It's in the Bible!!!

Discussion in 'Religion and Ethics' started by konradv, Apr 8, 2011.

  1. konradv
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    konradv Gold Member

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    Originally in "Science & technology", I thought it should get some play here.
    Thanks to the OP, JBeukema.


    Did clay mould life's origins?

    Job 33:5 (KJV)

    Behold, I am according to thy wish in God's stead: I also am formed out of the clay.
     
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  2. Si modo
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    Si modo Diamond Member

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    If one assumes that the vermiculite they used is completely free of any biomaterials or of inorganics and/or organics not originating from biological systems, a completely bio-free naturally occuring inorganic material is able to induce asymmetry as a catalyst for organic reactions.

    That's a really big deal. Really.

    Thanks for posting.
     
  3. Si modo
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    Si modo Diamond Member

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    In English and as it relates to religion, what this means:

    In nature (read, biological systems) the molecules involved have this thing called chirality or handedness. If the molecules in a system have an equal amount of left handed molecules as right handed molecules, the system is said to be symmetric. However, biochemical systems are asymmetric having much more of a handedness, usually left handedness. In the laboratory, we can do all the reactions that a biosystem can do. If we want to do the reactions symmetrically (equal amounts of handedness) that's not a problem. But, if we want to do the reactions with asymmetry (more of left handedness, for example), we must induce that asymmetry in some manner.

    Asymmetric induction of biochemical reactions is realized by adding a catalyst with a one handedness/chirality in excess or reaction components with one handedness/chirality in excess. And, these materials always have had their origins in something made biologically.

    Because of that, the origin of an excess handedness required in biosystems has only ever been repeated in the lab from materials originating from something living. The ultimate origin of excess handedness has never been from something completely earthly and inorganic and independent of anything living.

    Many favoring "Intelligent Design" have used this fact - necessary handedness excess coming only from already living systems - as a basis for the explanation that there must be some God providing this asymmetric induction.

    This may rock their world as here is an apparent method of inducing asymmetry from an earthly, inorganic, non-living source.
     
  4. Marie888
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    Marie888 † † †

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    Just a note: It is my personal opinion that upon the study of the flagellum, particularily the bacterial flagellum, that men are without excuse to NOT believe in God. It's got like a little rotary engine. Impossible for that to just come from "nothing."

    Flagellum
    Flagellum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    As for clay:
    However the Lord did it, we may study and find out things, but we still have not even touched on the surface on the complexity of His Creation. It is awesome, indeed. Aye, we are the clay, He is the Potter.

     
  5. konradv
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    konradv Gold Member

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    How do you know it's impossible? They say the same thing about the eye, but it easily could have come about in stages. IMO, the same thing could be said about the flagellum. You can't take as gospel the word of whomever said this , because they invariably leave out the other side of the story.

    As for coming from "nothing", neither theists or atheists would say that. Theists who believe in evolution would say it comes from the rules God laid down. Atheists would say, the world and the laws of nature aren't "nothing" and you're just playing with words to make your case.
     
  6. Marie888
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    Marie888 † † †

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    I could reply to this many ways. The argument goes back in forth and in great detail.

    I can't make someone believe, but I know because I know God exists and Created us, because I have a personal relationship with Him - That is, Jesus Christ our Lord. Of course, the argument against that is, "well what about all those other people who claim they know God? (other religions, Islam, etc who claim its the truth)"

    To that I reply, go right to the source. Ask Him yourself. Yes, that means talking and/or praying to Him to ask Him "are you real?", "what is the truth"? "Is Jesus the only way?" "why are there so many other religions?" Basically anything.

    In other words, I know that if someone is sincere in their heart and they want to know if God is real and seek Him, they WILL find Him. Because He has promised. He's God, He knows when we are "faking" it or not, or just set out to try to disprove Him. It won't work that way because He already knows the heart is hardened. But if someone comes seeking Him with full heart - be ready, because He promised He'll answer. (See Deut 4:29 in the Bible)

    I also personally don't understand why those who are atheists or don't believe don't go right to the source - Him anyhow. Isn't that what we try to do in science or anything else we want to know?

    Other than that, here's a video that goes about it in a funnier/sillier way, just for fun. : )
    Enjoy!

    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0donCN_IUhI]YouTube - ATHEISTS: How To Make Their Heads Explode[/ame]
     
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    Last edited: Apr 11, 2011
  7. peach174
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    peach174 Gold Member Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    What are some of the elements found in clay?
    Silicates, water,iron,calcium,sodium. All found in the human body.
    In Genesis 2:7 it says that God formed man of the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life.
    I have a question for those that think Man made up God. How did ancient Man know that clay or dust had all of these elements in order to write that in Genesis?
    It proves to me that God told Men what to write.
     
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  8. Jos
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    Jos BANNED

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    The Bible
    Spoiler alert! Turns Out He Dies in the End |
     
  9. Lyte
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    Take anything that is in nature, clay, granite, tree branch, handful of water etc. and human body has all of those elements in it.
    Clay however is mainly made of silicates (Si and O) which are really marginal elements in human body. Clay doesn't have carbon in it which makes about 18% of the human body, so forgive me if i don't accept your proof.

    Elements in human body.

    Oxygen (65%)
    Carbon (18%)
    Hydrogen (10%)
    Nitrogen (3%)
    Calcium (1.5%)
    Phosphorus (1.0%)
    Potassium (0.35%)
    Sulfur (0.25%)
    Sodium (0.15%)
    Magnesium (0.05%)
    Copper, Zinc, Selenium, Molybdenum, Fluorine, Chlorine, Iodine, Manganese, Cobalt, Iron (0.70%)
    Lithium, Strontium, Aluminum, Silicon, Lead, Vanadium, Arsenic, Bromine (trace amounts)
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2011
  10. Wingsofwind
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    Wingsofwind Active Member

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    All of what you listed there have been found in soil and some if not all are also found in water. Clay can be made from many types of soil and water from many different places. There are many ways of making clay. So you can not just go by the way it is made and sold today.
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2011

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