False Catholic Mary Doctrine

[turzovka]

Roman catholicism is nothing but paganism with some Biblical references thrown in for affect. They became afraid with the Reformation started by Martin Luther that made the Bible available to EVERYONE and not just the priests which was a direct attack against the catholic church. People learned that the catholic church was full of shit preaching that in exchange for a donation, they could have "indulgences", they could pay to have their loved ones not baptized by the church to get them to heaven because they were in "purgatory"....talk about a load of utter bullshit. THEN, they were told that this POS "pope" was the official spokesperson of "Christ on earth", the vicar of Christ.....(insert puking noises here).

So, in retaliation to the Reformation, they commission the Jesuit Order of Ignatius of Loyola to bring about a Counter -Reformation via the Council Of Trent to bring the people back into the fold of the catholic church and those that refused to cede to the papal powers were considered "heretics". Over 60 million people died in Europe from the mid 1500's to the late 1700's due to the Jesuit imposed inquisition. The Jesuits were suppressed in 1773 by Pope Clementine and three years later the Jesuit Order of the Illuminati came to be. In 1814, the Jesuits were un-suppressed because they infiltrated the vatican and their tentacles spreads out all over the world. The jesuits have been kicked out of 83 countries for political intrigue and subterfuge but because of America's "freedom of religion" vow, they got a foothold in this country and they used it to the advantage of the papacy. FUCK the catholic church and fuck the jesuits. Every head of the CIA has been jesuit trained. Don't EVEN get me started on the catholics, the jesuits and the knights of malta........I take a great big piss on them every chance I am afforded the opportunity.

Dale, nice to know you are still around. We shall find common ground on other matters.

"purgatory"....talk about a load of utter bullshit.

Over 60 million people died in Europe from the mid 1500's to the late 1700's due to the Jesuit imposed inquisition.

Roman catholicism is nothing but paganism with some Biblical references thrown in for affect.

Don't EVEN get me started on the catholics, the jesuits....

Geez, I would have thought you already did get started? 60 million died from the Inquisition, hey? Boy, did I lowball that one.

Look, Dale, I surely do not have nearly the time to respond in kind to your wild historical accusations and hyperbole. But I would like to because I highly doubt the vast amount of what you say above about the Church and its evilness. But we'll see if I answer the bell. Unfortunately, it still holds true on these boards that no one likes to read long posts or explanations so that in itself disarms me, or surely makes me far less motivated to put forth the effort. It is like St. Thomas More famously said: "Tis a shorter thing and sooner done to write heresies than to answer them."

I am as certain as you are uncertain that the Catholic Church is the One True Church started by Jesus Christ, that it contains the fullness of truth in its dogmas and doctrines, is the truest path to grace and salvation, and can easily be defended through Scripture, its saints and historical truths. You point to many egregious sins by its clergy and faithful and I point to its revealed truth. God had no choice but to work with sinners to build his Church, you know of any without sin besides the Virgin Mary we could have tapped into?

Later, hopefully. If not, maybe we'll meet up in purgatory : )

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

In the world, we can see a fervent goal of reaching a consensus between different churches and revival movements through ecumenism. The Roman Catholic Church is involved in ecumenism, and many people are not familiar with the Catholic doctrine. The Catholic "gospel" is a false one, and the Catholic Church does not represent Biblical Christian faith. The late bishop Alphonsus Liguiri, the author of a very well-known book titled "The Glories of Mary", writes in the book that Mary's intercessions are absolutely necessary for salvation, and that Mary, being the mother of God, is omnipotent and can save sinners.

Catholic News Service posted a piece on June 4, 2015, stating that the sitting Pope, Francis, has just recently read The Glories of Mary. Francis says that he enjoyed the book because all chapters of the book show how Mary always leads us to Jesus Christ. The Catholic News Service says that the pope gives praise for the book. Pope Francis did not reject and revoke any of the Mary doctrines in the book, which means that the Pope approves of the book's unbiblical Mary teachings that mock God. If the book's Mary doctrines were contrary to the official Catholic doctrine, Francis should absolutely have pointed that out, but he did not, and gave praise to the book instead. The Pope's attitude and words of praise confirm that the Catholic Church continues to worship Mary. If someone still wants to disagree, he or she has not learned to read, is incapable of understanding written text or information that he or she has heard, or is blinded by the lie and is a liar.

More info: Catholic Church Mary intercession omnipotent save sinners

Again we see more false teaching from Pope Francis in that he claims that Mary's intercession is absolutely necessary for salvation. False. Jesus Christ is our intercessor according to the Written Word of God. That Mary is the mother of God. False. She was a vessel and was the mother of Jesus Christ while he was upon the earth. Before the Word (Jesus Christ) became flesh - Mary was not his mother (See John Chapter 1 and note that Jesus was before Mary - He is God) See Genesis Chapter 1. Mary is not omnipotent - she was a sinner saved by grace just as every human on this earth who has ever been saved. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. All includes Mary. Finally, the pope is teaching false doctrine by claiming that it is Mary that leads us to Jesus Christ. It is not Mary but the Holy Spirit of God that leads us to Jesus Christ.

Did you miss the part about the angel Gabriel telling Mary she had found favor with God and would bear a Son? Did you miss the part where Mary visits her cousin Elizabeth, blessed are you among women? Look in Luke.

Of course she was blessed. She was chosen to be a vessel of the Lord. John the Baptist was blessed to be the one chosen to prepare the way for the Lord's coming. I'm blessed to be chosen to be a laborer / servant of the Lord. I'm trying to understand the point you are trying to make in your response. Mary was just a human being the same as John the Baptist, you or I. She isn't a deity to be worshiped or prayed to. She was a fallible human being that believed on Jesus Christ for her salvation just as all who desire to know the Lord and enter into the kingdom of heaven must do. No difference. A vessel is a vessel. People must not make her into a god. She isn't a god. She was flesh and blood with two parents just as we came into the world. She was the Lord's mother (while he was upon the earth), not ours. Jesus Christ is the one who died on a cross for our sins, Compost. Not Mary. Mary couldn't save herself.

Here is Mary's testimony of being saved through believing on Jesus Christ as Her Lord and Savior:

And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord, And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
Luke1:46,57

I have to tell you something, Compost. I believe that you truly desire to be pleasing to God and be accepted by Him. I've read many of your posts, I've seen you be kind to the Jewish people and others here and to stand up on certain issues that I haven't seen others stand up for(when they should have). I want you to know that I desire and pray for God's very best for you and if ever I personally offended you or hurt your feelings I am truly sorry. While I cannot change my stand concerning the Vatican / Catholicism, I know that my delivery has been rough at times and I felt the need to tell you this. I know the Lord loves you very much. Have a nice afternoon.

Thank you Book of Jeremiah.

I am not a big time Marian but I understand the veneration of her. Indeed, the older I get, the more I realize the importance of humility and obedience to God's will. Mary is that.

I've never heard it said that Mary is omnipotent. That's why I asked if you read the Glory of Mary books. Your links are, to put it bluntly, typically so virulently anti Catholic as to be laughable. So I don't put much stock in your links . Since I haven't read the books myself, I don't know if saint Al... says she's omnipotent. If he does, I disagree. Mary is a saint. She is, as you say, the vessel that brought Jesus into the world. She was a woman, like you and me- only she was better- more focused on what God wanted from her. Catholics think of her as our mother. From the cross, Jesus told John, this is your mother... we Catholics see this as more than saying, dude I'm about to die, take care of my mom, OK? It's that this simple woman took on this important job of bringing the Son of God into the world and seeing him die. She is praying for all of us, like a mother to all of us.

Thank you for accepting my apology, Compost. I won't be posting any more of those links. Should God ever have me comment or write on the subject of Catholicism again I would have to know without question it was by His leading but I do not believe that is what He has for me to do. God says that when we delight ourselves in Him, He will give us the desires of our heart. My heart's desire is not to write about Catholicism but to win souls and write about subjects that connect with intimacy with God.

 

[Blackrook]

Heaven and the Earthly Church is full of males in positions of power: the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, the Apostles, the Popes, the bishops, the priests, and (maybe) the angels (who always appeared on Earth as men). I have no problem with ONE WOMAN getting some say in all this.

