Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man?

[sealybobo]

Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man? The short answer is yes. Virtue is the foundation of a harmonious and orderly society. Virtue is the glue that holds communities and societies together. Our Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were indispensable pillars of freedom and liberty. That without virtue and morality freedom and liberty could not be maintained. Virtue and morality are the foundations of laws. Virtue and morality are the foundations of relationships. Virtue and morality are the foundation for all successful societies.

This seems like common sense. This just in. The founders said water was important.

 

[sealybobo]

Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man? The short answer is yes. Virtue is the foundation of a harmonious and orderly society. Virtue is the glue that holds communities and societies together. Our Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were indispensable pillars of freedom and liberty. That without virtue and morality freedom and liberty could not be maintained. Virtue and morality are the foundations of laws. Virtue and morality are the foundations of relationships. Virtue and morality are the foundation for all successful societies.

.

that says a lot about the christian religion which since the 4th century has an uninterrupted history of oppression and persecution from that time to the present.

But they raped pillaged and murdered virtuously

 

[ding]

Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man? The short answer is yes. Virtue is the foundation of a harmonious and orderly society. Virtue is the glue that holds communities and societies together. Our Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were indispensable pillars of freedom and liberty. That without virtue and morality freedom and liberty could not be maintained. Virtue and morality are the foundations of laws. Virtue and morality are the foundations of relationships. Virtue and morality are the foundation for all successful societies.

When did the founding fathers say this?

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

 

[ding]

We had virtue before we had organized religions.

Actually they didn't. Judaism established morals that were leaps and bounds ahead of their contemporaries and still challenge the world today. Huston Smith explains it thus:

Without moral constraints, human relations would become as snarled as traffic in the Chicago loop if everyone drove at will. The Jewish formulation of "those wise restraints that make men free" is contained in her Law. The Hebrew Bible contains no less than 613 commandments that regulate human behavior. Four of these will suffice for our purposes: the four ethical precepts of the Ten Commandments, for it is through these that Hebraic morality has had its greatest impact.

Appropriated by Christianity and Islam, four of the Ten Commandments constitute the moral foundation of most of the Western world. There are four danger zones in human life that can cause unlimited trouble if they get out of hand:

1. Force - You can bicker and fight, but killing within the in-group will not be permitted, for it instigates blood feuds that shred community. Therefore thou shalt not murder.

2. Wealth - As for possessions, you may make your pile as large as you please and be shrewd and cunning in enterprise. One thing, though, you may not do, and that is pilfer directly off someone else's pile, for this outrages the sense of fair play and builds animosities that become ungovernable. Therefore thou shalt not steal.

3. Sex - You can be a rounder, flirtatious, even promiscuous, and though we do not comment such behavior, we will not get the law after you. But at one point we draw the line: Sexual indulgence of married persons outside the nuptial bond will not be allowed, for it rouses passions the community cannot tolerate. Therefore thou shalt not commit adultery.

4. Speech - You may dissemble and equivocate, but there is one time when we require that you tell the truth, and nothing but the truth. If a dispute reaches such proportions as to be brought before a tribunal, on such occasions the judges must know what happened. If you lie then, while under oath to tell the truth, the penalty will be severe. Thou shalt not bear false witness.

07 Judaism

 

[ding]

Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man? The short answer is yes. Virtue is the foundation of a harmonious and orderly society. Virtue is the glue that holds communities and societies together. Our Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were indispensable pillars of freedom and liberty. That without virtue and morality freedom and liberty could not be maintained. Virtue and morality are the foundations of laws. Virtue and morality are the foundations of relationships. Virtue and morality are the foundation for all successful societies.

This seems like common sense. This just in. The founders said water was important.

That is because they are universal.

 

[sealybobo]

Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man? The short answer is yes. Virtue is the foundation of a harmonious and orderly society. Virtue is the glue that holds communities and societies together. Our Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were indispensable pillars of freedom and liberty. That without virtue and morality freedom and liberty could not be maintained. Virtue and morality are the foundations of laws. Virtue and morality are the foundations of relationships. Virtue and morality are the foundation for all successful societies.

When did the founding fathers say this?

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

 

[ding]

Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man? The short answer is yes. Virtue is the foundation of a harmonious and orderly society. Virtue is the glue that holds communities and societies together. Our Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were indispensable pillars of freedom and liberty. That without virtue and morality freedom and liberty could not be maintained. Virtue and morality are the foundations of laws. Virtue and morality are the foundations of relationships. Virtue and morality are the foundation for all successful societies.

When did the founding fathers say this?

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

 

[BreezeWood]

Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man? The short answer is yes. Virtue is the foundation of a harmonious and orderly society. Virtue is the glue that holds communities and societies together. Our Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were indispensable pillars of freedom and liberty. That without virtue and morality freedom and liberty could not be maintained. Virtue and morality are the foundations of laws. Virtue and morality are the foundations of relationships. Virtue and morality are the foundation for all successful societies.

When did the founding fathers say this?

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

 

[ding]

Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man? The short answer is yes. Virtue is the foundation of a harmonious and orderly society. Virtue is the glue that holds communities and societies together. Our Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were indispensable pillars of freedom and liberty. That without virtue and morality freedom and liberty could not be maintained. Virtue and morality are the foundations of laws. Virtue and morality are the foundations of relationships. Virtue and morality are the foundation for all successful societies.

When did the founding fathers say this?

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Really? Can you name ten things that America has done that you are proud of?

 

[sealybobo]

When did the founding fathers say this?

