Militray service and politics

[USMCSergeant]

Military service is a good thing for anyone that will possibly be CIC. But it isn't necessary.

As long as the person has a brilliant mind, can do good things for our country, I have no issue with him running for President. I do wish the media would bash all the candidates less, liberal, conservative both for their past mistakes, everyone makes them. Less bashing would promote more people to run for office and we'd have more brilliant minds to choose from.

With protection of Liberty being job ONE.

I agree, but the oath of office which includes protecting the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic, that should be implied.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Left wing? I attacked Republicans for supporting Cheney who dodged the draft 5 times while never blinking when sending other people's children to wars he would never have fought.

Romney's family has reaped the cream at the top of American society. Most old time Dems and Repubs of old felt a sense of obligation for their place in society. What the hell is wrong with these 1%ers?

Take, and never give? Romney is always talking about keeping America strong. He wants a strong America? It's time for his ilk to step up and sacrifice. The main reason troops had so many tours in Iraq and Afghanistan is NOT enough loud and proud flag wavers volunteered when needed.

..

Day by Day - Godspell

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...tism-5-privileged-sons-and-no-volunteers.html

 

[Lovebears65]

he was of age during a time when we drafted.

He used his religion to keep from fighting while many poor kids died for their country under this draft.

You bet it matters

Clinton was a draft dodger as well but I dont see you harping on him do you

Yes he was. Now...I need your help to remember. How many military members did he send to their deaths?

Well he did not stop Bin Ladin that got the USS cole and hit the world trade centers .. Guilty of association I say

 

[The T]

Military service is a good thing for anyone that will possibly be CIC. But it isn't necessary.

As long as the person has a brilliant mind, can do good things for our country, I have no issue with him running for President. I do wish the media would bash all the candidates less, liberal, conservative both for their past mistakes, everyone makes them. Less bashing would promote more people to run for office and we'd have more brilliant minds to choose from.

With protection of Liberty being job ONE.

I agree, but the oath of office which includes protecting the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic, that should be implied.

But with the one currently sitting there?

Violates it.

 

[SFC Ollie]

..

Day by Day - Godspell

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...tism-5-privileged-sons-and-no-volunteers.html

What part of the word Volunteer is giving you a problem?

 

[USMCSergeant]

With protection of Liberty being job ONE.

I agree, but the oath of office which includes protecting the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic, that should be implied.

But with the one currently sitting there?

Violates it.

LOL I didn't vote for him!

 

[JakeStarkey]

With protection of Liberty being job ONE.

I agree, but the oath of office which includes protecting the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic, that should be implied.

But with the one currently sitting there?

Violates it.

Yup. Sure did. Particularly when he said, "Go get Osama, make him dead, and then flush him overboard at sea."

 

[GoneBezerk]

I guess your missed the Blackhawk down story, idiot.

Clinton and his goons in the White House played General over the real 2-star in country that asked for TANKS to carry out the mission of capturing bad guys. Clinton and his goons with 0 time in the military know better than actual troops, so they denied the request which cost us time and lives in the rescue attempt.

You see you liberals like telling the troops how to do their job with no experience, whereas Bush didn't tell the troops how to execute their mission in Iraq. If a General requested tanks, then he got tanks.....nobody in the White House playing God back home from their cozy desk.

he was of age during a time when we drafted.

He used his religion to keep from fighting while many poor kids died for their country under this draft.

You bet it matters

Clinton was a draft dodger as well but I dont see you harping on him do you

Yes he was. Now...I need your help to remember. How many military members did he send to their deaths?

 

[The T]

Day by Day - Godspell

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...tism-5-privileged-sons-and-no-volunteers.html

What part of the word Volunteer is giving you a problem?

Maybe he thinks Romney sould have been drafted? Maybe Obama...[Who thought of serving]?


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_bbZ-OSA6g]Obama Didn't Serve in Military, but He Thought About it - YouTube[/ame]

 

[JakeStarkey]

This OP is such a fail. Neither man served. Neither man shirked a duty to serve. Both had their reasons. That is good enough for me, a guy who did serve.

 

[USMCSergeant]

Good post Jake

 

[bodecea]

Clinton was a draft dodger as well but I dont see you harping on him do you

Yes he was. Now...I need your help to remember. How many military members did he send to their deaths?

Well he did not stop Bin Ladin that got the USS cole and hit the world trade centers .. Guilty of association I say

You must REALLY hate Reagan then for what happened at the Lebanon Marine Corps barracks.

 

[MikeK]

Hores shit, pure and simple. Those who denigrated Bush and Kerry for their service were, every last one of them, American cowards.

I agree there is no substantive reason to denigrate Kerry's service, mainly because he was decorated for service in combat. But Bush?? You feel that spoiled, elitist, alcoholic, drug-addicted fop deserves the same level of respect as Kerry? I'm surprised.

George W. Bush was nothing but a privileged draft dodger who managed to evade service in Vietnam by using his father's political influence to secure a safe place in the Air National Guard's "Champagne Unit" where he partied, occasionally had fun flying jet planes, and eventually went permanently AWOL -- for which he was never held to account.

Briefly stated, former President George W. Bush was a scumbag and probably still is.

 

[JoeB131]

Is current or past military service (of ones self or ones family) the only indicator of patriotism?

Should lack of military service (personally) disqualify someone from holding public office?

Is it fair to criticize Romney for seeking the Presidency when neither he nor his children ever served in the military, and yet NOT criticize Obama, who never served in the military?

Discuss.

Yes, for a couple of reasons.

