How Pharma and Insurance Intend to Kill the Public Option

[Nik]

Waiting lists for elective surgeries, elderly patients cut off from expensive medications.

We don't have those now at all with private healthcare.

i dont.....

Then stay with your private healthcare, and let those who want to join a government run plan do so.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Free people can get all the healthcare they can buy, as soon as they want it.

Not so when government makes your healthcare decisions.

If your nearby private clinic donated too much to Republicans, or not enough to Democrats, they will get shut down like a car dealer.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

We don't have those now at all with private healthcare.

i dont.....

Then stay with your private healthcare, and let those who want to join a government run plan do so.

It ain't going to to work that way, jackass, and you know it.

Those plans will get taxed out of existence because they are too "rich" and they will need to pay for this pig.

And you and the rest of the drones will cheer that on.

 

[Nik]

Free people can get all the healthcare they can buy, as soon as they want it.

Not so when government makes your healthcare decisions.

If your nearby private clinic donated too much to Republicans, or not enough to Democrats, they will get shut down like a car dealer.

Sorry that auto dealer shit was debunked.

Next lie?

 

[Nik]

i dont.....

Then stay with your private healthcare, and let those who want to join a government run plan do so.

It ain't going to to work that way, jackass, and you know it.

Those plans will get taxed out of existence because they are too "rich" and they will need to pay for this pig.

And you and the rest of the drones will cheer that on.

Sure they will

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

It wasn't debunked.

 

[Harry Dresden]

We don't have those now at all with private healthcare.

i dont.....

Then stay with your private healthcare, and let those who want to join a government run plan do so.

go for it....im not standing in your way.....

 

[Nik]

It wasn't debunked.

Yeah, it was. Mostly Republican dealerships were closed, because dealerships are mostly Republican. What a crazy coincidence. Its like asking why so few Californians are arrested in new york and then claiming its a crazy conspiracy. The reason, if you weren't aware, is because most Californians aren't in New York.

 

[Nik]

i dont.....

Then stay with your private healthcare, and let those who want to join a government run plan do so.

go for it....im not standing in your way.....

Well Republicans are. Since I can't very well join a government plan if there isn't one.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

You just need to move someplace where the government has one.

 

[Nik]

You just need to move someplace where the government has one.

No thanks. I'll just let the government pass one, and then you can move your ass to somewhere where the government doesn't have one.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Get out of my country.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Then stay with your private healthcare, and let those who want to join a government run plan do so.

go for it....im not standing in your way.....

Well Republicans are. Since I can't very well join a government plan if there isn't one.

well then if it happens....

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

I am always amazed by those on these boards who have been sodomized by the Big Pharma and the Managed Care businesses and just keep smiling.

Indeed... And when we KNOW that "Managed Care" which is to say the HMO was saddled upon us BY THE SAME FUCKING PEOPLE THAT ARE TRYING TO DISMANTLE THE HEALTHCARE SYSTEM TODAY; USING THE SAME TIRD, LONG DISCREDITED ARGUMENTS.

It's AMAZING how those who come to bemoan "Managed CARE" drone on about a system which IS PRECISELY THE SAME DAMN THING; but VASTLY LARGER AND TO THE DEGREE THAT IT STRIPS FROM THE SYSTEM ANY VIABLE ALTERNATIVE.

Actually, HMO's were introduced to Nixon by, oh crap, lemme go look, there we go, by Ehrlichman. I remembered it from researching Nixon last year, and a whole bunch of stuff was declassified. Anyway, here you go:
www.habitablezone.com[/B]/currentevents/messages/473331.html]The start of the HMO began in Nixon's Oval Office
" February 17, 1971
5:30 p.m.
Ehrlichman: "We have now narrowed down the vice president's problem on this thing to one issue and that is whether we should include these Health Maintenance Organizations like Edgar Kaiser's Permanente thing."

Nixon: "Now let me ask you...you know I'm not too keen on any of these damn medical programs."

Ehrlichman: "This is a private enterprise one."

Nixon: "Well that appeals to me."

