Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

[WillowTree]

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

Incorrect. Your state is below average in fiscal stability. My state is far above average! You are still the loser.

 

[sealybobo]

View attachment 139890

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

Incorrect. Your state is below average in fiscal stability. My state is far above average! You are still the loser.

View attachment 139890

What state are you in?

 

[sealybobo]

View attachment 139890

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

Incorrect. Your state is below average in fiscal stability. My state is far above average! You are still the loser.

View attachment 139890

Is that the only thing you are measuring? Fiscal Stability?

 

[Skull Pilot]

I totally disagree regarding their labor costs making their business model unsupportable....

Toyota, paid their workers MORE with their bonuses, than the UAE workers in 2006/7....I posted an article on this the other day...

THIS MEANS that it is purely their business model in regards to product, that is at fault.....

I am not saying they DO NOT get paid too much for what their company is producing, but what i am saying is that if toyota could pay their employees $30 bucks an hour verses the UAW's $27 bucks an hour with their bonuses, and Toyota is NOT being strapped by having to pay these salaries, then this means THAT with the RIGHT PRODUCT, that SELLS at a good turn over rate and gross margin, employee high hourly rates can be supported, while still being profitable.

"Sales heals all troubles" when it comes to retail....even if at a lower gross margin, if the sales increase is big enough!

sales support the proration of employee costs....

sales supports the proration of all overhead costs... etc.

And the only way to increase sales is to have product that customers want to buy...

(Though there is another old saying that there NEVER is a bad product, but ONLY the WRONG retail price) So if something isn't selling, it is not necessarily because it is wrong, but because you have not priced it agressively enough...not priced it at the price that the product would ''sell it'' to the consumer.

Basically, if the Big three were hell on wheels and their product was selling and on fire... they could support even HIGHER salaries and compensation costs than what they are held to today.

BUT, their product is not up to par yet....they don't have at the right price, what customers want, thus the salaries for their employees negotiated in one of their "up" periods are extremely high for what they are selling "today".....

So, one of my solutions to this would be to set their salaries more on a commission or bonus structure....so that in slow times they get paid less and in booming times where they produce more....they get paid more.

care

It's not just the hourly wage. It's the total cost of labor.

A Tale of Two Auto Plants - WSJ.com

In Arlington, GM pays union-scale wages of $26.50 to $30.50 an hour to its 2,800 hourly workers there. On average, GM pays $81.18 an hour in wages and benefits to U.S. hourly workers, including pension and retiree medical costs. At that rate, labor costs per vehicle at Arlington are about $1,800, based on the Harbour Consulting estimate of labor hours per vehicle.


In San Antonio, Toyota will use non-union labor and will start its 1,600 hourly workers at $15.50 to $20.33 per hour, which will grow after three years to $21 to $25. Harbour Consulting President Ron Harbour estimates Toyota's total hourly U.S. labor costs, with benefits, at about $35 an hour -- less than half of GM's rates

Granted, this is an old article but it is still relevant.

One way to reduce retirement costs is to switch from defined benefit plans like old style pensions to defined contribution plans like 401Ks. Even with a generous company match the latter is much less expensive to support. But don't expect the UAW to go for that.

I'm all for piece work maybe even with a guaranteed base salary. Get paid a base and get paid more for what you produce over the required base production. That works for me. But again, don't expect the UAW to go for that either.

Here is what Republicans basically did. They fucked the middle class by sending all those high paying union jobs overseas. Lets say those jobs paid $35 hr. You bitches said that wasn't sustainable, but you never fucking mention when the executives pay themselves the same exact amount if not more than what we are taking about with the workers. Do you notice that? You never cry that the CEO pay is making the car unaffordable. You only cry about the workers. Now you say you are pro workers?

Ok, so here is what Republicans did basically. So they sent $35 hr jobs overseas and everyone who lost their job went to Walmart and got a $10 hr. job. Trump is bringing back $15 hr manufacturing jobs. So he's not exactly making America great again. He's just making it better than before Bushanomics/NAFTA fucked us. The idea is with illegals gone companies will eventually have to pay more than $15 to keep workers. I hope it works. I doubt it but since you won the election lets try it your way.

