It is better that this woman was raped, than that she use a gun on her hip to stop it...right?

[2aguy]

Logic dictates the woman would still be raped and her gun stolen unless she knows martial arts.

Locally, a man was just convicted of murder for shooting his ex with her own gun. It was DV. He climbed in her bedroom window and she got off one shot, winged him, before he took the gun and killed her with it.

And this....

Mother Shoots Intruder 'Multiple Times' to Save Baby - Breitbart

An Indianapolis mother shot a man “multiple times” after he allegedly broke into the home through the window in the baby’s room.

According to CBS 4, family members said that around noon on March 24, the woman “heard the window get busted and she called her husband and said I think somebody’s breaking in the house.”

She grabbed her pistol and ran toward the sound of breaking glass, only to be confronted by the alleged intruder who shot at her, but missed.

The mother then opened fire and struck the suspect “multiple times.” He was transported to a hospital for treatment.

In addition to being armed, a 911 dispatcher said the suspect was “carrying zip ties and a walkie-talkie.”
-------------

 

[2aguy]

What the OP just doesn't understand is that when that woman carries a gun, and has to use it against a rapist, she might miss when she shoots and she might end up hitting a 3 year old girl picking flowers in her yard.

So its best she just get raped.

Depending how caught off guard she was and how quickly this guy took physical control....would she have had time to get to a gun? What if he had a weapon out already...

You mean like this 14 year old...who was shot before she returned fire....and won the fight?

14-Year-Old Girl Shot By Home Invaders, Shoots Back: Defensive Gun Use of the Day - The Truth About Guns

Or this woman....

3/22/16
Woman vs. 3 thugs no shots fired

CCW IN ACTION: Armed 22-Year-Old Woman Stops Three Men Attempting To Rob Her In Store Parking Lot – Concealed Nation

OKLAHOMA CITY, OKLAHOMA — A concealed carrier successfully thwarted the efforts of three men to rob her late at night outside a Dollar Tree. According to police reports from the scene, the woman was exiting the Dollar Tree and heading to her car when she was approached by a man and asked to walk with him. When she refused, he point-blank told her he was going to rob her of her purse.
At this point, according to KOCO, she was presented by two other men backing up the first. She withdrew her concealed carry pistol from her purse and threatened to use it to protect herself. All three men quickly exited and fled the scene.

 

[airplanemechanic]

I wonder what he was going to do with the walkie talkie......

 

[BULLDOG]

What the OP just doesn't understand is that when that woman carries a gun, and has to use it against a rapist, she might miss when she shoots and she might end up hitting a 3 year old girl picking flowers in her yard.

So its best she just get raped.

Depending how caught off guard she was and how quickly this guy took physical control....would she have had time to get to a gun? What if he had a weapon out already...

Moron.....another woman....a different outcome......

What I want you to know on Gun Violence Awareness Day | Fox News

I correctly listened to my instincts; I had a feeling that my life was in danger in that elevator and prepared myself mentally for what was potentially to come.

I ran to my car in an attempt to escape and, before I could even get my entire body in my car, I was tackled by my attacker.

This man quickly overpowered me, stabbed at me with a knife, clamped his hand over my mouth multiple times, and repeatedly tried forcing me in the passenger seat of my car while telling me, “We’re going.”

The entire time this was happening, a rusted, serrated knife was being stabbed towards my abdomen and held at my face.

I had been hit in the face, thrown over my driver’s side console, and had rips in my tights from his hands trying to force my legs up and over into the passenger seat.

There are some individuals that think gun owners are “trigger happy” and wanting to pull their weapons out at the first opportunity. There is nothing further from the truth.

The night I was attacked, I fought like hell for my life before reaching for my gun. I kicked, I screamed, I had all ten fingernails ripped off and bloodied from scratching and trying to fight my way out of a literal life and death situation.

Ultimately, I accessed my gun, shot my attacker multiple times, and saved my life. He will be spending years in prison for what he did to me.

Using a gun in self-protection is not a decision one makes lightly; in fact, I never dreamed that I would be forced into a situation where I would have to do so. However, I also never imagined such evil existing in the world so that I would be powerless, wounded, on my back and unable to physically force my attacker off of me.

