Obama says the "A" word

[Ravi]

She did not get pregnant by herself. What if the man wants a family with the woman and the abortion goes horribly wrong ?

You mean like if the abortion results in an infection and the woman dies? I guess the man will have to commit suicide to make things fair.

 

[dilloduck]

You mean like if the abortion results in an infection and the woman dies? I guess the man will have to commit suicide to make things fair.

I knew you would understand being the family values supporter that you now are !

 

[Gunny]

perhaps you re right, perhaps people are more sophisticated now and perhaps states wouldn't automatically outlaw abortion immediately. I unfortunately, as a woman, am not willing to gamble on what if. I want Roe v. Wade upheld.



But Roe v. Wade is about upholding the 14th Amendment, which states were ruled to have violated by outlawing abortion. Are the states rights under the 10th Amendment more important than the citizens rights under the 14th? States still have the right to place restrictions on abortions they just can't outlaw them altogether. Seems like a fair compromise to me.



using the example you gave is comparing apples to oranges Gunny. Walking into your neighbors house isn't equal to terminating a pregnancy. and it's not based on morals either. the law that prevents you from doing that, it's based on the idea that if people could just walk up and shoot people this society would be in chaos and madness. That law is in place for the safety and welfare of ALL citizens and feutuses (sp?) don't become citizen's until they are born.



are women not the ones who need this right? are men faced with the choice of abortion on a physical and personal level? I don't deny people anything but I don't want the State dictating to me when and under what circumstances I can terminate a pregnancy, even if I were to have never exercised my right to choose I'd still want it there for other women who need it.

I'm enjoy our exchange by the way!

That would depend on your beliefs. Abortion is exactly the same as walking into my neighbor's house and putting a bullet through his head. Both are snuffing out a human life.

I do not believe the state should be dictating to you when and under what circumstances you can terminate a pregnancy. I have not argued that at all. My personal belief is mine, for me. I don't run around trying to force it on others. I'm merely expressing it on a message board.

As I have stated several times, I don't think this should be a matter of law at all. It should be a matter of individual choice. When I have to start answering for your decisions, THEN I'll worry about telling you what to think.

As far as your conflict with the 10th and 14th, you are saying the state does not trump the individual but the Fed does trump the state. That's cherrypicking which government body you wish you have final authority as it suits you. If the states didn't care about abortion but the Constitution made it illegal, which would you prefer then? I'd venture to guess you would become a proponent of the 10th real quick.

 

[Silence]

She did not get pregnant by herself. What if the man wants a family with the woman and the abortion goes horribly wrong ?

let me ask you a serious question, do you HONESTLY think most women who have a loving and supportive mate, who actually wants the baby in question, have abortions despite his feelings? c'mon dillo get real.

This fantasty that women just go out and hoover the kid out so they can go on partying is ridiculous.

Making the decision to terminate a pregnancy is probably one of if not the most difficult decision a woman could face.

Not to mention, legal abortions rarely result in complications that result in infertility unlike illegal abortions which resulted in thousands of women being maimed and killed.

Gunny, it's not cherry picking entirely. I think the Fed should have an obligation to uphold the citizens rights when and if the State oversteps their authority in governing the people of that State. does that make sense?

I am born a United States citizen. I am a resident of Florida which is ultimately ruled by the United States. correct?

 

[dilloduck]

let me ask you a serious question, do you HONESTLY think most women who have a loving and supportive mate, who actually wants the baby in question, have abortions despite his feelings? c'mon dillo get real.

Yes I personally know of three.

 

[Silence]

Yes I personally know of three.

then you don't hang around very nice girls dillo.... were these babies to be yours?

speaking from my own experience when I got pregnant in 1999 I was in a stable relationship and had a 4(almost 5) year old daughter who I had almost died having. Had my boyfriend, who we were living with, wanted that child I would've risked my life to have it, knowing that he would've loved it and my daughter in the event something were to happen to me during delivery. He didn't even care about the medical risk to me, that was not why he didn't want me to have the baby, he said "I'm not ready for this shit." when I told him I was pregnant. I even had second thoughts before doing it and he refused to even hear about it.

Needless to say, we broke up and my daughter and I moved out 2 months after the abortion.

so dillo, while I can appreciate your perspective from a man's POV, please don't pretend that what a man goes through is equal to what a woman goes through because it's not even close because, while I do not regret my decision, it is a decision that I think about almost daily.

 

[Ravi]

Men are such pitiable creatures.

