CDZ How Does Sanders Plan to Pay for Free College Education?

[320 Years of History]

So, what if the state turns down the federal funds and says, 'No thank you?'

I suppose states would be allowed to do that. I can't see why they would. The $70B is tuition paid, not "tuition paid by students and their families." Accordingly, unless states find themselves in the enviable position of contributing less than 1/3rd of their respective "bills" for student tuitions, I can't see why they'd opt out. Also, seeing as Mr. Sander's provisions would like likely increase overall enrollment, states should be thrilled to be part of the "deal" rather than not.

After all, nobody's tuition is actually enough to pay for the true cost of educating them. That is, to say, schools that must depend entirely on the revenue from tuition really can't do much in the way of ongoing development of knowledge in general. That's the reason research is so important; it's what pays most of the bills for all that infrastructure one sees at a university/college, as well as the quest for knowledge for its own sake, even though the tuition does help do so as well. It's also what attracts donors and talented new researchers. Without it, colleges and universities will have to make due with teaching undergraduates, maybe a very few masters degree students.

These seem like counter-proposals to each other, to lower costs while at the same time using more expensive professors. Seems kind of wishful thinking.

Well, yes and no. It's doable, but to do it, one must task professors to also do more of that which generates the most income, or at least enough income, to sustain the school. I think the rationale is that the savings from not paying adjunct teachers would balance the scales. I don't know that I think it will; indeed, I suspect it won't, but I'd have to look school by school to find out. (I ain't doing that, but you can if you want to or care enough. LOL)

The thing is that adjuncts, though they are lower paid, know more than enough to educate undergraduates, which is the class of student Mr. Sanders' proposal addresses. Generally adjunct professors, sometimes called instructors, are folks who have the knowledge to teach a topic, but who are not interested in continual research and publishing the findings of their research. Quite often adjunct professors are folks who are very good classroom teachers, but lousy or unmotivated researchers.

In short there is no good way to, by a person's title at a university, tell whether they are a good teacher. Plenty of full profs are lousy classroom teachers, but excellent one-on-one teachers to their GAs. Summarily throwing out or discounting the value of adjuncts is akin to "throwing out the baby with the bathwater," or "cutting off one's nose to spite one's face."

At major/predominantly research driven universities, adjunct professors are there for a very good reason. It'd be a mistake to prohibit or restrict their use. Occasionally, I encounter clients who, despite hiring my firm, want to tell us how to execute and deliver a project and rarely does that go as well -- for both them and us -- as when the client just lets us do the job they engaged us to do. The government needs to fund education, not tell universities and colleges how to deliver it.

Sidebar:
It's somewhat different if the engagement is a staff augmentation one, for it's understood at the start that is the nature of the project, but I don't personally manage, become closely involved with (barring calamity) or sell that type of engagement. Then again, I don't much like that medicine has shifted to the consultative model. I believe in letting experts do that at which they are expert and trusting in their expert opinion and letting them lead the show in that regard so I can do other things that I need to get done and not worry about what I'm paying them to do.

A little learning is a dangerous thing
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely sobers us again.
Fired at first sight with what the muse imparts,
In fearless youth we tempt the heights of arts
While from the bounded level of our mind
Short views we take nor see the lengths behind
But more advanced behold with strange surprise,
New distant scenes of endless science rise!
-- Alexander Pope, "An Essay on Criticism"​

End of sidebar:

This states no noneducational spending, but what is to prevent the state from accepting $X in funding, then shifting that amount from academic expenses to athletics, then taking in the federal money to the academic activities?

Well, the answer to that question depends on how the funds -- any and all of them -- come to the school. If they come in as general funds, nothing. If they come in as grant money or "special" funds, the terms set by the provider of the money constrain how they are used.

Over time the people taxed will leave the country and take their billions with them.

They certainly can elect to do emmigrate, but the tax would have to be especially onerous for it alone to motivate such a decision...onerous enough that, in concert with other "stuff" that ticks them off, it offsets the benefits of remaining in the country. It'd take a whole lot to make that happen. Mr. Sanders' proposal is hardly going to be enough to do that. Even just dispensing with annual corporate subsidies (tax or otherwise) would be enough to pay for $70B in tuition payments for college/trade school attending citizens.

U.S. Historic Corporate Tax Rates from 1909 to 2010 (TPC | United States Historical Corporate Top Tax Rate and Bracket From 1909)

Other:
I don't get the point of the remarks about "financial need." It seems to me only right that if the nation is going to pay for college for everyone, that financial need should have nothing to do with it. That said, I don't mind if wealthy folks are made to pay their own way, but I do mind if that's not made clear and the reason(s) why similarly made clear. Presumably the reason would be because they just don't need the assistance, and I'm okay with that. It makes sense that wealthy folks accept a handout if it's given to them; they're under no obligation to "leave money on the table, as it were. I hardly expect them to "cry the blues" if they don't get one, however.

