Herman Cains plan? 9-9-9 For those that hate it

[Avorysuds]

It's over, you crazy shallow Cain supporters better get used to it. Cain's rabid angry supporters are making Republicans looks truly stupid.

Could you post a link to these rabid cain supporters please.

Gramps thread on these boards.

Hell Gramps even admits he does not know if it is a good or bad thing (the 999 coupon), but if you don't agree with it he attacks you.

Fact is Gramps is supporting a guy that is using the Political stage of running for President to sell books.

He also attacks everyone else on the stage with an outright lie claiming they don't have plans when reality is they all have far better plans than Cain. Cain literally has no plan then of top of that he has zero backup plan. Cain's super simplistic 9 9 9 plan already has to have deductions added here and there and the loopholes are already being created because Cain never thought it through because he has no intention of being President.

 

[The T]

Read the op before you blindly attack. I clearly said their should be a trigger point to protect the indigent.

As far as my business goes I sell and install home remodeling products. At this point without all the details of its implimentation its hard to say exactly how the outcome will turn out. But I for one will not jump the gun and make broad based assumptions beyond the fact that this is a good starting point for "REAL" change.

Gramps... you have all the details. cain has said it complete and well thought out. All you have to do is go to his website and see the plan. Shouldn't take long, it's just a couple paragraphs.

I am at the site, 999 | Herman Cain for President

But I am not seeing the boogeyman. Are you making ASSumptions?

Strange how that works isn't it? GO to the site to read it for yourself...maybe the media pundits aren't being clear enough? Repubican Party elites perhaps that want this done already and sewn up for Romney or else?

 

[BenNatuf]

YOU need to get out of the box of thinking of the OLD system. I know it's hard for some of you...but at least try?

Oh. I'm way, way out of the box buddy. What i suggest is that you actually research the plan, it's on Cains website, and then actually DO SOME THINKING about what the ramifications of this simplistic marketting scam would be on taxes.

It doesn't matter, Cain win or lose, this plan will NEVER see the light of day.

I can't believe there's actually pseudo-intellectuals here who give genuine credence to such a shameless gimmick.

oh... I don't know, with a few tweaks I think the libs will love it.

it will be no harder to change than any other tax system, all it will take is a vote of the congress and the presidents signature. Progressivity and regressivity are meaningless to the congress' ability to manipulate the tax code... it's the power they have. And which tax code you have is irrelevant to thier ability to do it. Do anyone honestly think that just because 9-9-9 passed as 9-9-9 the congress couldn't tomorow say

"well, we're going to keep it 9-9-9 but were going to exempt all income below poverty level from the income tax, and to make up for it we're going to tax B2B purchases 9%... after all, why should they escape the sales tax when people have to pay it"?

Then the next day

"Ok, we need to make another adjustment, capital gains, dividends and interest are income, so they will be subject to the 9% income tax, and since that will bring in additional revenue we're going to use it to give a 9% sales tax exclusion credit (refundable) for those people living at up to 150% of the poverty level when they file their flat tax... still 9-9-9!!!!"

then the next day

"you know, it's just not fair that the only deduction people have is for charitable donations while business' get to deduct costs, it cost money for people to live too! So we're going to get rid of the business deductions and make thier tax as flat as anyone elses... Revenue-charitable donations!" 9-9-9 baby!!!!!!!!!!!!

then again!

"it is absolutely unfair that the poor who must by food and medicine have to pay the same tax on them as the rich do when they purchase furs and yachts, we're going to exempt food and medicine from the tax as it's to onerous on theose who are not wealthy, and were going to pay for it with a 9% wholesale tax on luxury items! after all, if you have to pay the tax at retail, why shouldn't big business have to pay it wholesale!" 9-9-9 all the way!!!!!!!!

all while maintining the 9-9-9ness!!!!

 

[Paulie]

It's a better plan than I've heard out of any other republican, including Ryan.

I don't like his idea for SS though. He knows better than to advocate a plan that gives the government the authority to manage citizens' retirements.

He's not a good enough conservative though as far as I'm concerned.

