it's very simple

Discussion in 'Middle East - General' started by Working Man, Jan 23, 2006.

  1. Working Man
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    Working Man Member

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    Forget about the global economy, there really is only one. That is China's.

    Ours is full of hopes and dreams, but that is about it.

    Look at the countries that have taken the bread and butter jobs from us. Shoes, clothes, forged products,etc... Are they not the ones harboring terrorists, or other anti US types??? I still say that China is helping North Korea. So in effect, we are helping the bad guys.

    You want to smother terrorism??? Cut off the funding. There is no reason we can't produce $39 cotton shirts here. No reason we can't make $80 shoes here. No reason we can't make $25 hydraulic jacks,,,, well wait on this one.. The F'n lawyers and their product liability crap... But, you get the drift..
     
  2. nosarcasm
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    nosarcasm Active Member

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    lawsuits are not a major cost factor in the manufacturing
    industry.

    Your answer to isolationism and tariffs would not work
    well for the large US based companies that operate
    world wide.
     
  3. Hobbit
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    Hobbit Senior Member

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    The primary answer is the tax code. If income and stealth taxes didn't cripple U.S. owned and operated businesses, jobs would flood to America faster than our seive-like southern fence could fill them.
     
  4. Mariner
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    Mariner Active Member

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    U.S. tax code is a mess. We could save a lot of money by simplifying it. But do you honestly think that with lower taxes, we'd suddenly have tons of jobs?

    I think it's a lot more complicated than that. Take a look at states within the U.S. that have aimed for a low tax "business-friendly" environment, such as Alabama. You can move your business to Alabama and pay a lot less in taxes than in Massachusetts. So how come Massachusetts is bursting with jobs, profits, and wealth? Because we have a more educated workforce, due in part to strong public education, good job training, and a decent safety net that picks people up when they fall down. Taxes can pay for things, in other words, that improve business for all. If India built better roads, for example, all its businesses would become more profitable immediately.

    China and other 3rd world countries outcompete us because they have minimal environmental and occupational safety rules, a very low standard of living, and a huge excess of workers who are therefore willing to accept lower wages. In America, people are expensive and things are cheap. In China and India, it's the other way around--you can pay someone to wash your floors every day for less than you'd pay for a vacuum cleaner.

    Over time, the 3rd world countries will develop 1st world tastes and demand 1st world safety and environmental controls. Then things will even out--but America may no longer be in the lead. We're simply unable to fill our science and technology slots with our home-grown talent. When the foreign pool dries up, we're history.

    Another way China is beating us now is thanks to this current Republican willingness to borrow and spend. China holds $250 billion of our foreign debt, almost all of it amassed during GW Bush. They cash in half of that tomorrow and our economy tanks. Hence, we can't take them to task about human rights abuses in Tibet, censorship, or other issues. I blame Bush and the Republican Party for being willing to sell out our independence that way. In ten years of controlling the budget process in Congress, the budget has risen from 1.5 to 2.5 trillion dollars. A billion dollars A DAY in interest payments. Living in fear of taxes, and on the international credit card, George Bush style.

    Mariner.
     
  5. Avatar4321
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    Avatar4321 Diamond Member Gold Supporting Member

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    I agree to a point. The Tax code is overly burdensome. But I think we also cant underestimate the extremely powerful unions who can also cripple companies and ironically destroy their own jobs. I have never understhood why a union will choose to refuse to endure cut backs rather than have everyone loose their jobs because the company goes bankrupt. Or why they will encourage employees to strike costing the business tons of money because they dont want to pay 2% of their medical insurance. Its absurd.

    On top of that we need to educate people on what raising the minimum wage does to the economy.
     
  6. Mariner
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    Mariner Active Member

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    Yes, unions over-reach sometimes. But historically unions were key to balancing the power of large corporations who treated their workers badly. 12-hour workdays were the norm in factories a century ago. Unionization created a big chunk of the middle class in this country, when it raised workers' salaries enough that a single worker could be breadwinner for the family (this lasted until tariffs against foreign goods, such as Japanese cars, were lifted). Certain industries and areas seem ripe for unionization now, from medicine to Walmart employees. The "physician's organization" I belong to, a sort of union, has successfully raised our salaries here much closer to the national norm. Previously, Harvard could trade on its prestige and pay physicians 1/2 or 1/3 what they could make elsewhere.

    Mariner.
     
  7. Hobbit
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    Hobbit Senior Member

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    Actually, one of the best state economies is Delaware, the most business friendly state in the union. Look how many companies are incorporated there. Massachussetts also has a booming economy not because of better public education. It's because Massachussetts has an infastructure that both supports and demands high jobs. It was one of the first places settled in this country, meaning it's grown into an urban powerhouse. That means that a lot of people live there and don't really want to move, not to mention the businesses and schools that have popped up over the years and really can't move. Areas that have been urban for a while always have a good economy, regardless of the tax code.

    However, the reason American companies move overseas is that if they're headquartered here, they must pay U.S. income taxes on everything they buy and must also pay accountants to make sure they pay their taxes correctly. If they headquarter overseas, they only pay U.S. income tax on what is sold here, and only pay taxes to the foreign country on what's sold there (for example, Germany has a value added tax that is refunded for any product sold overseas).
     
  8. Gunny
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    Gunny Gold Member

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    "Almost" a good post. But you just couldn't help posting that last paragraph taking a shot a Bush.

    :rolleyes:
     
  9. Working Man
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    Working Man Member

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    GW gets a shot because he deserves one. That boy had better start paying attention to where he is sailing this ship cause the rocks are ripping the hull out and water is pouring in!

    GW is giving our country away,, or is he just selling shares of our heritage and our future to the likes of China??? In this light he and Bill Clinton must be in competition to see who could whore the US out.

    GW, the whole house, the whole senate and the dopes that voted for liberals are the reasons why we are screwed. I don't see an appreciable number of politicians, nor the public clammering to make things better for the workforce, hence the economy.


    Discovery Channel is showing a program on Extreme Machines at this momment. The very iron mines we used to billed this country up in WW1 and WWII are being sold off to China. THis depletes our resources, fources OUR last manufacturing plants to compete unfairly, and makes us look like the third world country we USED to take advantage of... No, I am not bragging that we did, but now we are at a point where the shoe is on the other foot.. I don't like what I am seeing, and don't believe that we in the US are going to be "free" like we used to know it.

    For companies like Catapiller I send this thought,, SCREW YOU BASTARDS!!! You helped screw yourselves, and this country. Now you are going to be eaten up by the same monster you woke up from a dormant snooze.. Your company can't compete to buy the Iron ore pellets that your company needs to build equipment..You are going down...Up your tail pipes with your cheap Chink clothes too...
     
  10. ScreamingEagle
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    ScreamingEagle Gold Member

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    China is not going to "cash in" or else it will suffer economically as well.

    Free trade worldwide is our future. There can be no other way, otherwise we will artificially restrict ourselves into a corner. So what if old style manufacturing is taken over by third world countries? The American entrepreneur is our future - which is something liberals have a very hard time conceptualizing. In case you haven't noticed, America is now in the "information age" - a whole new paradigm. Let's not fear the changes that the future will bring, let's embrace them.
     

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