I owned a gun and had been trained on how to use it. I know how to safely carry and that a gun is a serious and significant weapon; it is not to be used carelessly. Naysayers and people with opposing opinions may try to undermine my situation with hypotheticals. I cannot answer these questions. All I can do is tell the facts of my story and the true account of how I saved my own life.

What I want you to know on Gun Awareness Day is that a gun in the hands of a potential victim is not improperly placed; it can be the only thing keeping her from being brutally raped and murdered.

Without my gun, I would not be alive today.


Guns are not the problem in America; men like my attacker -- who are willing to violently change one person’s life for no reason except for pure evil – are the problem.

Be safe at all times. Be aware of your surroundings. Trust your instincts. Always be able to protect yourself. Refuse to be a victim, and instead be a fighter and a survivor. Live to tell your tale and make a criminal regret the day he chose you as a “soft target.” My gun saved my life, and one could save yours too.

GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!
GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!

 

[2aguy]

What the OP just doesn't understand is that when that woman carries a gun, and has to use it against a rapist, she might miss when she shoots and she might end up hitting a 3 year old girl picking flowers in her yard.

So its best she just get raped.

Depending how caught off guard she was and how quickly this guy took physical control....would she have had time to get to a gun? What if he had a weapon out already...

And this woman......

Woman Scares off Assailant With Stick. Just Kidding, it was a gun.

Just before 7pm on Wednesday night, a 29 year-old woman had gathered up her dog and headed outside to… well, to let her dog do what dogs do.

Upon her first step outside her Minot, North Dakota home, she was hit solidly in the face with a blunt object, knocking her backward down the stairs and into her home.

Her assailant followed her into her home and started to approach her, but the woman had made it to a cabinet where she retrieved a handgun to protect herself and her home.

When confronted with the firearm, the violent intruder and would-be robber/rapist/murderer fled the scene.

The smart, independent, gun-owning woman did not require medical attention, most likely due to the fact that she was able to pull a weapon on her assailant to end the attack.

 

[2aguy]

Logic dictates the woman would still be raped and her gun stolen unless she knows martial arts.

Locally, a man was just convicted of murder for shooting his ex with her own gun. It was DV. He climbed in her bedroom window and she got off one shot, winged him, before he took the gun and killed her with it.

And this is another outcome.....3 men...armed with guns...vs. a woman..and her gun....

DGU of the Day: Trotwood Ohio Woman Defeats Three Home Invaders - The Truth About Guns

Three men break into a home in Trotwood, Ohio. [Click here to watch the video.] They’re all armed. It is before 6 am, just three days after Christmas. One of the men is armed with a Tec-9 pistol. He enters last. The other two hold what appear to be conventional semi-auto pistols. They bypass two sleeping children to find the mother. The surveillance video shows the three following the mother after they pistol whipped her in the laundry room.

The man directly behind her has the Tec-9. Presumably holds her at gunpoint while the other two attempt to drag off a safe, in a room with two more children. While the two men are occupied with the safe, the woman breaks free from her captor, accesses a hidden pistol, and starts to fire.

All three run, but the Tec-9 gunman, Azikiwe Presley, is mortally wounded. His body is found 100 yards from the house. From wdtn.com:

“I got my gun and I started shooting and they ran,” the female caller told dispatchers. “They all three had guns, I’m confused … they must not have had bullets because after I pulled the trigger they just took off, instead of firing back. I don’t know if I hit one or not, I don’t see blood anywhere.”

In this case, the recipient of female dedication to protecting innocent life ran a hundred yards and died. It is not uncommon for a man who is fatally shot to run that far, even with a heart/lung shot. As he was likely the one holding the woman at gunpoint, and the closest, greatest, threat with the Tec-9, it is not surprising that he drew the lethal ticket. Whether through choice or happenstance, the mother made the right tactical decision.

 

[2aguy]

Logic dictates the woman would still be raped and her gun stolen unless she knows martial arts.

Yeah...not so much...do you actually study these things...because you posts say you don't....

