Practicing religion without force

[Newby]

So you are angry at your parents and not the church or christianiaty.

Not to mention that what she described has nothing to do with 'religion'.

Actually it is relevant to religion--to Catholicism. Look up 'occasion of sin'. It's a Catholic teaching.

So, you think all catholic mothers treated their children this way. Guess what? I grew up catholic and I was catholic until about the age of 20, and my mother never ever treated me that way.

 

[syrenn]

I didn't say that. I illustrated an abuse of religion and use of force. This is the kind of heavy handed force that I object to.

I think you made a classic Freudian slip.

Really? How so? What is my error in speech? I made no unconscious slips. I object to heavy handed use of force and religious justification for it.

I am sure everyone sees what i saw. If you dont see it....get some help on your issues with your mother and grandmother.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I think you made a classic Freudian slip.

Really? How so? What is my error in speech? I made no unconscious slips. I object to heavy handed use of force and religious justification for it.

I am sure everyone sees what i saw. If you dont see it....get some help on your issues with your mother and grandmother.

This is very gamey. You insinuate there is some freudian slip in my post and refuse to point it out.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Not to mention that what she described has nothing to do with 'religion'.

Actually it is relevant to religion--to Catholicism. Look up 'occasion of sin'. It's a Catholic teaching.

So, you think all catholic mothers treated their children this way. Guess what? I grew up catholic and I was catholic until about the age of 20, and my mother never ever treated me that way.

You continually distort the meaning of my posts. I NEVER SAID ALL CATHOLICS ARE THIS WAY.

What I have said is that my experience, which informs my life choices, including the choice to leave the Catholic church are based on my experiences.

Nothing more, nothing less. I have NOT said that the Catholic Church is inherently wrong.
I have stated that in my experience, my family misused the teachings and this contributed to me choosing another path.

I am happy for you that no one abused you as a child.

 

[Foxfyre]

First, a discussion of one's religious beliefs is not necessarily counseling. Sometimes it is simply to inform.

Sometimes it is to test one's own beliefs/convictions to see if they will stand up under scrutiny by others.

Sometimes it is just in the spirit of friendly debate as a recreational exercise.

When others attempt to tell me that my personal faith sucks, is of the devil, is an offense to God (by whatever name), is superstition, is fairy tales, is hypocritical, is ignorant, is backward, or pick your unflattering metaphor or adjective of choice, they don't hurt my feelings. I just view them as poor ignorant souls.

When others tell me that I suck, I am the devil's helper, I am an offense to God (by whatever name), I am superstitious, I embrace fairy tales, I'm ignorant, backward, or pick your unflattering metaphor or adjective of choice because I identify myself as Christian, they don't hurt my feelings. I just view them as not only poor ignorant souls but meanspirited ones as well.

I personally would never tell another person that his/her faith sucks--I don't think many people are won over by being told they are going to hell--and I would take strong exception to people ganging up on somebody just because that person was of a different religious persuasion.

But if you're going to participate in a real life group intended to discuss a religious concept or participate on a thread discussing a religious concept, one should expect those participating to discuss that. And if you're going to be the only one in the group who sees something a particular way, you better be prepared for everybody else to disagree with you. (I seem to be in that position a lot. )

Those volunteering for that kind of critique simply shouldn't do that if they get their feelings hurt because everybody didn't embrace his/her faith or belief as s/he understands it.

But we don't have to be disagreeable to disagree either.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I did not volunteer to be counseled on my spiritual choices or to be proselytized. Some of you might consider what would have happened if I had told Marie that she needed Buddha and that Christianity wasn't her true path, or anyone's true path at all. Further, that I had a group of Buddhists posting on here that would put her down when she objected to me 'questioning her faith' and tell her she had no right to her feelings.

 

[syrenn]

Really? How so? What is my error in speech? I made no unconscious slips. I object to heavy handed use of force and religious justification for it.

I am sure everyone sees what i saw. If you dont see it....get some help on your issues with your mother and grandmother.

This is very gamey. You insinuate there is some freudian slip in my post and refuse to point it out.

Read your post. It is totally off base in the conversation over the last few pages. You insert a "hypothetical" situation of which i do not believe is so "hypothetical" for you.

You not only don't understand what force is, but also the nature of a Freudian slip. I believe you have misplaced anger issues with your mother and grandmother.

 

[Newby]

I am sure everyone sees what i saw. If you dont see it....get some help on your issues with your mother and grandmother.

