FDR and Pearl Harbor

[CrusaderFrank]

By now you are all aware that FDR had genuine Soviet spies in high offices and as key advisers. Part of their mission was to turn the USA and Japan on a collision course toward war.

The last time the Japanese and the Russian crossed swords in 1905, the Japanese mopped the floor up with the Rooskies ((Russo-Japanese War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) because you Progressives never believe anything happened unless its in Wiki) and the Soviet spies advising FDR got him to start a real life shooting war with Russia's natural and deadly enemy, the Japanese. I give the Soviets an enormous amount of credit for their geo-political victory here, it cannot be underestimated and should be applauded. They played FDR for a total patsy.

By now you also know that FDR provoked and goaded and all but invited the Japanese to attack us and in fact, since we had cracked the Japanese codes, we were well aware the invasion fleet was inbound to Pearl Harbor on Dec 7.

On Nov 27, 1941 George Marshall ordered a "War warning" and directed the base at Pearl to "undertake reconnaissance" a sensible precaution. However, suddenly, on December 6 Gen Short ordered the fighter to "Stand down" gave pilots THAT VERY Weekend off, ordered the mobile AA guns BACK TO BARRACKS, dispersed the aircraft from the protective bunkers and stacked them up on the runway (the only thing he didn't do was spray them with lighter fluid and leave matches nearby) insuring maximum damage would be inflicted on the ships at Pearl, but not the carriers, which were also sent out on patrol far away from the inbound Japanese strike force.

Clearly, Gen Short must have gotten an order, maybe from FDR personally, to leave Pearl Harbor vulnerable and insure maximum damage to the fleet (but not the carriers) at Pearl.

While I agree with you about FDR's cabinet (he was a well known fan of Uncle Joe you know) I ascribe General Shorts actions to sheer incompetence. I do believe that FDR knew what was coming. There is ample circumstantial evidence to show that.

However, the generals of that era were pretty damned stupid. Look at what Macarthur did AFTER the Pearl Harbor attacks had occured. He did the EXACT SAME THING! Lined his aircraft up wingtip to wingtip because he and his staff felt the Japanese were incompetent monkeys and couldn't possibly reach them from their bases in Formosa.

And the rest, as they say, is history.

All of this has to be taken in the context of FDR having genuine Communist spies calling the shots and advising him. The Soviet spies intended to put us on a collision course with Japan so that would free the USSR from their own 2 from war.

Hitler invaded in June 1941 and by December the spires of the Kremlin were in German site.

There are no odds that Short picked the very day before the attack to stand down ALL Defenses to insure a successful devastating attack

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Actually, there is far more direct and verifiable evidence to back up this one.

War is the health of the state, baby.

forget it,your wasting your breath with this troll.You would have better luck talking to a wall.This troll is a paid agent sent here to try and derail truth discussions such as 9/11,the kennedy assassination and Pearl Harbour.Your just giving him the attention he seeks by replying to him.

Best thing to do is put him on ignore.He seeks attention so badly he will quote you and address you as though you are reading his ramblings despite the many times you tell him you have him on ignore.pretty pathetic really.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Look who's backing you, Frank!

It's 9/11 inside nutjob!

rofl

I'm looking at the fact, and they're not too kind to FDR

 

[westwall]

By now you are all aware that FDR had genuine Soviet spies in high offices and as key advisers. Part of their mission was to turn the USA and Japan on a collision course toward war.

The last time the Japanese and the Russian crossed swords in 1905, the Japanese mopped the floor up with the Rooskies ((Russo-Japanese War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) because you Progressives never believe anything happened unless its in Wiki) and the Soviet spies advising FDR got him to start a real life shooting war with Russia's natural and deadly enemy, the Japanese. I give the Soviets an enormous amount of credit for their geo-political victory here, it cannot be underestimated and should be applauded. They played FDR for a total patsy.

By now you also know that FDR provoked and goaded and all but invited the Japanese to attack us and in fact, since we had cracked the Japanese codes, we were well aware the invasion fleet was inbound to Pearl Harbor on Dec 7.

On Nov 27, 1941 George Marshall ordered a "War warning" and directed the base at Pearl to "undertake reconnaissance" a sensible precaution. However, suddenly, on December 6 Gen Short ordered the fighter to "Stand down" gave pilots THAT VERY Weekend off, ordered the mobile AA guns BACK TO BARRACKS, dispersed the aircraft from the protective bunkers and stacked them up on the runway (the only thing he didn't do was spray them with lighter fluid and leave matches nearby) insuring maximum damage would be inflicted on the ships at Pearl, but not the carriers, which were also sent out on patrol far away from the inbound Japanese strike force.