 

[Meriweather]

Mary bore Christ to the world. Instead of picking on her, perhaps we should examine how well we are bearing Christ to the world.

Many books have been written on why Catholics honor Mary. Instead of endeavoring to understand, some try to use it to smear Catholics. Don't non-Catholics believe that Mary was specially prepared by God to become the mother of Christ? I have a hard time understanding this sneering of God in order to find some satisfaction in bashing fellow Christians.

Catholics do not worship Mary. Like every other Catholic--both living and those who have passed on--we ask for her to pray for us, just as we might ask our own friends and family (as members of the body of Christ) to pray for us.

 

[gtopa1]

The link works fine, it went straight to the article.

Catholic Church Mary intercession omnipotent save sinners

The false "Mary the omnipotent" doctrine of the Catholic Church

In the world, we can see a fervent goal of reaching a consensus between different churches and revival movements through ecumenism. The Roman Catholic Church is involved in ecumenism, and many people are not familiar with the Catholic doctrine. The Catholic "gospel" is a false one, and the Catholic Church does not represent Biblical Christian faith. The late bishop Alphonsus Liguiri, the author of a very well-known book titled "The Glories of Mary", writes in the book that Mary's intercessions are absolutely necessary for salvation, and that Mary, being the mother of God, is omnipotent and can save sinners. Spend time in prayer and compare the present text what the Bible teaches us.

Huh?? No; Mary can't save anyone. It's JC who did that. Mary can only POINT IN THE RIGHT direction, or maybe drag some recalcitrant sods by the earlobe towards where they should be heading. Nothing to stop anyone going straight to the top; for those who are a bit intimidated by approaching the saviour directly Mary is a guiding hand but only to getting said wuss onto the right track. If not to Jesus then sorry; you are STUFFED!!

That's my understanding anyway.

Greg

 

[gtopa1]

Heaven and the Earthly Church is full of males in positions of power: the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, the Apostles, the Popes, the bishops, the priests, and (maybe) the angels (who always appeared on Earth as men). I have no problem with ONE WOMAN getting some say in all this.

The Holy Spirit is male?? Really? Didn't know that. I just assumed that God was beyond gender; in fact beyond anything my pea brain could possibly comprehend. I'm glad He likes me. I know what a putz I can be. Then again, so does He. But is God a male? Of course not. Not a female either.



Greg

 

[gtopa1]

In the world, we can see a fervent goal of reaching a consensus between different churches and revival movements through ecumenism. The Roman Catholic Church is involved in ecumenism, and many people are not familiar with the Catholic doctrine. The Catholic "gospel" is a false one, and the Catholic Church does not represent Biblical Christian faith. The late bishop Alphonsus Liguiri, the author of a very well-known book titled "The Glories of Mary", writes in the book that Mary's intercessions are absolutely necessary for salvation, and that Mary, being the mother of God, is omnipotent and can save sinners.

Catholic News Service posted a piece on June 4, 2015, stating that the sitting Pope, Francis, has just recently read The Glories of Mary. Francis says that he enjoyed the book because all chapters of the book show how Mary always leads us to Jesus Christ. The Catholic News Service says that the pope gives praise for the book. Pope Francis did not reject and revoke any of the Mary doctrines in the book, which means that the Pope approves of the book's unbiblical Mary teachings that mock God. If the book's Mary doctrines were contrary to the official Catholic doctrine, Francis should absolutely have pointed that out, but he did not, and gave praise to the book instead. The Pope's attitude and words of praise confirm that the Catholic Church continues to worship Mary. If someone still wants to disagree, he or she has not learned to read, is incapable of understanding written text or information that he or she has heard, or is blinded by the lie and is a liar.

More info: Catholic Church Mary intercession omnipotent save sinners

Again we see more false teaching from Pope Francis in that he claims that Mary's intercession is absolutely necessary for salvation. False. Jesus Christ is our intercessor according to the Written Word of God. That Mary is the mother of God. False. She was a vessel and was the mother of Jesus Christ while he was upon the earth. Before the Word (Jesus Christ) became flesh - Mary was not his mother (See John Chapter 1 and note that Jesus was before Mary - He is God) See Genesis Chapter 1. Mary is not omnipotent - she was a sinner saved by grace just as every human on this earth who has ever been saved. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. All includes Mary. Finally, the pope is teaching false doctrine by claiming that it is Mary that leads us to Jesus Christ. It is not Mary but the Holy Spirit of God that leads us to Jesus Christ.

But Jesus is God so how can he intercede? If you go straight to JC then you go straight to God. Isn't an intercessor a go between sort of thingy?

Greg

 

[Dale Smith]

Roman catholicism is nothing but paganism with some Biblical references thrown in for affect. They became afraid with the Reformation started by Martin Luther that made the Bible available to EVERYONE and not just the priests which was a direct attack against the catholic church. People learned that the catholic church was full of shit preaching that in exchange for a donation, they could have "indulgences", they could pay to have their loved ones not baptized by the church to get them to heaven because they were in "purgatory"....talk about a load of utter bullshit. THEN, they were told that this POS "pope" was the official spokesperson of "Christ on earth", the vicar of Christ.....(insert puking noises here).

So, in retaliation to the Reformation, they commission the Jesuit Order of Ignatius of Loyola to bring about a Counter -Reformation via the Council Of Trent to bring the people back into the fold of the catholic church and those that refused to cede to the papal powers were considered "heretics". Over 60 million people died in Europe from the mid 1500's to the late 1700's due to the Jesuit imposed inquisition. The Jesuits were suppressed in 1773 by Pope Clementine and three years later the Jesuit Order of the Illuminati came to be. In 1814, the Jesuits were un-suppressed because they infiltrated the vatican and their tentacles spreads out all over the world. The jesuits have been kicked out of 83 countries for political intrigue and subterfuge but because of America's "freedom of religion" vow, they got a foothold in this country and they used it to the advantage of the papacy. FUCK the catholic church and fuck the jesuits. Every head of the CIA has been jesuit trained. Don't EVEN get me started on the catholics, the jesuits and the knights of malta........I take a great big piss on them every chance I am afforded the opportunity.

Dale, nice to know you are still around. We shall find common ground on other matters.

"purgatory"....talk about a load of utter bullshit.

Over 60 million people died in Europe from the mid 1500's to the late 1700's due to the Jesuit imposed inquisition.

Roman catholicism is nothing but paganism with some Biblical references thrown in for affect.

Don't EVEN get me started on the catholics, the jesuits....

Geez, I would have thought you already did get started? 60 million died from the Inquisition, hey? Boy, did I lowball that one.

Look, Dale, I surely do not have nearly the time to respond in kind to your wild historical accusations and hyperbole. But I would like to because I highly doubt the vast amount of what you say above about the Church and its evilness. But we'll see if I answer the bell. Unfortunately, it still holds true on these boards that no one likes to read long posts or explanations so that in itself disarms me, or surely makes me far less motivated to put forth the effort. It is like St. Thomas More famously said: "Tis a shorter thing and sooner done to write heresies than to answer them."

I am as certain as you are uncertain that the Catholic Church is the One True Church started by Jesus Christ, that it contains the fullness of truth in its dogmas and doctrines, is the truest path to grace and salvation, and can easily be defended through Scripture, its saints and historical truths. You point to many egregious sins by its clergy and faithful and I point to its revealed truth. God had no choice but to work with sinners to build his Church, you know of any without sin besides the Virgin Mary we could have tapped into?

Later, hopefully. If not, maybe we'll meet up in purgatory : )

Hey, I did not mean to offend good Catholics and if they have accepted Jesus Christ as their personal savior, they have a golden ticket. It's the Vatican and their military arm that is the Jesuit Order that I have disdain for. I have spent thousands of hours researching this and put the pieces in place. We can agree to disagree and I think you post some great stuff...good on ya.