 

[rightwinger]

Sanders plans to make Mexico pay for it

 

[iamwhatiseem]

I believe tuition should be paid by the government - yes. As per my previous post, if this administration can give $70 BILLION a MONTH to Wall Street, and super corporations despite record profits of said - then goddammit the government can take 1/12th the money they handout to corporations and investment banks to students.
However, the problem is what the left would do next. They would not stop at tuition, they would want to include full room and board. And then include illegal aliens. That estimated $75Bn would likely turn into $275 Bn by the time corrupt officials pump the numbers.

 

[Fishlore]

Sanders plans to make Mexico pay for it

It is always refreshing to hear from the Republican low-information voter. Thanks

 

[320 Years of History]

However, the problem is what the left would do next. They would not stop at tuition, they would want to include full room and board. And then include illegal aliens. That estimated $75Bn would likely turn into $275 Bn by the time corrupt officials pump the numbers.

Hypothesis contrary to fact

Slippery Slope

 

[2aguy]

Some useful data from here.

Bernie Sanders on Education

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/04/nyregion/across-europe-an-outcry-over-paying-for-college.html

This Country Just Abolished College Tuition Fees

England Student Debt Unprecedented as Government Shifts Funding
Statements by Sanders onhow he plans to pay for this free education.

My proposal is to put a speculation tax on wall street, raise very substantial sums of money, not only make public colleges and universities tuition-free, but also substantially lower interest rates on student debt. You have families out there paying 6 percent, 8 percent, 10 percent on student debt, refinance their homes at 3 percent.
.....
SANDERS: No, it is an extraordinary investment for this country. Germany & many other countries do it already. This is revolutionary for education in America. It will give hope to millions of young people.

Q: And you want to have the states pay for about 1/3 of this $70 billion plan, correct?

SANDERS: Yes. Bottom line here is, in the year 2015, we should look at a college degree the same way we looked at a high school degree 50 or 60 years ago. If you want to make it into the middle class, the bottom line now, is in America, in the year 2015, any person who has the ability and the desire should be able to get an education, college education, regardless of the income of his or her family. And we must substantially lower, as my legislation does, interest rates on student debt.
.....

On Education: Two years free tuition at state colleges. Reform student loans.

Sanders would provide $18 billion to state governments to allow them to cut tuition at state colleges by 55 percent. And he would allow anyone paying off a student loan currently to refinance at a lower rate.
.....

So the best I can find so far is that Sanders wants to:
1. Give federal money, not much really, $18 billion to states to cut state tuitions in half.
2. Impose a 'Speculation Tax' on Wall Street. Dont see a problem with taking some whore and blow money away from these scoundrels.
3. Lower interest rates on existing student loans.

Not sure if he plans to make private colleges and Universities also free tuition or not.

We I putting this plan together, I would only offer free tuition for those who first went to a community college and then to a state college. For those who went to a state university for the full 4 years, I think I would offer then a package of grants, student work and interest free loans that allowed them to attend the school. This would give schools in the private sector an incentive to reduce costs to lure more students.

I would also ban the expenditure of any state run universities and colleges from major college sports programs, capping it in some fashion.

We need to return our colleges to first educating Americans and to not being profit driven.

Has anyone else obtained any other details of how Sanders plans to fund his free college idea?

It isn't free......and it is the government can't handle anything else properly so expecting them to pay for college will turn to crap too....

 

[blackhawk]

The rich will cover it by paying their fair share that does seem to be how Sanders plans to pay for everything he wants to do.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

Some useful data from here.

Bernie Sanders on Education

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/04/nyregion/across-europe-an-outcry-over-paying-for-college.html

This Country Just Abolished College Tuition Fees

England Student Debt Unprecedented as Government Shifts Funding
Statements by Sanders onhow he plans to pay for this free education.

My proposal is to put a speculation tax on wall street, raise very substantial sums of money, not only make public colleges and universities tuition-free, but also substantially lower interest rates on student debt. You have families out there paying 6 percent, 8 percent, 10 percent on student debt, refinance their homes at 3 percent.
.....
SANDERS: No, it is an extraordinary investment for this country. Germany & many other countries do it already. This is revolutionary for education in America. It will give hope to millions of young people.

Q: And you want to have the states pay for about 1/3 of this $70 billion plan, correct?

SANDERS: Yes. Bottom line here is, in the year 2015, we should look at a college degree the same way we looked at a high school degree 50 or 60 years ago. If you want to make it into the middle class, the bottom line now, is in America, in the year 2015, any person who has the ability and the desire should be able to get an education, college education, regardless of the income of his or her family. And we must substantially lower, as my legislation does, interest rates on student debt.
.....

On Education: Two years free tuition at state colleges. Reform student loans.

Sanders would provide $18 billion to state governments to allow them to cut tuition at state colleges by 55 percent. And he would allow anyone paying off a student loan currently to refinance at a lower rate.
.....

So the best I can find so far is that Sanders wants to:
1. Give federal money, not much really, $18 billion to states to cut state tuitions in half.
2. Impose a 'Speculation Tax' on Wall Street. Dont see a problem with taking some whore and blow money away from these scoundrels.
3. Lower interest rates on existing student loans.