Clearly, Gen Short must have gotten an order, maybe from FDR personally, to leave Pearl Harbor vulnerable and insure maximum damage to the fleet (but not the carriers) at Pearl.

While I agree with you about FDR's cabinet (he was a well known fan of Uncle Joe you know) I ascribe General Shorts actions to sheer incompetence. I do believe that FDR knew what was coming. There is ample circumstantial evidence to show that.

However, the generals of that era were pretty damned stupid. Look at what Macarthur did AFTER the Pearl Harbor attacks had occured. He did the EXACT SAME THING! Lined his aircraft up wingtip to wingtip because he and his staff felt the Japanese were incompetent monkeys and couldn't possibly reach them from their bases in Formosa.

And the rest, as they say, is history.

All of this has to be taken in the context of FDR having genuine Communist spies calling the shots and advising him. The Soviet spies intended to put us on a collision course with Japan so that would free the USSR from their own 2 from war.

Hitler invaded in June 1941 and by December the spires of the Kremlin were in German site.

There are no odds that Short picked the very day before the attack to stand down ALL Defenses to insure a successful devastating attack

Look throughout history and you find these amazing coincidences Frank. Long before information was able to be transmitted super fast decisions were made that caused the destruction of countries due to sheer accident. It happens over and over and over.

Short was a moron. Macarthur was a bigger moron. IMO FDR's principle effect was to not elevate the concerns to the level they needed to be. That is criminal but I doubt it could ever be proven.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

While I agree with you about FDR's cabinet (he was a well known fan of Uncle Joe you know) I ascribe General Shorts actions to sheer incompetence. I do believe that FDR knew what was coming. There is ample circumstantial evidence to show that.

However, the generals of that era were pretty damned stupid. Look at what Macarthur did AFTER the Pearl Harbor attacks had occured. He did the EXACT SAME THING! Lined his aircraft up wingtip to wingtip because he and his staff felt the Japanese were incompetent monkeys and couldn't possibly reach them from their bases in Formosa.

And the rest, as they say, is history.

All of this has to be taken in the context of FDR having genuine Communist spies calling the shots and advising him. The Soviet spies intended to put us on a collision course with Japan so that would free the USSR from their own 2 from war.

Hitler invaded in June 1941 and by December the spires of the Kremlin were in German site.

There are no odds that Short picked the very day before the attack to stand down ALL Defenses to insure a successful devastating attack

Look throughout history and you find these amazing coincidences Frank. Long before information was able to be transmitted super fast decisions were made that caused the destruction of countries due to sheer accident. It happens over and over and over.

Short was a moron. Macarthur was a bigger moron. IMO FDR's principle effect was to not elevate the concerns to the level they needed to be. That is criminal but I doubt it could ever be proven.

Then again, we had cracked the Japanese codes, knew the invasion fleet was afoot, were on "war warning" footing until the very day before the attack.

It wasn't enough just to stand down the patrols, Pearl was set up to insure the absolute MAXIMUM damage from the "Surprise" attack.

It's not a coincidence, it was not poor planning; its very likely the work of the Soviet spies FDR was going to for advise

 

[westwall]

All of this has to be taken in the context of FDR having genuine Communist spies calling the shots and advising him. The Soviet spies intended to put us on a collision course with Japan so that would free the USSR from their own 2 from war.

Hitler invaded in June 1941 and by December the spires of the Kremlin were in German site.

There are no odds that Short picked the very day before the attack to stand down ALL Defenses to insure a successful devastating attack

Look throughout history and you find these amazing coincidences Frank. Long before information was able to be transmitted super fast decisions were made that caused the destruction of countries due to sheer accident. It happens over and over and over.

Short was a moron. Macarthur was a bigger moron. IMO FDR's principle effect was to not elevate the concerns to the level they needed to be. That is criminal but I doubt it could ever be proven.

Then again, we had cracked the Japanese codes, knew the invasion fleet was afoot, were on "war warning" footing until the very day before the attack.

It wasn't enough just to stand down the patrols, Pearl was set up to insure the absolute MAXIMUM damage from the "Surprise" attack.

It's not a coincidence, it was not poor planning; its very likely the work of the Soviet spies FDR was going to for advise

All of which is true and yet it isn't. The maximum damage would have been to hit the oil storage facilities which would have slowed us down by at least 6 months. The aircraft that were destroyed were mostly obsolete. Based on the experiences of the British in the Med and off of Norway it was clear that the age of the battleship was likewise drawing to a close, so their loss was likewise not a big deal.