 

[gtopa1]

Roman catholicism is nothing but paganism with some Biblical references thrown in for affect. They became afraid with the Reformation started by Martin Luther that made the Bible available to EVERYONE and not just the priests which was a direct attack against the catholic church. People learned that the catholic church was full of shit preaching that in exchange for a donation, they could have "indulgences", they could pay to have their loved ones not baptized by the church to get them to heaven because they were in "purgatory"....talk about a load of utter bullshit. THEN, they were told that this POS "pope" was the official spokesperson of "Christ on earth", the vicar of Christ.....(insert puking noises here).

So, in retaliation to the Reformation, they commission the Jesuit Order of Ignatius of Loyola to bring about a Counter -Reformation via the Council Of Trent to bring the people back into the fold of the catholic church and those that refused to cede to the papal powers were considered "heretics". Over 60 million people died in Europe from the mid 1500's to the late 1700's due to the Jesuit imposed inquisition. The Jesuits were suppressed in 1773 by Pope Clementine and three years later the Jesuit Order of the Illuminati came to be. In 1814, the Jesuits were un-suppressed because they infiltrated the vatican and their tentacles spreads out all over the world. The jesuits have been kicked out of 83 countries for political intrigue and subterfuge but because of America's "freedom of religion" vow, they got a foothold in this country and they used it to the advantage of the papacy. FUCK the catholic church and fuck the jesuits. Every head of the CIA has been jesuit trained. Don't EVEN get me started on the catholics, the jesuits and the knights of malta........I take a great big piss on them every chance I am afforded the opportunity.

Dale, nice to know you are still around. We shall find common ground on other matters.

"purgatory"....talk about a load of utter bullshit.

Over 60 million people died in Europe from the mid 1500's to the late 1700's due to the Jesuit imposed inquisition.

Roman catholicism is nothing but paganism with some Biblical references thrown in for affect.

Don't EVEN get me started on the catholics, the jesuits....

Geez, I would have thought you already did get started? 60 million died from the Inquisition, hey? Boy, did I lowball that one.

Look, Dale, I surely do not have nearly the time to respond in kind to your wild historical accusations and hyperbole. But I would like to because I highly doubt the vast amount of what you say above about the Church and its evilness. But we'll see if I answer the bell. Unfortunately, it still holds true on these boards that no one likes to read long posts or explanations so that in itself disarms me, or surely makes me far less motivated to put forth the effort. It is like St. Thomas More famously said: "Tis a shorter thing and sooner done to write heresies than to answer them."

I am as certain as you are uncertain that the Catholic Church is the One True Church started by Jesus Christ, that it contains the fullness of truth in its dogmas and doctrines, is the truest path to grace and salvation, and can easily be defended through Scripture, its saints and historical truths. You point to many egregious sins by its clergy and faithful and I point to its revealed truth. God had no choice but to work with sinners to build his Church, you know of any without sin besides the Virgin Mary we could have tapped into?

Later, hopefully. If not, maybe we'll meet up in purgatory : )

Hey, I did not mean to offend good Catholics and if they have accepted Jesus Christ as their personal savior, they have a golden ticket. It's the Vatican and their military arm that is the Jesuit Order that I have disdain for. I have spent thousands of hours researching this and put the pieces in place. We can agree to disagree and I think you post some great stuff...good on ya.

FUCK the catholic church and fuck the jesuits

Why on earth would one take offense at that??

Greg

 

[turzovka]

Roman catholicism is nothing but paganism with some Biblical references thrown in for affect. They became afraid with the Reformation started by Martin Luther that made the Bible available to EVERYONE and not just the priests which was a direct attack against the catholic church. People learned that the catholic church was full of shit preaching that in exchange for a donation, they could have "indulgences", they could pay to have their loved ones not baptized by the church to get them to heaven because they were in "purgatory"....talk about a load of utter bullshit. THEN, they were told that this POS "pope" was the official spokesperson of "Christ on earth", the vicar of Christ.....(insert puking noises here).

So, in retaliation to the Reformation, they commission the Jesuit Order of Ignatius of Loyola to bring about a Counter -Reformation via the Council Of Trent to bring the people back into the fold of the catholic church and those that refused to cede to the papal powers were considered "heretics". Over 60 million people died in Europe from the mid 1500's to the late 1700's due to the Jesuit imposed inquisition. The Jesuits were suppressed in 1773 by Pope Clementine and three years later the Jesuit Order of the Illuminati came to be. In 1814, the Jesuits were un-suppressed because they infiltrated the vatican and their tentacles spreads out all over the world. The jesuits have been kicked out of 83 countries for political intrigue and subterfuge but because of America's "freedom of religion" vow, they got a foothold in this country and they used it to the advantage of the papacy. FUCK the catholic church and fuck the jesuits. Every head of the CIA has been jesuit trained. Don't EVEN get me started on the catholics, the jesuits and the knights of malta........I take a great big piss on them every chance I am afforded the opportunity.

Dale, nice to know you are still around. We shall find common ground on other matters.

"purgatory"....talk about a load of utter bullshit.

Over 60 million people died in Europe from the mid 1500's to the late 1700's due to the Jesuit imposed inquisition.

Roman catholicism is nothing but paganism with some Biblical references thrown in for affect.

Don't EVEN get me started on the catholics, the jesuits....

Geez, I would have thought you already did get started? 60 million died from the Inquisition, hey? Boy, did I lowball that one.

Look, Dale, I surely do not have nearly the time to respond in kind to your wild historical accusations and hyperbole. But I would like to because I highly doubt the vast amount of what you say above about the Church and its evilness. But we'll see if I answer the bell. Unfortunately, it still holds true on these boards that no one likes to read long posts or explanations so that in itself disarms me, or surely makes me far less motivated to put forth the effort. It is like St. Thomas More famously said: "Tis a shorter thing and sooner done to write heresies than to answer them."

I am as certain as you are uncertain that the Catholic Church is the One True Church started by Jesus Christ, that it contains the fullness of truth in its dogmas and doctrines, is the truest path to grace and salvation, and can easily be defended through Scripture, its saints and historical truths. You point to many egregious sins by its clergy and faithful and I point to its revealed truth. God had no choice but to work with sinners to build his Church, you know of any without sin besides the Virgin Mary we could have tapped into?

Later, hopefully. If not, maybe we'll meet up in purgatory : )

Hey, I did not mean to offend good Catholics and if they have accepted Jesus Christ as their personal savior, they have a golden ticket. It's the Vatican and their military arm that is the Jesuit Order that I have disdain for. I have spent thousands of hours researching this and put the pieces in place. We can agree to disagree and I think you post some great stuff...good on ya.

Dale, I was never offended in the first place. I am Ok with protestants being sickened by what they read in Catholic Church history. A lot of it I am sure is true, and other parts maybe false or hyperbole. The Jesuits do have a dark past and that is why they were dismantled, but it is not maybe as clear as some think or believe. I am going to research it myself. The priestly abuse coverup by bishops is even more indefensible, imo, and I think that is the devil infiltrating the Church and what have you.

So Ok to attack, I understand your motives or reasons. I am trying to defend this from other facts or perspectives. I welcome the disgust of others.

As for you, yes, we are on the same page almost always even though you put some your comments in terms I might not choose. : ) I will be around, almost always with you but maybe sometimes against. : )

 

[seaofnails]

Hello.

Roman Catholic teaching concerning Mary is pretty clear.

MEDIATOR -- Mary is the Mediator to whom we can entrust all our cares and petitions. ("Catechism" 968-970, 2677)

POPE JOHN PAUL "It is possible to understand the authentic meaning of MARIAN WORSHIP in the ecclesial community ..... which is based on the will of Christ" (Vatican Information Service, May 7, 97
Worship of Mary

Pontiff Benedict XV [Decree on Joan of Are "In every miracle, we must recognize the mediation of Mary WHOM every grace and blessing comes to us."

"Let us pray to Mary Queen of Peace," said Benedict, "that she may implore from God the fundamental gift of harmony http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/new.php?n=7182

 

[zaangalewa]

I never heard of the very well-known book titled "The Glories of Mary".

-----
The glories of Mary
Translated from the Italian of
Saint Alphonsus Liguori

Publication date 1852
Publisher New York, Edward Dunigan and brother
-----

Liguori (and not Liguiri) lived from 1696-1787.