Not sure if he plans to make private colleges and Universities also free tuition or not.

We I putting this plan together, I would only offer free tuition for those who first went to a community college and then to a state college. For those who went to a state university for the full 4 years, I think I would offer then a package of grants, student work and interest free loans that allowed them to attend the school. This would give schools in the private sector an incentive to reduce costs to lure more students.

I would also ban the expenditure of any state run universities and colleges from major college sports programs, capping it in some fashion.

We need to return our colleges to first educating Americans and to not being profit driven.

Has anyone else obtained any other details of how Sanders plans to fund his free college idea?

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

LOL, no, its not quite that simple, dude.


Read it again and pay attention this time, lol.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

LOL, no, its not quite that simple, dude.


Read it again and pay attention this time, lol.

I don't need to read it again. I have been alive long enough to see that what the federal government spends is independent of the amount of tax they collect. Therefore any plan they have for paying for the next entitlement is simply a justification to enact the entitlement. Remember, they had a plan for social security too.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I don't need to read it again. I have been alive long enough to see that what the federal government spends is independent of the amount of tax they collect. Therefore any plan they have for paying for the next entitlement is simply a justification to enact the entitlement. Remember, they had a plan for social security too.

And Social Security has been one of the more successful entitlement programs, so whats your point?

 

[Fishlore]

Some useful data from here.

Bernie Sanders on Education

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/04/nyregion/across-europe-an-outcry-over-paying-for-college.html

This Country Just Abolished College Tuition Fees

England Student Debt Unprecedented as Government Shifts Funding
Statements by Sanders onhow he plans to pay for this free education.

My proposal is to put a speculation tax on wall street, raise very substantial sums of money, not only make public colleges and universities tuition-free, but also substantially lower interest rates on student debt. You have families out there paying 6 percent, 8 percent, 10 percent on student debt, refinance their homes at 3 percent.
.....
SANDERS: No, it is an extraordinary investment for this country. Germany & many other countries do it already. This is revolutionary for education in America. It will give hope to millions of young people.

Q: And you want to have the states pay for about 1/3 of this $70 billion plan, correct?

SANDERS: Yes. Bottom line here is, in the year 2015, we should look at a college degree the same way we looked at a high school degree 50 or 60 years ago. If you want to make it into the middle class, the bottom line now, is in America, in the year 2015, any person who has the ability and the desire should be able to get an education, college education, regardless of the income of his or her family. And we must substantially lower, as my legislation does, interest rates on student debt.
.....

On Education: Two years free tuition at state colleges. Reform student loans.

Sanders would provide $18 billion to state governments to allow them to cut tuition at state colleges by 55 percent. And he would allow anyone paying off a student loan currently to refinance at a lower rate.
.....

So the best I can find so far is that Sanders wants to:
1. Give federal money, not much really, $18 billion to states to cut state tuitions in half.
2. Impose a 'Speculation Tax' on Wall Street. Dont see a problem with taking some whore and blow money away from these scoundrels.
3. Lower interest rates on existing student loans.

Not sure if he plans to make private colleges and Universities also free tuition or not.

We I putting this plan together, I would only offer free tuition for those who first went to a community college and then to a state college. For those who went to a state university for the full 4 years, I think I would offer then a package of grants, student work and interest free loans that allowed them to attend the school. This would give schools in the private sector an incentive to reduce costs to lure more students.

I would also ban the expenditure of any state run universities and colleges from major college sports programs, capping it in some fashion.

We need to return our colleges to first educating Americans and to not being profit driven.

Has anyone else obtained any other details of how Sanders plans to fund his free college idea?

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

It is an attractive idea to think of paying down the national debt by cutting federal spending on health, education and welfare -- particularly if you are one of those resentful white folks that thing your standard of living is being gobbled upo by blacks, Mexicans, immigrants, welfare queens, layabouts etc. It is attractive but it isn't realistic.

The national debt must be paid off bond by bond as it comes due. Further debt can be avoided by raising taxes on those who have the money to pay them. Cutting services to the poor, the disabledm the elderly etc. isn't a workable plan because the social destruction such reductions would create cost more to fix than the amount saved.

I know these are unpleasant truths and seem counter-intuitive to those who think of the national economy in kitchen table terms, but that is why economics is a science. The angry resentment is a political manipulation by the 1%.

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

LOL, no, its not quite that simple, dude.


Read it again and pay attention this time, lol.

I don't need to read it again. I have been alive long enough to see that what the federal government spends is independent of the amount of tax they collect. Therefore any plan they have for paying for the next entitlement is simply a justification to enact the entitlement. Remember, they had a plan for social security too.

You will be pleasantly surprised to learn that in all its long history, Social Security has never borrowed a dime; in fact, the program is prohibited by law from borrowing money.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Some useful data from here.

