How Obama uses words to fool people

[MaggieMae]

Wanna bet that there isn't some nebulous language in that 1200-odd pages, that isn't ripe to be "interpreted" to mean that abortions will be fully funded??

I sure wouldn't.

So when are you guys gonna get it through your thick skulls that those 1200-odd pages are NOT "The Bill." THE BILL doesn't even exist yet.

It is the draft the country is asked to voice their opinions on.
Call it a vagina for all I care...it is all one in the same.

And it is what those voices don't want answers to because they think they already know it all. Kinda like you.

 

[Oldandtired]

So when are you guys gonna get it through your thick skulls that those 1200-odd pages are NOT "The Bill." THE BILL doesn't even exist yet.

It is the draft the country is asked to voice their opinions on.
Call it a vagina for all I care...it is all one in the same.

And it is what those voices don't want answers to because they think they already know it all. Kinda like you.

Perhaps. But you dont know me.

I am basing it striclty on the little I have had the patience to read, and the few answers the Obama adminsitration and members of congress have offered.



What have I heard?

"it will lower costs"...how? .....it will. Oh.
"it has nothing that imply's death panels"...Really? Then what did you admit to take out? Things people took as death panels. Oh really? Then what was it supposed to mean? Irrelevant. We took it out. Oh.
It will be deficit neutral. Really? How? ....It will. Oh.

So please Maggie...I am all ears....what is in the bill?

 

[Political Junky]

He said on Saturday that "abortion" concerns by those that are against abortion and do not want "elective" abortions paid for with tax payer dollars, are concerns that are unfounded as NO WHERE IN THE BILL is abortion itemized as an approved procedure in the bill. He continued by adamantly saying "it is no where to be found in the draft of the bill"...and people walked away saying "see...the right wing loons are nuts and fear mongerers"....

However...nowhere in the bill is "heart surgery" itemized as an approved procedure..and no where in the bill is "liver transplant" itemized in the bill.;

Actually.....the only things itemized in the bill are things that would NOT be covered by the plan.

So the man did not lie...he simply used words to fool people into thinking one thing, when in fact it is another.

He has been doing it for two years.

The Hyde amendment makes it illegal for the federal government to pay for abortions.

 

[Ringel05]

A D&C could be an abortion, or it could be aftercare after a miscarriage. An abortion can address a tubal pregnancy. I don't want idiots or men deciding anything about abortions, or their definitions. Nobody can force anyone to have one. Don't need/want one, don't have one.

I totally agree. I also know (having worked in a major metropolitan hospital) that they don't lable abortions as abortions. They do this primarily to keep the anti abortion crowd off their back, so to speak. Also since D&Cs are generally covered when hosptals apply for government subsidies (all forms that apply) and insurance payments it becomes a smoke and mirrors game.

 

[Maple]

You can bet that abortions will be covered, just look at who wrote the bill , the extreme left of the democratic party.

 

[Zona]

That he has been handed a new talking point doesn't mean that he has read the bill, nitwit.

I thought Obama was the nitwit...remember he cant think on the fly, yet he is now a master wordsmith? A manipulative genius?

Nitwit indeed.

Oh and name calling hurts sir. Now I am depressed.

You really oughtta learn to read for comprehension.

It's beyond clear that he is unable to make up, extemporaneously, the manipulative NLP boilerplate he so smoothly reads off of TOTUS....When he has been briefed and coached on what to say we get the manipulative bullshit, which he is entirely incapable of making up on the fly, or he would be doing so and not verbally stepping on his dick almost every time he goes off script.

Nitwit indeed.

 

[Oddball]

Glad to see you can own up to it.

 

[KittenKoder]

One thing that is never mentioned about this bill: Where will all the money to pay for the overpriced procedures come from?

 

[Xenophon]

One thing that is never mentioned about this bill: Where will all the money to pay for the overpriced procedures come from?

Where will money for anything come from?

Obama today admitted the public debt is 17 TRILLION.

Things are FAR worse then they were admitting.