 

[zaangalewa]

In the world, we can see a fervent goal of reaching a consensus between different churches and revival movements through ecumenism. The Roman Catholic Church is involved in ecumenism, and many people are not familiar with the Catholic doctrine. The Catholic "gospel" is a false one, and the Catholic Church does not represent Biblical Christian faith. The late bishop Alphonsus Liguiri, the author of a very well-known book titled "The Glories of Mary", writes in the book that Mary's intercessions are absolutely necessary for salvation, and that Mary, being the mother of God, is omnipotent and can save sinners.

Catholic News Service posted a piece on June 4, 2015, stating that the sitting Pope, Francis, has just recently read The Glories of Mary. Francis says that he enjoyed the book because all chapters of the book show how Mary always leads us to Jesus Christ. The Catholic News Service says that the pope gives praise for the book. Pope Francis did not reject and revoke any of the Mary doctrines in the book, which means that the Pope approves of the book's unbiblical Mary teachings that mock God. If the book's Mary doctrines were contrary to the official Catholic doctrine, Francis should absolutely have pointed that out, but he did not, and gave praise to the book instead. The Pope's attitude and words of praise confirm that the Catholic Church continues to worship Mary. If someone still wants to disagree, he or she has not learned to read, is incapable of understanding written text or information that he or she has heard, or is blinded by the lie and is a liar.

More info: Catholic Church Mary intercession omnipotent save sinners

I love how some Protestants demand all Catholic doctrine be clearly spelled out in the Bible --- while at the same time they totally ignore many Biblical teachings that uproot their own teachings. Purgatory, for one very important example. And the paths to salvation, many, not one. And the fact charity is more important than faith to God, for another.

Please quit acting so dogmatically when challenging Catholic teaching by insisting they follow the Bible only, and your specific interpretations only. It is kind of sad to witness such.

But since you think Jesus said all teachings must be in Scripture (He did not) here is one for you to dwell on --- "I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hell will not prevail against it. I give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatsoever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatsoever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven." Matthew 16:18-19

The Church --- the Catholic Church with Peter as the first pope and the apostles as the first bishops – given the keys of the kingdom, not Scripture, no small matter. The Church then assembled and determined the divinely inspired Word of God. The Bible is the book of the Church. And the unfolding of doctrine and teachings followed, not all so clearly spelled out in Scripture, and it was the Catholic Church who determined doctrine. And that includes the standing, worth and truth about Mary. ("Whatsoever you hold bound on earth shall be held bound in heaven.")

I could also point out to you how Protestants purposefully ignored other teachings from Scripture including the body and blood of Christ in the Eucharist, the sacrament of Penance administered only by ordained disciples (priests), purgatory, and the Immaculate Conception of Mary.

Woman! above all women glorified,
Our tainted nature's solitary boast; --- William Wordsworth

But the problem is the non-Catholic is not interested in knowing, nor shall they desire to take the time to read lengthy explanations or teachings. So I will not bother as a result.

But suffice it to say, Mary’s appearance at Fatima puts all Christians on trial. That is indubitably a supernatural manifestation. It is either from heaven above or from the devil. Choose carefully because we are all accountable. And as Jesus said " For you say that I cast out demons by Beelzebul. And if I by Beelzebul cast out demons, by whom do your sons cast them out? So they will be your judges. But if I cast out demons by the finger of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you." Luke 11:18-20

Roman catholicism is nothing but paganism with some Biblical references thrown in for affect. They became afraid with the Reformation started by Martin Luther that made the Bible available to EVERYONE and not just the priests which was a direct attack against the catholic church. People learned that the catholic church was full of shit preaching that in exchange for a donation, they could have "indulgences", they could pay to have their loved ones not baptized by the church to get them to heaven because they were in "purgatory"....talk about a load of utter bullshit. THEN, they were told that this POS "pope" was the official spokesperson of "Christ on earth", the vicar of Christ.....(insert puking noises here).


So, in retaliation to the Reformation, they commission the Jesuit Order of Ignatius of Loyola to bring about a Counter -Reformation via the Council Of Trent to bring the people back into the fold of the catholic church and those that refused to cede to the papal powers were considered "heretics". Over 60 million people died in Europe from the mid 1500's to the late 1700's due to the Jesuit imposed inquisition. The Jesuits were suppressed in 1773 by Pope Clementine and three years later the Jesuit Order of the Illuminati came to be. In 1814, the Jesuits were un-suppressed because they infiltrated the vatican and their tentacles spreads out all over the world. The jesuits have been kicked out of 83 countries for political intrigue and subterfuge but because of America's "freedom of religion" vow, they got a foothold in this country and they used it to the advantage of the papacy. FUCK the catholic church and fuck the jesuits. Every head of the CIA has been jesuit trained. Don't EVEN get me started on the catholics, the jesuits and the knights of malta........I take a great big piss on them every chance I am afforded the opportunity.

Spoken like a true Texan.

Texans are idiots? Oh sorry - I forgot. They are US-Americans.

 

[Taz]

I bet Jesus' big head busted her hymen big time!

 

[zaangalewa]

I bet Jesus' big head busted her hymen big time!

Ask her midwife. His name was Joseph.

 

[seaofnails]

Hello everyone.

Years ago. I discussed the subject about Mother Mary with a very nice Roman Catholic woman - and she was explaining The Catholic position about Mary.

We talked for a while and she brought up a verse about Mary - taken from the book of Luke. - She was saying that here in = Luke 2:41-51, when Yahoshua went to the temple at the age of 12, there is no mention of other children in his family.

But I tried to explain this very kind lady the fact that Yahoshua’s brothers and sisters may not have even been born yet and certainly not old enough to travel the really long distance that took day's to travel - to attend the feast that lasted up to a full week in another city. This was at least 40 miles from Bethlehem and 100 miles from Galilee - Then, during the feast, Mary had to go searching for three or four whole day,s - searching - through the streets and crowds throughout Jerusalem in a panicked search to find Yahoshua. For three whole day's,

Plus - - Even before she began the three or four-day search in Jerusalem - she had already left Jerusalem and had traveled a whole day's journey to go back to her home that was anywhere from 40 - 100 miles away. AND was thinking Yahoshua had left with them and was among them but was with others in the big crowd of other distant family,. kinsfolk / other relatives and acquaintances

If Mary had actually brought along all of her little children to make this long journey to feast in Jerusalem and spent a week there and then left Jerusalem and went a day's journey out / away from Jerusalem and suddenly - She and Joseph - TURNED BACK and went a day's journey - back to Jerusalem - after finding that Yahoshua had not been seen or found by all of her kinsfolk / other relatives and acquaintances - This was out just a single day's journey from Jerusalem but a few day's of traveling back to Galilee or Bethlehem where she lived,...

But - Jesus was not found..............

Here are the details of the story..
-
Luk 2:44 But they, supposing him to have been in the company, went a day's journey; and they sought him among their kinsfolk and acquaintance.
:45 And when they found him not, they turned back again to Jerusalem, seeking him.
:46 And it came to pass, that after three day's ( LOOKING ) they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions. ......... . :48 . . . and his mother said unto him, .............. thy father and I have sought thee sorrowing.

mary did not mention that everyone in the family was looking for Yahoshua - but that Her and Joseph were the ones who had been looking for Him.

By this time - why would Mary want to drag along all of Her younger aged little children back to Jerusalem - if she had she could simply leave with safely with Her other kinsfolk / other relatives - out away from Jerusalem. Why drag them all the way back to Jerusalem where they spent the next three whole day's frantically looking for their missing child. ? -

searching for Yahoshua - who left His mother's side and wandered into the temple. Is there any wonder or question why a handful of the rest of her other little babies and children would not manage to make it to the temple. it would be next to impossible for this to happen - to somehow - especially after three day's of looking, to bring all of Her little children and they all meet in the synagogue and / or for to even mention them in the first thing that she says to her lost child.

Verse 48 His mother said unto him, .... thy father and I have sought thee sorrowing.

