Education Dept. : BDS activity against Israel will be defined as anti-Semitism

Discussion in 'Israel and Palestine' started by rylah, Sep 12, 2018.

  1. Shusha
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    Shusha Gold Member

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    If you have examples of me doing any of those things, please provide and I will address.

    Since you have already provided one, I will address it here and now. I do not claim that anyone opposing the actions of Israel's government hates the Jewish people. I very clearly distinguish between valid and real criticism of Israel's government policies and generalized hate speech toward Israel and the Jewish people.

    For example, claiming that Gaza is equivalent to the Warsaw Ghetto is not a valid criticism of Israel's government policy. Wanna know how I know? It doesn't provide Israel's government policy. Claiming Gaza is equivalent to the Warsaw Ghetto is grossly ignorant of the reasons for and the conditions of the particular event. Wanna know how I know? Because I've researched it and understand the facts. Claiming that Gaza is equivalent to the Warsaw Ghetto is demonizing. It is an emotional appeal. And it subverts an atrocity. Wanna know how I know? Because there is no space in that statement to provide objective and researched facts. Its hate speech pure and simple.

    In contrast, you mentioned the destruction of the homes of terrorists by Israel. That IS valid criticism of Israel's government policy. It labels a specific policy. It leaves space for discussion centered around facts and objective analysis. (Btw, I agree with you this policy is unacceptable and I condemn it).
     
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  2. BlackFlag
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    BlackFlag I haz hoisted it!

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    LOLOL

    You don’t even have any idea why that’s funny, do you
     
  3. Sixties Fan
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    Sixties Fan Platinum Member

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    The people who governed the Land of Israel, for 700 years, were the Turks. Are you telling us that the Turks have the right to the Land of Israel and any and all land they used to govern over, OVER the indigenous people of any of those territories?

    You continue to not know what you are talking about.
     
  4. AzogtheDefiler
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    AzogtheDefiler VIP Member Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    It wasn't meant to be funny. Muslims were conquered, time to go. Only thing funny about you is your stupid face.
     
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  5. Shusha
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    Shusha Gold Member

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    Um. You DO know that Israel HAS agreements with her neighbors, right?

    Now you seem to be saying that no one has the right to national self-determination. [/quote]

    Okay. So Palestine can't just declare a country where Israelis live. Because that would be taking land away from others. Right.

    And now you are saying the rights of peoples to self-determination arise from their ability to conquer, hold and defend territory. You are all over the place. Which is it?
     
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  6. BlackFlag
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    BlackFlag I haz hoisted it!

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    I don’t know about the warsaw ghetto and never made that comparison. I’m just a typical person and when I see “Israel attacks Gaza after rockets fired” I think “oh yeah that’s a good idea they need to defend themselves.” Then when I see “Israel has 10+ year land and air embargo of Gaza” I think “wow if I were in Gaza that would really piss me off.”

    I weigh all the information I see from both sides and my conclusion is that Israel has all the power in this debate, they are not interested in Palestinian concerns because they don’t need to be, there are thousands of years of religious dogma infecting the issue, and at the end of the day one group suffers and another prospers. This happens in many places around the world, but for some reason as an American I’m supposed to champion Israel when I think so many of their problems are of their own making and that they are at least as guilty of any wrongs as those who call themselves Palestinian.

    That is how many (I suspect most) people in the world feel about the issue. Then the side with all the power comes out totally unnecessarily to say only Jewish people have a right to self-determination there? That same year they declare the basic demand for peace terms of East Jerusalem to be dismissed, to hell with the weaker party? They celebrate aid cuts to Palestine? And the illegal settlements, the over the top military responses, Netanyahu warning that Arabs are voting so Jews need to drown those votes out, etc. How do you think any of that will change my mind? Am I anti-semitic for not liking that, despite pretty fiercely defending and voting for Jewish people here in the U.S.?
     
  7. Shusha
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    Shusha Gold Member

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    The point I am trying to make, in the context of this thread, is that solutions to the problem can not be found when we use hate speech rather than discussing actual policies. It not only useless in finding solutions -- it damages the process.

    Agree or disagree?

    No one should be given a PASS on using hate speech.

    (And, btw, I disagree that Israel has all the power. The March of Return is proof enough of that.)
     
  8. Shusha
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    Shusha Gold Member

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    Its interesting you think it is permissible for Israel to defend herself using military strategy and yet are "pissed off" when they use non-military tactics like an embargo. Those are both defense mechanisms. Against the problem. Which is that the government of Gaza keeps attacking Israel.

    Israel's goal with Gaza is, and has always been, to defend herself against attacks from Gaza. The solution to the problem isn't complicated. Just. Stop. Attacking. Your. Neighbor.
     
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  9. BlackFlag
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    BlackFlag I haz hoisted it!

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    I’d say agree except if the palestinians that are angry enough at Israel to use hate speech were made to stop using hate speech, I doubt it would change a single thing. I think the most likely thing that would do is convince Israel that the Palestinian movement was drying up and inspire them to accelerate settlement building and other counterproductive activities that disregard any peace process.
     
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  10. BlackFlag
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    BlackFlag I haz hoisted it!

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    The cycle was going on long before the current government in Gaza was in power. You cannot tell an oppressed people to just suck it up and accept it. That’s how you get decades of violence like has happened there and will continue to happen there.
     
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