Dems Dismal 4 Years..

[Scaybeez]

The fact is,Bush enjoyed a consistent 4% Unemployment Rate and record high Stock Markets for much of his term. Things began to tank immediately after the Democrats took control of Congress. This is just fact. We still haven't recovered. I always find it hilarious when i see these Hopey Changeys cheerleading for their Hopey Changey One and his dismal 10% Unemployment when you realize that these same creeps used to actually pay protesters to go out in the streets to protest Bush's "awful" 4% Unemployment Rate. Now look at em spinning away. My God,their Democratic candidate for President even said we were in a "Depression" when Bush had that 4% Unemployment Rate. So if that was a "Depression",what do these tools call this? Time for real change. Make it happen America. Do it in 2010.

Actually, from '02-'05 unemployment was 5% or higher (according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics). In '06 and '07, the years of Dem. control prior to the market crash, unemployment remained below that 5% mark.

Also, you seem to be arguing that the Dems. retaking the House was somehow the cause in the increase in unemployment in this country - I mean, is that truly your take on things? Because it seems pretty clear that all the wonderful numbers one can point to prior to '08 were based on shady deals and insane gambling on the part of Wall St. It was a bubble that was bound to pop no matter who was in office at the time.

 

[Scaybeez]

Wow.. I just stumbled upon the "unhinged Obamabot" thread. Let's see... Obama in control for nearly 2 years, Dems in control for 4.... it's all Bush's fault. Love it... each day as the regime goes further down the toilet, it is just more BUSH BUSH BUSH BUSH.

Point taken, however, I think it's foolish to pretend that all (or even most) of these problems began in the last two years or that ANYONE (Republican or Democrat) would have been able to magically fix them in such a short period of time. I understand the GOP playing on peoples' desire to see everything fixed immediately, it's good party politics, but it's also highly unrealistic and will come back to bite them in the asses if they do manage to regain power.

 

[The Rabbi]

The fact is,Bush enjoyed a consistent 4% Unemployment Rate and record high Stock Markets for much of his term. Things began to tank immediately after the Democrats took control of Congress. This is just fact. We still haven't recovered. I always find it hilarious when i see these Hopey Changeys cheerleading for their Hopey Changey One and his dismal 10% Unemployment when you realize that these same creeps used to actually pay protesters to go out in the streets to protest Bush's "awful" 4% Unemployment Rate. Now look at em spinning away. My God,their Democratic candidate for President even said we were in a "Depression" when Bush had that 4% Unemployment Rate. So if that was a "Depression",what do these tools call this? Time for real change. Make it happen America. Do it in 2010.

Actually, from '02-'05 unemployment was 5% or higher (according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics). In '06 and '07, the years of Dem. control prior to the market crash, unemployment remained below that 5% mark.

Also, you seem to be arguing that the Dems. retaking the House was somehow the cause in the increase in unemployment in this country - I mean, is that truly your take on things? Because it seems pretty clear that all the wonderful numbers one can point to prior to '08 were based on shady deals insane gambling on the part of Wall St. It was a bubble that was bound to pop no matter who was in office at the time.

Yes, the unemployment rate declined as the Bush tax cuts took full effect. The rate declined until the Dems took office and began passing legislation, with Bush's signature. And then it skyrocketed.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Wow.. I just stumbled upon the "unhinged Obamabot" thread. Let's see... Obama in control for nearly 2 years, Dems in control for 4.... it's all Bush's fault. Love it... each day as the regime goes further down the toilet, it is just more BUSH BUSH BUSH BUSH.

Point taken, however, I think it's foolish to pretend that all (or even most) of these problems began in the last two years or that ANYONE (Republican or Democrat) would have been able to magically fix them in such a short period of time. I understand the GOP playing on peoples' desire to see everything fixed immediately, it's good party politics, but it's also highly unrealistic and will come back to bite them in the asses if they do manage to regain power.

Agree completely.

 

[The Rabbi]

Wow.. I just stumbled upon the "unhinged Obamabot" thread. Let's see... Obama in control for nearly 2 years, Dems in control for 4.... it's all Bush's fault. Love it... each day as the regime goes further down the toilet, it is just more BUSH BUSH BUSH BUSH.

Point taken, however, I think it's foolish to pretend that all (or even most) of these problems began in the last two years or that ANYONE (Republican or Democrat) would have been able to magically fix them in such a short period of time. I understand the GOP playing on peoples' desire to see everything fixed immediately, it's good party politics, but it's also highly unrealistic and will come back to bite them in the asses if they do manage to regain power.

The truth is that the Fed reduced rates when they should have been increasing them. This fueled the commodities boom and real estate boom, setting the stage for subsequent busts. The actions of the present administration have deepened and prolonged that downturn.

