Memorial Day: Those Who Didn't Return

[I amso IR]

I speak from experience Political Chick. I have struggled with post stress for many years now. I simply thought it was that I missed the Army after retirement. Turns everything upside down and backwards. Right becomes wrong and wrong right. It is not all nightmares and dreams of glory. I have killed my share of the enemy. I think of them, all, much less now, if at all. I'm better now. Last night bear513 wrote of Jake Starkey being "gone". I thought about Jake and the crap he and I have spoken about, argued over, and I thought of him, saddened by the fact that 513 reported him "gone". Then I found out it was all banter and bullshit! I drank myself to sleep. Waking up this morning, I asked my other self "Timmy" to address the folks here at USMB who participated last night in the roasting of Jake. "Timmy" declined and said take out your own trash and do that load of laundry. Kind of reminded me of a time in RVN, on a hill renamed from 913 to "Hamburger Hill". A fairly small unit from the 173d Airborne assaulted that hill for several days trying to dislodge a much larger unit of the NVA. We did and they were pushed off, for the proverbial parking lot improvement program. The point being, the 173d was damn near anhillated in the effort, which at the conclusion of which, units and personnel and equipment from all over RVN was involved. Those tough "little people" did not want to lose that hill and came within an inch of not losing their parking lot. I am much better now, thanks to my wife. I sleep alone, drink alone, listen to my Space Age music alone. I am somewhat more relaxed and thoughtful, but still have a problem with death as was evident in my response concerning the news about Jake. This morning I had to apologize to all involved, something I am also getting used to and grateful for the opportunity. But I am better now, "all better" and ready to fight for that old beautiful "Bald Eagle" pictured above , if asked to do so. So go on with your old bad self, "Political Chick" and "continue to march" and that is an order from your loving and kind "old" First Sergeant. Love ya!

 

[PoliticalChic]

I speak from experience Political Chick. I have struggled with post stress for many years now. I simply thought it was that I missed the Army after retirement. Turns everything upside down and backwards. Right becomes wrong and wrong right. It is not all nightmares and dreams of glory. I have killed my share of the enemy. I think of them, all, much less now, if at all. I'm better now. Last night bear513 wrote of Jake Starkey being "gone". I thought about Jake and the crap he and I have spoken about, argued over, and I thought of him, saddened by the fact that 513 reported him "gone". Then I found out it was all banter and bullshit! I drank myself to sleep. Waking up this morning, I asked my other self "Timmy" to address the folks here at USMB who participated last night in the roasting of Jake. "Timmy" declined and said take out your own trash and do that load of laundry. Kind of reminded me of a time in RVN, on a hill renamed from 913 to "Hamburger Hill". A fairly small unit from the 173d Airborne assaulted that hill for several days trying to dislodge a much larger unit of the NVA. We did and they were pushed off, for the proverbial parking lot improvement program. The point being, the 173d was damn near anhillated in the effort, which at the conclusion of which, units and personnel and equipment from all over RVN was involved. Those tough "little people" did not want to lose that hill and came within an inch of not losing their parking lot. I am much better now, thanks to my wife. I sleep alone, drink alone, listen to my Space Age music alone. I am somewhat more relaxed and thoughtful, but still have a problem with death as was evident in my response concerning the news about Jake. This morning I had to apologize to all involved, something I am also getting used to and grateful for the opportunity. But I am better now, "all better" and ready to fight for that old beautiful "Bald Eagle" pictured above , if asked to do so. So go on with your old bad self, "Political Chick" and "continue to march" and that is an order from your loving and kind "old" First Sergeant. Love ya!

That post of yours was what I hoped to spotlight with today's thread, but I didn't come close to what you did in a single post.

Bless you, and may you, and everyone who suffers the same, find peace.

And thank you again for sharing that.