That we were going to war was obvious to anyone who cared to look. Five of the ten Essex class carriers that we used to defeat Japan were begun BEFORE Pearl Harbor. Industry was being ramped up as early as 1939 to deal with impending orders. The aviation industry had been on the verge of extinction for the majority of the '30's and all of that changed with the advent of the Polish invasion.

Anywhere you choose to look it was obvious that we were going to war. Had Pearl Harbor not occured we still would have gone to war. We almost did after Topp sunk the Reuben James months before PH, we weren't ready yet so they accepted the German apology.

But it is clear that the convoy activities that we were engaged in (actively hunting U-boats while ostensibly neutral) would have landed us in the war soon enough.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

By now you are all aware that FDR had genuine Soviet spies in high offices and as key advisers. Part of their mission was to turn the USA and Japan on a collision course toward war.

The last time the Japanese and the Russian crossed swords in 1905, the Japanese mopped the floor up with the Rooskies ((Russo-Japanese War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) because you Progressives never believe anything happened unless its in Wiki) and the Soviet spies advising FDR got him to start a real life shooting war with Russia's natural and deadly enemy, the Japanese. I give the Soviets an enormous amount of credit for their geo-political victory here, it cannot be underestimated and should be applauded. They played FDR for a total patsy.

By now you also know that FDR provoked and goaded and all but invited the Japanese to attack us and in fact, since we had cracked the Japanese codes, we were well aware the invasion fleet was inbound to Pearl Harbor on Dec 7.

On Nov 27, 1941 George Marshall ordered a "War warning" and directed the base at Pearl to "undertake reconnaissance" a sensible precaution. However, suddenly, on December 6 Gen Short ordered the fighter to "Stand down" gave pilots THAT VERY Weekend off, ordered the mobile AA guns BACK TO BARRACKS, dispersed the aircraft from the protective bunkers and stacked them up on the runway (the only thing he didn't do was spray them with lighter fluid and leave matches nearby) insuring maximum damage would be inflicted on the ships at Pearl, but not the carriers, which were also sent out on patrol far away from the inbound Japanese strike force.

Clearly, Gen Short must have gotten an order, maybe from FDR personally, to leave Pearl Harbor vulnerable and insure maximum damage to the fleet (but not the carriers) at Pearl.

Did LBJ really say that? re quote on Thurgood Marshall in bold type

He absolutely said it.

He called the Civil Rights Bill, the "****** Bill" and when he was President he told he fellow Democrats not to worry about passing Ike's Civil Rights Bill as his own because he'd "have them ******* voting Democrat for the next 200 years"

Very true,LBJ was known by people that knew him in his early days in the senate for hating blacks calling them ******* all the time.He signed the civil rights bill RELUCTANTLY only after pressure had been put on him by Martin Luther King and the civil rights movement.He knew if he did not sign it,he would show his true colors that he was a ****** hater and that he did not share Kennedys ideas on civil rights since Kennedy was the one who initally got the bal;l rolling for the civil rights movement.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

Actually, there is far more direct and verifiable evidence to back up this one.

War is the health of the state, baby.

forget it,your wasting your breath with this troll.You would have better luck talking to a wall.This troll is a paid agent sent here to try and derail truth discussions such as 9/11,the kennedy assassination and Pearl Harbour.Your just giving him the attention he seeks by replying to him.

Best thing to do is put him on ignore.He seeks attention so badly he will quote you and address you as though you are reading his ramblings despite the many times you tell him you have him on ignore.pretty pathetic really.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Look who's backing you, Frank!

It's 9/11 inside nutjob!

rofl

so say the troll Toto afraid of the truth about government conspiracys who runs off with his tail between his legs when challeneged to refute evidence in videos or books who would be laughed out of a debating hall with his debating skills refusing to address points his opponent gives him.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

Don't need any help, Bubba.

okay its your funeral.If you want to play his game and give him your time and the attention he seeks thats your perogative but your just playing his game he wants you to though.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

This conspiracy theory is right up there with "Bush knew 9/11 was going to happen, and let it happen so we could steal the Arabs oil."

Outstanding.

Actually, there is far more direct and verifiable evidence to back up this one.

War is the health of the state, baby.

No there's not.