 

[dilloduck]

then you don't hang around very nice girls dillo.... were these babies to be yours?

speaking from my own experience when I got pregnant in 1999 I was in a stable relationship and had a 4(almost 5) year old daughter who I had almost died having. Had my boyfriend, who we were living with, wanted that child I would've risked my life to have it, knowing that he would've loved it and my daughter in the event something were to happen to me during delivery. He didn't even care about the medical risk to me, that was not why he didn't want me to have the baby, he said "I'm not ready for this shit." when I told him I was pregnant. I even had second thoughts before doing it and he refused to even hear about it.

Needless to say, we broke up and my daughter and I moved out 2 months after the abortion.

so dillo, while I can appreciate your perspective from a man's POV, please don't pretend that what a man goes through is equal to what a woman goes through because it's not even close because, while I do not regret my decision, it is a decision that I think about almost daily.

Don't put words in my mouth---you asked a question;

are men faced with the choice of abortion on a physical and personal level?

I answered

yes

I never said anything about them being equal .

While we are at it---please expalin to me the reproductive rights of men .

 

[Red Dawn]

then you don't hang around very nice girls dillo.... were these babies to be yours?

speaking from my own experience when I got pregnant in 1999 I was in a stable relationship and had a 4(almost 5) year old daughter who I had almost died having. Had my boyfriend, who we were living with, wanted that child I would've risked my life to have it, knowing that he would've loved it and my daughter in the event something were to happen to me during delivery. He didn't even care about the medical risk to me, that was not why he didn't want me to have the baby, he said "I'm not ready for this shit." when I told him I was pregnant. I even had second thoughts before doing it and he refused to even hear about it.

Needless to say, we broke up and my daughter and I moved out 2 months after the abortion.

so dillo, while I can appreciate your perspective from a man's POV, please don't pretend that what a man goes through is equal to what a woman goes through because it's not even close because, while I do not regret my decision, it is a decision that I think about almost daily.

I seriously doubt there are many women who don't consult with their committed male partners before having an abortion.

But, the woman has the final say in the matter. Its her uterus and her embryo.

 

[dilloduck]

I seriously doubt there are many women who don't consult with their committed male partners before having an abortion.

But, the woman has the final say in the matter. Its her uterus and her embryo.

I can assure you that you are wrong about the consultation. Maybe you can explain the reproductive rights of a man to me.

 

[greenpartyaz]

Maybe technically vaild but the attempt is to scare women voters into thinking the GOP ticket intends to take away their "freedom to abort".
Did you here ANYTHING at all it the convention regarding the overturning of Roe V Wade ?

This may be news to you, but we don't take anything McCain says at face value.

 

[dilloduck]

Men are such pitiable creatures.

And women are special because they have a uterus ? LMAO !

 

[Red Dawn]

I can assure you that you are wrong about the consultation.

Maybe you can explain the reproductive rights of a man to me.

LOL!

thanks for the laugh!

 

[dilloduck]

LOL!

thanks for the laugh!

As I thought--they dont have any Sounds fair to me !

 

[del]

I think RvW should be overturned and decided by the States as well, but there must be a guarantee protecting the States against a federal ban on abortion.

tenth amendment covers that pretty nicely

 

[Ravi]

I can assure you that you are wrong about the consultation. Maybe you can explain the reproductive rights of a man to me.

They can dispense their sperm. That's about it, really.

 

[del]

They can dispense their sperm. That's about it, really.

seems fair to me...

 

[Ravi]

And women are special because they have a uterus ? LMAO !

Yes, in a way. At least when it comes to giving birth...women are special. But that's not what I meant. I'm just laughing at all the whining men have been doing lately about the unfairness of their lot in life.

Men are the new victim. It cracks me up.

 

[jreeves]

smart move. Expose the extreme rightwingism of McCain/Palin to the light of day.

So much for this unity huh?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nnqun3vqsms]YouTube - United States of America[/ame]

 

[Jon]

I seriously doubt there are many women who don't consult with their committed male partners before having an abortion.

But, the woman has the final say in the matter. Its her uterus and her embryo.

Her uterus, yes. Her embryo? Last I checked, it took two to make an embryo, and last I checked, that makes it equally the man's.

As for whoever said men don't suffer what women do in the case of abortion, I assure you if someone were to abort my child, I'd be pretty upset. I value human life, even if it is unexpected. It's not a religious issue, or a women's rights issue, or a political issue, or a legal issue, it's an issue of responsibility. You make a mistake, you rectify it. Rather you keep the child and raise it or give it up for adoption, the LIFE of the child comes FIRST, not the convenience of the woman.