 

[I amso IR]

I speak from experience Political Chick. I have struggled with post stress for many years now. I simply thought it was that I missed the Army after retirement. Turns everything upside down and backwards. Right becomes wrong and wrong right. It is not all nightmares and dreams of glory. I have killed my share of the enemy. I think of them, all, much less now, if at all. I'm better now. Last night bear513 wrote of Jake Starkey being "gone". I thought about Jake and the crap he and I have spoken about, argued over, and I thought of him, saddened by the fact that 513 reported him "gone". Then I found out it was all banter and bullshit! I drank myself to sleep. Waking up this morning, I asked my other self "Timmy" to address the folks here at USMB who participated last night in the roasting of Jake. "Timmy" declined and said take out your own trash and do that load of laundry. Kind of reminded me of a time in RVN, on a hill renamed from 913 to "Hamburger Hill". A fairly small unit from the 173d Airborne assaulted that hill for several days trying to dislodge a much larger unit of the NVA. We did and they were pushed off, for the proverbial parking lot improvement program. The point being, the 173d was damn near anhillated in the effort, which at the conclusion of which, units and personnel and equipment from all over RVN was involved. Those tough "little people" did not want to lose that hill and came within an inch of not losing their parking lot. I am much better now, thanks to my wife. I sleep alone, drink alone, listen to my Space Age music alone. I am somewhat more relaxed and thoughtful, but still have a problem with death as was evident in my response concerning the news about Jake. This morning I had to apologize to all involved, something I am also getting used to and grateful for the opportunity. But I am better now, "all better" and ready to fight for that old beautiful "Bald Eagle" pictured above , if asked to do so. So go on with your old bad self, "Political Chick" and "continue to march" and that is an order from your loving and kind "old" First Sergeant. Love ya!

That post of yours was what I hoped to spotlight with today's thread, but I didn't come close to what you did in a single post.

Bless you, and may you, and everyone who suffers the same, find peace.

And thank you again for sharing that.

It was my pleasure to share, tho I have never done so before. There comes a point when reality is really real. I have reached that point. It was my pleasure to serve my nation. I was a 17 year old kid when I enlisted on my 17th birthday. I was 27 years old at the time "H-hill". Many young punk faced troops lost those days of battle, some only barely 17/18. I mourn them as well as the NVA. They too were kids fresh from the rice paddies. And we killed them as quickly as possible as well as efficiently as possible. A marine general who was a critic of the battle declared the Army paid to steep a cost in the fight, and he was correct, except for one factor, The Marines had no dog in this fight. It was all Army, Air Force and ARVIN. Not a marine within 200 miles. So I simply considered the source and thought about their besieged outpost up on the DMZ. Poor bastards!

 

[Marion Morrison]

Of course, there are others who seamlessly re-entered civilian life, the veterans, who should be honored as well....we have the November holiday.

But this thread....remembering the third legion...warriors who have no holiday. Their return was not seamless.....many have injuries that can be seen....and many have those injuries not able to be seen, once called 'shell shock,' now Posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD).




1. War is an accepted and regular practice among hominids....Homo sapiens. No major religion has demanded an end to the practice, and, in fact, the oldest of our traditions memorializes a final one at Megiddo, Israel: a final battle between the forces of good vs. evil.

2. Social scientists attribute this.....avocation.....to our very nature. Zoologist and ethologist Desmond Morris writes, in his masterpiece, "The Naked Ape," that man is no different from many other animals who fight and kill.

In fact, the animal characteristic of tribalism leads to aggression and warfare. Almost as though we shy away from any discussion that imagines the end of all warfare, very little attention is given....purposely......to the effects on those who participate.....and survive.



3. Memorial day is reserved for those who did not return, or who returned and then perished.
It is not Veterans Day....the November day when all who served are honored.\
Even so....there is a category between the two,....

And there is not enough attention paid to this group.
Many return from war with wounds that cannot be seen....and are difficult to treat.
More Vietnam veterans have died of suicide than in the actual event of the war.


4. John Connolly writes poignantly about some of our veterans who didn't make it out of war unscathed....This is from his novel 'The Whisperers.'

".... Ronald spoke to me of suicides and homelessness; of addiction and waking nightmares; of men left without limbs who were struggling to receive full disability from the military; of the backlog of claims, 400,000 and counting; and of those whose scars were not visible, who were damaged psychologically but not physically, and whose sacrifice was therefore not recognized as yet by their government, for they were denied a Purple Heart. "


"... his small office, from which he was running Concerned Veterans of Maine. The walls were covered with clippings from newspapers, and tables of fatalities, and photographs. One, directly above Ronald’s computer, depicted a woman helping her injured son from his bed. The picture had been taken from behind, so that only the mother’s face was visible. It took me a moment to spot what was wrong with the photograph: almost half of the young man’s head was missing, and what was left was a network of scars and crevasses, like the surface of the moon. His mother’s face displayed a mixture of emotions too complex to interpret.