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Really? Can you name ten things that America has done that you are proud of?

Moon landing.

The vote

National parks

Social security and Medicare
Unions labor laws and new deal

Can you name some I missed?

 

[sealybobo]

Is virtue the greatest organizing principle known to man? The short answer is yes. Virtue is the foundation of a harmonious and orderly society. Virtue is the glue that holds communities and societies together. Our Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were indispensable pillars of freedom and liberty. That without virtue and morality freedom and liberty could not be maintained. Virtue and morality are the foundations of laws. Virtue and morality are the foundations of relationships. Virtue and morality are the foundation for all successful societies.

When did the founding fathers say this?

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Ding would have never separated church and state

 

[BreezeWood]

When did the founding fathers say this?

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Ding would have never separated church and state

.

Dng would have never separated church and state

no doubt about that ... and how they skew the founding fathers is outrageous, that guy would try and convince you George Washington was a loyalist for the crown.

 

[ding]

When did the founding fathers say this?

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Ding would have never separated church and state

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

 

[sealybobo]

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Ding would have never separated church and state

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

It has evolved to a logical conclusion. Separate them.

 

[BreezeWood]

The early thinkers of our country were convinced that the state must be held accountable to the authority of a higher ethical and spiritual standard – the “Natural Law” or the “Law of Nature’s God.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796
“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.” The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

John Adams, “Letter to Zabdiel Adams, Philadelphia, 21 June 1776”
“Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand.” John Adams Letter of June 21, 1776, quoted in The Wall Builder Report, Summer 1993 The Works of John Adams – Second President of theUnited States, ed. Charles Francis Adams (Boston: Little, Brown & Co., 1854), 9:401.


Samuel Adams Letter to John Trumbull, October 16, 1778
“Religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness.” Paul H. Smith, Gerard W. Gawalt, Rosemary Fry Plakes, et. al., Letters of Delegates to Congress, 1774-1789, volume 11, October 1 1778-January 31 1779.


Patrick Henry Letter to Archibald Blair, January 8, 1799
“The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor…and this alone, that renders us invincible.” Moses Coit Tyler, Patrick Henry (New York: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1898; reprint, Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 1962), 409.


Benjamin Rush Essays, Literary, Moral and Philosophical, 1798
“The only foundation for...a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.” (Philadelphia: Thomas and Samuel F. Bradford, 1798), 8.

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Ding would have never separated church and state

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

.

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

they wrote the amendment to get around people like you bing ... separation is the full intent.

the founding fathers wrote many articles such as the 1st and 2nd Amendments as close to what they intended as the times permitted. anotherwords they were socially conscious, neither religious nor reactive to primitive instincts.

we needn't doubt the alliance of people like bing during that time - loyalist to the crown and their personal religious dogma.

 

[ding]

True. Most were bible thumpers especially the politicians

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Ding would have never separated church and state

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

.

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

they wrote the amendment to get around people like you bing ... separation is the full intent.

the founding fathers wrote many articles such as the 1st and 2nd Amendments as close to what they intended as the times permitted. anotherwords they were socially conscious, neither religious nor reactive to primitive instincts.

we needn't doubt the alliance of people like bing during that time - loyalist to the crown and their personal religious dogma.

The establishment clause of the 1st Amendment prevents the Federal government from establishing religion and interfering with the state established religions of which half of the states had at the time the Constitution was ratified. It was perfectly legal for states to establish religions.

 

[sealybobo]

Which means they were more like me and less like you.

.

Which means they were more like me and less like you (sealy).

nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Ding would have never separated church and state

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

.

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

they wrote the amendment to get around people like you bing ... separation is the full intent.

the founding fathers wrote many articles such as the 1st and 2nd Amendments as close to what they intended as the times permitted. anotherwords they were socially conscious, neither religious nor reactive to primitive instincts.

we needn't doubt the alliance of people like bing during that time - loyalist to the crown and their personal religious dogma.

The establishment clause of the 1st Amendment prevents the Federal government from establishing religion and interfering with the state established religions of which half of the states had at the time the Constitution was ratified. It was perfectly legal for states to establish religions.

Not anymore. Yesterday they were talking about one state full of Irish people. They were worried too many Germans were coming in and that they were going to Germany that state.

Eventually we realize no religion has the right to be the official religion of that state unless 100% of the citizens agree

 

[ding]

.
nothing could be further from the truth, the founding fathers were revolutionaries and the earliest successful social conscious politicians to form a government at its inception - you on the otherhand would have been a loyalist of the monarchy and a religious zealot which they were anything but - you should stop believing your propaganda is anything more than just a fairytail.

Ding would have never separated church and state

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

.

They actually never were. You don't understand what the intent of the 1st Amendment was.

they wrote the amendment to get around people like you bing ... separation is the full intent.

the founding fathers wrote many articles such as the 1st and 2nd Amendments as close to what they intended as the times permitted. anotherwords they were socially conscious, neither religious nor reactive to primitive instincts.

we needn't doubt the alliance of people like bing during that time - loyalist to the crown and their personal religious dogma.

The establishment clause of the 1st Amendment prevents the Federal government from establishing religion and interfering with the state established religions of which half of the states had at the time the Constitution was ratified. It was perfectly legal for states to establish religions.

Not anymore. Yesterday they were talking about one state full of Irish people. They were worried too many Germans were coming in and that they were going to Germany that state.

Eventually we realize no religion has the right to be the official religion of that state unless 100% of the citizens agree

Who says not anymore. Did the 1st Amendment get repealed?