But after I explained all of this to my Catholic friend - I also - tried to explain that after, Yahoshua was fully grown here in - Mar 6: 2 - 4 - - it does mention that His sisters were present - with Him in the synagogue in Galilee or Bethlehem - where He and His family lived..

Here in - Mar 6: 2 - 4 . . . Yahoshua was an adult - teaching in the synagogue - Soon thereafter the people in the synagogue begin to list the family members of Yahoshua, saying - - :3 Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and Juda, and Simon? and are not his sisters here with us ? And offended in him.

This verse is literally saying that His little sisters were reasonably embarrassed or uncomfortable for being called and openly mentioned in the synagogue as their brother completely caused every eye there to be directed at them..... And they, His sisters were " at that moment " being accused of being offended and displeased in Yahoshua - as the people in the temple attempted to dishonor, discredit and scandalize and make an offense - of His words, miracles and teachings, and entire ministry.

Also - If one was to pay close attention to what the people in the synagogue were saying, they clearly are not saying that Mary His mother and James, Joses, and Juda His brothers were there and present there in the synagogue that day. The people only accused - that His sisters ( Of all of His Family members ) were there and present that day and that they ( HIS SISTERS ) were “scandalize” and offended directly in or by Yahoshua. - The Greek word is “ IN “ = G1722 - ἐν - en / en - “ IN “ Meaning = (in place, time or state), “in by, etc.: - about, after, among, as, by (+ all means), for (. . . sake of), + (because) of, (-in - they were said to be offended in Him. - And after, Yahoshua was fully grown here in Mat_13:54 - 58 - - it does mention that His sisters were present - with Him in as He addressed the crowds. And again - Again this same exact thing happens in - Mat 13:55 as Yahoshua was teaching before the multitudes of people .

Mat 13:55 - is not his mother called Mary? and his brethren, James, and Joses, and Simon, and Judas?
Mat 13:56 And his sisters, are they not all with us?
Mat 13:57 And they ( His family ) were offended in him. But Jesus said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, except in his own country, and in his “ own house.”

As I was reading further Mar 6:4 .... Yahoshua said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, but in his own country, and among his own kin, and in his own house.

Here Yahoshua was admitting to them that - IN - His own family, His own household, among His own relatives and Mother, Father and family - He was without any honor ( AS A PROPHETIC FIGURE OR A RELIGIOUS LEADER ) - If these sisters were His cousins - the Greek language had a word for “ COUSIN “ And - anytime a cousin was mentioned in The New Testament - they always used the word cousin.
G4773 - - suggenēs - soong-ghen-ace'
A close relative (by blood); cousin, kin.
These sisters were not cousins or kin to Yahoshua - they were said to be His sisters.

Please remember that Yahoshua’s family and Abraham’s Family were very polygamous people. In fact the normal and standard family in The Bible were polygamous families.
The Greek language, however, is very different - - there is a Greek word used for Cousin - - BUT - in Hebrew - there was no literal word meaning a cousin – because in a normal polygamy situation of Gods people it would be a polygamy setting - where a Cousin would also be a Brother or a Sister - also - the many, many numerous Uncles and Aunts stemming from a single man marrying many wives - would be very high.
A typical Biblical child whose father had 8 wives - could easily have more than 30 to 60 aunts and uncles.

Also - The “ LANGUAGE STRUCTURE “ of the entire Hebrew culture was spoken and written to support polygamy. in the way that described the Godly, moral, holy and clean family structure.. - Cousins and Nieces were also often Brother and Sister - As Abraham and Sarah were brother and sister and also cousins at the same time.

And – remember - Uncle and Aunt in-laws were very numerous in a polygamous family structure because the many wives of the man, were all many uncle and aunt in laws to the children. - The authors of The Old Testament simply wrote out the description - as we see here in these following verses.

Lev 25:49 his uncle's son .
Jer 32:8 mine uncle's.
Jer 32:9 my uncle's son.
Jer 32:12 mine uncle's son.
Lev 20:20 his uncle's wife.
Est 2:7 Esther, his uncle's daughter.

But, there was no other word in the Hebrew at that time to say “ Cousin “ therefore the word brother and sister would apply to a wide variety of family members, as they were very closely related by blood. - -But in The Greek Language as we see that - the Greek language did include the word “ Cousin “ - to differentiate and make the distinction and difference between a “ BROTHER “ - a “ COUSIN “ and a friend or relative.

The Hebrew language did not include the words cousin and niece and the term brother could even be applied to any number of males - who were closely related in the polygamous family even if they were cousins. - Even if they were second cousins - The Grandfather in polygamous marriage created many brothers and sisters who were second and third generation and still called one another brother – with the same grandfather.

Also, If You read a little more of the actual words of The Bible, as it completes and explains that Yahoshua had brothers and sisters. –
We find that the Bible would have stated that Yahoshua was Mary’ s “ Only Begotten “ son. This phrase “ Only Begotten “ son is used through the Old and New Testament many times and it is very important when someone has an “ Only Begotten “ child, to make it very clear in the Bible history. - This term “ Only Begotten “ - Means --- = an only child “ Only Begotten “ - as The son of God or “ Only Begotten “ child of a man or woman as well. - Yahoshua is never called an “ Only Begotten “ son of Mary and the Bible clearly describes that Yahoshua had other Brothers and Sisters and that Mary THE MOTHER OF YAHOSHUA literally had sons and daughters

Not to ask that polygamy be something that is - of any point of mentioning - other than to show the language structure of the Bible. - was literal polygamy family from Genesis to Revelation. - - But - The “ First Born “ son of Mary in conjunction to the direct clause that a sexual encounter did happen between a man and woman - but there was a “ First Born “ son that prevented the sex and almost prevented the whole marriage. And until that “ First Born “ son was born - Mary did not have sex. Until this time passed… … … .. It is just saying that sex happened and took place and the sexual experiences did not happen until an event happened firstly. The Bible says that Joseph did have sex with Mary - But the sexual encounter was not UNTIL she had borne Her FIRST – born son.
Mat 1:25 And knew her not until she had brought forth her firstborn son:
This Greek word “ until “ is the word G4219 pote / pot'-eh

Until = - Means = At what point in time: - + how long or when. = Or AS SOON OR AS LATER AFTER A TIME OR POINT. - This same exact word is used again and again “ 148 “ times in The New Testament and it always ( ALWAYS ) is used in the context as we see here below in these two other examples.

Mat 2:13 Mary and Joseph were to flee into Egypt, and be thou there “ until “ I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him.

Mat 1:17 from David “ until “ the carrying away into Babylon ... and from the carrying away into Babylon “ until “ Christ are fourteen generations.

Such as here in - Mar 9:19 He answereth him, and saith, O faithless generation, “ how long “ shall I be with you? - It is the same “ HOW LONG “ - “ until “ time / word - . That tells of events of circumstances and UNTIL lets the reader know that something is on hold UNTIL a certain time or event is complete or carried out. The sexual event happened, The Bible conveys the sexual experience, saying that Joseph Knew Mary Sexually, BUT - NOT - “ UNTIL “ = “ how long “ - “ until “
- .
The most solid proof out of all other passages is found here in Joh_7:3 - His brothers said unto him, Depart from here, and go into Judaea so that your disciples also can see the works that You do. And verse 5 says that Yahoshua’ s very own brothers at / in HIS HOME WHERE HE LIVED did not even believe in him.
Here, His own brothers are telling Him to leave His home in Galilee, and to go into Judaea and show His miracles to His disciples / - The Bible continually makes a distinction The Disciples and Apostles and - blood brothers all in the same verses together - whenever / anytime they are mentioned in the same verse. The Bible leads one to understand that Yahoshua had brothers and sisters and that Mary had Children and that Mary did have a “ FIRST BORN “ son and did have sex not until after Her “ FIRST BORN “ was born. Anytime the word “ FIRST BORN “ was used - it always means that the “ FIRST BORN “ is first as there is a second or a third or more.