‘Grenade,’ said Ronald. ‘He lost forty percent of his brain. He’ll need constant care for the rest of his life. His mother, she doesn’t look young, does she?’ He said it as if noticing her for the first time, even though he must have stared at her every single day.

‘No, she doesn’t.’

And I wondered what would be better: for him to die before his mother, so that his pain could come to an end, and hers could take another, perhaps less wrenching, form; or for him to outlive her, so that she could have her time with him, and be a mother to him as she was when he was an infant, when the possibility of a life like this could only have come to her in a nightmare. The former would be best, I thought, for if he lived too long then she would be gone, and eventually he would become a shadow in the corner of a room, a name without a past, forgotten by others and with no memories of his own."


Memorial Day, 2017
Spare a prayer for those who returned.....sort of.

Idk about seamlessly. The first I learned about D-day and all that was when my uncle fell asleep watching TV and started having nightmares and crying like a child.

Sure he came back and started a business, but if he fell asleep he was right back there.

He was a big man, 6'2", heavy when I was his pall bearer too. Great man.

Very proper. He always said: "When you're going to church, dress like you're dressing for God".

America and the world would be a better place if there were more men like him.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Of course, there are others who seamlessly re-entered civilian life, the veterans, who should be honored as well....we have the November holiday.

But this thread....remembering the third legion...warriors who have no holiday. Their return was not seamless.....many have injuries that can be seen....and many have those injuries not able to be seen, once called 'shell shock,' now Posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD).




1. War is an accepted and regular practice among hominids....Homo sapiens. No major religion has demanded an end to the practice, and, in fact, the oldest of our traditions memorializes a final one at Megiddo, Israel: a final battle between the forces of good vs. evil.

2. Social scientists attribute this.....avocation.....to our very nature. Zoologist and ethologist Desmond Morris writes, in his masterpiece, "The Naked Ape," that man is no different from many other animals who fight and kill.

In fact, the animal characteristic of tribalism leads to aggression and warfare. Almost as though we shy away from any discussion that imagines the end of all warfare, very little attention is given....purposely......to the effects on those who participate.....and survive.



3. Memorial day is reserved for those who did not return, or who returned and then perished.
It is not Veterans Day....the November day when all who served are honored.\
Even so....there is a category between the two,....

And there is not enough attention paid to this group.
Many return from war with wounds that cannot be seen....and are difficult to treat.
More Vietnam veterans have died of suicide than in the actual event of the war.


4. John Connolly writes poignantly about some of our veterans who didn't make it out of war unscathed....This is from his novel 'The Whisperers.'

".... Ronald spoke to me of suicides and homelessness; of addiction and waking nightmares; of men left without limbs who were struggling to receive full disability from the military; of the backlog of claims, 400,000 and counting; and of those whose scars were not visible, who were damaged psychologically but not physically, and whose sacrifice was therefore not recognized as yet by their government, for they were denied a Purple Heart. "


"... his small office, from which he was running Concerned Veterans of Maine. The walls were covered with clippings from newspapers, and tables of fatalities, and photographs. One, directly above Ronald’s computer, depicted a woman helping her injured son from his bed. The picture had been taken from behind, so that only the mother’s face was visible. It took me a moment to spot what was wrong with the photograph: almost half of the young man’s head was missing, and what was left was a network of scars and crevasses, like the surface of the moon. His mother’s face displayed a mixture of emotions too complex to interpret.


‘Grenade,’ said Ronald. ‘He lost forty percent of his brain. He’ll need constant care for the rest of his life. His mother, she doesn’t look young, does she?’ He said it as if noticing her for the first time, even though he must have stared at her every single day.

‘No, she doesn’t.’

And I wondered what would be better: for him to die before his mother, so that his pain could come to an end, and hers could take another, perhaps less wrenching, form; or for him to outlive her, so that she could have her time with him, and be a mother to him as she was when he was an infant, when the possibility of a life like this could only have come to her in a nightmare. The former would be best, I thought, for if he lived too long then she would be gone, and eventually he would become a shadow in the corner of a room, a name without a past, forgotten by others and with no memories of his own."


Memorial Day, 2017
Spare a prayer for those who returned.....sort of.

Idk about seamlessly. The first I learned about D-day and all that was when my uncle fell asleep watching TV and started having nightmares and crying like a child.

Sure he came back and started a business, but if he fell asleep he was right back there.

He was a big man, 6'2", heavy when I was his pall bearer too. Great man.

Very proper. He always said: "When you're going to church, dress like you're dressing for God".