 

[Oddball]

One thing that is never mentioned about this bill: Where will all the money to pay for the overpriced procedures come from?

 

[Gudrid]

The Capps amendment does contain a statement – as we noted in an earlier article – that prohibits the use of public money to pay for abortions, except in cases of rape, incest and to save the life of the mother. That would still allow the public plan to cover all abortions, so long as the plans took in enough private money in the form of premiums paid by individuals or their employers. The Capps language also would allow private plans purchased with federal subsidies ("affordability credits" for low-income families and workers) to cover abortion.

So in essence, abortions for medical reasons would be covered. Other forms of abortion could be covered under the public plan, but only using private funds (in other words, not the subsidized public plan, assuming I'm understanding that correctly.) So with those first two, no government money spent on elective abortions. In the last one, it's saying that private plans can cover abortions if they want, and potentially someone who gets a subsidy could purchase one of those private plans with a subsidy. That appears to be the only way that federal dollars could go toward elective abortion that I can see. That's kind of like saying that welfare funds abortions solely because some welfare recipients choose to have abortions. Technically correct, but still bullshit.

To the OP - where did you pull that Obama quote from? I can't find it anywhere, and I like to see context.

 

[KittenKoder]

Why is my question avoided in every single thread? Where will the fucking money come from for all this? I mean, great, so everyone is ensured healthcare, can't argue that it's a nice idea. But seriously, does anyone realize why it hasn't happened yet?

 

[PoliticalChic]

US Law (Hyde Ammendment) currently prohibits public funding for abortion. Nowhere in the bill does it provide for abortion coverage.

Thus why you are so easily fooled.

The public option is not deemed as public funded. Yoiu WILL be paying a premium for it.

I suggest you stop listening and start reading.

You are going to be quite disappointed.

Oh really?

Care to show me? Where is any mention made of funding abortion? More right wing fear mongering and distortion of facts

The truth is that bills now before Congress don’t require federal money to be used for supporting abortion coverage. So the president is right to that limited extent. But it’s equally true that House and Senate legislation would allow a new "public" insurance plan to cover abortions, despite language added to the House bill that technically forbids using public funds to pay for them. Obama has said in the past that "reproductive services" would be covered by his public plan, so it’s likely that any new federal insurance plan would cover abortion unless Congress expressly prohibits that. Low- and moderate-income persons who would choose the "public plan" would qualify for federal subsidies to purchase it. Private plans that cover abortion also could be purchased with the help of federal subsidies. Therefore, we judge that the president goes too far when he calls the statements that government would be funding abortions "fabrications."

Abortion: Which Side Is Fabricating? | FactCheck.org

 

[chanel]

There are several states who have gotten around the Hyde amendment. And doesn't Planned Parenthood get tax money? Abortion will be covered one way or another. I just wish they'd be honest about it and stop pointing fingers at people they claim are spreading "disinformation". Pot Kettle Black?

 

[rdean]

What Factcheck says:

"Under the leading House plan, H.R. 3200, and an addition to the bill known as the Capps Amendment, the public plan can cover elective abortions as long as the abortions are paid for only by enrollees' premiums. Similarly, lower-income people will be allowed to use federal subsidies to purchase a public or private plan that covers abortions as long as the subsidy itself does not go toward financing abortions. Supporters say the segregation of funds is a compromise that would work."

What I don't understand is why you right wingers care? Aren't you pro torture and you carry assault weapons around? You use assault weapons on people, not food. Besides, once the kid is born, YOU don't want to take care of it. American conservatives only want to get it born and then, screw it, it's not MY kid. Right?

You're so pro life, but then, what kind of life? By a drug addict mother who will beat the kid to death?

You know what it really, really funny, is Michelle Bachmann, a true representative of the Confederate Party. She says she wants government to "Stay away from my body", apparently except for her uterus. She wants the government to control that.

Even more hilarious, the Republicans want health care to cover Viagra because "erectile dysfunction" or as I call it, "Lackaboner", is a medical condition, but birth control shouldn't be covered.

