Here's An Idea

260 million people buying their own health insurance. The competition for their business would be fierce.

Will everyone be mandated to purchase?

No.

This is a problem. You are one of our more intelligent members. I am sure you will see what the problem is with a little more research on the subject.

The desire to simplify this very complex issue is strong. We'd all like to do that.

Why have insurance at all? Why not just make buying health care the same as buying a cup of coffee? That would be the simplest way to go. It won't work....but it is simple.
 
No one is forcing you to accept your employer's healthcare plan.
You can reject it and buy your own if you chose.

The government has placed you at an extreme disadvantage if you choose this route.

First, your employer-sponsored health insurance is tax exempt. That's a giant government boondoggle right there all by itself.

If you buy your own health insurance, you are already at a multi-thousand tax dollar disadvantage before you even pick up the phone.

Second, very few employers compensate you for not using their insurance. You don't get an increase in pay, even though you are saving them about $10,000 in cost share.

Third, the government has tied the hands of its health insurance competitors. You cannot pick up the phone and call any health insurance company in the country. You are as much a hostage to insurance companies as you are to cable/internet provider companies.

1) Government is correct to put incentives in place for employers to offer health insurance. If private business are willing to take care of this for their most valued employees - as a perk - then who are we to tell them they can't?

2) If your employer wants to compensate you for not using their plan, that's their choice. If you don't like their choice, YOU have the choice to look for employment elsewhere where they compensate you in a way you appreciate more.

3)There is a lot more choice in healthcare insurance than there is for cable/internet provides.

I think you've invented the vast majority of this problem in your mind.
 
No one is forcing you to accept your employer's healthcare plan.
You can reject it and buy your own if you chose.

The government has placed you at an extreme disadvantage if you choose this route.

First, your employer-sponsored health insurance is tax exempt. That's a giant government boondoggle right there all by itself.

If you buy your own health insurance, you are already at a multi-thousand tax dollar disadvantage before you even pick up the phone.

Second, very few employers compensate you for not using their insurance. You don't get an increase in pay, even though you are saving them about $10,000 in cost share.

Third, the government has tied the hands of its health insurance competitors. You cannot pick up the phone and call any health insurance company in the country. You are as much a hostage to insurance companies as you are to cable/internet provider companies.

If you paid your health insurance premiums with your own after-tax money, they’re deductible.

For example, if you bought an individual or family health insurance policy on your state’s health insurance exchange or directly from an insurance company, the money you paid toward your monthly health insurance premiums can be taken as a tax deduction. You’ll list this deduction as a medical expense on Schedule A of Form 1040.

Is Health Insurance Tax Deductible?
 
an even more insane idea would be to have the Republicans on board with the Democrats working to iron out all the wrinkles for the benefit of the PEOPLE.


Crazy isn't it?

No point ironing the wrinkles out of a shirt that's on fire.
 
1) Government is correct to put incentives in place for employers to offer health insurance.

No. No, no, no. For many reasons.

I have made my position on tax expenditures pretty clear around here, and that is my chief reason for saying no to your suggestion.

But a specific reason for being opposed to incentivizing employer-sponsored health care is that it does not make us wise consumers of health care, and it is well known that employer-sponsored health insurance bends the cost curve upward.
 
I have this really insane idea.

Let's say you have a job. And let's say all your employer does every couple of weeks or so is give you...a paycheck!

Your employer does not give you health insurance. Instead, you call up any insurance company in the country and...get this...YOU decide what you need! :eek:

Do you need birth control coverage? You got it! No problem!

Do you need coverage if you get a broken leg? You got it! No problem!

Do you NOT need birth control coverage? No problem! You don't have to pay for that.


Just like the way you buy your auto insurance. You decide how big a deductible you can handle, and how much coverage you want.

And since you can buy your insurance from any company anywhere, they are all competing like crazy for your business. You have bargaining power.



I know how insane that sounds. Everyone knows the government should be deciding these things for me. What the hell am I doing deciding what kind of health care coverage I want? That should not be between me and my doctor and my insurance. The government should be involved in every way possible.

And it is better that a big chunk of your income is diverted into a health insurance plan at your job that you have absolutely no choice about. You have to go with what your company provides. That's MUCH better than you receiving that income and getting to decide what is best for you and your family. It is just plain nuts to leave such personal decisions up to you. I'm totally crazy for proposing such a preposterous idea.

Obviously you hate women, blacks, and poor people.
 
Will everyone be mandated to purchase?

No.

This is a problem. You are one of our more intelligent members. I am sure you will see what the problem is with a little more research on the subject.

The desire to simplify this very complex issue is strong. We'd all like to do that.

Why have insurance at all? Why not just make buying health care the same as buying a cup of coffee? That would be the simplest way to go. It won't work....but it is simple.

I fleshed out my reasons for being opposed to personal health insurance mandates in the subsequent post after that one.
 
an even more insane idea would be to have the Republicans on board with the Democrats working to iron out all the wrinkles for the benefit of the PEOPLE.


Crazy isn't it?

No point ironing the wrinkles out of a shirt that's on fire.