This is very gamey. You insinuate there is some freudian slip in my post and refuse to point it out.

Read your post. It is totally off base in the conversation over the last few pages. You insert a "hypothetical" situation of which i do not believe is so "hypothetical" for you.

You not only don't understand what force is, but also the nature of a Freudian slip. I believe you have misplaced anger issues with your mother and grandmother.

I agree, and she has placed her anger in the wrong direction. They may have misused the excuse of religion for their actions, but as a grown adult woman Sky should know that religion wasn't the cause, merely the vehicle. And they could have chosen anything to be that vehicle, they just happened to choose religion.

 

[syrenn]

I did not volunteer to be counseled on my spiritual choices or to be proselytized. Some of you might consider what would have happened if I had told Marie that she needed Buddha and that Christianity wasn't her true path, or anyone's true path at all. Further, that I had a group of Buddhists posting on here that would put her down when she objected to me 'questioning her faith' and tell her she had no right to her feelings.

You volunteer to be counseled by stepping into the ring.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I am sure everyone sees what i saw. If you dont see it....get some help on your issues with your mother and grandmother.

This is very gamey. You insinuate there is some freudian slip in my post and refuse to point it out.

Read your post. It is totally off base in the conversation over the last few pages. You insert a "hypothetical" situation of which i do not believe is so "hypothetical" for you.

You not only don't understand what force is, but also the nature of a Freudian slip. I believe you have misplaced anger issues with your mother and grandmother.

I have no anger toward my mother or grandmother. Neither were abusive to me. I do have some wounds that haven't fully healed from the abuse I received in my childhood from my foster parent in a Catholic Charities home.

It was doubly damaging because of the way religion was inserted into the abuse inappropriately.
Do you really judge me harshly for seeking another path? Walk in my shoes.

 

[Newby]

I did not volunteer to be counseled on my spiritual choices or to be proselytized. Some of you might consider what would have happened if I had told Marie that she needed Buddha and that Christianity wasn't her true path, or anyone's true path at all. Further, that I had a group of Buddhists posting on here that would put her down when she objected to me 'questioning her faith' and tell her she had no right to her feelings.

You volunteer to be counseled by stepping into the ring.

I just don't understand why she thinks she has the right to tell anyone else what they can and cannot post, it's a free board.

 

[Newby]

This is very gamey. You insinuate there is some freudian slip in my post and refuse to point it out.

Read your post. It is totally off base in the conversation over the last few pages. You insert a "hypothetical" situation of which i do not believe is so "hypothetical" for you.

You not only don't understand what force is, but also the nature of a Freudian slip. I believe you have misplaced anger issues with your mother and grandmother.

I have no anger toward my mother or grandmother. Neither were abusive to me. I do have some wounds that haven't fully healed from the abuse I received in my childhood.

It was doubly damaging because of inserting the religion into the abuse inappropriately.
Do you really judge me harshly for seeking another path?

No one's judging you, look in the mirror and that's where you'll see the judge.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I did not volunteer to be counseled on my spiritual choices or to be proselytized. Some of you might consider what would have happened if I had told Marie that she needed Buddha and that Christianity wasn't her true path, or anyone's true path at all. Further, that I had a group of Buddhists posting on here that would put her down when she objected to me 'questioning her faith' and tell her she had no right to her feelings.

You volunteer to be counseled by stepping into the ring.

No. I am not asking for counseling. I am sharing my personal experiences.

 

[syrenn]

This is very gamey. You insinuate there is some freudian slip in my post and refuse to point it out.

Read your post. It is totally off base in the conversation over the last few pages. You insert a "hypothetical" situation of which i do not believe is so "hypothetical" for you.

You not only don't understand what force is, but also the nature of a Freudian slip. I believe you have misplaced anger issues with your mother and grandmother.

I agree, and she has placed her anger in the wrong direction. They may have misused the excuse of religion for their actions, but as a grown adult woman Sky should know that religion wasn't the cause, merely the vehicle. And they could have chosen anything to be that vehicle, they just happened to choose religion.

Think of it like this. You beat a kid with a wooden spoon. That kid grows up fearing and or hating wooden spoons. The anger and hate should not be about wooden spoons...but about the hand that held the spoon and delivered the blows.

In the "hypothetical" given by sky, religion was only the spoon.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Read your post. It is totally off base in the conversation over the last few pages. You insert a "hypothetical" situation of which i do not believe is so "hypothetical" for you.