Concealed Carrier Holds Burglar At Gunpoint With Her FNX .45

CLEVELAND, TENNESSEE — A woman successfully subdued a would-be burglar outside her home using her FNX .45. The suspect, James Jeffrey Dunn, was allegedly trying to break in through her front door late at night. She got her handgun and confronted the burglar, according to WRCB. Once at the doorway, she yelled through the door for him to stay put and not move. Moments later, she confronted him head-on — handgun drawn and ready to go.

via WRCB

“I tried to order him to stay right where he was at and I pointed the gun at him and I came running off the porch and I came within 10 feet of him and he laid the bicycle down and he crumpled on top of the bicycle,” she says.

She held him at gunpoint until Cleveland Police arrived and arrested Dunn, 35, on charges of aggravated burglary, theft, and burglary of a motor vehicle. Police note that Dunn had an arrest sheet tallying over 40 charges — the most recent being only 6 hours prior to his attempted burglary of this concealed carrier.

“We went over this when we got my concealed carry permit, these types of scenarios. But I had already put that gun up and ever taken it out since, you know?” she says. “Maybe to go the range once.”

When we talk about the new generation of concealed carriers, let’s take a good long look at the realities these people are facing: hardened, career criminals unafraid to bust through the door or do damage to private property and persons. It’s a good thing this woman had the proper training she needed and the right equipment.

 

[2aguy]

What the OP just doesn't understand is that when that woman carries a gun, and has to use it against a rapist, she might miss when she shoots and she might end up hitting a 3 year old girl picking flowers in her yard.

So its best she just get raped.

Depending how caught off guard she was and how quickly this guy took physical control....would she have had time to get to a gun? What if he had a weapon out already...

This is one of my favorites.....

Lancaster Woman Scares Off Bat-Wielding Attackers By Pulling Gun On Them

LANCASTER, Ohio - It happened along a walking path in Lancaster.

Dinah Burns is licensed to carry a concealed gun, but she'd only recently started taking her weapon while walking her dog.

Based on what happened, it looks like she'll make a point of carrying from now on.

"I think if they'd gotten any closer, I probably would have fired,” said Burns.

It was Monday when Burns was on a footpath near Sanderson Elementary School.

"Two gentlemen came out of the woods, one holding a baseball bat, and said 'You're coming with us'."

The men weren't deterred by Dinah's dog Gracie.

"I said, 'Well, what do you want?,' and as I was saying that I reached in to my pocket and slipped my gun out, slipped the safety off as I pulled it out. As I was doing that the other gentleman came toward me and raised the baseball bat. And, I pointed the gun at them and said, 'I have this and I'm not afraid to use it.'"

The men took off and so far have eluded police. Dinah posted about the incident on Facebook to alert friends and neighbors, to criticism by some.

"Most of the males' opinion was, 'Why didn't you shoot them?'"

Easy to second-guess a decision made under pressure, based on her concealed carry training, and police agree.

"To get out of a situation, back out, get out of it as much as you can without having to discharge your firearm."

"I will say it's a good thing to go from a place of danger to a place of safety, however you get that done,” said Sgt. Matt Chambers, Lancaster Police.

"Very thankful that it turned out the way it did, and hope it doesn't happen again, but I will be prepared."

 

[EvilCat Breath]

In Britain, they have taken guns away from law abiding people.....and now their gun crime rate has gone through the roof, and their violent crimes, like rape....are going through the roof.......

And according to anti gunners here on U.S. message...and everywhere else....it is better that women be raped, and possibly murdered, than that they should have the option of using a concealed or open carried gun to stop that rape......

This woman is in Britain...she got off of a London Bus....and was raped....according to anti gunners, this is better than if she had a gun and used it to drive off, capture, injure or kill her attacker...right?

Since they do not believe anyone should carry a gun, this is the preferred outcome....right?

Young woman raped after getting off late-night bus

London.

The victim, aged in her 20s, had got off the bus and was walking down an alleyway when she was attacked from behind and raped, police said.

The incident happened just after midnight as the woman made her way from Millwood Road to Brantwood Road in St Paul's Cray, Bromley.


DC James White, who leads the investigation, said: "This incident took place in a secluded area, and the attack has left the woman traumatised by her ordeal.

