Private Law vs Public Law

[ihopehefails]

Knowing the difference between public and private law is essential to understand the nature of freedom because each is a distinct creation from one another. One is the creation of our free interactions with others while the other does not require us to choose to agree to its laws.

The existence of any laws that maintain societies cohesiveness exists within the fabric of society itself because the rules that govern all interactions with other members of society exist within in an unwritten agreement between its members. This agreement can take many forms such as a financial contract, pledge to friendship, marriage vows, and etc and as long as all conditions are met each side continues the relationship until the agreement is broken by one of the participants.

This kind of law exists in the unwritten social contract itself and the participants are only restrained by the agreement itself. A pledge to be someone's best friend can be thought of as a law that forbids each side from seeking other best friends. This kind of "law" is not created or enforced by the state but by the voluntary decisions of two or more people and since it is away from the state it is called private law.

In this atmosphere, the free choice of individuals is always maintained and human beings exist in their natural state free of anything that may cause them to act against their own choices. It is in this state, devoid of public law, that people find the most freedom over their own lives but since we create government authority to give us a sense of security we allow the creation of public law that that authority has the right to create.

Public law, unlike natural law, is not created by the choice of its participants but simply exists as raw force over our lives. This makes public law a violation of your freedom because it is not based on the free choice of the individual.

Since the creation and natures of both kinds of laws are so radically different it makes the existence of anything under their perspective domains different. All things that live under public law exist without freedom while all things that live under natural law exist within freedom and a society where there is no distinction between public law (state) and natural law (society) becomes a society where the natural free inclinations of its citizens now becomes subject to the controls of the government.

 

[jillian]

"natural law" only exists as a philosophical construct.

what on earth are you babbling about?

 

[ihopehefails]

"natural law" only exists as a philosophical construct.

what on earth are you babbling about?

Are you telling me there are no laws that regulate the behavior of people within society outside government?

 

[jillian]

you think there are?

 

[ihopehefails]

you think there are?

It pretty obvious if you think about it for a minute. How much of your own behavior is limited due to the fact of an agreement with others. You can't cheat on your spouse or risk destroying the marital contract. You can't talk back to your boss without getting fired. You can't opt out to no pay bills without having your electricity turned off. All of these things you do because you fear dissolving the contract.

 

[goldcatt]

you think there are?

It pretty obvious if you think about it for a minute. How much of your own behavior is limited due to the fact of an agreement with others. You can't cheat on your spouse or risk destroying the marital contract. You can't talk back to your boss without getting fired. You can't opt out to no pay bills without having your electricity turned off. All of these things you do because you fear dissolving the contract.

Are you brain dead?

 

[jillian]

and that purported agreement breaks down the second the government doesn't enforce it.

just ask the people who lived in nazi germany.

the only place "natural law" exists is in political theory class.

everything else is morals...and there are far too many immoral types for your opinion to be correct. for that, you can ask bernie madoff's victims.

 

[jillian]

you think there are?

It pretty obvious if you think about it for a minute. How much of your own behavior is limited due to the fact of an agreement with others. You can't cheat on your spouse or risk destroying the marital contract. You can't talk back to your boss without getting fired. You can't opt out to no pay bills without having your electricity turned off. All of these things you do because you fear dissolving the contract.

Are you brain dead?

of course she is her nic gave it away.

 

[Steerpike]

the only place "natural law" exists is in political theory class.

I don't know. If you're religious you might subscribe to the idea of independent natural law in the universe. In that case, it would exist regardless of whether humans ever enforce it or not.

 

[goldcatt]

It pretty obvious if you think about it for a minute. How much of your own behavior is limited due to the fact of an agreement with others. You can't cheat on your spouse or risk destroying the marital contract. You can't talk back to your boss without getting fired. You can't opt out to no pay bills without having your electricity turned off. All of these things you do because you fear dissolving the contract.

Are you brain dead?

of course she is her nic gave it away.

 

[ihopehefails]

It pretty obvious if you think about it for a minute. How much of your own behavior is limited due to the fact of an agreement with others. You can't cheat on your spouse or risk destroying the marital contract. You can't talk back to your boss without getting fired. You can't opt out to no pay bills without having your electricity turned off. All of these things you do because you fear dissolving the contract.

Are you brain dead?

of course she is her nic gave it away.

