thanatos144
Gold Member
These conversations are absurd because pro abortion people always speak of women as if they can't control their libido
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These conversations are absurd because pro abortion people always speak of women as if they can't control their libido
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CaféAuLait;8566937 said:This is not just the males responsibility, females can get snipped as well, yes and avoid 'choice'?
yes but as a male i can only be 100 percent sure of not fathering a child
by
1- refraining
or
2 getting fixed
absent a medical record there is not a 100 percent surety
of not fathering a child because a female claimed to be snipped
If a woman has sex with a man, she knows full well that pregnancy is a possible outcome.
the male should assume that is a possibility as well
IF men have equal responsibility, they should have equal rights. A choice.
they do
the choice is either to refrain or take precaution it insure there
will not be a pregnancy
or roll the dice
If you read back, my argument is about men who have taken responsibility and a pregnancy has happened after using protection and or men who have been "tricked" into pregnancy, which does happen at times.
Women have an abundance of methods at their fingertips, abortion, condoms, RU486, the morning after pill, surgical sterilants, safe haven, adoption, etc. In fact there is a big problem with Utah as we speak who strip fathers of their rights when women decide to adopt a child out where a man has explicitly said he wants to father this child. Google it, it's pretty crazy, but I digress. It just seems to me, men and their feelings are disregarded, too easily and their choices are not as diverse as females are.
Men should have a choice, especially if in a relationship where they have taken precautions and or expressed they do not want children.
What it boils down to is generations of teaching kids men are cheating dogs. Girls are taught from a young age to have no respect for men and to treat them as breathing wallets
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CaféAuLait;8566937 said:If you read back, my argument is about men who have taken responsibility and a pregnancy has happened after using protection and or men who have been "tricked" into pregnancy, which does happen at times.
Women have an abundance of methods at their fingertips, abortion, condoms, RU486, the morning after pill, surgical sterilants, safe haven, adoption, etc. In fact there is a big problem with Utah as we speak who strip fathers of their rights when women decide to adopt a child out where a man has explicitly said he wants to father this child. Google it, it's pretty crazy, but I digress. It just seems to me, men and their feelings are disregarded, too easily and their choices are not as diverse as females are.
Men should have a choice, especially if in a relationship where they have taken precautions and or expressed they do not want children.
What it boils down to is generations of teaching kids men are cheating dogs. Girls are taught from a young age to have no respect for men and to treat them as breathing wallets
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Tell it to the dead beat dads.
Yes, there are dead beat mothers too but no where near as many. Way too many men believe they have no responsibility to support their own children.
What it boils down to is generations of teaching kids men are cheating dogs. Girls are taught from a young age to have no respect for men and to treat them as breathing wallets
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Tell it to the dead beat dads.
Yes, there are dead beat mothers too but no where near as many. Way too many men believe they have no responsibility to support their own children.
How little you think of women of disturbing.
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What it boils down to is generations of teaching kids men are cheating dogs. Girls are taught from a young age to have no respect for men and to treat them as breathing wallets
Tell it to the dead beat dads.
Yes, there are dead beat mothers too but no where near as many. Way too many men believe they have no responsibility to support their own children.
How little you think of women of disturbing.
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It wasn't me who wrote this -
What it boils down to is generations of teaching kids men are cheating dogs. Girls are taught from a young age to have no respect for men and to treat them as breathing wallets
You have a right to not put the unwanted baby there in the first place.
If the woman did not want a baby she has the same responsibility not to get pregnant. The only correct, equal and just way is to give BOTH the choice. As it is if a man wants the child he has no choice about the woman getting the abortion. So it is only fair that if the woman wants the child and the man does not. He should have the choice to not be responsible for a child. Same as the woman has.
I mean, what the heck is going to deter a guy from getting 50 women pregnant? The deterrents on the female side are obvious (they'd have to face pregnancy/birth, or a horrible abortion), but what about men?
Even today, with laws that make dads pay for their children we still have an epidemic of Deadbeat dads (especially in poor, urban areas). How will your proposal affect this situation?
If the woman did not want a baby she has the same responsibility not to get pregnant. The only correct, equal and just way is to give BOTH the choice. As it is if a man wants the child he has no choice about the woman getting the abortion. So it is only fair that if the woman wants the child and the man does not. He should have the choice to not be responsible for a child. Same as the woman has.
I mean, what the heck is going to deter a guy from getting 50 women pregnant? The deterrents on the female side are obvious (they'd have to face pregnancy/birth, or a horrible abortion), but what about men?
Even today, with laws that make dads pay for their children we still have an epidemic of Deadbeat dads (especially in poor, urban areas). How will your proposal affect this situation?
What deters a woman from doing the same? What deters a woman from having sex and getting pregnant with multiple men to get support? Women have just as much responsibility NOT to get pregnant as the man does. It is only equal that if a woman can choose she is not ready for a child. Without the consent of a man {and I agree}. A man should have the same right. That is equality. It is just as wrong holding the man emotionally, mentally and financially responsible. When they do not want a child. As it would be a woman. Have you heard about these insane stories? This is how idiotic it is getting.