Bernie Sanders on Education

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/04/nyregion/across-europe-an-outcry-over-paying-for-college.html

This Country Just Abolished College Tuition Fees

England Student Debt Unprecedented as Government Shifts Funding
Statements by Sanders onhow he plans to pay for this free education.

My proposal is to put a speculation tax on wall street, raise very substantial sums of money, not only make public colleges and universities tuition-free, but also substantially lower interest rates on student debt. You have families out there paying 6 percent, 8 percent, 10 percent on student debt, refinance their homes at 3 percent.
.....
SANDERS: No, it is an extraordinary investment for this country. Germany & many other countries do it already. This is revolutionary for education in America. It will give hope to millions of young people.

Q: And you want to have the states pay for about 1/3 of this $70 billion plan, correct?

SANDERS: Yes. Bottom line here is, in the year 2015, we should look at a college degree the same way we looked at a high school degree 50 or 60 years ago. If you want to make it into the middle class, the bottom line now, is in America, in the year 2015, any person who has the ability and the desire should be able to get an education, college education, regardless of the income of his or her family. And we must substantially lower, as my legislation does, interest rates on student debt.
.....

On Education: Two years free tuition at state colleges. Reform student loans.

Sanders would provide $18 billion to state governments to allow them to cut tuition at state colleges by 55 percent. And he would allow anyone paying off a student loan currently to refinance at a lower rate.
.....

So the best I can find so far is that Sanders wants to:
1. Give federal money, not much really, $18 billion to states to cut state tuitions in half.
2. Impose a 'Speculation Tax' on Wall Street. Dont see a problem with taking some whore and blow money away from these scoundrels.
3. Lower interest rates on existing student loans.

Not sure if he plans to make private colleges and Universities also free tuition or not.

We I putting this plan together, I would only offer free tuition for those who first went to a community college and then to a state college. For those who went to a state university for the full 4 years, I think I would offer then a package of grants, student work and interest free loans that allowed them to attend the school. This would give schools in the private sector an incentive to reduce costs to lure more students.

I would also ban the expenditure of any state run universities and colleges from major college sports programs, capping it in some fashion.

We need to return our colleges to first educating Americans and to not being profit driven.

Has anyone else obtained any other details of how Sanders plans to fund his free college idea?

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

It is an attractive idea to think of paying down the national debt by cutting federal spending on health, education and welfare -- particularly if you are one of those resentful white folks that thing your standard of living is being gobbled upo by blacks, Mexicans, immigrants, welfare queens, layabouts etc. It is attractive but it isn't realistic.

The national debt must be paid off bond by bond as it comes due. Further debt can be avoided by raising taxes on those who have the money to pay them. Cutting services to the poor, the disabledm the elderly etc. isn't a workable plan because the social destruction such reductions would create cost more to fix than the amount saved.

I know these are unpleasant truths and seem counter-intuitive to those who think of the national economy in kitchen table terms, but that is why economics is a science. The angry resentment is a political manipulation by the 1%.

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

LOL, no, its not quite that simple, dude.


Read it again and pay attention this time, lol.

I don't need to read it again. I have been alive long enough to see that what the federal government spends is independent of the amount of tax they collect. Therefore any plan they have for paying for the next entitlement is simply a justification to enact the entitlement. Remember, they had a plan for social security too.

You will be pleasantly surprised to learn that in all its long history, Social Security has never borrowed a dime; in fact, the program is prohibited by law from borrowing money.

What elected national conservative thinks that blacks are stealing whites jobs?

I do know that black market labor illegally from outside the USA is stealing jobs, but that doesnt fit your racist narrative, does it, dude? Why cant you paint the picture as it is without adding your 'white devils' spin to it?

And yo are right about Social Security; actually it has been loaning money, not borrowing it, and it does so by buying a special issued series of Treasury bonds that cannot be sold except back to the US Treasury. So it cannot be stolen, lost or defaulted on without the entire federal government also losing credit worthiness as well.

Social Security is as solid as the US government can make it.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

Some useful data from here.

Bernie Sanders on Education

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/04/nyregion/across-europe-an-outcry-over-paying-for-college.html

This Country Just Abolished College Tuition Fees

England Student Debt Unprecedented as Government Shifts Funding
Statements by Sanders onhow he plans to pay for this free education.

My proposal is to put a speculation tax on wall street, raise very substantial sums of money, not only make public colleges and universities tuition-free, but also substantially lower interest rates on student debt. You have families out there paying 6 percent, 8 percent, 10 percent on student debt, refinance their homes at 3 percent.
.....
SANDERS: No, it is an extraordinary investment for this country. Germany & many other countries do it already. This is revolutionary for education in America. It will give hope to millions of young people.

Q: And you want to have the states pay for about 1/3 of this $70 billion plan, correct?

SANDERS: Yes. Bottom line here is, in the year 2015, we should look at a college degree the same way we looked at a high school degree 50 or 60 years ago. If you want to make it into the middle class, the bottom line now, is in America, in the year 2015, any person who has the ability and the desire should be able to get an education, college education, regardless of the income of his or her family. And we must substantially lower, as my legislation does, interest rates on student debt.
.....