It's the exact same lame argument the twoofers make.

yes there is,its just we cant help it that you brainwashed Bush dupes wont look at the evidence and only see what you want to see.its not his fault you wont look at the evidence and run away everytime when challeneged to.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

I think the Interent is the problem a lot of folks have with believing that we were surprised.

When you're not on a war footing, you never think you're going to be attacked. Especially by Japan.

We live in a society where you can know what is on television (if you want to that is) in Sydney. In 1941, you didn't have any such access to information. Having such cultural differences didn't lend itself to intel gathering either.

All in all, the stories are interesting but I don't think there was any conspiracy. It was just one of those dang deals. Those with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight shouldn't judge the men on the ground too harshly.

On Nov 27, 1941 George Marshall ordered a "War warning" and directed the base at Pearl to "undertake reconnaissance" a sensible precaution. However, suddenly, on December 6 Gen Short ordered the fighter to "Stand down" gave pilots THAT VERY Weekend off, ordered the mobile AA guns BACK TO BARRACKS, dispersed the aircraft from the protective bunkers and stacked them up on the runway (the only thing he didn't do was spray them with lighter fluid and leave matches nearby) insuring maximum damage would be inflicted on the ships at Pearl, but not the carriers, which were also sent out on patrol far away from the inbound Japanese strike force.

Did you gloss over that part of the OP?

so YOU are going go give this paid disinformation agent troll the attention he seeks also huh? Your playing his game and he is wasting your time like he wants to do,not smart.

 

[Baruch Menachem]

The assumption that since we were reading the Japanese diplomatic traffic we were also reading their military traffic is a huge mistake.

Of course, we got the military codes by April, so the Midway battle was a forgone conclusion.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

It's good to deal with FDR's blunders even though his legacy has been protected by the liberal media for almost a hundred years. How much evidence do you need to admit that FDR wanted the US to be attacked by Japan so the US would get into the "real war" in Europe? His own words? I doubt if FDR set up the Pearl Harbor attack. He was a slick politician but he just wasn't that smart. I think FDR and the entire government suffered from terminal bigotry with respect to the Japanese. There are several examples of profound ignorance regarding the Japanese including the administration's opinion that they were poor in math skills to build a ship that would float and too nearsighted to fly a plane. In other words the FDR administration thought the Japanese would be a pushover and a minor inconvenience on the road to war with Germany.

you need to read the book DAY OF DECEIT.Its a book based on over 10,000 declassified documents and interviews with navel men including admirals who said Roosevelt was a traiter to his country.then you will know FDR did indeed set up the attack.

 

[westwall]

The assumption that since we were reading the Japanese diplomatic traffic we were also reading their military traffic is a huge mistake.

Of course, we got the military codes by April, so the Midway battle was a forgone conclusion.

Not forgone at all. Our forces were still outnumbered and at a definite disadvantage in capability of aircraft (the ZERO was significantly better at that time) the one advantage we had was we knew they were attacking and they didn't know we had aircraft carriers in the area.

And once again, due to a mistake in timing, the Japanese aircraft were on the deck being re-armed when the SBD's started their dives. Yet another in an unending line of coincidences.

 

[westwall]

It's good to deal with FDR's blunders even though his legacy has been protected by the liberal media for almost a hundred years. How much evidence do you need to admit that FDR wanted the US to be attacked by Japan so the US would get into the "real war" in Europe? His own words? I doubt if FDR set up the Pearl Harbor attack. He was a slick politician but he just wasn't that smart. I think FDR and the entire government suffered from terminal bigotry with respect to the Japanese. There are several examples of profound ignorance regarding the Japanese including the administration's opinion that they were poor in math skills to build a ship that would float and too nearsighted to fly a plane. In other words the FDR administration thought the Japanese would be a pushover and a minor inconvenience on the road to war with Germany.

you need to read the book DAY OF DECEIT.Its a book based on over 10,000 declassified documents and interviews with navel men including admirals who said Roosevelt was a traiter to his country.then you will know FDR did indeed set up the attack.

That would be NAVAL officers and why would he need to set up the attack? We were allready engaged in an undeclared war against German U-boats. All they needed to do was say, "nope, we decided that your apology for the Reuben James sinking isn't eneough".

There was ALLREADY grounds (sort of, we were actually violating the Neutrality Act) to go to war.