Women Can Now Use Sperm From Oral Sex To Impregnate Themselves & Collect Child Support ? ThisIsYourConscience.com
Judge rules Kansas sperm donor DOES have to pay child support because lesbian couple performed procedure at home without a doctor | Mail Online
CaféAuLait;8566937 said:This is not just the males responsibility, females can get snipped as well, yes and avoid 'choice'?
yes but as a male i can only be 100 percent sure of not fathering a child
by
1- refraining
or
2 getting fixed
absent a medical record there is not a 100 percent surety
of not fathering a child because a female claimed to be snipped
If a woman has sex with a man, she knows full well that pregnancy is a possible outcome.
the male should assume that is a possibility as well
IF men have equal responsibility, they should have equal rights. A choice.
they do
the choice is either to refrain or take precaution it insure there
will not be a pregnancy
or roll the dice
If you read back, my argument is about men who have taken responsibility and a pregnancy has happened after using protection and or men who have been "tricked" into pregnancy, which does happen at times.
Women have an abundance of methods at their fingertips, abortion, condoms, RU486, the morning after pill, surgical sterilants, safe haven, adoption, etc. In fact there is a big problem with Utah as we speak who strip fathers of their rights when women decide to adopt a child out where a man has explicitly said he wants to father this child. Google it, it's pretty crazy, but I digress. It just seems to me, men and their feelings are disregarded, too easily and their choices are not as diverse as females are.
Men should have a choice, especially if in a relationship where they have taken precautions and or expressed they do not want children.
What it boils down to is generations of teaching kids men are cheating dogs. Girls are taught from a young age to have no respect for men and to treat them as breathing wallets
tapatalk post
A husband and father has the same legal rights over his children outside their mother's womb as his wife. So why wouldn't he have a 50% say/right when they're still inside the womb?
Abotion should require both mother's and father's consent/permisison.
A husband and father has the same legal rights over his children outside their mother's womb as his wife. So why wouldn't he have a 50% say/right when they're still inside the womb?
Abortion should require both mother's and father's consent/permission.
A husband and father has the same legal rights over his children outside their mother's womb as his wife. So why wouldn't he have a 50% say/right when they're still inside the womb?
Abotion should require both mother's and father's consent/permisison.
t would be reasonable to conclude as a general matter that the father's interest in the welfare of the child and the mother's interest are equal.
Before birth, however, the issue takes on a very different cast. It is an inescapable biological fact that state regulation with respect to the child a woman is carrying will have a far greater impact on the mother's liberty than on the father's. The effect of state regulation on a woman's protected liberty is doubly deserving of scrutiny in such a case, as the State has touched not only upon the private sphere of the family but upon the very bodily integrity of the pregnant woman. The Court has held that "when the wife and the husband disagree on this decision, the view of only one of the two marriage partners can prevail. Inasmuch as it is the woman who physically bears the child and who is the more directly and immediately affected by the pregnancy, as between the two, the balance weighs in her favor." This conclusion rests upon the basic nature of marriage and the nature of our Constitution: "[T]he marital couple is not an independent entity with a mind and heart of its own, but an association of two individuals each with a separate intellectual and emotional makeup. If the right of privacy means anything, it is the right of the individual, married or single, to be free from unwarranted governmental intrusion into matters so fundamentally affecting a person as the decision whether to bear or beget a child." The Constitution protects individuals, men and women alike, from unjustified state interference, even when that interference is enacted into law for the benefit of their spouses.
Planned Parenthood of Southeastern Pa. v. Casey, 505 U.S. 833 (1992)
damn good post19 years ago, I held our daughter's life in my hands. Some of you know the story already, but for those who don't...
The first ultrasound revealed obvious signs of Downs Syndrome, and the doctor told us to go down to the coffee shop to "discuss our options".
And there we sat. Staring at each other in disbelief. I was fucking speechless. I had no clue what was going through my wife's head. So I waited for her to make the first move. That was the longest moment of my life.
Three scenarios presented themselves to me....
In my mind, I envisioned our lives immersed in servitude and poverty.
I also envisioned our lives as they existed before we walked into THE hospital that morning. Parents!
Cool.
And finally, I pictured us as the carefree lovers we were when we first met, and how with one word from me it could all return to the carefree days.
And yet, I waited. For the host to speak.
Her words changed our lives forever.... "you take what life gives you".
That so fucking blew me away that I didn't care what the future would bring for us.
Eight months later she gave birth to a perfectly (albeit premature) healthy child.
She graduates in May and is on her way to college in the fall.
So, fuck you people of "choice", and your Supreme Court-given right to slaughter at will.
A husband and father has the same legal rights over his children outside their mother's womb as his wife. So why wouldn't he have a 50% say/right when they're still inside the womb?
Abotion should require both mother's and father's consent/permisison.
A husband and father has the same legal rights over his children outside their mother's womb as his wife. So why wouldn't he have a 50% say/right when they're still inside the womb?
Abotion should require both mother's and father's consent/permisison.
It is the position of prochoice people that abortion is not murder. The fetus before viability outside the womb does not have a right to life that trumps the will of the potential mother. Thus, the pregnant female may legally use abortion as a method of birth control if she decides that she does not want the responsibilities of a child for any reason. She may even get an abortion against the wishes of the potential father.
However, if the male does not want a child, the female can go through with the pregnancy anyway. The male currently has no choice at this point but the female does. The male could be on the hook for 18 years of child support if the female has the baby.
I purpose that if a fetus is not a baby, not a legally protected human life, then the male should be able to op out of his responsibility for the pregnancy. He should be able to legally inform the female that if she does not use the available contraception of abortion, then she is responsible for the child that is born as a consequence of the pregnancy.
Prochoice people, am I wrong? Why or why not?