Obamanomics fails because it's supposed to, just like FDR Depression

[The Rabbi]

GDP, 1929-1936
1929: 103.6B
1930: 91.2B
1931: 76.5B
1932: 58.7B
1933: 56.4B <-----FDR takes office.
1934: 66.0B
1935: 73.3B
1936: 83.8B

a good way to deflect when you cant win the argument.

Deflect from a baseless opinion by providing actual factual information? Indeed.

Anyway, note that GDP never got even close to where it had been before the crash, and took 5 years to reach where it had been two years after the crash.

That's not because growth was slow - in fact, the pace of growth was record pace. It's because the depth of the hole created was so great.

In 1936 orders from Europe began picking up, both for the Spanish Civil War and WW2.

Well that didn't do us much good!

You've pretty much proven you're an idiot.

I see the same comments today: Things are bad because they had been so much worse.
Too bad it isn't true. Unemployment remained at record rates until WW2 started and the draft took care of unemployment.
Who do you think was filling those orders from Europe, dumbass?

Every time you venture into history or economics you get your lunch eaten. Maybe you should consider a nice cup of STFU?

 

[8537]

a good way to deflect when you cant win the argument.

Deflect from a baseless opinion by providing actual factual information? Indeed.




That's not because growth was slow - in fact, the pace of growth was record pace. It's because the depth of the hole created was so great.

In 1936 orders from Europe began picking up, both for the Spanish Civil War and WW2.

Well that didn't do us much good!

You've pretty much proven you're an idiot.

I see the same comments today: Things are bad because they had been so much worse.
Too bad it isn't true. Unemployment remained at record rates until WW2 started and the draft took care of unemployment.

So the record pace of growth between 1933 and 1937 didn't increase incomes and make people better off? You should tell that to the 61% of people who voted for FDR in November of 1936.

Who do you think was filling those orders from Europe, dumbass?

Well, dumbass, apparently NOT the US - we fell into another recession a year later. Did war orders from Europe fall into steep decline in late 1937?

Every time you venture into history or economics you get your lunch eaten. Maybe you should consider a nice cup of STFU?

ah yes, the Richard Nixon Strategy - when getting one's ass kicked, "declare victory and get the fuck out."

 

[old navy]

With government spending at 100 percent of GDP, the president is close to his goal of "fundamentally changing" the United States of America. The problem with socialism though, is that other people's money soon runs out.

 

[8537]

With government spending at 100 percent of GDP

GDP: Approximately 14.5T
2011 Projected government spending: Approximately 3.8T.

3.8 is not 100% of 14.5.

 

[old navy]

With government spending at 100 percent of GDP

GDP: Approximately 14.5T
2011 Projected government spending: Approximately 3.8T.

3.8 is not 100% of 14.5.

Thanks for the catch. I meant debt not spending.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

It's no surprise to me that the US economy continues to cough, sputter and wheeze. What did you think would happen when you copy play for play the EXACT steps FDR used to preside over an economy worse than the 7 Biblical Lean Years?

Cru you so don't know what you're talking about.

Seriously, read a book.

What year did the New Deal get us out of the FDR Depression?

 

[8537]

It's no surprise to me that the US economy continues to cough, sputter and wheeze. What did you think would happen when you copy play for play the EXACT steps FDR used to preside over an economy worse than the 7 Biblical Lean Years?

Cru you so don't know what you're talking about.

Seriously, read a book.

What year did the New Deal get us out of the FDR Depression?

The depression that started in August of 1929 ended in March of 1933.

 

[Oddball]

The depression that started in August of 1929 ended in March of 1933.

And what of the second depression that started in '37?

 

[Oddball]

gdp, 1929-1936
1929: 103.6b
1930: 91.2b
1931: 76.5b
1932: 58.7b
1933: 56.4b <-----fdr takes office.
1934: 66.0b
1935: 73.3b
1936: 83.8b

must.....blame.....democrats....no.....matter....the....facts.....

Must...print...more....money....and....call...it....growth....

 

[CrusaderFrank]

GDP, 1929-1936
1929: 103.6B<--Fed raises rates, tightens money supply
1930: 91.2B<--Fed raises rates, tightens money supply
1931: 76.5B<-- Fed allows bank collapse after collapse
1932: 58.7B<-- Fed continues to draw money OUT of US economy, Democrats reveal names of trouble banks, exacerbating run on banks
1933: 56.4B <-----FDR takes office after taking a cruise and ignoring Hoovers pleas for help stemming the bank collapses, inauguration was in March
1934: 66.0B
1935: 73.3B
1936: 83.8B

 

[Trajan]

GDP, 1929-1936
1929: 103.6B
1930: 91.2B
1931: 76.5B
1932: 58.7B
1933: 56.4B <-----FDR takes office.
1934: 66.0B
1935: 73.3B
1936: 83.8B

Let me ask you a question; if you had a heart condition, would you blame the doctor for not immediately curing you after your first visit? Because FDR took office, everything that preceded him is HIS fault?