 

[The T]

Oh. I'm way, way out of the box buddy. What i suggest is that you actually research the plan, it's on Cains website, and then actually DO SOME THINKING about what the ramifications of this simplistic marketting scam would be on taxes.

It doesn't matter, Cain win or lose, this plan will NEVER see the light of day.

I can't believe there's actually pseudo-intellectuals here who give genuine credence to such a shameless gimmick.

oh... I don't know, with a few tweaks I think the libs will love it.

it will be no harder to change than any other tax system, all it will take is a vote of the congress and the presidents signature. Progressivity and regressivity are meaningless to the congress' ability to manipulate the tax code... it's the power they have. And which tax code you have is irrelevant to thier ability to do it. Do anyone honestly think that just because 9-9-9 passed as 9-9-9 the congress couldn't tomorow say

"well, we're going to keep it 9-9-9 but were going to exempt all income below poverty level from the income tax, and to make up for it we're going to tax B2B purchases 9%... after all, why should they escape the sales tax when people have to pay it"?

Then the next day

"Ok, we need to make another adjustment, capital gains, dividends and interest are income, so they will be subject to the 9% income tax, and since that will bring in additional revenue we're going to use it to give a 9% sales tax exclusion credit (refundable) for those people living at up to 150% of the poverty level when they file their flat tax... still 9-9-9!!!!"

then the next day

"you know, it's just not fair that the only deduction people have is for charitable donations while business' get to deduct costs, it cost money for people to live too! So we're going to get rid of the business deductions and make thier tax as flat as anyone elses... Revenue-charitable donations!" 9-9-9 baby!!!!!!!!!!!!

then again!

"it is absolutely unfair that the poor who must by food and medicine have to pay the same tax on them as the rich do when they purchase furs and yachts, we're going to exempt food and medicine from the tax as it's to onerous on theose who are not wealthy, and were going to pay for it with a 9% wholesale tax on luxury items! after all, if you have to pay the tax at retail, why shouldn't big business have to pay it wholesale!" 9-9-9 all the way!!!!!!!!

all while maintining the 9-9-9ness!!!!

I'll take "What is the bridge to the FAIRTAX for $1,000 Alex..."

16th A? Buh Bye. Gubmint tyranny? Buh Bye.

 

[bripat9643]

What's to elaborate? It's another thoughtless bumper-sticker slogan.

You mean like "no blood for oil" and "people before profits?"

 

[Full-Auto]

It's over, you crazy shallow Cain supporters better get used to it. Cain's rabid angry supporters are making Republicans looks truly stupid.

Could you post a link to these rabid cain supporters please.

Gramps thread on these boards.

Hell Gramps even admits he does not know if it is a good or bad thing (the 999 coupon), but if you don't agree with it he attacks you.

Fact is Gramps is supporting a guy that is using the Political stage of running for President to sell books.

He also attacks everyone else on the stage with an outright lie claiming they don't have plans when reality is they all have far better plans than Cain. Cain literally has no plan then of top of that he has zero backup plan. Cain's super simplistic 9 9 9 plan already has to have deductions added here and there and the loopholes are already being created because Cain never thought it through because he has no intention of being President.

Thank you for your thoughts. But I dont buy into the no intention thing. I personally chuckle at these arguments because if anyone stopped for two seconds and took their favorite pacifiers out of their mouths they would realize there isnt a plan out there that would make it through congress without revisions. I am looking for someone who will kick the table over. Our cozy compromises have us 15 trillion in debt and counting.......................

 

[bripat9643]

Holy shit! EVERY analysis I have seen by economists is clear. What has been released by Cain as a 999 plan is unworkable and favors the wealthy.

It is DOA.

Those Marxist propagandists you read are not "economists." What is unworkable about it?

Liberal Dictionary:
============================================
Favors the wealthy - doesn't loot the wealthy.

 

[Full-Auto]

Holy shit! EVERY analysis I have seen by economists is clear. What has been released by Cain as a 999 plan is unworkable and favors the wealthy.

It is DOA.

Those Marxist propagandists you read are not "economists." What is unworkable about it?