America and the world would be a better place if there were more men like him.

"Idk about seamlessly. The first I learned about D-day and all that was when my uncle fell asleep and started having nightmares and crying like a child."

Your uncle was in that third group that I mentioned....not those who seamlessly re-entered civilian life.

He paid a great price to serve our country.

God bless.

 

[Marion Morrison]

 

[midcan5]

"Don't Say 'Thank You For Your Service' This Monday"

Don't Say 'Thank You For Your Service' This Monday

To my fellow vets appreciate this day.

 

[PoliticalChic]

"Don't Say 'Thank You For Your Service' This Monday"

Don't Say 'Thank You For Your Service' This Monday

To my fellow vets appreciate this day.

1. Memorial Day is not directed to or for veterans.
It is a recognition of the nearly one and a half million Americans who have died in service to this nation.
So.....although the spirit of your post is admirable, it is misdirected.

Veterans Day is in November.



2. I posted this thread on Sunday....not on Memorial Day for a specific reason: it is a request that we remember those who have lived, but have suffered grievous injury, not always visible or treatable injury....those with PTSD.



If you have the time, or interest, please re-read the thread, and you will see the difference.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Today is Memorial Day, a day of remembrance.



"The first soldier to give his life in service to America was Isaac Davis, a gunsmith shot through the heart at the Battle of Concord on April 19, 1775. The most recent was Kyle Milliken, a Navy senior chief petty officer killed May 5 by Islamist irregulars near Mogadishu, Somalia. Overall, some 1.2 million young Americans have died while under arms, more than one-half of them during the Civil War.

Monday is their day—Memorial Day, when Americans traditionally take a moment to hold in their hearts a thought, a prayer, for those who, as Abraham Lincoln noted, “gave the last full measure of devotion” to the ideals expressed so profoundly in the Declaration of Independence.

A document worth dying for, in other words."
Blood Redemption




And, it is an opportune time for all of those mislead by government schooling, and Liberal secularism, to recall that the ideals expressed so profoundly in the Declaration of Independence include a religiosity that the Left works assiduously to remove from the public arena.

There are four references to ‘Divine’ in Declaration of Independence:

1) in first paragraph ‘Laws of Nature and of Nature’s God,’

2) next paragraph ‘endowed by their Creator,”

3) Supreme Judge of the world,

and 4) ‘divine’ Providence, last paragraph.

This is important because our historic documents memorialize a government based on individuals born with inalienable rights, by, in various references, by the Divine, or Nature’s God, or their Creator, or the Supreme Judge, or divine Providence.

God Bless America.

 

[debbiedowner]

 

[boedicca]

Heartbreaking and beautiful:

Pulitzer Prize winning photo “Husband’s final request” (Story)

 

[task0778]

As a military vet, this isn't my day, that comes in November. This day is for those who made the ultimate sacrifice, who gave their lives in service to their country, right or wrong. And IMHO not just the military, but also the police, firefighters, anyone who willingly went into harms way to protect and serve the rest of us. People may say "Thank you for your service, and I will respond with a 'You're Welcome', but the real heroes who deserve that gratitude lie in graves across the country and across the world.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Well done video.
Thank you.

But....six months early for Veterans Day.

 

[I amso IR]

Even i, have learned from this thread. This thread epitomizes my lack of understanding. I, all by myself, me alone, forget those working around, with, or by me. Myself alone! Never mind the particlars, they are accepted doctrine. Only he or she who pulls the trigger causes the death of another. Right church, wrong pew! Adolph Hitler never sighted in on an individual, just the little guy following orders! Certainly not Uncle Adolph himself. You hypocrite's, you children!

 

[RASTAMEN]

Military Troops Fighting For Oil Not Freedom

In this letter, I'm writing about how our military troops are fighting for oil not our freedom.

Dear future president,

Let me start off by saying congratulations on being elected. But, the US is facing many problems that need fixing. One problem is how our military is not fighting for our freedom, but for oil. Did you know that our soldiers are dying for oil overseas? Well, i know life is not fair, but, this is just plain out wrong. How do you live with people that believe that they are fighting and risking our lives for our freedom but all it is for is for oil? “Yeah! Wake up America! Your sons and daughters are dying for nothing! This war is not about freedom or stopping terrorism. Bring us home now! We are dying for oil and corporate greed!” That is a quote from an interview with a soldier that was in the military for 20 years. This can be found at US SOLDIERS TO AMERICA: We’re Dying For Oil And Corporate Greed!''. He was a high up rank, and he saw things that most of us have never seen and probably will never see.