You not only don't understand what force is, but also the nature of a Freudian slip. I believe you have misplaced anger issues with your mother and grandmother.

I have no anger toward my mother or grandmother. Neither were abusive to me. I do have some wounds that haven't fully healed from the abuse I received in my childhood.

It was doubly damaging because of inserting the religion into the abuse inappropriately.
Do you really judge me harshly for seeking another path?

No one's judging you, look in the mirror and that's where you'll see the judge.

When I look in the mirror I see a kind face and a person who is ok with me being vulnerable and having residual feelings about the Catholic Church. I see the face of Tara, mother of all the buddhas of the three times.

I don't see anyone who is scowling, telling me I have no right to feel the way I do.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Read your post. It is totally off base in the conversation over the last few pages. You insert a "hypothetical" situation of which i do not believe is so "hypothetical" for you.

You not only don't understand what force is, but also the nature of a Freudian slip. I believe you have misplaced anger issues with your mother and grandmother.

I agree, and she has placed her anger in the wrong direction. They may have misused the excuse of religion for their actions, but as a grown adult woman Sky should know that religion wasn't the cause, merely the vehicle. And they could have chosen anything to be that vehicle, they just happened to choose religion.

Think of it like this. You beat a kid with a wooden spoon. That kid grows up fearing and or hating wooden spoons. The anger and hate should not be about wooden spoons...but about the hand that held the spoon and delivered the blows.

In the "hypothetical" given by sky, religion was only the spoon.

Tell that to the kid who was molested by a priest.

 

[syrenn]

I did not volunteer to be counseled on my spiritual choices or to be proselytized. Some of you might consider what would have happened if I had told Marie that she needed Buddha and that Christianity wasn't her true path, or anyone's true path at all. Further, that I had a group of Buddhists posting on here that would put her down when she objected to me 'questioning her faith' and tell her she had no right to her feelings.

You volunteer to be counseled by stepping into the ring.

No. I am not asking for counseling. I am sharing my personal experiences.

And sharing your personal experiences is stepping into the ring.


Again if you dont like what you get back on a message board you may want to reconsider your participation on message boards.

What i read of maries post... what she said was in a kindly fashion. It was not an attack. I am sure she did not say it to hurt your feelings.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I did not volunteer to be counseled on my spiritual choices or to be proselytized. Some of you might consider what would have happened if I had told Marie that she needed Buddha and that Christianity wasn't her true path, or anyone's true path at all. Further, that I had a group of Buddhists posting on here that would put her down when she objected to me 'questioning her faith' and tell her she had no right to her feelings.

You volunteer to be counseled by stepping into the ring.

I just don't understand why she thinks she has the right to tell anyone else what they can and cannot post, it's a free board.

I have no right to tell anyone what they can and cannot post. I have a right to post my reactions to their views.

It's a free board. I'm entitled to speak my truth.

Sometimes religion is forced on a child. Think of the polygamists.

 

[syrenn]

I agree, and she has placed her anger in the wrong direction. They may have misused the excuse of religion for their actions, but as a grown adult woman Sky should know that religion wasn't the cause, merely the vehicle. And they could have chosen anything to be that vehicle, they just happened to choose religion.

Think of it like this. You beat a kid with a wooden spoon. That kid grows up fearing and or hating wooden spoons. The anger and hate should not be about wooden spoons...but about the hand that held the spoon and delivered the blows.

In the "hypothetical" given by sky, religion was only the spoon.

Tell that to the kid who was molested by a priest.

Being molested by priests also has nothing to do with religion. Granted that the clergy protect the priests so that there is no scandal but that is not religion.

The act itself has nothing to do with religion. Molestation is about sick fuck pedophiles taking advantage of trusting kids and parents.

 

[syrenn]

I have no anger toward my mother or grandmother. Neither were abusive to me. I do have some wounds that haven't fully healed from the abuse I received in my childhood.

It was doubly damaging because of inserting the religion into the abuse inappropriately.
Do you really judge me harshly for seeking another path?

No one's judging you, look in the mirror and that's where you'll see the judge.

When I look in the mirror I see a kind face and a person who is ok with me being vulnerable and having residual feelings about the Catholic Church. I see the face of Tara, mother of all the buddhas of the three times.

I don't see anyone who is scowling, telling me I have no right to feel the way I do.

Again...as far as i see it...another Freudian slip.

I really feel you need to work on the issues you have with your mother.