Foreign Aid

[Rikurzhen]

I'd like to address post number 4 who informed me of this thread. I'd like to thank Rikurzhen for the invite and for what he has done overseas. Your work and knowledge are very Praise Worthy...................

Currently about 890 million people in this world are suffering from Malnutrition or Starvation. A child dies every 11 seconds mainly do to this. Food prices have soared on the globe, and their is drought and famine. His post on Ethiopia is an eye opener, as I've also been looking at the birth rates in Africa which are very high with no way to feed the increasing populations. His point, I believe is that we must push for birth control in these areas of Aid because they can't sustain the rapidly increasing populations. I believe the birth rate of Somalia is at 6.2. With no way to feed them.

I don't like what I see out there right now. Drought conditions and starvation are growing again. The price of food led to Food Riots in 2008 and 2011 which triggered the Arab Spring. There are many factors in this equation. Cost of shipping going up due to fuel prices, Ethanol has increased to 143 Metric Tons of corn a year, Severe drought conditions. Plant diseases. Over Grazing of farm lands have turned the land into dust bowls in places like China. and Commodity speculation....................

The Worlds population is at 7.1 Billion. 80 Million more a year on average, and food production is not going up, and prices have tripled for agricultural products such as food since 2000. We are facing a global crisis, and it is time to pony up to look into this situation about how to solve it and increase food production, increase water production in areas near the oceans via large evaporator systems to produce potable water from sea water......and push for birth control in areas where they cannot sustain the population.

We need to look at dealing with this with other countries involved to find a way to try and deal with it before it becomes worse. I'm in agreement with aid in this area even with my last post stated, because the lives that can be lost will be in the millions...............

I don't think the world should stand by and not try and deal with this one.

Let me add a few points.

Agriculture is energy intensive, in terms of mechanization and fertilization, so as we increase production we also increase use of fossil fuels.

Same with desalinization of water - that requires energy.

Here's news from yesterday:

At least six people have drowned after a fishing boat carrying migrants from North Africa got into trouble south of the Italian island of Lampedusa.

Rescue workers say they have managed to pull more than 360 migrants alive from the water.

It is the third such incident to take place on the migrant route between Libya and Italy over the last few days.

The Italian coastguard says it has rescued nearly 4,000 people altogether over the weekend.

On Friday, dozens were feared dead after a wooden boat carrying at least 170 Africans capsized off the Libyan coast. The coastguard said it had only rescued 17 people.

Eighteen more bodies of migrants were discovered aboard a sinking inflatable dinghy on Sunday.
​

I see this situation as though I'm in a lifeboat that I built alongside other builders. Out in the ocean are people who want to jump into my lifeboat. At some point if all the people who want to jump into the lifeboat are allowed to jump in, then the lifeboat will sink and drown us all.

I don't want my society brought down to the lowest common denominator through the acts of kind-heartedness and compassion for the suffering of others. Unlike most people on this board, I've see famine first hand because my wife and I have been to Africa a number of times to lend our hands when we lived in the Middle East. My compassion has topped out.

The problem here is all of those Christian Aid societies that people donate to. Aid workers only see the immediate problem - helpless people in need of aid. They aim to solve that problem. The downstream effects are above their pay grade but the trouble is that no one in the world is doing anything to address those downstream effects. The result is Europe is currently getting swamped, as per above, and this is weakening European society. Europeans have exercised remarkable responsibility in terms of family planning. For instance, the population of the Netherlands in 1960 was 11.5 million and this has grown to 16.9 million in 2014 and that's with generous immigration. During the entire period their Total Fertility Rate was between 1.5 and 1.7. Meanwhile, the population of Ethiopia in 1960 was 24.2 million and by 2014 it was 96.6 million and that's with healthy out-migration. In that 54 year time span, the population of the Netherlands increased by 47% while the population of Ethiopia increased by 300%.

There is no justice in having the responsible people (Europe) be stuck with the bad outcomes caused by the irresponsible people (Africa) but that is what is happening with these migrations.

Nature is sending signals and we need to listen to those signals. Any foreign aid we provide really needs to focus on birth control and abortion. We need to stop sending food aid. This is a direct shot across the bow of Christians, from the Pope on down to the ordinary folks in America - you are part of the problem here. Acts of kindness solve the immediate problem and cause huge problems downstream.

 

[eagle1462010]

I'd like to address post number 4 who informed me of this thread. I'd like to thank Rikurzhen for the invite and for what he has done overseas. Your work and knowledge are very Praise Worthy...................

Currently about 890 million people in this world are suffering from Malnutrition or Starvation. A child dies every 11 seconds mainly do to this. Food prices have soared on the globe, and their is drought and famine. His post on Ethiopia is an eye opener, as I've also been looking at the birth rates in Africa which are very high with no way to feed the increasing populations. His point, I believe is that we must push for birth control in these areas of Aid because they can't sustain the rapidly increasing populations. I believe the birth rate of Somalia is at 6.2. With no way to feed them.

I don't like what I see out there right now. Drought conditions and starvation are growing again. The price of food led to Food Riots in 2008 and 2011 which triggered the Arab Spring. There are many factors in this equation. Cost of shipping going up due to fuel prices, Ethanol has increased to 143 Metric Tons of corn a year, Severe drought conditions. Plant diseases. Over Grazing of farm lands have turned the land into dust bowls in places like China. and Commodity speculation....................