On Education: Two years free tuition at state colleges. Reform student loans.

Sanders would provide $18 billion to state governments to allow them to cut tuition at state colleges by 55 percent. And he would allow anyone paying off a student loan currently to refinance at a lower rate.
.....

So the best I can find so far is that Sanders wants to:
1. Give federal money, not much really, $18 billion to states to cut state tuitions in half.
2. Impose a 'Speculation Tax' on Wall Street. Dont see a problem with taking some whore and blow money away from these scoundrels.
3. Lower interest rates on existing student loans.

Not sure if he plans to make private colleges and Universities also free tuition or not.

We I putting this plan together, I would only offer free tuition for those who first went to a community college and then to a state college. For those who went to a state university for the full 4 years, I think I would offer then a package of grants, student work and interest free loans that allowed them to attend the school. This would give schools in the private sector an incentive to reduce costs to lure more students.

I would also ban the expenditure of any state run universities and colleges from major college sports programs, capping it in some fashion.

We need to return our colleges to first educating Americans and to not being profit driven.

Has anyone else obtained any other details of how Sanders plans to fund his free college idea?

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

It is an attractive idea to think of paying down the national debt by cutting federal spending on health, education and welfare -- particularly if you are one of those resentful white folks that thing your standard of living is being gobbled upo by blacks, Mexicans, immigrants, welfare queens, layabouts etc. It is attractive but it isn't realistic.

The national debt must be paid off bond by bond as it comes due. Further debt can be avoided by raising taxes on those who have the money to pay them. Cutting services to the poor, the disabledm the elderly etc. isn't a workable plan because the social destruction such reductions would create cost more to fix than the amount saved.

I know these are unpleasant truths and seem counter-intuitive to those who think of the national economy in kitchen table terms, but that is why economics is a science. The angry resentment is a political manipulation by the 1%.

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

LOL, no, its not quite that simple, dude.


Read it again and pay attention this time, lol.

I don't need to read it again. I have been alive long enough to see that what the federal government spends is independent of the amount of tax they collect. Therefore any plan they have for paying for the next entitlement is simply a justification to enact the entitlement. Remember, they had a plan for social security too.

You will be pleasantly surprised to learn that in all its long history, Social Security has never borrowed a dime; in fact, the program is prohibited by law from borrowing money.

You may unpleasantly surprised to learn that the social security fund has no cash, but rather a bunch of IOUs from the federal government. The point is these guys will spend what they want and send you the tab.

 

[Fishlore]

Some useful data from here.

Bernie Sanders on Education

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/04/nyregion/across-europe-an-outcry-over-paying-for-college.html

This Country Just Abolished College Tuition Fees

England Student Debt Unprecedented as Government Shifts Funding
Statements by Sanders onhow he plans to pay for this free education.

My proposal is to put a speculation tax on wall street, raise very substantial sums of money, not only make public colleges and universities tuition-free, but also substantially lower interest rates on student debt. You have families out there paying 6 percent, 8 percent, 10 percent on student debt, refinance their homes at 3 percent.
.....
SANDERS: No, it is an extraordinary investment for this country. Germany & many other countries do it already. This is revolutionary for education in America. It will give hope to millions of young people.

Q: And you want to have the states pay for about 1/3 of this $70 billion plan, correct?

SANDERS: Yes. Bottom line here is, in the year 2015, we should look at a college degree the same way we looked at a high school degree 50 or 60 years ago. If you want to make it into the middle class, the bottom line now, is in America, in the year 2015, any person who has the ability and the desire should be able to get an education, college education, regardless of the income of his or her family. And we must substantially lower, as my legislation does, interest rates on student debt.
.....

On Education: Two years free tuition at state colleges. Reform student loans.

Sanders would provide $18 billion to state governments to allow them to cut tuition at state colleges by 55 percent. And he would allow anyone paying off a student loan currently to refinance at a lower rate.
.....

So the best I can find so far is that Sanders wants to:
1. Give federal money, not much really, $18 billion to states to cut state tuitions in half.
2. Impose a 'Speculation Tax' on Wall Street. Dont see a problem with taking some whore and blow money away from these scoundrels.
3. Lower interest rates on existing student loans.

Not sure if he plans to make private colleges and Universities also free tuition or not.

We I putting this plan together, I would only offer free tuition for those who first went to a community college and then to a state college. For those who went to a state university for the full 4 years, I think I would offer then a package of grants, student work and interest free loans that allowed them to attend the school. This would give schools in the private sector an incentive to reduce costs to lure more students.

I would also ban the expenditure of any state run universities and colleges from major college sports programs, capping it in some fashion.

We need to return our colleges to first educating Americans and to not being profit driven.

Has anyone else obtained any other details of how Sanders plans to fund his free college idea?

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

It is an attractive idea to think of paying down the national debt by cutting federal spending on health, education and welfare -- particularly if you are one of those resentful white folks that thing your standard of living is being gobbled upo by blacks, Mexicans, immigrants, welfare queens, layabouts etc. It is attractive but it isn't realistic.