“Yes, the Iraq War was a war for oil, and it was a war with winners: Big Oil. It has been 10 years since Operation Iraqi Freedom's bombs first landed in Baghdad. And while most of the U.S.-led coalition forces have long since gone, Western oil companies are only getting started.Before the 2003 invasion, Iraq's domestic oil industry was fully nationalized and closed to Western oil companies. A decade of war later, it is largely privatized and utterly dominated by foreign firms. From ExxonMobil and Chevron to BP and Shell, the West's largest oil companies have set up shop in Iraq. So have a slew of American oil service companies, including Halliburton, the Texas-based firm Dick Cheney ran before becoming George W. Bush's running mate in 2000.The war is the one and only reason for this long sought and newly acquired access.Oil was not the only goal of the Iraq War, but it was certainly the central one.” This is part of an article from Why the war in Iraq was fought for Big Oil - CNN.com which can be found from the first paragraph down to the sixth. If our troops are over in foreign countries such as Iraq and Afghanistan and are dying for mostly oil and not our freedom, then they should be sent home to their families so that they can see each other. If you take that away from them, then you should have better healthcare and benefits. “Oh, I almost forgot Afghanistan. No, al-Qaeda was never going to invade and occupy the United States and take away our freedom. Neither was the Taliban. The 9/11 attacks were retaliation for actions taken by the U.S. government in the Middle East prior to 9/11. The Taliban government never attacked the United States or even threatened to do so.” This can be found at American Soldiers Did Not Die Defending Our Freedom - The Future of Freedom Foundation in the 2nd to last paragraph. Because of what happened with us trying to get the oil from the Middle East, terrorist attacks took place on US soil. .I have had family in the military. My aunt and uncle were in the navy and my cousin was in the marines. They have had seen some pretty bad things that happened when they were deployed. They have had nightmares because of what they have seen. They are trying to forget what they have seen and only remember the good things that happened. This is not only because they were in some sort of conflict with the so called “enemies” but the reason why they were in that conflict. I have friend that have been in the military for a couple of years. They have been sent letters to resign because of what is going on overseas. That is not fair how people want to protect and defend our country for what it is and not for oil. People are dying overseas for oil. I know that the US doesn’t want to have any more blood on our home soil because of the war for oil.

Sincerely,

A concerned citizen of the United States

Jerremy Aguilar

 

[PoliticalChic]

 

[RASTAMEN]

Path to recovering from PTSD........STOP Republican inspired wars of OCCUPATION and Imperialism!

 

[PoliticalChic]

Path to recovering from PTSD........STOP Republican inspired wars of OCCUPATION and Imperialism!

Occupation?

When in England at a fairly large conference, Colin Powell was asked by the Archbishop of Canterbury if our plans for Iraq were just an example of empire building by George Bush.

He answered by saying that, “Over the years, the United States has sent many of its fine young men and women into great peril to fight for freedom beyond our borders. The only amount of land we have ever asked for in return is enough to bury those that did not return.”



You certainly have burnished your reputation as a low-grade moron.

 

[RASTAMEN]

Path to recovering from PTSD........STOP Republican inspired wars of OCCUPATION and Imperialism!

Occupation?

When in England at a fairly large conference, Colin Powell was asked by the Archbishop of Canterbury if our plans for Iraq were just an example of empire building by George Bush.

He answered by saying that, “Over the years, the United States has sent many of its fine young men and women into great peril to fight for freedom beyond our borders. The only amount of land we have ever asked for in return is enough to bury those that did not return.”



You certainly have burnished your reputation as a low-grade moron.

Republican Presidents and the GOP just love ENDLESS WARS........which equal endless PTSD's.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Path to recovering from PTSD........STOP Republican inspired wars of OCCUPATION and Imperialism!

Occupation?

When in England at a fairly large conference, Colin Powell was asked by the Archbishop of Canterbury if our plans for Iraq were just an example of empire building by George Bush.

He answered by saying that, “Over the years, the United States has sent many of its fine young men and women into great peril to fight for freedom beyond our borders. The only amount of land we have ever asked for in return is enough to bury those that did not return.”



You certainly have burnished your reputation as a low-grade moron.

Republican Presidents and the GOP just love ENDLESS WARS........which equal endless PTSD's.

JFK and LBJ were hardly Republicans, you moron.