Well put! :lol:


Sadly, I am convinced we are stuck with ObamaCare until such a time it fails so catastrophically that the addicts will then cry out for Universal Health Insurance. That being the case, we have no choice but to "iron out the wrinkles" of this flaming shirt with the Democrats.

Things which are so clearly harmful, like the employer mandate, were delayed for a very good reason. And the GOP could easily have legislated that problem away, but refused to do so, forcing Obama to do so by fiat. And now they howl at the fiat!

Even now, the GOP House could legislatively delay the mandate any time they wish. The Senate and Obama would sign off on it in a heartbeat. But the GOP refuses to do so.

This is really stupid partisan bullshit. The GOP is acting like sore losers, not acting in the best interest of the American people.
 
Last edited:
an even more insane idea would be to have the Republicans on board with the Democrats working to iron out all the wrinkles for the benefit of the PEOPLE.


Crazy isn't it?

No point ironing the wrinkles out of a shirt that's on fire.

Well put! :lol:



no point in trying to justify people having a better quality of life to the RW's either.

that shirt is a Law, Laws are subject to amendments, amendments made by both parties .. if the right spent as much effort putting out the fire as they do pouring gas on it, the problems would be well on their way to repair ...
 
I have this really insane idea.

Let's say you have a job. And let's say all your employer does every couple of weeks or so is give you...a paycheck!

Your employer does not give you health insurance. Instead, you call up any insurance company in the country and...get this...YOU decide what you need! :eek:

Do you need birth control coverage? You got it! No problem!

Do you need coverage if you get a broken leg? You got it! No problem!

Do you NOT need birth control coverage? No problem! You don't have to pay for that.


Just like the way you buy your auto insurance. You decide how big a deductible you can handle, and how much coverage you want.

And since you can buy your insurance from any company anywhere, they are all competing like crazy for your business. You have bargaining power.



I know how insane that sounds. Everyone knows the government should be deciding these things for me. What the hell am I doing deciding what kind of health care coverage I want? That should not be between me and my doctor and my insurance. The government should be involved in every way possible.

And it is better that a big chunk of your income is diverted into a health insurance plan at your job that you have absolutely no choice about. You have to go with what your company provides. That's MUCH better than you receiving that income and getting to decide what is best for you and your family. It is just plain nuts to leave such personal decisions up to you. I'm totally crazy for proposing such a preposterous idea.

Obamcare is here to stay, quit being a sore looser/whiner/baby/racist G5. Nothing you are going to be able to do about it, inst't that what you always tell people that complain?
 
1) Government is correct to put incentives in place for employers to offer health insurance.

No. No, no, no. For many reasons.

I have made my position on tax expenditures pretty clear around here, and that is my chief reason for saying no to your suggestion.

But a specific reason for being opposed to incentivizing employer-sponsored health care is that it does not make us wise consumers of health care, and it is well known that employer-sponsored health insurance bends the cost curve upward.

Tax expenditures have absolutely nothing to do with my suggestion.

And the influence that "must-have" hospitals have with insurance companies to jack up prices could (but currently are not) be offset by the negotiating power of the larger insurers. The cost curve isn't being bent upwards by the fact that employers buy the insurance. It's being bent upwards by the failure of larger insurers to exert all the influence they can.

Eliminating the employer out of the equation is not going to bend the curve downward.

And I still don't understand why you want to dictate to employers what benefits they are allowed to offer their employees.
 
If your employer-sponsored health insurance company fucks you over, there is nothing you can do about it. You can't drop them and go to a better insurance company. This completely removes market pressure on insurance companies to straighten up.

My last employer self-insures up to a very large number and then buys

a stoploss insurance policy to cover the possibility of a financially catastrophic year.

I retired and stay on their plan for $60 a month, until Medicare, then they become my supplemental for a good price.
 
g5000: this is the first time I can ever remember saying this, but I think you are 100% off-base on this one.

You are one of the most intelligent and well-researched posters on here - but I gotta agree to disagree here.
 
If your employer-sponsored health insurance company fucks you over, there is nothing you can do about it. You can't drop them and go to a better insurance company. This completely removes market pressure on insurance companies to straighten up.

My last employer self-insures up to a very large number and then buys

a stoploss insurance policy to cover the possibility of a financially catastrophic year.

I retired and stay on their plan for $60 a month, until Medicare, then they become my supplemental for a good price.



I read an article about Medicare supplemental ins ... cost vs benefit ... unless you're a sick person who averages at least one 5 day stay in a hospital every year, your cost outweighs your benefits... I'll see if I can find it.. brb


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-belk/medicare-supplemental-policies_b_3901861.html
 
Last edited:
No point ironing the wrinkles out of a shirt that's on fire.

Well put! :lol:



no point in trying to justify people having a better quality of life to the RW's either.

that shirt is a Law, Laws are subject to amendments, amendments made by both parties .. if the right spent as much effort putting out the fire as they do pouring gas on it, the problems would be well on their way to repair ...

People had a better quality of life before you forced then to wear the flaming shirt. And now rather than take the shirt off, you want to iron it. Probably with gasoline.

And somehow we end up being the bad guy here
 

Forum List

Back
Top