Ehrlichman: "Edgar Kaiser is running this Permanente deal for profit and the reason he can do it...I had Edgar Kaiser come in, talk to me about this, and I went into some depth. All the incentives are toward less medical care. Because the less care they give them, the more money they make."

Nixon: "Fine."

Ehrlichman: "...and the incentives run the right way."

Nixon: "Not bad."

ROFL... Ahhh.... So you're sourcing a message board... OUTSTANDING!

Nothing says dumbass, like the sourcing of heresay...

Sadly, for you, and the American People... the FACT is that Ted Kennedy gave us the HMO... He championed it, he nursed it, he stood in the senate and DEMANDED IT! And he's the one to look to, for accountability for it.

Of course Kennedy is a Leftists, so accountability isn't his thing... Like Bawny Fwank and the coercion of the Mortgage industry, who now DEMANDS that he 'TRIED HIS BEST TO GET FANNY AND FREDDIE UNDER CONTROL... but the Republicans wouldn't let him... the fact is that it was Bawny Fwank and her minions that DEMANDED that US mortgage banks scrap long standing actuarial lending policy and lend money to unsuitable borrowers...

And while Kennedy would LOVE to avoid ANY discussion of his influence on saddling the US with "Managed Care"... and foist the SAME THING on a VASTLY LARGER SCALE onto the SAME idiots that clammered for it THEN... there exist those of us who were THERE and remember all too well his vociferous demands that 'Health Maintenance Organizations would reduce the cost of health care by simply treating illness long before it becomes serious...

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

Free people can get all the healthcare they can buy, as soon as they want it.

Not so when government makes your healthcare decisions.

If your nearby private clinic donated too much to Republicans, or not enough to Democrats, they will get shut down like a car dealer.

Sorry that auto dealer shit was debunked.

Next lie?

Where was this debunked, SFB?

Cite the specific argument that 'debunked' such...

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

It wasn't debunked.

Yeah, it was. Mostly Republican dealerships were closed, because dealerships are mostly Republican. What a crazy coincidence. Its like asking why so few Californians are arrested in new york and then claiming its a crazy conspiracy. The reason, if you weren't aware, is because most Californians aren't in New York.

ROFLMNAO... Oh GOD! Now that's precious...

This member is clearly a cognitive deficient... So her argument that the closing of Car Dealerships was not a politicla issue... that it was not a strike at the political opposition... it was merely a business decision which just happened to effect the political opposition...

ROFL... Oh lordy... what a buffoon...

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

Then stay with your private healthcare, and let those who want to join a government run plan do so.

go for it....im not standing in your way.....

Well Republicans are. Since I can't very well join a government plan if there isn't one.

Well you can run for the legislature... they have the 'best government helthcare plan' on earth...

You could join the US military... They have a HUGE government healthcare system...

You could do A LOT of things to be eligible for such... you simply do not want to do ANYTHING except reap the benefits minus the effort... which of course identifies you as THE PROBLEM.

 

[Barb]

Indeed... And when we KNOW that "Managed Care" which is to say the HMO was saddled upon us BY THE SAME FUCKING PEOPLE THAT ARE TRYING TO DISMANTLE THE HEALTHCARE SYSTEM TODAY; USING THE SAME TIRD, LONG DISCREDITED ARGUMENTS.

It's AMAZING how those who come to bemoan "Managed CARE" drone on about a system which IS PRECISELY THE SAME DAMN THING; but VASTLY LARGER AND TO THE DEGREE THAT IT STRIPS FROM THE SYSTEM ANY VIABLE ALTERNATIVE.

Actually, HMO's were introduced to Nixon by, oh crap, lemme go look, there we go, by Ehrlichman. I remembered it from researching Nixon last year, and a whole bunch of stuff was declassified. Anyway, here you go:
www.habitablezone.com[/B]/currentevents/messages/473331.html]The start of the HMO began in Nixon's Oval Office
" February 17, 1971
5:30 p.m.
Ehrlichman: "We have now narrowed down the vice president's problem on this thing to one issue and that is whether we should include these Health Maintenance Organizations like Edgar Kaiser's Permanente thing."