Everything you do in society is because other people are around to facilitate your ability to do it and since you need others to make that happen their participation in your activity is a choice on their part. Think of all the mutual choices you engage in with others that are outside the scope of government law? Your choice of friends and work are all based on your choice and theirs so its really an agreement that did not require any government force to create.

 

[jillian]

the only place "natural law" exists is in political theory class.

I don't know. If you're religious you might subscribe to the idea of independent natural law in the universe. In that case, it would exist regardless of whether humans ever enforce it or not.

There are, of course, physical laws that govern space and time and our natural world. but those "natural laws" aren't the political/legal theory she's discussing.

you don't have to be religious to believe in the "laws" surrounding science.

 

[ihopehefails]

you think there are?

It pretty obvious if you think about it for a minute. How much of your own behavior is limited due to the fact of an agreement with others. You can't cheat on your spouse or risk destroying the marital contract. You can't talk back to your boss without getting fired. You can't opt out to no pay bills without having your electricity turned off. All of these things you do because you fear dissolving the contract.

Are you brain dead?

I was wondering the same because why would you spell cat with two tees?

 

[Steerpike]

There are, of course, physical laws that govern space and time and our natural world. but those "natural laws" aren't the political/legal theory she's discussing.

you don't have to be religious to believe in the "laws" surrounding science.

No, I don't mean those. If you believe in a religion where certain moral tenets are prescribed by god, then those are natural laws. For many natural law philosophers, religion is the ultimate source of natural law.

 

[goldcatt]

Are you brain dead?

of course she is her nic gave it away.

Everything you do in society is because other people are around to facilitate your ability to do it and since you need others to make that happen their participation in your activity is a choice on their part. Think of all the mutual choices you engage in with others that are outside the scope of government law? Your choice of friends and work are all based on your choice and theirs so its really an agreement that did not require any government force to create.

I would argue with you, but I can't figure out what the hell you're babbling about. Forget what you seem to think is legal jargon of some kind, can you try again in English?

 

[ihopehefails]

There are, of course, physical laws that govern space and time and our natural world. but those "natural laws" aren't the political/legal theory she's discussing.

you don't have to be religious to believe in the "laws" surrounding science.

No, I don't mean those. If you believe in a religion where certain moral tenets are prescribed by god, then those are natural laws. For many natural law philosophers, religion is the ultimate source of natural law.

I was kind of talking about the laws that govern society that exist outside of government and usually develop naturally over time within any society but morality I think is a good place for natural law since it frees people to pick their own morality and there own way of life.

 

[ihopehefails]

of course she is her nic gave it away.

Everything you do in society is because other people are around to facilitate your ability to do it and since you need others to make that happen their participation in your activity is a choice on their part. Think of all the mutual choices you engage in with others that are outside the scope of government law? Your choice of friends and work are all based on your choice and theirs so its really an agreement that did not require any government force to create.

I would argue with you, but I can't figure out what the hell you're babbling about. Forget what you seem to think is legal jargon of some kind, can you try again in English?

That does not surprise me....

 

[goldcatt]

Everything you do in society is because other people are around to facilitate your ability to do it and since you need others to make that happen their participation in your activity is a choice on their part. Think of all the mutual choices you engage in with others that are outside the scope of government law? Your choice of friends and work are all based on your choice and theirs so its really an agreement that did not require any government force to create.

I would argue with you, but I can't figure out what the hell you're babbling about. Forget what you seem to think is legal jargon of some kind, can you try again in English?

That does not surprise me....

That you don't know what you're talking about and nobody else does either? No, not surprising at all. Have fun playing with yourself!

 

[ihopehefails]

I would argue with you, but I can't figure out what the hell you're babbling about. Forget what you seem to think is legal jargon of some kind, can you try again in English?

That does not surprise me....

That you don't know what you're talking about and nobody else does either? No, not surprising at all. Have fun playing with yourself!

Its not that hard to understand but I suspect some people won't get it because deep down they believe society is an autocracy where every single human interaction is created by the state. I was using a natural law argument that not everything is dictated by the state and in order for freedom to exist there has to be a distinct separation between the authority of the state (public law) and our own authority (private law) and in order for some things to do very well and exist within the scope of freedom it has to be within the scope of natural law due to the choices it provides for us through the voluntary participation process.

 

[RadiomanATL]

The words are all there. They're all in English.

And yet they don't make sense.

Are they in the right order? Is this a USMB Scramble post?