 

[Scaybeez]

You mean where 2 Republicans on theSenate committee initially were in favor of the proposal but the committee was bufallo'd by the White House to throw something together so they lost GOP support? That health care debate?
Dolt

Actually, I mean where the Democrats willingly abandoned a number of proposals highly favored by the left (in particular, the public option) in an attempt to bring Republicans to the table - all to no avail.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

The Democrats intentionally undermined Bush & the Economy so they could regain power. This is the way it is with dirty politics. I remember John Kerry actually claiming we were in a "Depression" when Bush had a 4% Unemployment Rate. They undermined everything so they could regain power. Now look at em spinning their Hopey Changey's dismal numbers. Hopefully the American People know the real story and give the Dems the boot starting in 2010. I guess we'll see.

 

[Scaybeez]

The actions of the present administration have deepened and prolonged that downturn.

I think that's debatable. I believe it's likely that many companies are holding off on expanding/hiring out of fear of what health care reform will cost them, but at the same time, it remains clear (according to the CBO) that the stimulus package has prevented a much worse downturn than would have occured otherwise. In other words, the administration's actions have been a mixed bag thus far.

 

[The Rabbi]

The actions of the present administration have deepened and prolonged that downturn.

I think that's debatable. I believe it's likely that many companies are holding off on expanding/hiring out of fear of what health care reform will cost them, but at the same time, it remains clear (according to the CBO) that the stimulus package has prevented a much worse downturn than would have occured otherwise. In other words, the administration's actions have been a mixed bag thus far.

The line of "if you think things are bad now imagine what they would ahve been if we hadn't done it" is the White House's line and like all such is full of bullshit. It has been proven that a payroll tax cut of the same amount would have yielded far better benefit. As it is, the "multiplier" of governmetn spending has been calculated to be about .40, meaning it has cost the economy more than it has benefited. That is why we see things lagging even years into this recession. The actions of CEOs in an uncertain regulatory and tax environment are part of the whole problem.

 

[Scaybeez]

The line of "if you think things are bad now imagine what they would ahve been if we hadn't done it" is the White House's line and like all such is full of bullshit. It has been proven that a payroll tax cut of the same amount would have yielded far better benefit. As it is, the "multiplier" of governmetn spending has been calculated to be about .40, meaning it has cost the economy more than it has benefited. That is why we see things lagging even years into this recession. The actions of CEOs in an uncertain regulatory and tax environment are part of the whole problem.

The CBO has looked into this and the results have been quite clear. Without the stimulus package, we'd be experiencing much higher unemployment and much lower growth.

 

[The Rabbi]

The line of "if you think things are bad now imagine what they would ahve been if we hadn't done it" is the White House's line and like all such is full of bullshit. It has been proven that a payroll tax cut of the same amount would have yielded far better benefit. As it is, the "multiplier" of governmetn spending has been calculated to be about .40, meaning it has cost the economy more than it has benefited. That is why we see things lagging even years into this recession. The actions of CEOs in an uncertain regulatory and tax environment are part of the whole problem.

The CBO has looked into this and the results have been quite clear. Without the stimulus package, we'd be experiencing much higher unemployment and much lower growth.

And teh CBO's numbers are full of shit. Basically they took the approach that "stimulus spending" will increase the economy so much for every dollar spent. So they looked at the number of dollars spent and did the math.
Unfortunately in the real world their assumption is unproven and almost certainly wrong. So their conclusions are equally wrong.

 

[Old Rocks]

What exactly have the Republicans accomplished in 4 years?

The more sincere question would be.. what have the Democrats allowed Republicans to accomplish?

The Democrats hold all the cards but they act like they don't...yup, I know what your thinking, the poor little... crybabies...

Let's see. The Repubs had the House, Senate, and Executive for six years and what did they accomplish. Tax breaks for the very wealth, two failed wars, allowed an attack that cost the lives of 3000 Americans, then let the mastermind of that attack get away. Attacked a nation on the basis of lies, and the cost of which is already 4500 American lives, 3 trillion in dollars for the total cost. And we gained absolutely nothing from that war.

Then they built on the deregulations pushed by Phil Gramm, and damned near bankrupted the whole world. We are still in a recession if you are a working man or woman. Not only that, they took a budget that had surpluses, and was beginning to pay on the National Debt, and created a huge increase in the National Debt, even as they decreased government income through their tax breaks for the very wealthy.

Compared to that record, President Obama has done very well.

 

[Old Rocks]

The CBO has looked into this and the results have been quite clear. Without the stimulus package, we'd be experiencing much higher unemployment and much lower growth.

And teh CBO's numbers are full of shit. Basically they took the approach that "stimulus spending" will increase the economy so much for every dollar spent. So they looked at the number of dollars spent and did the math.
Unfortunately in the real world their assumption is unproven and almost certainly wrong. So their conclusions are equally wrong.

And your conclusions about the period from 2001 to 2009 that you people ran things are what?

People with your ideological bent totally blew it. Failed in foreign policy at every turn, failed in domestic policy, damned near bankrupted the whole world. Got 4500 Americans killed for the lies of the President and Vice President. And tried to fight two wars while reducing taxes. About as fiscally stupid as is possible to be. But you were right there cheering for the whole ball of idiocy.

