Developing Flint news

[pwjohn]

So firing the Fire Chief and Police Chief is going to fix the water problem? Why did she not fire the Water department chief?

Flint water supervisor warned state of problems before switch to river

Flint water supervisor warned state of problems before switch to river

The state did not make them switch, the Flint City Council voted to do it 7-1.

I don't believe you

 

[saveliberty]

Flint's massive water poisoning all started with an innocent-enough vote at city council.

I don't care what you feel, facts are facts.

 

[eagle1462010]

ASCE | 2013 Report Card for America's Infrastructure

Nearly 170,000 public drinking water systems are located across the United States. Of these, 54,000 are community water systems that collectively serve more than 264 million people.

It is estimated that more than one million miles of water mains are in place in the United States. The conditions of many of these pipes are unknown, as they are buried underground out of sight, and owned and operated by various local entities. Some pipes date back to the Civil War era and often are not examined until there is a problem or a water main break. These breaks are becoming more common, as there are an estimated 240,000 water main breaks per year in the United States.

The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) estimates that approximately 4,000 to 5,000 miles of drinking water mains are replaced annually. The annual replacement rate is projected to peak around 2035 at 16,000 to 20,000 miles of aging pipe replaced each year. Meanwhile, pipes installed during the middle of the 20th century are likely to begin to fail in large numbers.

And, .....?

Q. What is the solution you see to what is a serious problem

A. My answer is for the Congress to act and to create a "Marshall Plan", to renew, replace, repair our aging infrastructure. It will create long term jobs and will bolster our economy, especially if contracts are directed to American businesses and industries, and grades 13 & 14 are added to our public education focused on the skills necessary for such an effort.

I suggested that when there was massive bailout money going out...........but alas it was fucking wasted on pet political projects like solar energy and choo choo trains...........................

Why would I now agree to give them more money so they can put it in their buddies pockets............................

Yeah, it needs to be fixed and needs to be fixed at STATE LEVELS.................

 

[bullwinkle]

"The final decision to use the Flint River as an interim source rather than Detroit appears to have been made by the EFM (at this time, Darnell Earley. He claims the decision was made by the state; former Mayor Walling says it was made by Earley). Earley note at the time that it would save Flint $12 million over the two years of the contract. Not much of a bargain in hindsight, but nobody had foreknowledge of the screw-up and cover-up to come".

Once again, The Governor of a State has a duty to protect its residents. The buck stopped on the desk of the Governor.

The water authority there said they could properly treat the water.
Your decision makes no account to the blatant black mail by Detroit.
The Cover up involved all in the process.

And you only want one head because you play politics with it.

Eagle, the Flint Water Authority was against this switch from the gitgo, and said so. The below is part of an article about the released Snyder Emails: (Maybe this is why he wasn't fired)

""I have people above me making plans to distribute water ASAP," Laboratory & Water Quality Supervisor Mike Glasgow said in an email to the state Department of Environmental Quality on April 17, 2014.

The email was among more than 20,000 pages of documents related to Flint's water crisis and released today, Feb. 12, by Gov. Rick Snyder.

"I was reluctant before, but after looking at the monitoring schedule and our current staffing, I do not anticipate giving the OK to begin sending water out anytime soon," Glasgow's email says. "If water is distributed from this plant in the next couple weeks, it will be against my direction.

"I need time to adequately train additional staff and to update our monitoring plans before I will feel we are ready. I will reiterate this to management above me, but they seem to have their own agenda."

Eight days after Glascow wrote the email to Adam Rosenthal, Mike Prysby and Stephen Busch, officials at the DEQ, former mayor Dayne Walling turned off the flow of water from Detroit and water plant workers started treating and pumping Flint River water for the first time in nearly 50 years.""

 

[eagle1462010]

"The final decision to use the Flint River as an interim source rather than Detroit appears to have been made by the EFM (at this time, Darnell Earley. He claims the decision was made by the state; former Mayor Walling says it was made by Earley). Earley note at the time that it would save Flint $12 million over the two years of the contract. Not much of a bargain in hindsight, but nobody had foreknowledge of the screw-up and cover-up to come".

Once again, The Governor of a State has a duty to protect its residents. The buck stopped on the desk of the Governor.