Keep in mind that fiscal years begin Oct. 1, so the first year that can be counted as a FDR year is fiscal 1934. The appropriations bills for fiscal year 1933 was signed by FDR's predecessor, Herbert Hoover.

FDR and the New Deal created the LARGEST increase in GDP in American history.

Gross Domestic Product (GDP)

Percent change from preceding period

GDP percent change based on current dollars


1930 -12.0
1931 -16.1
1932 -23.2
1933 -3.9 <-----FDR takes office. BUT, it is still Hoover's budget
1934 17.0 <-----FDR's FIRST budget year.
1935 11.1
1936 14.3
1937 9.7
1938 -6.3
1939 7.0
1940 10.0
1941 25.0
1942 27.7
1943 22.7
1944 10.7
1945 1.5 <-----FDR dies.

FDR had his own right wing regressives to contend with, HERE is where that led.

The Recession of 1937–1938 was a temporary reversal of the pre-war 1933 to 1941 economic recovery from the Great Depression in the United States. Economists disagree about the causes of this downturn, but agree that government austerity reversed the recovery. wiki

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

FDR and the New Deal created the LARGEST increase in GDP in American history.

FDR had his own right wing regressives to contend with, HERE is where that led.

you're blaming the 36-37 depression in the depression on the right wing?
sorry that won't wash........


the 74th congress had 73 dem senators and 322 dem house members....they started their session jan of 35....

 

[oreo]

It's no surprise to me that the US economy continues to cough, sputter and wheeze. What did you think would happen when you copy play for play the EXACT steps FDR used to preside over an economy worse than the 7 Biblical Lean Years?

Deficit spending and a centrally planned economy have only brought despair and ruin to the vast majority. That's what Obama wanted and got.

Case in point: Government control and regulation. The main reason the FDR Depression lasted so long was because it was supposed to. Both FDR and Obama issued massive regulation all in an effort to control and centrally plan the economy, terrorizing business in the process.

Here's an article that in the midst of what appears to the the beginning of a Double Dip, Obama is issuing business strangling regulation at a staggering clip

"Many House and Senate conservatives are reviving their battle against federal regulations, claiming that the president hasn't stopped issuing job-killing rules during the debt ceiling fight. "While Washington and Americans have been focused on the debt ceiling, the Obama administration has continued to roll out more crushing red tape," said a spokesperson for Wyoming Republican Sen. John Barrasso, who's been championing the regulation fight."
Report: Obama Administration Added $9.5 Billion in Red Tape in July - US News and World Report

That's why Obama, ObamaCare and FinReg must get piled on the ash heap of history after Nov 2012

Agreed--but there is one thing FDR did that Barack Obama never even considered--and in fact did the opposite.

FDR CUT the Federal Budget immediately by 100 million dollars. Back in the 1930's that was HUGE. Albeit it didn't work with the government spending all this money--you still have to give FDR credit for FIRST cutting the expense of the Federal Government.

Barack Obama expanded the Federal Budget it by 1 trillion dollars--and never had any intention of cutting the expenses of the federal government--he immediately set out to expand and grow the size and scope of the Federal Government. There--these two President's are opposite. IOW--FDR would not approve of what Obama has done.

And what took thousands of men with shovels in the 1930's to build roads and bridges can now be done with a couple of heavy equipment operators.

Something that our Harvard Graduate--Community Organizer--most intellectual President ever--and now professional golfer never understood.

 

[Oddball]

GDP, 1929-1936
1929: 103.6B
1930: 91.2B
1931: 76.5B
1932: 58.7B
1933: 56.4B <-----FDR takes office.
1934: 66.0B
1935: 73.3B
1936: 83.8B

Let me ask you a question; if you had a heart condition, would you blame the doctor for not immediately curing you after your first visit? Because FDR took office, everything that preceded him is HIS fault?

Keep in mind that fiscal years begin Oct. 1, so the first year that can be counted as a FDR year is fiscal 1934. The appropriations bills for fiscal year 1933 was signed by FDR's predecessor, Herbert Hoover.

FDR and the New Deal created the LARGEST increase in GDP in American history.

Gross Domestic Product (GDP)

Percent change from preceding period

GDP percent change based on current dollars


1930 -12.0
1931 -16.1
1932 -23.2
1933 -3.9 <-----FDR takes office. BUT, it is still Hoover's budget
1934 17.0 <-----FDR's FIRST budget year.
1935 11.1
1936 14.3
1937 9.7
1938 -6.3
1939 7.0
1940 10.0
1941 25.0
1942 27.7
1943 22.7
1944 10.7
1945 1.5 <-----FDR dies.

FDR had his own right wing regressives to contend with, HERE is where that led.