Liberal Dictionary:
============================================
Favors the wealthy - doesn't loot the wealthy.

Same guys that predicted unemployment wont go over 8%

 

[bripat9643]

no not really. you are forgetting all the other taxes out there as well.oh and Cain wants to get rid of state taxes..So much for state rights, right?You realize this is giving the Feds MORE power right?

Some how i doubt you guys even thought of it this way

Cain has never said he wants to get rid of state taxes. There's plenty to criticize about Cain's plan without making stuff up.

 

[The T]

Could you post a link to these rabid cain supporters please.

Gramps thread on these boards.

Hell Gramps even admits he does not know if it is a good or bad thing (the 999 coupon), but if you don't agree with it he attacks you.

Fact is Gramps is supporting a guy that is using the Political stage of running for President to sell books.

He also attacks everyone else on the stage with an outright lie claiming they don't have plans when reality is they all have far better plans than Cain. Cain literally has no plan then of top of that he has zero backup plan. Cain's super simplistic 9 9 9 plan already has to have deductions added here and there and the loopholes are already being created because Cain never thought it through because he has no intention of being President.

Thank you for your thoughts. But I dont buy into the no intention thing. I personally chuckle at these arguments because if anyone stopped for two seconds and took their favorite pacifiers out of their mouths they would realize there isnt a plan out there that would make it through congress without revisions. I am looking for someone who will kick the table over. Our cozy compromises have us 15 trillion in debt and counting.......................

Indeed. Bandaids on a patient in a full body cast. Time to get the patient on the mend. Century-old punative taxation doesn't cut it any longer.

 

[bripat9643]

Herman Cains plan? 9-9-9 For those that hate it


It ain't a matter of hate. It is just that marketing slogans does not leadership make.

You mean like "hope and change?"

 

[bripat9643]

The other taxes exist no matter what our federal tax rate is. And I have not heard Cain mention aboloshing state taxes. He cant and that would be an obsurd position

I thought we were beyond the days of acid trips and euphoria.

How does that prove Cain wants to abolish state taxes? Are you capable of a coherent argument?

 

[BenNatuf]

Read the op before you blindly attack. I clearly said their should be a trigger point to protect the indigent.

As far as my business goes I sell and install home remodeling products. At this point without all the details of its implimentation its hard to say exactly how the outcome will turn out. But I for one will not jump the gun and make broad based assumptions beyond the fact that this is a good starting point for "REAL" change.

Gramps... you have all the details. cain has said it complete and well thought out. All you have to do is go to his website and see the plan. Shouldn't take long, it's just a couple paragraphs.

I am at the site, 999 | Herman Cain for President

But I am not seeing the boogeyman. Are you making ASSumptions?

well then here's the plan budy, please, take a look and tell me where I'm wrong.

•9% Business Flat Tax
◦Gross income less all purchases from other U.S. located businesses, all capital investment, and net exports.
◦Empowerment Zones will offer deductions for the payroll of those employed in the zone
•9% Individual Flat Tax.
◦Gross income less charitable deductions.
◦Empowerment Zones will offer additional deductions for those living and/or working in the zone.
•9% National Sales Tax.
◦Unlike a state sales tax, which is an add-on tax that increases the price of goods and services, this is a replacement tax. It replaces taxes that are already embedded in selling prices. By replacing higher marginal rates in the production process with lower marginal rates, marginal production costs actually decline, which will lead to prices being the same or lower, not higher.

you seeing COL in there anywhere? Do you sell Makita saws? Sorry, not deductable--not made in the US of A!! Is the lumber you sell shipped down from Canada? So sorry man, give up the 9% you paid for it, it's just regular income not an expense. Do you have employees who cost you money? Dude, just pay the 9% labor is not deductable.

I don't have to assume anything, the plan is right there in black and white. On the other hand for you to believe that stuff does matter you have to assume a lot!!!! But hey, it's your money and you can assume any amount of it you want away.

999 | Herman Cain for President

This plan should be called "The small business destruction and illegal alien employment assurity act." Cause after it goes into effect unless you dealing strictly in cash from your customers and paying cash... you ain't gonna have much left.