I am not a republican and I employ people right here in this country.

I didn't vote for Trump


And CEO pay does not have any effect on me whatsoever. I have never made less money because some CEO got a raise. I don't pay more for anything than I think it's worth.

You assume that if CEO pay gets cut that people will make more and you are wrong it would just mean more profit for the company and its stockholders.

SO instead of whining that other people get paid more than you why don't you make yourself worth more money?

And why are you responding to a post from 9 fucking years ago?

 

[WillowTree]

View attachment 139890

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

Incorrect. Your state is below average in fiscal stability. My state is far above average! You are still the loser.

View attachment 139890

Is that the only thing you are measuring? Fiscal Stability?

Ewe said ewe were back and better than ever! Below average in fiscal stability is better than ever?

 

[WillowTree]

 

[Moonglow]

View attachment 139890

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

Incorrect. Your state is below average in fiscal stability. My state is far above average! You are still the loser.

View attachment 139890

That map is hardly correct, Oklahoma is in deep doo-doo with finances...Along with Kanass...Nice, but no cee-gar ..

 

[WillowTree]

View attachment 139890

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

Incorrect. Your state is below average in fiscal stability. My state is far above average! You are still the loser.

View attachment 139890

That map is hardly correct, Oklahoma is in deep doo-doo with finances...Along with Kanass...Nice, but no cee-gar ..

Here is link to text!

Ranking the States by Fiscal Condition 2017 Edition




Do you have one that shows different results?

 

[Moonglow]

View attachment 139890

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

Opinion | Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

See loser, we didn't take your advice and Michigan is back and better than ever.
Michigan's unemployment rate now under 4 percent

Thanks Obama

Incorrect. Your state is below average in fiscal stability. My state is far above average! You are still the loser.

View attachment 139890

That map is hardly correct, Oklahoma is in deep doo-doo with finances...Along with Kanass...Nice, but no cee-gar ..

Here is link to text!

Ranking the States by Fiscal Condition 2017 Edition




Do you have one that shows different results?

I need a map to know what states are like that I live next to?

 

[eagle1462010]

Nobody wants the Big 3 automakers to fail. Nobody wants a city like Detroit to go further down the tube.

However, putting a band aide on an open chest wound is not a solution. In a Republic it is not the tax payers responsibility to bail out private business for their own mismanagement or stupidity. If they can't make it on their own, then they should step down and someone else can come in and fill the void.

If they don't get their heads out of their asses, then nothing will change even with another bail out. They must rise our fall on their own.........That is the way it needs to be.

 

[Jomama]

Sealy, you realize that you did say; "...better than ever"? Incorrect by decades. Detroit used to be the land of riches and prosperity now it's an 85 year old former smoker/drinker who got released from hospice but is a mere shadow of his former self.

Clinton brought in NAFTA so try not to chew your tongue off blaming Rs for NAFTA.

As an industrial employer in US and Canada, I wish we had been more like Germany and Japan protecting its industrial base instead of giving it away to China. Everyone screwed that up, equally Dems and unions.

 

[Penelope]

Sealy, you realize that you did say; "...better than ever"? Incorrect by decades. Detroit used to be the land of riches and prosperity now it's an 85 year old former smoker/drinker who got released from hospice but is a mere shadow of his former self.

Clinton brought in NAFTA so try not to chew your tongue off blaming Rs for NAFTA.

As an industrial employer in US and Canada, I wish we had been more like Germany and Japan protecting its industrial base instead of giving it away to China. Everyone screwed that up, equally Dems and unions.

Actually Bush Sr started Nafta, Clinton just signed the bill. Detroit is now known as Gilbertville, and also Cleveland. Quicken Loans , who you probably never heard of, gave out many loans and sold them right away and then confiscated the empty houses , the land. Dan Gilbert has been buying up most of Detroit.

Manufacturing is not coming back to Detroit.

 

[WillowTree]

Detroit let herself go to shit! The unions priced themselves out of competition and Clinton gave away their jobs with his NAFTA treaty! Detroit became so corrupt and crime ridden that the whites fled, that was the taxpayibg base. They are in the suburbs and the inner city has very little tax revenue. Same thing is going on in Chicago!