 

[Obamerican]

It's good to deal with FDR's blunders even though his legacy has been protected by the liberal media for almost a hundred years. How much evidence do you need to admit that FDR wanted the US to be attacked by Japan so the US would get into the "real war" in Europe? His own words? I doubt if FDR set up the Pearl Harbor attack. He was a slick politician but he just wasn't that smart. I think FDR and the entire government suffered from terminal bigotry with respect to the Japanese. There are several examples of profound ignorance regarding the Japanese including the administration's opinion that they were poor in math skills to build a ship that would float and too nearsighted to fly a plane. In other words the FDR administration thought the Japanese would be a pushover and a minor inconvenience on the road to war with Germany.

you need to read the book DAY OF DECEIT.Its a book based on over 10,000 declassified documents and interviews with navel men including admirals who said Roosevelt was a traiter to his country.then you will know FDR did indeed set up the attack.

See how this illiterate fuck posts? And we're supposed to believe anything this idiot says?

9/11 = Conspiracy
Kennedy = Conspiracy
Pearl Harbor = Conspiracy

Rimjob is illiterate and very uneducated. He also thinks we get paid to argue with him!! This fucking shit stain thinks he's important enough for Uncle Sam to keep an eye on him and other fools like Eots and 7Foreskin.

Keep it up, ass wipe Rimjob. At least you prove that the internet is still open to EVERYONE!!

 

[Unkotare]

The last time the Japanese and the Russian crossed swords in 1905, the Japanese mopped the floor up with the Rooskies ((Russo-Japanese War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) because you Progressives never believe anything happened unless its in Wiki) and the Soviet spies advising FDR got him to start a real life shooting war with Russia's natural and deadly enemy, the Japanese. .

Japan was never Russia's "natural enemy." If you're looking for one in Asia it would be China. It's true that the humiliation of the Russo-Japanese War basically brought down the Czar (and all that followed from that), but "natural enemy" is overstating the case.

 

[Unkotare]

This conspiracy theory is right up there with "Bush knew 9/11 was going to happen, and let it happen so we could steal the Arabs oil."

Outstanding.

Actually, there is far more direct and verifiable evidence to back up this one.

War is the health of the state, baby.

forget it,your wasting your breath with this troll.You would have better luck talking to a wall.This troll is a paid agent sent here to try and derail truth discussions such as 9/11,the kennedy assassination and Pearl Harbour.Your just giving him the attention he seeks by replying to him.

Best thing to do is put him on ignore.He seeks attention so badly he will quote you and address you as though you are reading his ramblings despite the many times you tell him you have him on ignore.pretty pathetic really.

Are you being treated for your Schizophrenia?

 

[Toro]

I'm looking at the fact, and they're not too kind to FDR

Twoofers say the same thing about Bush/Cheney.

 

[Toro]

so say the troll Toto afraid of the truth about government conspiracys who runs off with his tail between his legs when challeneged to refute evidence in videos or books who would be laughed out of a debating hall with his debating skills refusing to address points his opponent gives him.

Are you going to tell me to watch 347 youtube videos and read a book on the Pearl Harbor conspiracies too?



Why do Americans worry about little things, like "their children" when FDR and the murderers walk free?

 

[Toro]

It's good to deal with FDR's blunders even though his legacy has been protected by the liberal media for almost a hundred years. How much evidence do you need to admit that FDR wanted the US to be attacked by Japan so the US would get into the "real war" in Europe? His own words? I doubt if FDR set up the Pearl Harbor attack. He was a slick politician but he just wasn't that smart. I think FDR and the entire government suffered from terminal bigotry with respect to the Japanese. There are several examples of profound ignorance regarding the Japanese including the administration's opinion that they were poor in math skills to build a ship that would float and too nearsighted to fly a plane. In other words the FDR administration thought the Japanese would be a pushover and a minor inconvenience on the road to war with Germany.

you need to read the book DAY OF DECEIT.Its a book based on over 10,000 declassified documents and interviews with navel men including admirals who said Roosevelt was a traiter to his country.then you will know FDR did indeed set up the attack.

See how this illiterate fuck posts? And we're supposed to believe anything this idiot says?

9/11 = Conspiracy
Kennedy = Conspiracy
Pearl Harbor = Conspiracy

Rimjob is illiterate and very uneducated. He also thinks we get paid to argue with him!! This fucking shit stain thinks he's important enough for Uncle Sam to keep an eye on him and other fools like Eots and 7Foreskin.

Keep it up, ass wipe Rimjob. At least you prove that the internet is still open to EVERYONE!!

Now, be fair. 9/11 inside nutjob DOES know how to link youtube videos. Or at least to tell you to watch youtube videos. That's gotta count for something, dunnit?