The national debt must be paid off bond by bond as it comes due. Further debt can be avoided by raising taxes on those who have the money to pay them. Cutting services to the poor, the disabledm the elderly etc. isn't a workable plan because the social destruction such reductions would create cost more to fix than the amount saved.

I know these are unpleasant truths and seem counter-intuitive to those who think of the national economy in kitchen table terms, but that is why economics is a science. The angry resentment is a political manipulation by the 1%.

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

LOL, no, its not quite that simple, dude.


Read it again and pay attention this time, lol.

I don't need to read it again. I have been alive long enough to see that what the federal government spends is independent of the amount of tax they collect. Therefore any plan they have for paying for the next entitlement is simply a justification to enact the entitlement. Remember, they had a plan for social security too.

You will be pleasantly surprised to learn that in all its long history, Social Security has never borrowed a dime; in fact, the program is prohibited by law from borrowing money.

You may unpleasantly surprised to learn that the social security fund has no cash, but rather a bunch of IOUs from the federal government. The point is these guys will spend what they want and send you the tab.

Oh, I'm not despondent or alarmed over the well-known fact that SS has been buying Treasury bonds. Those "IOUs" as you so delicately call them, are backed by the full faith and credit of the United States Government and, under the XIV Amendment, cannot be defaulted upon. Uncle Sam would have to sell nukes to North Korea if necessary, but Social Security is going to be repaid.

As you probably know, FICA tax is not collected on income over $118,500. Raising that cap will sufficiently increase SS revenues to cover all obligations into the foreseeable future. Bernie Sanders has advocated removing the cap entirely. Medicare is not capped. Such a change would leave SS rolling in dough.

Then there is widely popular proposal to reduce SS payments on a sliding scale for retirees with high incomes. This too would remove all financial pressure from the Social Security program. Social Security is the most popular federal program in the history of the United States. Every GOP politician who tries to monkey with it is immediately catapulted into the Outer Darkness. Americans love socialism, they just don't understand the term.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

Some useful data from here.

Bernie Sanders on Education

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/04/nyregion/across-europe-an-outcry-over-paying-for-college.html

This Country Just Abolished College Tuition Fees

England Student Debt Unprecedented as Government Shifts Funding
Statements by Sanders onhow he plans to pay for this free education.

My proposal is to put a speculation tax on wall street, raise very substantial sums of money, not only make public colleges and universities tuition-free, but also substantially lower interest rates on student debt. You have families out there paying 6 percent, 8 percent, 10 percent on student debt, refinance their homes at 3 percent.
.....
SANDERS: No, it is an extraordinary investment for this country. Germany & many other countries do it already. This is revolutionary for education in America. It will give hope to millions of young people.

Q: And you want to have the states pay for about 1/3 of this $70 billion plan, correct?

SANDERS: Yes. Bottom line here is, in the year 2015, we should look at a college degree the same way we looked at a high school degree 50 or 60 years ago. If you want to make it into the middle class, the bottom line now, is in America, in the year 2015, any person who has the ability and the desire should be able to get an education, college education, regardless of the income of his or her family. And we must substantially lower, as my legislation does, interest rates on student debt.
.....

On Education: Two years free tuition at state colleges. Reform student loans.

Sanders would provide $18 billion to state governments to allow them to cut tuition at state colleges by 55 percent. And he would allow anyone paying off a student loan currently to refinance at a lower rate.
.....

So the best I can find so far is that Sanders wants to:
1. Give federal money, not much really, $18 billion to states to cut state tuitions in half.
2. Impose a 'Speculation Tax' on Wall Street. Dont see a problem with taking some whore and blow money away from these scoundrels.
3. Lower interest rates on existing student loans.

Not sure if he plans to make private colleges and Universities also free tuition or not.

We I putting this plan together, I would only offer free tuition for those who first went to a community college and then to a state college. For those who went to a state university for the full 4 years, I think I would offer then a package of grants, student work and interest free loans that allowed them to attend the school. This would give schools in the private sector an incentive to reduce costs to lure more students.

I would also ban the expenditure of any state run universities and colleges from major college sports programs, capping it in some fashion.

We need to return our colleges to first educating Americans and to not being profit driven.

Has anyone else obtained any other details of how Sanders plans to fund his free college idea?

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

It is an attractive idea to think of paying down the national debt by cutting federal spending on health, education and welfare -- particularly if you are one of those resentful white folks that thing your standard of living is being gobbled upo by blacks, Mexicans, immigrants, welfare queens, layabouts etc. It is attractive but it isn't realistic.

The national debt must be paid off bond by bond as it comes due. Further debt can be avoided by raising taxes on those who have the money to pay them. Cutting services to the poor, the disabledm the elderly etc. isn't a workable plan because the social destruction such reductions would create cost more to fix than the amount saved.

I know these are unpleasant truths and seem counter-intuitive to those who think of the national economy in kitchen table terms, but that is why economics is a science. The angry resentment is a political manipulation by the 1%.