The water authority there said they could properly treat the water.
Your decision makes no account to the blatant black mail by Detroit.
The Cover up involved all in the process.

And you only want one head because you play politics with it.

Eagle, the Flint Water Authority was against this switch from the gitgo, and said so. The below is part of an article about the released Snyder Emails: (Maybe this is why he wasn't fired)

""I have people above me making plans to distribute water ASAP," Laboratory & Water Quality Supervisor Mike Glasgow said in an email to the state Department of Environmental Quality on April 17, 2014.

The email was among more than 20,000 pages of documents related to Flint's water crisis and released today, Feb. 12, by Gov. Rick Snyder.

"I was reluctant before, but after looking at the monitoring schedule and our current staffing, I do not anticipate giving the OK to begin sending water out anytime soon," Glasgow's email says. "If water is distributed from this plant in the next couple weeks, it will be against my direction.

"I need time to adequately train additional staff and to update our monitoring plans before I will feel we are ready. I will reiterate this to management above me, but they seem to have their own agenda."

Eight days after Glascow wrote the email to Adam Rosenthal, Mike Prysby and Stephen Busch, officials at the DEQ, former mayor Dayne Walling turned off the flow of water from Detroit and water plant workers started treating and pumping Flint River water for the first time in nearly 50 years.""

I would have to find them but other articles said they had used the Flint River as a temporary source during outages before........................

There are a butt ass load of articles out there..............all for damage control............bottom line...........It was not properly treated.............and Detroit black mailed them.....................

Had they hired a crew of GOOD CHEMIST for the final treatment I don't think we'd even be talking about this now.

 

[bullwinkle]

"The final decision to use the Flint River as an interim source rather than Detroit appears to have been made by the EFM (at this time, Darnell Earley. He claims the decision was made by the state; former Mayor Walling says it was made by Earley). Earley note at the time that it would save Flint $12 million over the two years of the contract. Not much of a bargain in hindsight, but nobody had foreknowledge of the screw-up and cover-up to come".

Once again, The Governor of a State has a duty to protect its residents. The buck stopped on the desk of the Governor.

The water authority there said they could properly treat the water.
Your decision makes no account to the blatant black mail by Detroit.
The Cover up involved all in the process.

And you only want one head because you play politics with it.

Eagle, the Flint Water Authority was against this switch from the gitgo, and said so. The below is part of an article about the released Snyder Emails: (Maybe this is why he wasn't fired)

""I have people above me making plans to distribute water ASAP," Laboratory & Water Quality Supervisor Mike Glasgow said in an email to the state Department of Environmental Quality on April 17, 2014.

The email was among more than 20,000 pages of documents related to Flint's water crisis and released today, Feb. 12, by Gov. Rick Snyder.

"I was reluctant before, but after looking at the monitoring schedule and our current staffing, I do not anticipate giving the OK to begin sending water out anytime soon," Glasgow's email says. "If water is distributed from this plant in the next couple weeks, it will be against my direction.

"I need time to adequately train additional staff and to update our monitoring plans before I will feel we are ready. I will reiterate this to management above me, but they seem to have their own agenda."

Eight days after Glascow wrote the email to Adam Rosenthal, Mike Prysby and Stephen Busch, officials at the DEQ, former mayor Dayne Walling turned off the flow of water from Detroit and water plant workers started treating and pumping Flint River water for the first time in nearly 50 years.""

I would have to find them but other articles said they had used the Flint River as a temporary source during outages before........................

There are a butt ass load of articles out there..............all for damage control............bottom line...........It was not properly treated.............and Detroit black mailed them.....................

Had they hired a crew of GOOD CHEMIST for the final treatment I don't think we'd even be talking about this now.

Eagle, I know my limitations and I am certain your expertise is far above mine on this water issue. However, we have strayed from my original intent of this thread, which is that something is happening. The firing of the Police Chief and Fire Chief and City Admin, I assume, is beyond the water crisis which is primary for now. But crime and arsons and misuse of funds are also an issue and the fat-cats are feeling the pain. The City has lost a couple of outrageous lawsuits that shouldn't have been lost and placed on the taxpayers, and rubbed in that the scammers who won did so because of poor representation by City attorneys. Now it looks like there is action on the water crisis in the form of help replacing infrastructure, AND an added benefit of taking back streets and parks too. My family there is ecstatic! I should also add that I love that old town of my youth and prime.