The NT Bible does have a Greek word for cousins and kinfolk and uses these words consistently and accurately - around 40 times -kinfolk, cousins and relatives but whenever they were brothers would always be called Cousins or kinfolk of someone - if this was the case. but they were called brothers of Yahoshua. And there is a lot of consistency of continual mentioning the brothers and sisters of Yahoshua who were His Bothers and Sisters. Only John is a COUSIN and the Greek uses the Greek word cousin to describe John as Yahoshua's literal cousin. Never are these other brothers and sisters said to be cousins or any other kinfolk or relatives of Yahoshua.

The Bible continually makes a distinction The Disciples and Apostles and - blood brothers - in the same verses together ....

The Bible truly leads one to understand that Mary had a “ FIRST BORN “ son and that she did have sex with her husband and did not have sex until after the first born son was born. This is all what we really know for sure - and it calls mentions to the fact that Yahoshua had brothers and sisters. A first - born son is not an only son,. and not having sex until the birth of the first - born - is not saying that a virgin remains a virgin - but that there was a second son and after His birth there was sexual intercourse and a marriage did take place This is what The Bible leads one to believe.

 

[ding]

In the world, we can see a fervent goal of reaching a consensus between different churches and revival movements through ecumenism. The Roman Catholic Church is involved in ecumenism, and many people are not familiar with the Catholic doctrine. The Catholic "gospel" is a false one, and the Catholic Church does not represent Biblical Christian faith. The late bishop Alphonsus Liguiri, the author of a very well-known book titled "The Glories of Mary", writes in the book that Mary's intercessions are absolutely necessary for salvation, and that Mary, being the mother of God, is omnipotent and can save sinners.

Catholic News Service posted a piece on June 4, 2015, stating that the sitting Pope, Francis, has just recently read The Glories of Mary. Francis says that he enjoyed the book because all chapters of the book show how Mary always leads us to Jesus Christ. The Catholic News Service says that the pope gives praise for the book. Pope Francis did not reject and revoke any of the Mary doctrines in the book, which means that the Pope approves of the book's unbiblical Mary teachings that mock God. If the book's Mary doctrines were contrary to the official Catholic doctrine, Francis should absolutely have pointed that out, but he did not, and gave praise to the book instead. The Pope's attitude and words of praise confirm that the Catholic Church continues to worship Mary. If someone still wants to disagree, he or she has not learned to read, is incapable of understanding written text or information that he or she has heard, or is blinded by the lie and is a liar.

More info: Catholic Church Mary intercession omnipotent save sinners

What does the Catechism say?

 

[ding]

I do not believe St. Mary's "intercession" is necessary.

She is a very treasured and revered saint however.

And the mother of the church.

 

[ding]

Hello everyone.

Years ago. I discussed the subject about Mother Mary with a very nice Roman Catholic woman - and she was explaining The Catholic position about Mary.

We talked for a while and she brought up a verse about Mary - taken from the book of Luke. - She was saying that here in = Luke 2:41-51, when Yahoshua went to the temple at the age of 12, there is no mention of other children in his family.

But I tried to explain this very kind lady the fact that Yahoshua’s brothers and sisters may not have even been born yet and certainly not old enough to travel the really long distance that took days to travel - to attend the feast that lasted up to a full week in another city. This was at least 40 miles from Bethlehem and 100 miles from Galilee - Then, during the feast, Mary had to go searching for three or four whole days - searching - through the streets and crowds throughout Jerusalem in a panicked search to find Yahoshua. For three whole days,

Plus - - Even before she began the three or four-day search in Jerusalem - she had already left Jerusalem and had traveled a whole days journey to go back to her home that was anywhere from 40 - 100 miles away. AND was thinking Yahoshua had left with them and was among them but was with others in the big crowd of other distant family,. kinsfolk / other relatives and acquaintances

If Mary had actually brought along all of her little children to make this long journey to feast in Jerusalem and spent a week there and then left Jerusalem and went a days journey out / away from Jerusalem and suddenly - She and Joseph - TURNED BACK and went a days journey - back to Jerusalem - after finding that Yahoshua had been seen or found by all of her kinsfolk / other relatives and acquaintances - This was out just a single days journey from Jerusalem but a few days of traveling back to Galilee or Bethlehem where she lived,...

But - Jesus was not found..............

Here are the details of the story..
-
Luk 2:44 But they, supposing him to have been in the company, went a day's journey; and they sought him among their kinsfolk and acquaintance.
:45 And when they found him not, they turned back again to Jerusalem, seeking him.
:46 And it came to pass, that after three days ( LOOKING ) they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions. ......... . :48 . . . and his mother said unto him, .............. thy father and I have sought thee sorrowing.

mary did not mention that everyone in the family was looking for Yahoshua - but that Her and Joseph were the ones who had been looking for Him.

By this time - why would Mary want to drag along all of Her younger aged little children back to Jerusalem - if she had she could simply leave with safely with Her other kinsfolk / other relatives - out away from Jerusalem. Why drag them all the way back to Jerusalem where they spent the next three whole days frantically looking for their missing child. ? -

searching for Yahoshua - who left His mother's side and wandered into the temple. Is there any wonder or question why a handful of the rest of her other little babies and children would not manage to make it to the temple. it would be next to impossible for this to happen - to somehow - especially after three days of looking, to bring all of Her little children and they all meet in the synagog and / or for to even mention them in the first thing that she says to her lost child.

Verse 48 His mother said unto him, .... thy father and I have sought thee sorrowing.

But after I explained all of this to my Catholic friend - I also - tried to explain that after, Yahoshua was fully grown here in - Mar 6: 2 - 4 - - it does mention that His sisters were present - with Him in the synagogue in Galilee or Bethlehem - where He and His family lived..

Here in - Mar 6: 2 - 4 . . . Yahoshua was an adult - teaching in the synagogue - Soon thereafter the people in the synagogue begin to list the family members of Yahoshua, saying - - :3 Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and Juda, and Simon? and are not his sisters here with us ? And offended in him.

This verse is literally saying that His little sisters were reasonably embarrassed or uncomfortable for being called and openly mentioned in the synagogue as their brother completely caused every eye there to be directed at them..... And they, His sisters were " at that moment " being accused of being offended and displeased in Yahoshua - as the people in the temple attempted to dishonor, discredit and scandalize and make an offense - of His words, miracles and teachings, and entire ministry.

Also - If one was to pay close attention to what the people in the synagogue were saying, they clearly are not saying that Mary His mother and James, Joses, and Juda His brothers were there and present there in the synagogue that day. The people only accused - that His sisters ( Of all of His Family members ) were there and present that day and that they ( HIS SISTERS ) were “scandalize” and offended directly in or by Yahoshua. - The Greek word is “ IN “ = G1722 - ἐν - en / en - “ IN “ Meaning = (in place, time or state), “in by, etc.: - about, after, among, as, by (+ all means), for (. . . sake of), + (because) of, (-in - they were said to be offended in Him. - And after, Yahoshua was fully grown here in Mat_13:54 - 58 - - it does mention that His sisters were present - with Him in as He addressed the crowds. And again - Again this same exact thing happens in - Mat 13:55 as Yahoshua was teaching before the multitudes of people .

Mat 13:55 - is not his mother called Mary? and his brethren, James, and Joses, and Simon, and Judas?
Mat 13:56 And his sisters, are they not all with us?
Mat 13:57 And they ( His family ) were offended in him. But Jesus said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, except in his own country, and in his “ own house.”

As I was reading further Mar 6:4 .... Yahoshua said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, but in his own country, and among his own kin, and in his own house.

Here Yahoshua was admitting to them that - IN - His own family, His own household, among His own relatives and Mother, Father and family - He was without any honor ( AS A PROPHETIC FIGURE OR A RELIGIOUS LEADER ) - If these sisters were His cousins - the Greek language had a word for “ COUSIN “ And - anytime a cousin was mentioned in The New Testament - they always used the word cousin.
G4773 - - suggenēs - soong-ghen-ace'
A close relative (by blood); cousin, kin.
These sisters were not cousins or kin to Yahoshua - they were said to be His sisters.