This is why much of the Republican party is actually insane. They don't need a "check up", they need to be "checked in".

 

[Ravi]

Even more hilarious, the Republicans want health care to cover Viagra because "erectile dysfunction" or as I call it, "Lackaboner", is a medical condition, but birth control shouldn't be covered.

This is because Republicans are the ones that need this drug.

 

[MaggieMae]

It is the draft the country is asked to voice their opinions on.
Call it a vagina for all I care...it is all one in the same.

And it is what those voices don't want answers to because they think they already know it all. Kinda like you.

Perhaps. But you dont know me.

I am basing it striclty on the little I have had the patience to read, and the few answers the Obama adminsitration and members of congress have offered.



What have I heard?

"it will lower costs"...how? .....it will. Oh.
"it has nothing that imply's death panels"...Really? Then what did you admit to take out? Things people took as death panels. Oh really? Then what was it supposed to mean? Irrelevant. We took it out. Oh.
It will be deficit neutral. Really? How? ....It will. Oh.

So please Maggie...I am all ears....what is in the bill?

Costs are projections based on history and forecasts. This isn't something like building a new airplane where the cost thereof can be determined beforehand and the plane will be built and done with in a year. Those who are demanding specific dollars and cents are just being totally unrealistic. OF COURSE it's going to "cost" something. It would be the largest policy change since Medicare. But if they can figure out how to close some of the existing gaps which are already costly and ineffective, it will help reduce the cost.

The things that were removed were simply to appease people who are determined to find fault anyway with VERY CLEAR language. When in doubt, throw it out. People have and will continue to have a patient's right to discuss end of life decisions with their physicians. But now it will cost them out of pocket. Get it now?

Here's an analysis of the points left on the table when Congress recessed and which will be taken up in the Senate when they return.

The Associated Press: A look at health care plans in Congress

I am not, however, waiting with bated breath for any reform "package" to be enacted, unless there is some sympathy voting over the death of Ted Kennedy who championed this cause for 40 years. The best I can hope for is crackdown on the insurance industry sharks who are, in effect, making all your medical decisions for you within the walls of their glass highrises while you, on the other hand, may lose your modest home due to a catastrophic illness or injury.

 

[MaggieMae]

A D&C could be an abortion, or it could be aftercare after a miscarriage. An abortion can address a tubal pregnancy. I don't want idiots or men deciding anything about abortions, or their definitions. Nobody can force anyone to have one. Don't need/want one, don't have one.

I totally agree. I also know (having worked in a major metropolitan hospital) that they don't lable abortions as abortions. They do this primarily to keep the anti abortion crowd off their back, so to speak. Also since D&Cs are generally covered when hosptals apply for government subsidies (all forms that apply) and insurance payments it becomes a smoke and mirrors game.

Then hospital administrators are lying. If a hospital does a D&C without a medical reason, their liability is enormous and they are taking a huge risk.

 

[MaggieMae]

You can bet that abortions will be covered, just look at who wrote the bill , the extreme left of the democratic party.

Yep. No Republican has ever had an abortion by choice. Never ever ever.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

He said on Saturday that "abortion" concerns by those that are against abortion and do not want "elective" abortions paid for with tax payer dollars, are concerns that are unfounded as NO WHERE IN THE BILL is abortion itemized as an approved procedure in the bill. He continued by adamantly saying "it is no where to be found in the draft of the bill"...and people walked away saying "see...the right wing loons are nuts and fear mongerers"....

However...nowhere in the bill is "heart surgery" itemized as an approved procedure..and no where in the bill is "liver transplant" itemized in the bill.;

Actually.....the only things itemized in the bill are things that would NOT be covered by the plan.

So the man did not lie...he simply used words to fool people into thinking one thing, when in fact it is another.

He has been doing it for two years.

The Hyde amendment makes it illegal for the federal government to pay for abortions.

No it doesn't.... as I've already shown.


You must really be stupid!!