First, Romney actively avoided the draft, and that emphasized the unfairness of the draft. If you were poor, you got drafted and sent over to fight in a rice paddy. If you were the son of a rich governor/ex CEO, you got an exemption to go over and annoy French people with the Book of Mormon.

Secondly, Romney himself opened the door when he claimed that his sons working on his 2008 campaign was as valid as service to the country as the young men (such as the sons of John McCain and Sarah Palin) who were over in Afghanistan and Iraq. Really, Mitt?

Third, like a lot of Chicken Hawks, Mitt is very anxious to send other people's kids off to die. He not only opposed the drawdown in Iraq, he opposes withdrawing from Afghanistan, and he wants to mix it up with Iran. He seems very anxious to send other people's kids to wars, but not his own. Obama is trying to extracate us from these messes.

When President Obama was of an age to serve, we werent' at war with anyone and we didn't have a draft. The services were finding excuses not to take people because they didn't have enough slots.

So, yeah, it's a fair criticism.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Hores shit, pure and simple. Those who denigrated Bush and Kerry for their service were, every last one of them, American cowards.

I agree there is no substantive reason to denigrate Kerry's service, mainly because he was decorated for service in combat. But Bush?? You feel that spoiled, elitist, alcoholic, drug-addicted fop deserves the same level of respect as Kerry? I'm surprised.

George W. Bush was nothing but a privileged draft dodger who managed to evade service in Vietnam by using his father's political influence to secure a safe place in the Air National Guard's "Champagne Unit" where he partied, occasionally had fun flying jet planes, and eventually went permanently AWOL -- for which he was never held to account.

Briefly stated, former President George W. Bush was a scumbag and probably still is.

I don't like Bush, so please don't mistake my point.

My point is this: the official records uphold both men. I am willing to accept the official records.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Sophistry on JoeB's part and easily dismissed.

 

[SFC Ollie]

Hores shit, pure and simple. Those who denigrated Bush and Kerry for their service were, every last one of them, American cowards.

I agree there is no substantive reason to denigrate Kerry's service, mainly because he was decorated for service in combat. But Bush?? You feel that spoiled, elitist, alcoholic, drug-addicted fop deserves the same level of respect as Kerry? I'm surprised.

George W. Bush was nothing but a privileged draft dodger who managed to evade service in Vietnam by using his father's political influence to secure a safe place in the Air National Guard's "Champagne Unit" where he partied, occasionally had fun flying jet planes, and eventually went permanently AWOL -- for which he was never held to account.

Briefly stated, former President George W. Bush was a scumbag and probably still is.

And when was the last time you strapped your ass to a fucking rocket? Bush did his time, and no one has ever proven any different......... Give it the fuck up already....

 

[Sallow]

he was of age during a time when we drafted.

He used his religion to keep from fighting while many poor kids died for their country under this draft.

You bet it matters

Clinton was a draft dodger as well but I dont see you harping on him do you

Clinton registered for the draft, eventually. And he was against the Vietnam war.

Romney was for the Vietnam war. He protested in Pro-War rallies.

Then went to France.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Sallow, you are reporting history, but your implied conclusion, that Romney was somehow wrong or inferior, does not follow. You have written a non sequitur.

 

[Navy1960]

Former President George W. Bush was rated and flew this aircraft.

The first revised aircraft, designated YF-102A flew on 20 December 1954, 118 days after the redesign started, exceeding Mach 1 the next day.[12] The revised design demonstrated a speed of Mach 1.22 and a ceiling of 53,000 ft (16,154 m), which was sufficient for the Air Force to allow production of the F-102.[13]
The production F-102A had the Hughes MG-3 fire control system, later upgraded in service to the MG-10. It had a three-segment internal weapons bay under the fuselage for air-to-air missiles. Initial armament was three pairs of GAR-1/2/3/4 (Later re-designated as AIM-4) Falcon missiles, which included both infrared and semi-active radar homing variants. The doors of the two forward bays each had tubes for 12 FFAR rockets (for a total of 24) with initially 2 in (5.1 cm) being fitted and later 2.75 in (70 mm) replacing them. The F-102 was later upgraded to allow the carriage of up to two GAR-11/AIM-26 Nuclear Falcon missiles in the center bay.[14] The larger size of this weapon required redesigned center bay doors with no rocket tubes. Plans were considered to fit the MB-1 Genie nuclear rocket to the design, but although a Genie was test fired from a YF-102A in May 1956, it was never adopted

Convair F-102 Delta Dagger - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is not an aircraft that your average person just straps-in and decides because of his fathers political connections he is going to just take up for a joy ride. It takes time, dedication, and long hours of traning to master the skills needed in order to fly an aircract like that. Keep in mind that aircraft like that are not the same as they are today, and the on-board computers on that aircarft was the man in the seat. There was no fly-by-wire, it was all stick and rudder, and in order to keep a bird like that in the air one would need to have some skills to do so. While it's true that President Bush did not serve in any deployments to Vietnam, so to it's true there are many men and women who do the hard job of supporting and defending this nation that do not deploy overseas, and as such their service to this nation is no less important. As for Sen. Kerry, I have had the chance like I indicated in my last post to look at the Senators records and it indicates a dedicated Naval Officer who's awards were given well withing Naval regs. Still further, people need to consider that Sen Kerry requested to be assigned to the Brownwater Navy.

Presidents or candidates that do not serve in the Military in my humble opinion should not be disqualified from serving or running for office. In fact, just to make that commitment says the person loves their nation enough to make a difference. In other words there are many ways to serve this great nation. If a President does have that Military experience I see this as a big plus because it serves to give that President a good idea of what it means to commit young men and women in defense of this nation.