Please remember that Yahoshua’s family and Abraham’s Family were very polygamous people. In fact the normal and standard family in The Bible were polygamous families.
The Greek language, however, is very different - - there is a Greek word used for Cousin - - BUT - in Hebrew - there was no literal word meaning a cousin – because in a normal polygamy situation of Gods people it would be a polygamy setting - where a Cousin would also be a Brother or a Sister - also - the many, many numerous Uncles and Aunts stemming from a single man marrying many wives - would be very high.
A typical Biblical child whose father had 8 wives - could easily have more than 30 to 60 aunts and uncles.

Also - The “ LANGUAGE STRUCTURE “ of the entire Hebrew culture was spoken and written to support polygamy. in the way that described the Godly, moral, holy and clean family structure.. - Cousins and Nieces were also often Brother and Sister - As Abraham and Sarah were brother and sister and also cousins at the same time.

And – remember - Uncle and Aunt in-laws were very numerous in a polygamous family structure because the many wives of the man, were all many uncle and aunt in laws to the children. - The authors of The Old Testament simply wrote out the description - as we see here in these following verses.

Lev 25:49 his uncle's son .
Jer 32:8 mine uncle's.
Jer 32:9 my uncle's son.
Jer 32:12 mine uncle's son.
Lev 20:20 his uncle's wife.
Est 2:7 Esther, his uncle's daughter.

But, there was no other word in the Hebrew at that time to say “ Cousin “ therefore the word brother and sister would apply to a wide variety of family members, as they were very closely related by blood. - -But in The Greek Language as we see here in these following verse - the Greek language did include the word “ Cousin “ - to differentiate and make the distinction and difference between a “ BROTHER “ - a “ COUSIN “ and a friend or relative.

The Hebrew language did not include the words cousin and niece and the term brother could even be applied to any number of males - who were closely related in the polygamous family even if they were cousins. - Even if they were second cousins - The Grandfather in polygamous marriage created many brothers and sisters who were second and third generation and still called one another brother – with the same grandfather.

Also, If You read a little more of the actual words of The Bible, as it completes and explains that Yahoshua had brothers and sisters. –
We find that the Bible would have stated that Yahoshua was Mary’ s “ Only Begotten “ son. This phrase “ Only Begotten “ son is used through the Old and New Testament many times and it is very important when someone has an “ Only Begotten “ child, to make it very clear in the Bible history. - This term “ Only Begotten “ - Means --- = an only child “ Only Begotten “ - as The son of God or “ Only Begotten “ child of a man or woman as well. - Yahoshua is never called an “ Only Begotten “ son of Mary and the Bible clearly describes that Yahoshua had other Brothers and Sisters and that Mary THE MOTHER OF YAHOSHUA literally had sons and daughters

Not to ask that polygamy be something that is - of any point of mentioning - other than to show the language structure of the Bible. - was literal polygamy family from Genesis to Revelation. - - But - The “ First Born “ son of Mary in conjunction to the direct clause that a sexual encounter did happen between a man and woman - but there was a “ First Born “ son that prevented the sex and almost prevented the whole marriage. And until that “ First Born “ son was born - Mary did not have sex. Until this time passed… … … .. It is just saying that sex happened and took place and the sexual experiences did not happen until an event happened firstly. The Bible says that Joseph did have sex with Mary - But the sexual encounter was not UNTIL she had borne Her FIRST – born son.
Mat 1:25 And knew her not until she had brought forth her firstborn son:
This Greek word “ until “ is the word G4219 pote / pot'-eh

Until = - Means = At what point in time: - + how long or when. = Or AS SOON OR AS LATER AFTER A TIME OR POINT. - This same exact word is used again and again “ 148 “ times in The New Testament and it always ( ALWAYS ) is used in the context as we see here below in these two other examples.

Mat 2:13 Mary and Joseph were to flee into Egypt, and be thou there “ until “ I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him.

Mat 1:17 from David “ until “ the carrying away into Babylon ... and from the carrying away into Babylon “ until “ Christ are fourteen generations.

Such as here in - Mar 9:19 He answereth him, and saith, O faithless generation, “ how long “ shall I be with you? - It is the same “ HOW LONG “ - “ until “ time / word - . That tells of events of circumstances and UNTIL lets the reader know that something is on hold UNTIL a certain time or event is complete or carried out. The sexual event happened, The Bible conveys the sexual experience, saying that Joseph Knew Mary Sexually, BUT - NOT - “ UNTIL “ = “ how long “ - “ until “
- .
The most solid proof out of all other passages is found here in Joh_7:3 - His brothers said unto him, Depart from here, and go into Judaea so that your disciples also can see the works that You do. And verse 5 says that Yahoshua’ s very own brothers at / in HIS HOME WHERE HE LIVED did not even believe in him.
Here, His own brothers are telling Him to leave His home in Galilee, and to go into Judaea and show His miracles to His disciples / - The Bible continually makes a distinction The Disciples and Apostles and - blood brothers all in the same verses together - whenever / anytime they are mentioned in the same verse. The Bible leads one to understand that Yahoshua had brothers and sisters and that Mary had Children and that Mary did have a “ FIRST BORN “ son and did have sex not until after Her “ FIRST BORN “ was born. Anytime the word “ FIRST BORN “ was used - it always means that the “ FIRST BORN “ is first as there is a second or a third or more.

The NT Bible does have a Greek word for cousins and kinfolk and uses these words consistently and acuratly - around 40 times -kinfolk, cousins and relatives whenever but therse brothers would always be called Cousins or kinfolk of someone - if this was trhe case. but they were called brothers of Yahoshua.

The Bible continually makes a distinction The Disciples and Apostles and - blood brothers - in the same verses together ....

The Bible truly leads one to understand that Mary had a “ FIRST BORN “ son and that she did have sex with her husband and did not have sex until after the first born son was born. This is all what we really know for sure - and it calls mentions to the fact that Yahoshua had brothers and sisters. A first - born son is not an only son,. and not having sex until the birth of the first - born - is not saying that a virgin remains a virgin - but that there was a second son and after His birth there was sexual intercourse and a marriage did take place This is what The Bible leads one to believe.

You should read the Catechism.

Catechism of the Catholic Church - Mary - Mother of Christ, Mother of the Church

 

[seaofnails]

.
Yes, Thank You so much for sharing this Catechism - about Socialism. And thank You for responding- very kind of You to take time to reply.

Although I did not find this material on the webpage that You posted - ill take Your word for it. Let's both accept that this is in the Catechism and just buried deeper in the site and is on another page of the Vatican website.

However, the Socialist and Communist governments had been fighting against one another as The Vatican and The Soviet Union were in a political war against one another in WWll. This was they were fighting over - - who would control the Socialist System,. The Pope and The Vatican system - they are ok with socialism just as long as they are the ones on the top of the Socialist Government Structure. If they are not - then they vilify and dethrone it and destroy it - in order to take control of it and get back to the top. The Catholic Church is pure Socialism.

This will take a long time to explain - But - Hitler used the Idea of Socialism to get the Vatican and Roman Catholic support and they voted for Him in a majority because of the Vatican Support - and the Catholic Center Political In Germany was given the order and go ahead to vote Hitler into power. Hitler and the Nazis called themselves AS a full National Socialism and as - The National Socialist German Workers' Party

After the collapse of Yugoslavia, located just across The Adriatic sea, the Nazis installed a puppet regime in Croatia headed by Ante Pavelic, a Roman Catholic terrorist - on April 11, 1941, the Nazis installed a puppet regime in Croatia headed by Ante Pavelic, a Roman Catholic terrorist who led the Cclero - Fascist Ustasha movement. Pavelic and his followers had been in exile in Italy under the protection of Mussolini and was wanted in both France and Yugoslavia for orchestrating the assassination of King Alexander of Yugoslavia and French Foreign Minister Louis Barthou.

Ante Pavelić, was head of the Ustaša, The Catholic Ustasha dictated to solidify their control through - forced religious conversions, expulsion, and extermination - . In the words of the Ustasha Minister of Education and Culture Mile Budak: He stated that " Members of Pavelic's bodyguard swear allegiance unto death to the Croatian leader and receive the church's blessing " - " We have three million bullets. We will kill a part of the Serbs. Others we will deport, and the rest we will force to accept the Roman Catholic Religion. Thus the new Croatia will be rid of all Serbs in its midst in order to be 100% Catholic within 10 years."