 

[eagle1462010]

FYI article on why the decision was made.........

ftp://cityofswartzcreek.org/2010%20Full%20Council%20Packets/2010-May-24%20Mtg,%20Budget%20-%20Karegnondi%20Report/May%2024%20Mtg,%20Karegnondi%20Water%20Line%20Engineering%20Study.pdf

Go to page 11 1st..............just to show the cost of water by staying on Detroit water......versus the new pipeline

This article is the engineering report used to decide to build the new pipelines.............It was not just about Flint either............It would also get cheaper water to other counties other than Flint.......

In this article, in order to stay with Detroit Water....Flint was required to pay for new piping systems and upgrades to a tune of..................346 Million........see page 8

 

[eagle1462010]

Flint to spend $171,000 for engineering to treat Flint River water while KWA pipeline is built

Flint currently gets its water from Detroit and Flint's water plant has been used as an emergency backup if there was an interruption in service from Detroit.

"The engineering work they're looking at involves potentially using the river on a continuing basis," said Steve Busch, a district supervisor with the Michigan Department of Environmental Quality. "I think it's yet to be determined if they would use (the Flint River) as a primary source."

City Spokesman Jason Lorenz said Flint would like to work out an agreement with Detroit to provide water for Flint until KWA's pipeline is built.

"We still believe that going with Detroit for the next two years (while the KWA pipeline is built) is the best option," said Flint Spokesman Jason Lorenz. "We already had to make these upgrades ahead of KWA."

Former emergency manager Ed Kurtz approved the contract in a resolution signed June 26.

"The city of Flint requires professional engineering services for assistance in placing the Flint water plant into operation using the Flint River as a primary drinking water source for approximately two years and then converting to KWA delivered lake water when available," the resolution reads.

http://mediad.publicbroadcasting.ne...ion.pdf?_ga=1.129405580.1036207224.1446746452

The contract............June 2013

 

[eagle1462010]

EPA showing that it was mistreated water..........some of the stuff I've already stated.

http://www.aclumich.org/sites/default/files/Original EPA memo. 062514.pdf

Following a change in the water source, the City of Flint has experienced a number of water quality issues resulting in violations ofNational Primary Drinking Water Regulations (NPDWR) including acute and non-acute Coliform Maximum Contaminant Level (MCL) violations and Total Trihalomethanes (TTHM) MCL violations as follows:
Acute Coliform MCL violation in August 2014
Monthly Coliform MCL violation in August 2014
Monthly Coliform MCL violation in September 2014
Average TTHM MCL violation in December2Al4
Average TTHM MCL violation in June 2015

In addition, as of April30,20l4, when the City of Flint switched from purchasing finished water from the City of Detroit to using the Flint River as their new water source, the City of Flint is no longer providing corrosion control treatment for lead and copper. A major concern from a public health standpoint is the absence of corrosion control treatment in the City of Flint for mitigating lead and copper levels in the drinking water. Recent drinking water sample results indicate the presence of high lead results in thc drinking w&ter, whieh is to be expceted in a publie water system that is not providing Ennoslon e.onuol treatment. The laek of any mltigating treatmcnt tbr leed is of serious ooncem for residents that llve in homes with lead serviee lines or parttal lead service lines, which are corrmon throughout the City of Flint. In addition, following the switch to using the Flint River, the City of Flint began adding fenic chloride, a coagulant used to improve the removal of organic mattor, as part of the strategy to reduce the TTHM levels. Studies have shown that an increase in the chloride-to-sulfate mass ratio in the water can adversely affect lead levels by increasing the galvanic corrosion of lead in the plumbing network.

 

[eagle1462010]

"The final decision to use the Flint River as an interim source rather than Detroit appears to have been made by the EFM (at this time, Darnell Earley. He claims the decision was made by the state; former Mayor Walling says it was made by Earley). Earley note at the time that it would save Flint $12 million over the two years of the contract. Not much of a bargain in hindsight, but nobody had foreknowledge of the screw-up and cover-up to come".

Once again, The Governor of a State has a duty to protect its residents. The buck stopped on the desk of the Governor.