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

LOL, no, its not quite that simple, dude.


Read it again and pay attention this time, lol.

I don't need to read it again. I have been alive long enough to see that what the federal government spends is independent of the amount of tax they collect. Therefore any plan they have for paying for the next entitlement is simply a justification to enact the entitlement. Remember, they had a plan for social security too.

You will be pleasantly surprised to learn that in all its long history, Social Security has never borrowed a dime; in fact, the program is prohibited by law from borrowing money.

You may unpleasantly surprised to learn that the social security fund has no cash, but rather a bunch of IOUs from the federal government. The point is these guys will spend what they want and send you the tab.

Oh, I'm not despondent or alarmed over the well-known fact that SS has been buying Treasury bonds. Those "IOUs" as you so delicately call them, are backed by the full faith and credit of the United States Government and, under the XIV Amendment, cannot be defaulted upon. Uncle Sam would have to sell nukes to North Korea if necessary, but Social Security is going to be repaid.

As you probably know, FICA tax is not collected on income over $118,500. Raising that cap will sufficiently increase SS revenues to cover all obligations into the foreseeable future. Bernie Sanders has advocated removing the cap entirely. Medicare is not capped. Such a change would leave SS rolling in dough.

Then there is widely popular proposal to reduce SS payments on a sliding scale for retirees with high incomes. This too would remove all financial pressure from the Social Security program. Social Security is the most popular federal program in the history of the United States. Every GOP politician who tries to monkey with it is immediately catapulted into the Outer Darkness. Americans love socialism, they just don't understand the term.

Great, IOU's backed by the full faith and credit of the USA. you still get the bill for it. Are you not the least bit concerned about a $19 trillion debt. You sound like a policy wonk bureaucrat the way you decipher the numbers and analyze solutions. THE FEDERAL GOVERMENT SPENDS TOO MUCH MONEY ON SOCIAL ENTITLEMENTS.
Quotation: "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not" Thomas Jefferson.

 

[JimBowie1958]

As you probably know, FICA tax is not collected on income over $118,500. Raising that cap will sufficiently increase SS revenues to cover all obligations into the foreseeable future. Bernie Sanders has advocated removing the cap entirely. Medicare is not capped. Such a change would leave SS rolling in dough..

There is no good reason to cap the Social Security tax. Sanders is right on this issue as well.

The fact that FICA is capped is why we effectively have a regressive tax rate on people in this c ountry, where the wealthy pay LESS as a percentage of their income than struggling Middle Class Americans do.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Great, IOU's backed by the full faith and credit of the USA. you still get the bill for it. Are you not the least bit concerned about a $19 trillion debt. You sound like a policy wonk bureaucrat the way you decipher the numbers and analyze solutions. THE FEDERAL GOVERMENT SPENDS TOO MUCH MONEY ON SOCIAL ENTITLEMENTS.
Quotation: "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not" Thomas Jefferson.

Social Security is EARNED and therefore an entitlement, and not given so people wont work, dude.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

Great, IOU's backed by the full faith and credit of the USA. you still get the bill for it. Are you not the least bit concerned about a $19 trillion debt. You sound like a policy wonk bureaucrat the way you decipher the numbers and analyze solutions. THE FEDERAL GOVERMENT SPENDS TOO MUCH MONEY ON SOCIAL ENTITLEMENTS.
Quotation: "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not" Thomas Jefferson.

Social Security is EARNED and therefore an entitlement, and not given so people wont work, dude.

Fine, everything is ok then. People only get back what they put in. Then we shouldn't have to do anything with SS. The money...er IOU's is all there and when your time comes to collect you'll be fine. Guess I'll cash in my IRA. How any conservative can defend SS is a mystery to me.

 

[320 Years of History]

Some useful data from here.

Bernie Sanders on Education

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/04/nyregion/across-europe-an-outcry-over-paying-for-college.html

This Country Just Abolished College Tuition Fees

England Student Debt Unprecedented as Government Shifts Funding
Statements by Sanders onhow he plans to pay for this free education.

My proposal is to put a speculation tax on wall street, raise very substantial sums of money, not only make public colleges and universities tuition-free, but also substantially lower interest rates on student debt. You have families out there paying 6 percent, 8 percent, 10 percent on student debt, refinance their homes at 3 percent.
.....
SANDERS: No, it is an extraordinary investment for this country. Germany & many other countries do it already. This is revolutionary for education in America. It will give hope to millions of young people.

Q: And you want to have the states pay for about 1/3 of this $70 billion plan, correct?

SANDERS: Yes. Bottom line here is, in the year 2015, we should look at a college degree the same way we looked at a high school degree 50 or 60 years ago. If you want to make it into the middle class, the bottom line now, is in America, in the year 2015, any person who has the ability and the desire should be able to get an education, college education, regardless of the income of his or her family. And we must substantially lower, as my legislation does, interest rates on student debt.
.....

On Education: Two years free tuition at state colleges. Reform student loans.