Nixon: "Now let me ask you...you know I'm not too keen on any of these damn medical programs."

Ehrlichman: "This is a private enterprise one."

Nixon: "Well that appeals to me."

Ehrlichman: "Edgar Kaiser is running this Permanente deal for profit and the reason he can do it...I had Edgar Kaiser come in, talk to me about this, and I went into some depth. All the incentives are toward less medical care. Because the less care they give them, the more money they make."

Nixon: "Fine."

Ehrlichman: "...and the incentives run the right way."

Nixon: "Not bad."

ROFL... Ahhh.... So you're sourcing a message board... OUTSTANDING!

Nothing says dumbass, like the sourcing of heresay...

Sadly, for you, and the American People... the FACT is that Ted Kennedy gave us the HMO... He championed it, he nursed it, he stood in the senate and DEMANDED IT! And he's the one to look to, for accountability for it.

Of course Kennedy is a Leftists, so accountability isn't his thing... Like Bawny Fwank and the coercion of the Mortgage industry, who now DEMANDS that he 'TRIED HIS BEST TO GET FANNY AND FREDDIE UNDER CONTROL... but the Republicans wouldn't let him... the fact is that it was Bawny Fwank and her minions that DEMANDED that US mortgage banks scrap long standing actuarial lending policy and lend money to unsuitable borrowers...

And while Kennedy would LOVE to avoid ANY discussion of his influence on saddling the US with "Managed Care"... and foist the SAME THING on a VASTLY LARGER SCALE onto the SAME idiots that clammered for it THEN... there exist those of us who were THERE and remember all too well his vociferous demands that 'Health Maintenance Organizations would reduce the cost of health care by simply treating illness long before it becomes serious...

Weak. It's word for word from the declassified documents. But hey, listen for yourself:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QkgUkM0o6Q]YouTube - Nixon Launches the HMO's - What a SICKO[/ame]

 

[editec]

I'm not a socialist.

I'm a historian playing the futurist for your benefit, Dude.

I'm just informing you what your future will look like.

Nationalist gopvernments are dying.

Corporatism will dominate the planet by the end of the century.

Some few people (far less than the combined number of national leaders) will control the world.

They will be the social scientists who

"..are the proper position to tell everyone else what is "in our best interests".

One certainly doesn't need to be a socialist to see the writing on the walls, Dude.

You posted the sentiments of socialists....

A socialist is one who believes that the government should rightly control the mean of production, sport.

And tend to agree with them.

No I think that is not typically a good idea.

The slouch to global corporatism is being led by the biggest multi-national corporation in the world, known as "District of Columbia".

Washington is the ENABLER of the corporations, amigo.

Big capital owns big goverment.

You seem to want to further enable and empower that corporation.

ACtually I'd like to see the people take it back. Not a chance that will happen since people like yourself can't apparently see how the system they have in place actually works.

My bias is toward the individual, rather than any one of the various favored elite collectivist authoritarian cliques.

As is mine, actually. However the only hope for individual rights is through a government committed to protecting those rights.

That would take a government not dominated by big capital, of course...something we don't have and probably never will have, either.

Certainly you cannot imagine that corporations are in the business (or should be in the business, either) of protecting the rights of the individual.

Corporations really only have one job...to produce wealth for their stockholders.

Hence the rights of the individuals are left at the door when those people go to work for corporations.

 

[Political Junky]

Of course they don't, since while the government is in charge of what companies are allowed to sell what, all they have to do is bribe them to keep out competition.

Wrong. It's the government going into business expressly to compete against them, and put them out of business. That's not the way it works in America.

They'll have to become more competitive then, won't they? I don't see why the government shouldn't compete in a free market. In fact, the collusion and inflationary price fixing in the private markets mandates such competition. If they can come up with a system that the consumer would prefer over the government system, they'll survive. If they choose to remain the blood-sucking parasites that they are, then they won't. Its about time people had real choices.

Absolutely right about that. Force the blood suckers to compete with a public plan, or cease to exist.