The water authority there said they could properly treat the water.
Your decision makes no account to the blatant black mail by Detroit.
The Cover up involved all in the process.

And you only want one head because you play politics with it.

Eagle, the Flint Water Authority was against this switch from the gitgo, and said so. The below is part of an article about the released Snyder Emails: (Maybe this is why he wasn't fired)

""I have people above me making plans to distribute water ASAP," Laboratory & Water Quality Supervisor Mike Glasgow said in an email to the state Department of Environmental Quality on April 17, 2014.

The email was among more than 20,000 pages of documents related to Flint's water crisis and released today, Feb. 12, by Gov. Rick Snyder.

"I was reluctant before, but after looking at the monitoring schedule and our current staffing, I do not anticipate giving the OK to begin sending water out anytime soon," Glasgow's email says. "If water is distributed from this plant in the next couple weeks, it will be against my direction.

"I need time to adequately train additional staff and to update our monitoring plans before I will feel we are ready. I will reiterate this to management above me, but they seem to have their own agenda."

Eight days after Glascow wrote the email to Adam Rosenthal, Mike Prysby and Stephen Busch, officials at the DEQ, former mayor Dayne Walling turned off the flow of water from Detroit and water plant workers started treating and pumping Flint River water for the first time in nearly 50 years.""

I would have to find them but other articles said they had used the Flint River as a temporary source during outages before........................

There are a butt ass load of articles out there..............all for damage control............bottom line...........It was not properly treated.............and Detroit black mailed them.....................

Had they hired a crew of GOOD CHEMIST for the final treatment I don't think we'd even be talking about this now.

Eagle, I know my limitations and I am certain your expertise is far above mine on this water issue. However, we have strayed from my original intent of this thread, which is that something is happening. The firing of the Police Chief and Fire Chief and City Admin, I assume, is beyond the water crisis which is primary for now. But crime and arsons and misuse of funds are also an issue and the fat-cats are feeling the pain. The City has lost a couple of outrageous lawsuits that shouldn't have been lost and placed on the taxpayers, and rubbed in that the scammers who won did so because of poor representation by City attorneys. Now it looks like there is action on the water crisis in the form of help replacing infrastructure, AND an added benefit of taking back streets and parks too. My family there is ecstatic! I should also add that I love that old town of my youth and prime.

I highly doubt that on the water issue.........I dig on issues when I have the time and have dug into this on earlier threads on this issue................I just dig..............trying to find the answers..............

 

[saveliberty]

The politics played was from Democrats in Flint wanting the Lake Huron 62 mile pipeline. Flint employees do not send emails to the EPA or DEQ without CCing local officials. They probably do not include the governor in that loop, but perhaps state officials.

 

[eagle1462010]

January 2015

https://www.cityofflint.com/wp-content/uploads/CoF-Water-System-FAQ-1-16-2015.pdf

 

[eagle1462010]

The Flint Water Crisis: A Timeline

Timeline from professional magazine on treatment plants.

 

[eagle1462010]

The EPA knew about Flint’s toxic water for months and didn’t tell anyone

As it turns out, people knew about the horrible water situation long before the Governor ever caught wind of it. And when you think of a government agency in the same sentence as a disaster in a water supply, who do you think of first? The Environmental Protection Agency, of course. As The Daily Caller found out, the EPA was looking into this almost a year ago but buried the topic in an internal food fight.

EPA official Susan Hedman did not publicize the EPA’s concern over Flint’s water quality or the water’s dangerous health concerns. The federal agency instead quietly fought with the Michigan Department of Environmental Quality for at least six months about what should be done.

EPA water expert, Miguel Del Toral, identified potential contamination problems with Flint’s drinking water last February and confirmed the suspicions in April. He authored an internal memo about the problem in June, according to documents obtained by Virginia Tech.

Meanwhile, Hedman became aware of the contamination issue in April. She sought legal advice, but didn’t receive the guidance until November 2014. The American Civil Liberties Union accused Hedman in October of attempting to keep Miguel Del Toral’s memo in-house, downplaying its significance.

 

[eagle1462010]

EPA Region 5 Administrator Susan Hedman to resign in wake of the Flint water crisis

 

[eagle1462010]

A lot of heads need to roll.................all the way to the top...........Many already are being replaced or have resigned because the LAW SUITS will be out of this world over this.............Count on it..................