With our obscene ability to arm ourselves in this country, women are still raped every day. This argument is a low argument to emotion. I thought you didn't like that?
And since you live in the United States of America, it would be nice if you would stop posting every gun crime in England.

Yes women are raped every day. Not every woman has a gun. If more women had guns those stats would go down but a lot of women just won't defend themselves. Not even when they can.

I taught a seminar in self defense for women. Not the methods, but the psychology of self defense. Most women would not defend themselves. If they have a gun, they will hesitate to use it. They will say "Go away. Leave me alone. Come closer and I'll shoot you." Of course this is nothing more than an invitation to take the gun and kill her with it. Guns are not the only method of self defense. Women trained in martial arts will not use it against an assailant. Women that have other weapons will not use them. I've taught women how to use a rat tail comb to put an eye out. Women won't do it. This is slowly changing, but not fast enough to save many female lives. So when you see an instance in which a man took a gun away from a woman and killed her with it, 90% of the time it's her fault. She refused to pull the trigger.

 

[2aguy]

58 innocent people gunned down in Vegas
500 injured

Gas keep us safe

Nice, France, rental truck used to murder 89 people, and injure 450.

 

[2aguy]

In Britain, they have taken guns away from law abiding people.....and now their gun crime rate has gone through the roof, and their violent crimes, like rape....are going through the roof.......

And according to anti gunners here on U.S. message...and everywhere else....it is better that women be raped, and possibly murdered, than that they should have the option of using a concealed or open carried gun to stop that rape......

This woman is in Britain...she got off of a London Bus....and was raped....according to anti gunners, this is better than if she had a gun and used it to drive off, capture, injure or kill her attacker...right?

Since they do not believe anyone should carry a gun, this is the preferred outcome....right?

Young woman raped after getting off late-night bus

London.

The victim, aged in her 20s, had got off the bus and was walking down an alleyway when she was attacked from behind and raped, police said.

The incident happened just after midnight as the woman made her way from Millwood Road to Brantwood Road in St Paul's Cray, Bromley.


DC James White, who leads the investigation, said: "This incident took place in a secluded area, and the attack has left the woman traumatised by her ordeal.

What is your fixation with England? They have far fewer gun related deaths than we do. They are doing something right, while we kill thousands per year.

No..they aren't doing anything right.....they are now about to experience an increase in crime the way we did in the 1960s.......their society was set back by World War 2...and now they are about to catch up...their criminals are younger now, and they are shooting each other more.....and now, their people have nothing to use to stop their criminals...that is why their country is so more violent than ours is...

 

[airplanemechanic]

I don't understand the democratic party. They claim to be for womens rights and the party of women, but they want those women defenseless against an attacker. WTF kind of logic is that? How do you people sleep at night?

 

[2aguy]

What the OP just doesn't understand is that when that woman carries a gun, and has to use it against a rapist, she might miss when she shoots and she might end up hitting a 3 year old girl picking flowers in her yard.

So its best she just get raped.

Depending how caught off guard she was and how quickly this guy took physical control....would she have had time to get to a gun? What if he had a weapon out already...

Moron.....another woman....a different outcome......

What I want you to know on Gun Violence Awareness Day | Fox News

I correctly listened to my instincts; I had a feeling that my life was in danger in that elevator and prepared myself mentally for what was potentially to come.

I ran to my car in an attempt to escape and, before I could even get my entire body in my car, I was tackled by my attacker.

This man quickly overpowered me, stabbed at me with a knife, clamped his hand over my mouth multiple times, and repeatedly tried forcing me in the passenger seat of my car while telling me, “We’re going.”

The entire time this was happening, a rusted, serrated knife was being stabbed towards my abdomen and held at my face.

I had been hit in the face, thrown over my driver’s side console, and had rips in my tights from his hands trying to force my legs up and over into the passenger seat.

There are some individuals that think gun owners are “trigger happy” and wanting to pull their weapons out at the first opportunity. There is nothing further from the truth.

The night I was attacked, I fought like hell for my life before reaching for my gun. I kicked, I screamed, I had all ten fingernails ripped off and bloodied from scratching and trying to fight my way out of a literal life and death situation.