Sanders would provide $18 billion to state governments to allow them to cut tuition at state colleges by 55 percent. And he would allow anyone paying off a student loan currently to refinance at a lower rate.
.....

So the best I can find so far is that Sanders wants to:
1. Give federal money, not much really, $18 billion to states to cut state tuitions in half.
2. Impose a 'Speculation Tax' on Wall Street. Dont see a problem with taking some whore and blow money away from these scoundrels.
3. Lower interest rates on existing student loans.

Not sure if he plans to make private colleges and Universities also free tuition or not.

We I putting this plan together, I would only offer free tuition for those who first went to a community college and then to a state college. For those who went to a state university for the full 4 years, I think I would offer then a package of grants, student work and interest free loans that allowed them to attend the school. This would give schools in the private sector an incentive to reduce costs to lure more students.

I would also ban the expenditure of any state run universities and colleges from major college sports programs, capping it in some fashion.

We need to return our colleges to first educating Americans and to not being profit driven.

Has anyone else obtained any other details of how Sanders plans to fund his free college idea?

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

It is an attractive idea to think of paying down the national debt by cutting federal spending on health, education and welfare -- particularly if you are one of those resentful white folks that thing your standard of living is being gobbled upo by blacks, Mexicans, immigrants, welfare queens, layabouts etc. It is attractive but it isn't realistic.

The national debt must be paid off bond by bond as it comes due. Further debt can be avoided by raising taxes on those who have the money to pay them. Cutting services to the poor, the disabledm the elderly etc. isn't a workable plan because the social destruction such reductions would create cost more to fix than the amount saved.

I know these are unpleasant truths and seem counter-intuitive to those who think of the national economy in kitchen table terms, but that is why economics is a science. The angry resentment is a political manipulation by the 1%.

Ahh....yea....duh, It's called a credit card with your name on it. You spent a lot of time looking at numbers when all you need to look at is the big one called the national debt.....$19 trillion and counting. Perhaps it's obscured by being so obvious.

LOL, no, its not quite that simple, dude.


Read it again and pay attention this time, lol.

I don't need to read it again. I have been alive long enough to see that what the federal government spends is independent of the amount of tax they collect. Therefore any plan they have for paying for the next entitlement is simply a justification to enact the entitlement. Remember, they had a plan for social security too.

You will be pleasantly surprised to learn that in all its long history, Social Security has never borrowed a dime; in fact, the program is prohibited by law from borrowing money.

You may unpleasantly surprised to learn that the social security fund has no cash, but rather a bunch of IOUs from the federal government. The point is these guys will spend what they want and send you the tab.

Oh, I'm not despondent or alarmed over the well-known fact that SS has been buying Treasury bonds. Those "IOUs" as you so delicately call them, are backed by the full faith and credit of the United States Government and, under the XIV Amendment, cannot be defaulted upon. Uncle Sam would have to sell nukes to North Korea if necessary, but Social Security is going to be repaid.

As you probably know, FICA tax is not collected on income over $118,500. Raising that cap will sufficiently increase SS revenues to cover all obligations into the foreseeable future. Bernie Sanders has advocated removing the cap entirely. Medicare is not capped. Such a change would leave SS rolling in dough.

Then there is widely popular proposal to reduce SS payments on a sliding scale for retirees with high incomes. This too would remove all financial pressure from the Social Security program. Social Security is the most popular federal program in the history of the United States. Every GOP politician who tries to monkey with it is immediately catapulted into the Outer Darkness. Americans love socialism, they just don't understand the term.

Red:
Though I'm not keen on the idea of raising or removing the cap, I could live with it were that alone a change policy makers implement and were SS's benefits paid out in accordance with the higher sums paid in.

Blue:
That is unacceptable to me. It is because the whole point of SSI is that it's essentially a mandatory retirement provision that allows one to have retirement income commensurate with one's contributions to SSI. In other words, what one contributes to SSI is meant to benefit oneself (or one's family members). As it is now, if one dies before collecting the sum corresponding to what one contributed over the course of one's career, the money one (or one's spouse) contributed is effectively lost.

Other:
My personal preference is now and always has been that SSI be made optional for everyone; however, that may defeat the "forced to provide for one's retirement" intent. Accordingly, I would be fine with the idea that one must be at or above a given earnings level before it becomes optional -- the idea being that at or above a given level, one should not need to be forced to save for one's retirement. I don't want to see us become a nation wherein millions of average wage earners have no source of retirement income, but I also don't see the point in high earners being forced to contribute to a retirement plan for which they have no real need.

Also, I'd strongly prefer that SSI be returned to its original design whereby it was quite literally a forced savings account. Would doing that impose a burden on current contributors and beneficiaries? Yes, it would; however, it eases, indeed eliminates, the burden and risk for future generations. Given the choice between "biting the bullet" myself or unavoidably making my kids and grandkids do so, I'll always choose to "take the heat" instead of making them do so. Such is my view of trade-off between leaving the world better for my descendants than it was when I entered it and making the world better for myself now.