These waring Socialist and Communistic government were not always united before WW ll - The world of Socialisms and Communisms were fighting against one another in a bloody battle over whose ideas and who's Government Socialist systems would run the political structure.

There were millions and millions of dollars invested in the Roman Catholic and German socialist government and the Communists would greatly - ( BY LEGAL MEANS ) - influence the Government electoral and business power structure where The Churches business interests existed in Europe and Pope Pius would Fein / Pretend / Make - Believe and convince himself and fantasize and lie and falsely accuse " of " the Communists - that He and His business associates were being physically attacked everywhere that Communism had taken over by political means and the Pope and Catholics and The Roman Catholics - were allowed to be militarily escorted at the borders of The Soviet Union to force their Catholicism and Socialism into The Soviet Union - by violent bloody force - trying to destroy the business and Socialism / Comunism of The Soviet Union,

Even here in The USA - The Catholic Voters and the Vatican - are joined and connected and in unison with the Democrat Socialist Liberal Politicians here in the USA.

The majority VOTE for Socialism - just like they voted for Hitler in Germany. And The fact is - The Roman Catholic Church Leadership always worked to even promote the type of leaders even if they murder Children and Babies

Such as the Democrat Political leaders here in America. - The Popes displeasure and dissatisfaction with Donald Trump’s election is obvious, the Pope would rather have placed Hillary Clinton or Bernie Sanders or even ( again ) Oboma into the White House.

Today Pope Francis Pope Francis;'s SOCIALISM IDEA is to make demands that President Trump should expand his definition of 'pro-life' to include protecting all DACA recipients.

But He was never concerned publicly to ask Oboma to stop killing new - born children.

Today Pope Francis is LITERALLY { COMPARING THE ENTIRE SUBJECT OF ABORTION - TO TRUMP'S IMMIGRATION POLICY }

Although many in the minority portion of The Roman Catholic Church are not this way, this is such a perversity and truly evil mentality - The Entire Catholic Leadership Organization seems to support the likes of the people such as King Herod in The New Testament.
Please read the story of the Child Murderer “ King Herod “ here in Mat 2:8 King Herod sent them to Bethlehem, and said, Go and search diligently for the young child; and when ye have found him, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also.
And here in verse - 16. - 16 Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked of the wise men, was exceeding wroth, and sent forth, and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem, and in all the coasts thereof, from two years old and under, according to the time which he had diligently enquired of the wise men.

King Herod - here reminds me of exactly how the Popes and Catholic Political SOCIALISM Organizations behaves - they pretend to have interest in worshiping good and in Biblical things concerning God - just as King Herod did in verse 8 . - King Herod wanted to get close to Yahoshua so that he could manipulate and control the situation before He became popular and began to threaten His business and power structure and dominance. - But when things did not go His way and He at the moment that had absolutely no control, no way to control the situation, He immediately turned to murder and to the killing of thousands of innocent babies.

The Pope and Vatican may pretend to distance themselves from their blatant and outright Socialist IDEOLOGY while seeking to demonize Donald Trump by comparing His stand on border security as somehow the same evil and murderous acts of abortion. When Donald Trump doing everything He can to protect babies and stop late term abortion. Donald Trump is working with Congress to get a bill approved for a ban on abortion after 20 weeks of pregnancy. But the Pope has never once made a single public comment about Barak Oboma and His complete and total murderous acts of killing little children just before they are to be born.

The Pope harps and drivels and rambles on and on about contraceptives while He tries to derail and dethrone Republican politicians who are doing everything in their power to prevent the murdering of babies.

The Pope deliberately and deceitfully works against the American progress and only process that could possibly ever stop partial birth abortion - and what is takes by electing Republican politicians who place the right Republican judges and legislative representatives in the elections - who can do something about it. – while, demonizing them all and comparing them to child murders and infant killers. For not accepting illegal aliens as citizens. - - This is exactly what King Herod did in the example of His own politics - and Catholics work with The Pope and Democrat voter - in making sure that this always happens. - it is all about them and their lusts, their desires, their wants, their fantasies and pleasures and their worship of sex - like a supreme Lord God of delights and orgasms that I am expected to government- ly fund.

The Vatican is a State even a mini country - with borders, walls and locks and armed guards.
Like a mega banking system worldwide with organizations and enterprise and business in every continent, You do not need necessarily to travel all the way to Italy to deal with the Vatican unless You want to see the Pontiff who is a spokesperson.
You or I may be dealing with the Vatican bank and business system here in the United States and we would never know it. it is blended into the CIA, FBI, Military and Government systems and embedded even in our Bible Translations in our very homes. Even Television Shows, Commercials and Moves that we watch have dealings with the Vatican banking system.
The Vatican's wealth can find hundreds of millions of euros that they do not even use. and off its central balance sheet. The Vatican Bank has $8 billion in assets. The Vatican has big investments in banking, insurance, chemicals, steel, construction, real estate. Dividends help pay for Vatican expenses and charities such as assisting 1,500,000 children and providing some measure of food and clothing to 7,000,000 needy Italians. And The Vatican receives tax credits in every major country. Just in the last couple of years, the Italian Government has make a public show to state that they would ask the Vatican to start paying taxes. Because they have not paid full taxes for the last 2000 years.. But do pay some taxes where it applies. The Vatican is a socialist system that embeds itself into governments around the world and it does do a lot of good things to help millions of people, however being a social services organization is not the same as giving Your own money to help anyone - and then returning back to Your job and suffering a loss by the donations and giving's that You have given freely. The Vatican gets their money back and keeps growing as they continue to grow in wealth and riches and have been running the same system for hundreds of years.

THIS IS THE ONLY SOCIALISM THAT THE VATICAN WILL EVER ACCEPT . . . . .

The Article 13 of the Reichskonkordat between Nazi Germany ( Hitler ) and the Vatican, Hitler guaranteed in His contract with the Vatican - that the right of the Catholic Church to levy taxes would be guaranteed in Germany - And Hitler also guaranteed that the Catholic Church would not be held responsible for debts to German businesses. ( Concerning Vatican Properties and accounts. )

They wanted to be treated like German Government Officials on the payroll of the taxpayers. No debts, No Fees, and no reimbursements for failed and collapsed businesses would be allowed to seize Catholic / Vatican Socialist Government Properties to be reimbursed.

An eternal Socialist state and condition Catholic debt - that can only be collected and - only - be Re - Paid by the taxpayers - to flow to the hands of other taxpayers - who the Vatican may owe to. This is THE ONLY Socialism that the VATICAN WILL EVER SUPPORT - and Hitler gave the Vatican the only Socialism that it considers Holy, Sacred, Godly and Devine, and the only Socialism that it will ever find acceptable and they wrapped their strumpet arms around the Nazi Party and placed the keys of the Church into Hitler's hand ....

All other forms of Socialism and Communism are to be De-Throned, Vilified, Manipulated, Cheated and Forced to repay the Catholic Church for any Aid, any Help any Services any Supplies and any Charities that the Catholic Church dispenses to the masses. Their only goal is to embed themselves into every government on earth and EXIST as a SOCIALIST - Government Funded Agency that is legally guaranteed that the Catholic Church would not be held responsible for debts to any Non - Catholic businesses. ( Concerning Vatican Properties and accounts. ) and that - the right of the Catholic Church to receive tax credits for their social services and properties in SOCIALIST SOCIAL SERVICE - SISPENSATIONS // DISPENSATIONS.

Hitler gave Pope Pius everything He wanted to place every single Catholic Bishop and Priest into the Socialist Service and to be treated like a government worker. And Pope Pius placed the keys of the Church into His evil hand. Pope Pius wrote in His Vatican newspaper L’Osservatore Romano, that The Reichskonkordat a triumph for the Code of Canon Law....

The Canon Law is a rule book, a code of laws that are within the jurisdiction of the Church, that dictates many things such as - like ----- who may or may not marry and The Vatican never marries anyone - they simply strumpet and strip tease their way into every Socialist Government System that is looking for a political and spiritual Socialist shrew to be embedded into their Socialist Government system.