Taomon
Active Member
- Dec 21, 2007
- 1,563
- 47
- 36
Have you spoken to any Canadians? Can you back up your claims? I have spoken to a lot of Canadians. You are dead set against socialized healthcare so you will only listen to and research data in a predetermined - biased manner. I don't think you are capable of understanding the problem because you are determined to be against any social program what so ever. How pathetic.If Canada's socialized medicine is so great, why would any sane Canadian purchase private insurance?
Let me clue you. The delays for care are widespread. In some cases people have died as a result of waiting too long. Those who are not on the "serious" lists find themselves waiting and suffering in pain.
And again, there are flaws and they can be addressed. You act as though every flaw in any system is evidence that we cannot do it better and should not try.The Vancouver, British Columbia-based Fraser Institute keeps track of Canadian waiting times for various medical procedures. According to the Fraser Institute's 14th annual edition of "Waiting Your Turn: Hospital Waiting Lists in Canada (2004)," total waiting time between referral from a general practitioner and treatment, averaged across all 12 specialties and 10 provinces surveyed, rose from 17.7 weeks in 2003 to 17.9 weeks in 2004.
But you are looking historical records of corrupt regimes and ignoring the glaring historical record against capitalism and the free market system. It only works if you are in the top ten percentile and can influence the corrupt legislatures.I do not have "unreasonable" fear/loathing of socialism. One only has to look at the facts.
Exactly! They only want us to eat shitty food and become fat, sickly and weak. They want us to pay for every fad diet, work out video, and miracle cure that comes along. They want to advertise prescription drugs to us to convince us that a bleeding out of our colon is better than erectile dysfunction or the sniffles. They will never have coupons for apples that don't include the purchase of a mass produced item (such as candy apple ingredients). Marketing is a manufactured need. It is a form of mind control, which is what all of the academic literature will tell you point blank.If marketing is "the problem" as you say, why are apples more costly than chips? I never see ads for bags of apples.
I believe in being honest. I believe in education. Look at our food pyramid. Look at the percentage of meat compared to the percentage of vegetables that we are told we should eat daily. It is a lie. It is sponsored by the Department of Agriculture who are influenced by very specific lobbies (grains & sugar for example). The grain industry is mostly for feed for our meat industries. The warnings about sugar have become very obscure and muddled. Think about it.You appear to be one of those people who support the "food police". Where does it say in our Constitution that anybody has the right to tell anyone what they can or cannot eat? Don't you believe in indidividual freedom? If we go to socialized medicine the government will take away a lot of that because it will then have the power to dictate your lifestyle choices.
If you want to eat chips, then eat chips. But make the good foods (fruits, vegetables, water) less expensive. Minimize the advertisements for junk food. Make more PA about good food, diet & exercise. And make those marketing firms develop those PAs. That is what I believe in.
And yet, I was not suggesting anything be free. You accused me of such. I said that all necessities should be affordable.Flop houses with shared bathrooms? Sounds like college days. Yes I am suggesting we follow this model. It appears that many immigrants also like this model as they keep on coming here for the privilege of living in a flophouse because they know it is only temporary. They know they can pursue a better life here. Believe it or not nobody has the "right" to be handed anything for free. You need to work for your supper. The government has no right to take from one person and give it to another person. I suppose you are going to call me hard-hearted again for saying that…too bad. That's how Americans learn the nitty gritty of life and to value their hard won freedoms. Socialism is a form of government servitude.
And you still haven't explained why that is bad.
And you are saying that people don't work hard enough so what are you trying to say? You want to work and keep all of your money to yourself, pay no taxes, have no social responsibility, and keep to your own.Would you have liked to work under Socialism in Russia? You'd work twice as hard and get half as much.
I don't believe in wealth distribution! But taxes are the grease for the wheels of society. We cannot run our government on arms deals. Would you prefer Anarchy? No laws? Survival of the fittest?
Funny, that is what the free market is doing too. You claim the free market lets the consumers control the prices and that is not true at all. The free market allows conglomerates to take jobs away at will (capital flight) and price whatever they want for their commodities. That is a form of oppression. It is economic in nature. So most people will not make it in America. There is only so much room at the top. You do not address what becomes of the lower classes.That's why the Socialist propaganda today is such a lie. They promise utopia (and for some for a while this seems true) but in reality you get hell in the end.
There are flaws and we can fix them. Economically, the Medicare system works as a tight ship. Socially, it is bad now for many people. I am all for reform. We have the wrong leaders now and have had that problem for decades. Since Nixon at least.Less effective than anything the govt. can do? What do you think of the effectiveness of Medicare? Now there's a great example of what the govt. can do. Not.
I don't want any private entity (individual doctors, insurance agencies, etc) to manage my healthcare. There should be oversight. There should be regulations. There should be a system of checks and balances. Why not instill civilian tribunals as an oversight system? I would be all for that.Today's health care is not as privatized as it should be. It should be privatized to the point where you and your doctor are making your health care decisions, not an insurance company. If you think an insurance company is bad for your health care, wait until the government takes over. You want politicians managing your health care?
And you refuse to consider any option other than privatized healthcare. Your views are individualistic. You don't seem to care about your fellow Americans. You don't seem to care about strangers who are also people.I have been reading and thinking about your position. I don't buy it. You haven't provided any real proof that socialized medicine will work...you just have the heartfelt belief it will work.
No, because there are greedy doctors. And there are plenty of historical evidence of that. We need oversight and checks & balances. We need to make sure that Doctor A is not overcharging people. We need to make sure that Doctor B is qualified and honest.IMO we don't "need" any of that stuff you claim we "need"...price controls and subsidies (other than for the core poor) are not necessary to provide our health care. Instead we need a health care system that is rid of government and insurance company interference. Once third parties get their grubby hands out of the system the market can work.
WalMart also will not fill birth control and abortion pill prescriptions. here is a reason why monopolies are bad, they ultimately control what we can and cannot buy...and that is not exactly a free market system.Take a look at WalMart. This is private enterprise at work without the price controls and subsidies. You can go there and buy $4 prescriptions. Believe it or not, that is helping a lot of poor and working class people. Going further, Walmart is also going to set up clinics at many of its stores. People will be able to go there and get everyday health care at a low cost. It will help take the pressure off regular clinics which should help everybody. A great boon to the poor and "disenfranchised" wouldn't you say? That's the free market at work.