 

[bripat9643]

and Cain would be better, how?

A dead carp would be better than Obama.

 

[candycorn]

The other taxes exist no matter what our federal tax rate is. And I have not heard Cain mention aboloshing state taxes. He cant and that would be an obsurd position

I thought we were beyond the days of acid trips and euphoria.

How does that prove Cain wants to abolish state taxes? Are you capable of a coherent argument?

Help me out here...the Federal Sales Tax will be on top of any state and local sales taxes...right?

The Federal Income Tax of 9% across the board will be on top of any State Income taxes then, right?

 

[bripat9643]

yeah i cant find it either, so grain of salt there.
But Cains plan is nothing more than a slightly different Ryan plan that increases taxes on the poor.

Ryan's plan mostly addresses the spending side. Cain hasn't ever mentioned any plans to address that.

 

[bripat9643]

Wouldn't that just enable them....make them have no incentive to go out and work harder? Wouldn't it mean that they are not paying their fair share? Cain's entire bullshit is that he wants the rate to be the same for everyone.

Why is that bullshit? Why shouldn't everyone pay the same percentage? Don't you think everyone should have "some skin in the game?"

 

[bripat9643]

So here we are 3 pages in and not one of you can articulate a position against his plan.

Let's see the articulation is that his plan is just plain simpleton, marketing slogans. I haven't seen an economist that thinks it is feasible yet.

We can't help it if you're an economic ignoramus who only reads Marxist propaganda.

What's "infeasible" about it? I've read economists who have objections to it, but not on the grounds that it's "infeasible."

 

[BenNatuf]

It doesn't matter, Cain win or lose, this plan will NEVER see the light of day.

I can't believe there's actually pseudo-intellectuals here who give genuine credence to such a shameless gimmick.

oh... I don't know, with a few tweaks I think the libs will love it.

it will be no harder to change than any other tax system, all it will take is a vote of the congress and the presidents signature. Progressivity and regressivity are meaningless to the congress' ability to manipulate the tax code... it's the power they have. And which tax code you have is irrelevant to thier ability to do it. Do anyone honestly think that just because 9-9-9 passed as 9-9-9 the congress couldn't tomorow say

"well, we're going to keep it 9-9-9 but were going to exempt all income below poverty level from the income tax, and to make up for it we're going to tax B2B purchases 9%... after all, why should they escape the sales tax when people have to pay it"?

Then the next day

"Ok, we need to make another adjustment, capital gains, dividends and interest are income, so they will be subject to the 9% income tax, and since that will bring in additional revenue we're going to use it to give a 9% sales tax exclusion credit (refundable) for those people living at up to 150% of the poverty level when they file their flat tax... still 9-9-9!!!!"

then the next day

"you know, it's just not fair that the only deduction people have is for charitable donations while business' get to deduct costs, it cost money for people to live too! So we're going to get rid of the business deductions and make thier tax as flat as anyone elses... Revenue-charitable donations!" 9-9-9 baby!!!!!!!!!!!!

then again!

"it is absolutely unfair that the poor who must by food and medicine have to pay the same tax on them as the rich do when they purchase furs and yachts, we're going to exempt food and medicine from the tax as it's to onerous on theose who are not wealthy, and were going to pay for it with a 9% wholesale tax on luxury items! after all, if you have to pay the tax at retail, why shouldn't big business have to pay it wholesale!" 9-9-9 all the way!!!!!!!!

all while maintining the 9-9-9ness!!!!

I'll take "What is the bridge to the FAIRTAX for $1,000 Alex..."

16th A? Buh Bye. Gubmint tyranny? Buh Bye.

the fairtax is the stupidest tax scheme ever devised. Please enlighten me as to why a conservative would support a tax that has to be set 10 point artificially high so the government has the power to send EVERY FUCKING ADULT a check every month. Does that sound remotely like "shrinking the size and scope" of the federal government and getting them "out of our lives"? Getting a freakin EITC for everyone welfare check every month deisguised as a "prebate" is NOT a good idea?