But to state it's 1 persons fault with so many involved is BS.................

There are many players in this fiasco.....................

The switch to a BRAND NEW SYSTEM was correct.............not the Flint River........but to Lake Huron with BRAND NEW PIPING..........NO LEAD............UPGRADE INFRASTRUCTURE..............type work to provide a new water source not just to Flint but the surrounding counties which would prevent a 30% cost increase to customers by staying with Detroit..............

Stop with the political nonsense........

 

[pwjohn]

"The final decision to use the Flint River as an interim source rather than Detroit appears to have been made by the EFM (at this time, Darnell Earley. He claims the decision was made by the state; former Mayor Walling says it was made by Earley). Earley note at the time that it would save Flint $12 million over the two years of the contract. Not much of a bargain in hindsight, but nobody had foreknowledge of the screw-up and cover-up to come".

Once again, The Governor of a State has a duty to protect its residents. The buck stopped on the desk of the Governor.

The water authority there said they could properly treat the water.
Your decision makes no account to the blatant black mail by Detroit.
The Cover up involved all in the process.

And you only want one head because you play politics with it.

Eagle, the Flint Water Authority was against this switch from the gitgo, and said so. The below is part of an article about the released Snyder Emails: (Maybe this is why he wasn't fired)

""I have people above me making plans to distribute water ASAP," Laboratory & Water Quality Supervisor Mike Glasgow said in an email to the state Department of Environmental Quality on April 17, 2014.

The email was among more than 20,000 pages of documents related to Flint's water crisis and released today, Feb. 12, by Gov. Rick Snyder.

"I was reluctant before, but after looking at the monitoring schedule and our current staffing, I do not anticipate giving the OK to begin sending water out anytime soon," Glasgow's email says. "If water is distributed from this plant in the next couple weeks, it will be against my direction.

"I need time to adequately train additional staff and to update our monitoring plans before I will feel we are ready. I will reiterate this to management above me, but they seem to have their own agenda."

Eight days after Glascow wrote the email to Adam Rosenthal, Mike Prysby and Stephen Busch, officials at the DEQ, former mayor Dayne Walling turned off the flow of water from Detroit and water plant workers started treating and pumping Flint River water for the first time in nearly 50 years.""

I already put up a link to this article, but thanks for posting

 

[Ame®icano]

Funny how lefties are pointing fingers at the governor just because he's R.

I would suggest they take a walk through Flint. For the past 30 years it looks like Fallout 4 and that is not because of governor, but because of all D's that are fucking up every city in the country.

 

[sealybobo]

Newly elected Flint Mayor Karen Weaver today fired, er um, accepted the resignations of the Chief of Police, the Fire Chief, and the City Administrator hired by the State Appointed emergency manager in 2014 on a 5 year contract. This girl is kicking butt and taking names. This all happened at 5:00PM today. I have to assume she checked with the City lawyers before taking this action, but as everyone knows, Flint has other problems besides the water pollution. So far she has shown a lot of class and backbone.

You guys are so worried about Hillary's emails but what about this?
Progress Michigan Calls for Snyder Resignation In Light of New Emails - Progress Michigan

 

[bullwinkle]

Newly elected Flint Mayor Karen Weaver today fired, er um, accepted the resignations of the Chief of Police, the Fire Chief, and the City Administrator hired by the State Appointed emergency manager in 2014 on a 5 year contract. This girl is kicking butt and taking names. This all happened at 5:00PM today. I have to assume she checked with the City lawyers before taking this action, but as everyone knows, Flint has other problems besides the water pollution. So far she has shown a lot of class and backbone.

You guys are so worried about Hillary's emails but what about this?
Progress Michigan Calls for Snyder Resignation In Light of New Emails - Progress Michigan

I heard yesterday that the petition to recall Snyder has over 700,000 signatures, this from a son-in-law that works at U of M in Ann Arbor. I have no firm opinion on that, as I am more concerned about some positive solutions than head hunting at this time. I am also heartened and deeply impressed with the people from all over the country, and even Canada, who are arranging convoys of water and donations to the cause, all free to Flint residents. Lets not forget that either.