Zone1 maybe we should hand the occupied Ukranian territories to Moscow after all?

[luiza]

How did that strategy of invading Ukraine work out?

See you still are in Denier mode , or , as we say , Arsehole mode .
Russia pre-empted the Donbas invasion planned for March 1 ,2022 .
They then launched an SMO which so far has effectively restored Ukraine back to Moscow's safekeeping and now they will wrap up the loose ends, having despatched over 500 000 US and UAF fighters to the heavenly battleground and stripped around 40 US paid for and built bio labs of their evil work .
Other details on request . SAE please .

 

[luiza]

Ukraine that has an invading Army in its midst

What makes you think they will ever quit?

Zilch remaining .
No leader.
No troops .
No guns .
No ammunition .
No money
No hope .

 

[ESay]

Ukraine that has an invading Army in its midst

What makes you think they will ever quit?

I am pretty sure that the Putin regime will eventually fail. Maybe not with Putin, but with his successor. These idiots never learn. There will be another Gorbachev, perestroika, loss of territories, social transformation etc.

 

[martybegan]

Congress is rightfully supporting Biden
Better to provide aid to Ukraine than to spend trillions for OUR TROOPS to do the fighting and dying..

Like we did in Vietnam, Kuwait, Afghanistan and Iraq

The Biden doctrine is working

I wouldn't call it "working"

It's led to a stalemate, one that continues to destabilize the entire planet.

I want Ukraine to win, but right now there is nothing preventing Russia from keeping this up for years.

 

[martybegan]

I am pretty sure that the Putin regime will eventually fail. Maybe not with Putin, but with his successor. These idiots never learn. There will be another Gorbachev, perestroika, loss of territories, social transformation etc.

Who says whoever replaces Putin won't be worse?

 

[ESay]

Who says whoever replaces Putin won't be worse?

No one. It may well be that his 'replacement' will be worse.

 

[peacefan]

Ukraine that has an invading Army in its midst

What makes you think they will ever quit?

Trump came up with a pretty good solution to that particular dilemma :

say to the Russians: we're gonna give the Ukranians more arms than you've ever seen if you don't return to the negotiating table and hammer out a deal.
say to the Ukranians: we're gonna withhold weaponry from you if you don't return to the negotiating table and hammer out a deal.
and mean both those statements, be fully prepared to back those statements up.

 

[martybegan]

Trump came up with a pretty good solution to that particular dilemma :

say to the Russians: we're gonna give the Ukranians more arms than you've ever seen if you don't return to the negotiating table and hammer out a deal.
say to the Ukranians: we're gonna withhold weaponry from you if you don't return to the negotiating table and hammer out a deal.
and mean both those statements, be fully prepared to back those statements up.

Right now there is no possible deal. Russia wants Donbas and the Crimea. Ukraine wants Donbas and the Crimea.

 

[peacefan]

Right now there is no possible deal. Russia wants Donbas and the Crimea. Ukraine wants Donbas and the Crimea.

all Russia needs to do is protect the sea of Azov and that old naval base of theirs in Crimea, and thus : all lands around those areas and the lands leading to it.
that is reasonable according to my own interpretation of multipolaric pie-sharing.

 

[martybegan]

all Russia needs to do is protect the sea of Azov and that old naval base of theirs in Crimea, and thus : all lands around those areas and the lands leading to it.
that is reasonable according to my own interpretation of multipolaric pie-sharing.

Why do those lands "belong to it"?

They had to take it by force in 2014, and are now trying to take the rest.

 

[peacefan]

Why do those lands "belong to it"?

They had to take it by force in 2014, and are now trying to take the rest.

because protecting the entire Black Sea and Sea of Azov is of vital tactical and strategic military interest to the Moscovians!

 

[martybegan]

because protecting the entire Black Sea and Sea of Azov is of vital tactical and strategic military interest to the Moscovians!

They have other areas of coastline on the Black Sea, they don't need the Crimea.

 

[peacefan]

They have other areas of coastline on the Black Sea, they don't need the Crimea.

that Sebastopol naval base in Crimea has been around for over a hundred years and is a sore spot in the Russian ego and sense of security!

 

[peacefan]

multi-polarity starts at mutual respect.

 

[martybegan]

because protecting the entire Black Sea and Sea of Azov is of vital tactical and strategic military interest to the Moscovians!

They can do that from Rostov on Don with a passage agreement out of the Sea of Azov.

 

[martybegan]

that Sebastopol naval base in Crimea has been around for over a hundred years and is a sore spot in the Russian ego and sense of security!

Tough for them. When everything was re-sorted after WWII is was given to the Ukraine.

 

[peacefan]

They can do that from Rostov on Don with a passage agreement out of the Sea of Azov.

oh come on.. that's not nearly as easy or relaxed as having a foothold in Sebastopol.

 

[martybegan]

oh come on.. that's not nearly as easy or relaxed as having a foothold in Sebastopol.

Which they don't deserve, it's Ukrainian territory.

It was given to them during the Poles/Germans/Ukrainians/Russians shuffle done right after WW II.

 

[peacefan]

Which they don't deserve, it's Ukrainian territory.

It was given to them during the Poles/Germans/Ukrainians/Russians shuffle done right after WW II.

well, i counter that with :
for the defense of Moscow, they DO deserve a solid foothold on the entire Black Sea and Sea of Azov.

 

[martybegan]

well, i counter that with :
for the defense of Moscow, they DO deserve a solid foothold on the entire Black Sea and Sea of Azov.

Moscow is nowhere near the Black Sea.