The Worlds population is at 7.1 Billion. 80 Million more a year on average, and food production is not going up, and prices have tripled for agricultural products such as food since 2000. We are facing a global crisis, and it is time to pony up to look into this situation about how to solve it and increase food production, increase water production in areas near the oceans via large evaporator systems to produce potable water from sea water......and push for birth control in areas where they cannot sustain the population.

We need to look at dealing with this with other countries involved to find a way to try and deal with it before it becomes worse. I'm in agreement with aid in this area even with my last post stated, because the lives that can be lost will be in the millions...............

I don't think the world should stand by and not try and deal with this one.

Let me add a few points.

Agriculture is energy intensive, in terms of mechanization and fertilization, so as we increase production we also increase use of fossil fuels.

Same with desalinization of water - that requires energy.

Here's news from yesterday:

At least six people have drowned after a fishing boat carrying migrants from North Africa got into trouble south of the Italian island of Lampedusa.

Rescue workers say they have managed to pull more than 360 migrants alive from the water.

It is the third such incident to take place on the migrant route between Libya and Italy over the last few days.

The Italian coastguard says it has rescued nearly 4,000 people altogether over the weekend.

On Friday, dozens were feared dead after a wooden boat carrying at least 170 Africans capsized off the Libyan coast. The coastguard said it had only rescued 17 people.

Eighteen more bodies of migrants were discovered aboard a sinking inflatable dinghy on Sunday.
​

I see this situation as though I'm in a lifeboat that I built alongside other builders. Out in the ocean are people who want to jump into my lifeboat. At some point if all the people who want to jump into the lifeboat are allowed to jump in, then the lifeboat will sink and drown us all.

I don't want my society brought down to the lowest common denominator through the acts of kind-heartedness and compassion for the suffering of others. Unlike most people on this board, I've see famine first hand because my wife and I have been to Africa a number of times to lend our hands when we lived in the Middle East. My compassion has topped out.

The problem here is all of those Christian Aid societies that people donate to. Aid workers only see the immediate problem - helpless people in need of aid. They aim to solve that problem. The downstream effects are above their pay grade but the trouble is that no one in the world is doing anything to address those downstream effects. The result is Europe is currently getting swamped, as per above, and this is weakening European society. Europeans have exercised remarkable responsibility in terms of family planning. For instance, the population of the Netherlands in 1960 was 11.5 million and this has grown to 16.9 million in 2014 and that's with generous immigration. During the entire period their Total Fertility Rate was between 1.5 and 1.7. Meanwhile, the population of Ethiopia in 1960 was 24.2 million and by 2014 it was 96.6 million and that's with healthy out-migration. In that 54 year time span, the population of the Netherlands increased by 47% while the population of Ethiopia increased by 300%.

There is no justice in having the responsible people (Europe) be stuck with the bad outcomes caused by the irresponsible people (Africa) but that is what is happening with these migrations.

Nature is sending signals and we need to listen to those signals. Any foreign aid we provide really needs to focus on birth control and abortion. We need to stop sending food aid. This is a direct shot across the bow of Christians, from the Pope on down to the ordinary folks in America - you are part of the problem here. Acts of kindness solve the immediate problem and cause huge problems downstream.

I understand where you are coming from. But we can't completely agree. They are going to keep coming so the problem will not go away. Same as with illegal immigration here. When you have over 200 million people living on less than $2.50 a day in central America they are eventually going to storm the border and try to go somewhere where conditions are better. They are already doing so. The problem isn't here it's there. I agree.

So we should push VERY HARD for what you are saying instead of inheriting the problem at home. As we nor Europe can sustain these types of massive immigration.

Therefore, wouldn't be more efficient to attempt a smaller fix down there and at least try by putting some rules in with the fix........................

I don't know, but even if I'm part of the problem per say, It's very hard for the world to stand by as millions starve to death......................

We picked up Vietnamese on small boats when I served over there. Which included Somalia in 93. I don't have your experience, but I'm not a total dolt on the subject either.

 

[Rikurzhen]

I understand where you are coming from. But we can't completely agree. They are going to keep coming so the problem will not go away. Same as with illegal immigration here. When you have over 200 million people living on less than $2.50 a day in central America they are eventually going to storm the border and try to go somewhere where conditions are better. They are already doing so. The problem isn't here it's there. I agree.

So we should push VERY HARD for what you are saying instead of inheriting the problem at home. As we nor Europe can sustain these types of massive immigration.

Therefore, wouldn't be more efficient to attempt a smaller fix down there and at least try by putting some rules in with the fix........................

I don't know, but even if I'm part of the problem per say, It's very hard for the world to stand by as millions starve to death......................

We picked up Vietnamese on small boats when I served over there. Which included Somalia in 93. I don't have your experience, but I'm not a total dolt on the subject either.

People with military experience who've actually seen war have, in my opinion, a deeper understanding of suffering and the need to sometimes allow the suffering in order to fulfill a higher goal. Those who are focused on doing good deeds, doing God's work, etc always fixate on the immediate problem and that's what has led us into this crisis.

I'll tell you this much - even with birth control and abortion, the birth rate is still going to be high for the very same reason that AIDS is rampant in Africa. Some countries have already outstripped their carrying capacity - too many people for both the economy and the environment. These people are in a 2 steps forward, 4 steps backward, type of race. They can never accumulate enough wealth and pass it on to the next generation in order to give them a leg up.

Like I said, this is a very hard decision. Soft hearts just punt the problem forward a decade or so and then the problem becomes worse.Rinse and repeat.

Camp of the Saints, here we come.

 

[paulitician]

End the current system of how Foreign Aid is dispersed. The current system does not demand accountability or Citizen input.