The Recession of 1937–1938 was a temporary reversal of the pre-war 1933 to 1941 economic recovery from the Great Depression in the United States. Economists disagree about the causes of this downturn, but agree that government austerity reversed the recovery. wiki

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

FDR and the New Deal created the LARGEST increase in GDP in American history.

FDR had his own right wing regressives to contend with, HERE is where that led.

you're blaming the 36-37 depression in the depression on the right wing?
sorry that won't wash........


the 74th congress had 73 dem senators and 322 dem house members....they started their session jan of 35....

Lest we forget the treats by FDR to stack USSC!

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Cru you so don't know what you're talking about.

Seriously, read a book.

What year did the New Deal get us out of the FDR Depression?

The depression that started in August of 1929 ended in March of 1933.

Oh, the Depression ended in 1933? I didn't know that 7 years of almost 20% unemployment was considered something other than Depression, what was that called, Sunshine and Roses?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

GDP, 1929-1936
1929: 103.6B<--Fed raises rates, tightens money supply
1930: 91.2B<--Fed raises rates, tightens money supply
1931: 76.5B<-- Fed allows bank collapse after collapse
1932: 58.7B<-- Fed continues to draw money OUT of US economy, Democrats reveal names of trouble banks, exacerbating run on banks
1933: 56.4B <-----FDR takes office.
1934: 66.0B
1935: 73.3B
1936: 83.8B

 

[The Rabbi]

What year did the New Deal get us out of the FDR Depression?

The depression that started in August of 1929 ended in March of 1933.

Oh, the Depression ended in 1933? I didn't know that 7 years of almost 20% unemployment was considered something other than Depression, what was that called, Sunshine and Roses?

Actually it was called Hope and Change.

 

[oreo]

The depression that started in August of 1929 ended in March of 1933.

Oh, the Depression ended in 1933? I didn't know that 7 years of almost 20% unemployment was considered something other than Depression, what was that called, Sunshine and Roses?

Actually it was called Hope and Change.

Did the Hope and Change put a "chicken in the pot"--I don't think so. Massive Government spending to create private sector job growth--may have worked temporarily during the great depression--but we must remember that these jobs were just that. TEMPORARY JOBS. Once the project was done unemployment rose again.

During the Great Depression we would see spurts of employment gains--and then they would crash down again.

Let's face it--the ONLY thing that brought us out of the Great Depression was WW2. Men went off to war--women went to work in factories across this nation--building airplanes ad aircraft carriers--the US treasuries cofers filled with revenue--and people had no problems what-so-ever finding a JOB. When the men came home--women went back to being home-makers--and this economy was out of the Great Depression--it's as simple as that.

 

[Charles_Main]

FACT: America took much longer than almost every other industrialized Nation, to recover from the Great Depression.

Take from it what you want.

 

[Charles_Main]

Oh, the Depression ended in 1933? I didn't know that 7 years of almost 20% unemployment was considered something other than Depression, what was that called, Sunshine and Roses?

Actually it was called Hope and Change.

Did the Hope and Change put a "chicken in the pot"--I don't think so. Massive Government spending to create private sector job growth--may have worked temporarily during the great depression--but we must remember that these jobs were just that. TEMPORARY JOBS. Once the project was done unemployment rose again.

During the Great Depression we would see spurts of employment gains--and then they would crash down again.

Let's face it--the ONLY thing that brought us out of the Great Depression was WW2. Men went off to war--women went to work in factories across this nation--building airplanes ad aircraft carries--the US treasuries cofers filled with revenue--and people had no problems what-so-ever finding a JOB. When the men came home--women went back to being home-makers--and this economy was out of the Great Depression.

You hit that nail on the head when you said FDR spent massively to create Private sector Jobs, Even if they were Temporary. That is where Obama is even Worse than FDR, because other than some Temporary Construction jobs, Obama spent massively Creating Government Jobs, and Programs, not Private sector Jobs.

The Simple fact is, that it was spending that got us out of the Depression. Not spending on Government Road building programs, or Other Government Programs. It was the Massive spending by the government on Private sector Goods and services to fight WWII that in the end was needed for us to recover.

In that case government spending worked to create long term Jobs, Because instead of spending on some temporary Construction jobs, and a bunch of new Government programs and government Jobs, We were spending Billions buying products made by the private sector.

There in lies the difference, and why Obama's Style of spending will never lead to sustained Job Growth in the Private Sector.

Add to the the Endless Regulations that he is quietly adding daily and uncertainty about the Debt and future of Taxes and Interest Rates and you have an environment where nobody is spending money to grow and hire more people.

The Last month alone the Obama Admin Quietly added New Regulations that some say will cost American Business 10 Billion dollars a month in new costs, and lost revenue.

Wooo Hooo Hope and change.

 

[8537]

The depression that started in August of 1929 ended in March of 1933.

And what of the second depression that started in '37?

It was a recession - and it ended quite quickly. And the economy once again returned to a path of record growth.