Ultimately, I accessed my gun, shot my attacker multiple times, and saved my life. He will be spending years in prison for what he did to me.

Using a gun in self-protection is not a decision one makes lightly; in fact, I never dreamed that I would be forced into a situation where I would have to do so. However, I also never imagined such evil existing in the world so that I would be powerless, wounded, on my back and unable to physically force my attacker off of me.

I owned a gun and had been trained on how to use it. I know how to safely carry and that a gun is a serious and significant weapon; it is not to be used carelessly. Naysayers and people with opposing opinions may try to undermine my situation with hypotheticals. I cannot answer these questions. All I can do is tell the facts of my story and the true account of how I saved my own life.

What I want you to know on Gun Awareness Day is that a gun in the hands of a potential victim is not improperly placed; it can be the only thing keeping her from being brutally raped and murdered.

Without my gun, I would not be alive today.


Guns are not the problem in America; men like my attacker -- who are willing to violently change one person’s life for no reason except for pure evil – are the problem.

Be safe at all times. Be aware of your surroundings. Trust your instincts. Always be able to protect yourself. Refuse to be a victim, and instead be a fighter and a survivor. Live to tell your tale and make a criminal regret the day he chose you as a “soft target.” My gun saved my life, and one could save yours too.

GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!
GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!GUN NUT!!!!

Living in your head, rent free would be nice....but there is so much space in your head, since there is no brain in here, and the cobwebs and disuse have really made it pretty yucky....

 

[2aguy]

I don't understand the democratic party. They claim to be for womens rights and the party of women, but they want those women defenseless against an attacker. WTF kind of logic is that? How do you people sleep at night?

Wait...you would have to talk to demcorat superstar, harvey weinstein about how democrats treat women....

 

[airplanemechanic]

That's true, and democrats are totally silent about him.

Women are nothing more than baby death chambers for democrats.

Oh yea, and votes.

 

[2aguy]

What the OP just doesn't understand is that when that woman carries a gun, and has to use it against a rapist, she might miss when she shoots and she might end up hitting a 3 year old girl picking flowers in her yard.

So its best she just get raped.

I wasn't actually saying no woman can handle a gun. I am objecting to OP holding up a tragic rape case and coming up with the "What If" question "If she had been armed.." Guns don't always save us and using a rape case instead of a purse snatching or mugging is just lowdown emotional gut strings. Not playing his game.

No...that isn't the case I am making.....

I am pointing out where the anti gun argument rubber meets the real world road.

To an anti gunner, such as yourself, who believes that no one should be allowed to carry a gun for self defense, it is better that the woman be raped, than she be allowed to carry a gun to try to stop it.

You don't want her to have that gun no matter what. So her being raped and murdered is the acceptable outcome to you.......

 

[2aguy]

That's true, and democrats are totally silent about him.

Women are nothing more than baby death chambers for democrats.

Oh yea, and votes.

And sex slaves...just ask bill clinton, roman polanski and harvey weinstein.....

 

[JoeB131]

This woman is in Britain...she got off of a London Bus....and was raped....according to anti gunners, this is better than if she had a gun and used it to drive off, capture, injure or kill her attacker...right?

Since they do not believe anyone should carry a gun, this is the preferred outcome....right?

Since 83% of rape victims know their attackers, putting guns in their hands is kind of meaningless.

DGU's are a unicorn. I know you all want to believe in the happy place where they exist, but they really don't.

The criminal always has the advantage of surprise.

 

[2aguy]

This woman is in Britain...she got off of a London Bus....and was raped....according to anti gunners, this is better than if she had a gun and used it to drive off, capture, injure or kill her attacker...right?

Since they do not believe anyone should carry a gun, this is the preferred outcome....right?

Since 83% of rape victims know their attackers, putting guns in their hands is kind of meaningless.

DGU's are a unicorn. I know you all want to believe in the happy place where they exist, but they really don't.

The criminal always has the advantage of surprise.

Actual research shows you are wrong...even bill clinton and obama showed this with their own government research programs...

