and necessary medicine for restoring equilibrium to the economy.
2. A stimulus will only stimulate the deficit: Past experience with trying to fine-tune the economy shows that counter-cyclical fiscal and monetary policy can sometimes make matters much worse (as in the 1970s). Wise politicians would therefore be advised not to meddle, however much their instincts tell them to show voters theyre doing something.
3. Pure laissez-faire doesnt work either: Some regulation is necessary for individuals to carry out their plans and for the market to function. Hayek therefore endorsed general rules, equally applicable to all people and intended to be permanent (even if subject to revision with the growth of knowledge), which provides an institutional framework within which the decisions as to what to do and how to earn a living are left up to the individuals.
4. Central planning and excessive regulation sure as hell dont work: The desire to plan and to subject the economy to the rule of experts endangers liberty. As Hayek succinctly noted: the more the state plans, the more difficult planning becomes for the individual.
5. The economy is too complex for precise forecasting: As Yogi Berra could have said: I hate making economic predictions. Especially about the future. Its not that we dont know anything, but rather that what we do know reveals the limits of our knowledge, and consequently, of our ability to plan and forecast.
6. Remember the rule of unintended consequences: History shows that when trying to realize certain endsparticularly when their achievement involves interfering with the workings of the price mechanismall sorts of pernicious effects will occur that were not part of the original plan.
7. You wont believe how much youll learn in Econ 101: While Hayek repeatedly pointed to the limitations inherent in a discipline that deals with a complex system like the economy, the basic principles of economicsscarcity, supply and demand, division of labor, etc.can explain a lot about the world and, more importantly, help rule out certain inappropriate policy responses (e.g. price ceilings).
8. Leave social justice out of it: Free markets necessarily lead to an unequal distribution of wealth and, just as inevitably, fuel calls for egalitarian social justice. Hayek viewed such cries as misguidedjustice has nothing to do with an impersonal market processand dangerousredistributive schemes presume that we possess knowledge that we in fact can never possess (see #5).
9. Nothing beats the free market: Hayek admitted that if we had more knowledge we could do a lot more to improve the world through planning and regulation. But we dont, and in the world of dispersed knowledge we live in, much of the knowledge we actually do possess is due to the workings of the market mechanism.
10. As a rule of thumb, government cures are not only worse than the disease, but lead to further disease: When you consider that bureaucrats have an incentive to maximize bureaucracy, that politicians who seek reelectionand which ones dont?have an incentive to increase spending and decrease taxes, and that corporations have an incentive to squeeze out the competition through government conferred advantages, youll conclude that the free market remains our best option (see #9).
Hayek
Are you encouraging voters to reject ALL Republican AND Democratic candidates in 2012?And do what with the proceeds?
Redistribute them? To who? Who decides what is fair and what is not, who gets what and how much?
The government? An organisation so inept that it gives tax refunds to dead people and animals? Thats going to be the arbiter of who wins and who loses?
Stupidest goddamn idea since people started thinking elections changed anything.
Your understanding of the Forbes plan may be correct, however that is immaterial."Every cent earned" is the key phrase, I think.As many others have suggested, a flat tax of around 15% on every cent earned, without ANY write-offs would, (I think) be the way to go.
But without a little restraint in spending, and someone with the balls to tell these useless tits with their hands out to "fuckoff", it won't matter what convoluted taxing system you use to "get the rich".
What about unearned income?
It's my understanding the Forbes flat tax proposal, for example, would exempt FIRE sector income. (Finance, Insurance, Real Estate)
Any solution that doesn't reverse the widening divide between the rich and the rest of America won't revive the American economy.
Obama made sure he took care of those who financed his campaign first:Instead of cutting the federal deficit, put more money into the pockets of average working families by expanding the Earned Income Tax Credit to include people earning up to $50,000 per year and reduce their income taxes to $0.
Exempt the first $20,000 from payroll taxes.
Pay 10% on incomes between $50,000 - $90,000/year.
Pay 20% on incomes between $90,000 - $120,000/year.
Pay 30% on incomes between $120,000 - $250,000/year
Make up the missing money by increasing the taxes on those responsible for causing our Great Recession:
"Make up the revenues by increasing taxes on incomes between $250,000 to $500,000 to 40 percent; between $500,000 and $5 million, to 50 percent; between $5 million and $15 million, to 60 percent; and anything over $15 million, to 70 percent.
"And raise the ceiling on the portion of income subject to payroll taxes to $500,000.
"It’s called progressive taxation."
Robert Reich
What they should have done with the "Bail Out" money is split it evenly between all persons who pay federal income tax and let them decide what to do with the money. They would have paid off their mortgages and loans and the banks would have still gotten their money and stayed afloat. People would have kept their homes and had a little extra money in their pockets to spend on things--thus stimulating the economy. Our government screwed the pooch when it comes to the federal deficit.
The main problem is that our government keeps sending BILLIONS overseas. Money we obviously don't have. I say cut all of the overseas aid and quit printing out money.
Are you encouraging voters to reject ALL Republican AND Democratic candidates in 2012?And do what with the proceeds?
Redistribute them? To who? Who decides what is fair and what is not, who gets what and how much?
The government? An organisation so inept that it gives tax refunds to dead people and animals? Thats going to be the arbiter of who wins and who loses?
Stupidest goddamn idea since people started thinking elections changed anything.