Self defense with a gun......40 years of actual research...first is the name of the group that conducted the research, then the year, then the number of defensive gun uses and finally wether the research contained police or military defensive gun uses....

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....
GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys

Field...1976....3,052,717 ( no cops, military)

DMIa 1978...2,141,512 ( no cops, military)

L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68 ( no cops, military)

Kleck......1994...2.5 million ( no cops, military)

Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544

DMIb...1978...1,098,409 ( no cops, military)

Hart...1981...1.797,461 ( no cops, military)

Mauser...1990...1,487,342 ( no cops, military)

Gallup...1993...1,621,377 ( no cops, military)

DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million ( the bill clinton study)

Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."

(Based on survey data from a 2000 study published in the Journal of Quantitative Criminology,[17] U.S. civilians use guns to defend themselves and others from crime at least 989,883 times per year.[18])

Paper: "Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment." By David McDowall and others. Journal of Quantitative Criminology, March 2000. Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment - Springer


-------------------------------------------

Ohio...1982...771,043

Gallup...1991...777,152

Tarrance... 1994... 764,036 (no cops, military)

Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..

*****************************************
If you take the studies from that Kleck cites in his paper, 16 of them....and you only average the ones that exclude military and police shootings..the average becomes 2 million...I use those studies because I have the details on them...and they are still 10 studies (including Kleck's)....

 

[2aguy]

This woman is in Britain...she got off of a London Bus....and was raped....according to anti gunners, this is better than if she had a gun and used it to drive off, capture, injure or kill her attacker...right?

Since they do not believe anyone should carry a gun, this is the preferred outcome....right?

Since 83% of rape victims know their attackers, putting guns in their hands is kind of meaningless.

DGU's are a unicorn. I know you all want to believe in the happy place where they exist, but they really don't.

The criminal always has the advantage of surprise.

And you don't know what you are talking about....

Guns Effective Defense Against Rape


However, most recent studies with improved methodology are consistently showing that the more forceful the resistance, the lower the risk of a completed rape, with no increase in physical injury. Sarah Ullman's original research (Journal of Interpersonal Violence, 1998) and critical review of past studies (Criminal Justice and Behavior, 1997) are especially valuable in solidifying this conclusion.

I wish to single out one particular subtype of physical resistance: Use of a weapon, and especially a firearm, is statistically a woman's best means of resistance, greatly enhancing her odds of escaping both rape and injury, compared to any other strategy of physical or verbal resistance. This conclusion is drawn from four types of information.

First, a 1989 study (Furby, Journal of Interpersonal Violence) found that both male and female survey respondents judged a gun to be the most effective means that a potential rape victim could use to fend off the assault. Rape "experts" considered it a close second, after eye-gouging.

Second, raw data from the 1979-1985 installments of the Justice Department's annual National Crime Victim Survey show that when a woman resists a stranger rape with a gun, the probability of completion was 0.1 percent and of victim injury 0.0 percent, compared to 31 percent and 40 percent, respectively, for all stranger rapes (Kleck, Social Problems, 1990).

Third, a recent paper (Southwick, Journal of Criminal Justice, 2000) analyzed victim resistance to violent crimes generally, with robbery, aggravated assault and rape considered together. Women who resisted with a gun were 2.5 times more likely to escape without injury than those who did not resist and 4 times more likely to escape uninjured than those who resisted with any means other than a gun. Similarly, their property losses in a robbery were reduced more than six-fold and almost three-fold, respectively, compared to the other categories of resistance strategy.

Fourth, we have two studies in the last 20 years that directly address the outcomes of women who resist attempted rape with a weapon. (Lizotte, Journal of Quantitative Criminology, 1986; Kleck, Social Problems, 1990.) The former concludes,"Further, women who resist rape with a gun or knife dramatically decrease their probability of completion." (Lizotte did not analyze victim injuries apart from the rape itself.) The latter concludes that "resistance with a gun or knife is the most effective form of resistance for preventing completion of a rape"; this is accomplished "without creating any significant additional risk of other injury."

The best conclusion from available scientific data, then, is when avoidance of rape has failed and one must choose between being raped and resisting, a woman's best option is to resist with a gun in her hands.