 

[The Rabbi]

And teh CBO's numbers are full of shit. Basically they took the approach that "stimulus spending" will increase the economy so much for every dollar spent. So they looked at the number of dollars spent and did the math.
Unfortunately in the real world their assumption is unproven and almost certainly wrong. So their conclusions are equally wrong.

And your conclusions about the period from 2001 to 2009 that you people ran things are what?

People with your ideological bent totally blew it. Failed in foreign policy at every turn, failed in domestic policy, damned near bankrupted the whole world. Got 4500 Americans killed for the lies of the President and Vice President. And tried to fight two wars while reducing taxes. About as fiscally stupid as is possible to be. But you were right there cheering for the whole ball of idiocy.

Do you ever stop repeating things from people dumber than you?
First, I don't know who "you people" are. I wasn't in the government then.
Let's see:
Dismantled al Qaeda
Overthrew Saddam Hussein
Installed a stable Iraqi regime, despite the conviction on the Left it was impossible
Overthrew the Taliban and denied al Qaeda safe havens in that country
Took us out of the stupid and archaic ABM treaty
Brought about the second largest growth in the U.S. economy post WW2
Brought us out of a potentially severe recession brought on by the dot com bust and 9/11

Things began going downhill when the Dums took Congress and Bush tried reaching across the aisle and working with them. Unlike Obama who wants to go it alone all the time.

Were you saying something, there, Ole Rocks in the Head?

 

[Scaybeez]

And teh CBO's numbers are full of shit. Basically they took the approach that "stimulus spending" will increase the economy so much for every dollar spent. So they looked at the number of dollars spent and did the math.
Unfortunately in the real world their assumption is unproven and almost certainly wrong. So their conclusions are equally wrong.

If the non-partisan CBO is wrong, that's fine, but that's something that needs to be proven, not simply accepted out of hand. Their calculations are based on what has been judged to be the average result of each dollar spent. If that's inaccurate, I welcome our conservative friends to crunch the numbers themselves and prove it.

 

[Scaybeez]

Do you ever stop repeating things from people dumber than you?
First, I don't know who "you people" are. I wasn't in the government then.
Let's see:
Dismantled al Qaeda
Overthrew Saddam Hussein
Installed a stable Iraqi regime, despite the conviction on the Left it was impossible
Overthrew the Taliban and denied al Qaeda safe havens in that country
Took us out of the stupid and archaic ABM treaty
Brought about the second largest growth in the U.S. economy post WW2
Brought us out of a potentially severe recession brought on by the dot com bust and 9/11

Things began going downhill when the Dums took Congress and Bush tried reaching across the aisle and working with them. Unlike Obama who wants to go it alone all the time.

Were you saying something, there, Ole Rocks in the Head?

Credit for al-Qaeda's poor state can be shared by both Bush and Obama - at least as far as drone strikes and the carrot-and-stick routine regarding Pakistan is concerned. With that in mind, though, it's inaccurate to state that al-Qaeda has been "dismantled".

Iraq is stabilizing, slowly, though that doesn't change the fact that invading it was completely unnecessary, cost thousands of American lives, and hundreds of billions of our hard earned dollars.

Safe havens for al-Qaeda continue to exist, both within Afghanistan and in neighboring Pakistan (not to mention a host of other countries). Too early to declare victory on this front, I'm afraid.

I find it impossible to accept that Bush led out us of the economic hardships we were faced with at that time. Things stabilized, but they hardly recovered.

And finally, what does the further economic downturn have to do with the Dems. taking control of Congress? I mean, you state it and one led to the other, but that's hardly been proven.

 

[The Rabbi]

And teh CBO's numbers are full of shit. Basically they took the approach that "stimulus spending" will increase the economy so much for every dollar spent. So they looked at the number of dollars spent and did the math.
Unfortunately in the real world their assumption is unproven and almost certainly wrong. So their conclusions are equally wrong.

If the non-partisan CBO is wrong, that's fine, but that's something that needs to be proven, not simply accepted out of hand. Their calculations are based on what has been judged to be the average result of each dollar spent. If that's inaccurate, I welcome our conservative friends to crunch the numbers themselves and prove it.

CBO Report Was Pre-Ordained to Show the Stimulus Succeeded | The Foundry: Conservative Policy News.
Key up charges of rightwing bias......

 

[007]

The spend, spend, spend like the wind dems were hoping that if they spent enough money, that things would hold together until the November elections. Problem is, they're not. All they did was add to the debt, and now there's just all the more to pay back. What they did was foolish beyond comprehension, all orchestrated by a little community organizer that didn't know jack shit when he stepped into the White House about running a business or the economy. All he knew was what he had been taught as he grew up... RADICAL SOCIALISM. So that's what he's trying to implement, at a fever pitch, and there wasn't a single dem with enough guts to stand up to him. They were all afraid of being called a RACIST. Well, seems there's a few dems now that are sick of his agenda. They're finally starting to see that what he's doing is political suicide, and anyone that stays on board with him to the end, will go down with the ship with him.

 

[rightwinger]

The spend, spend, spend like the wind dems were hoping that if they spent enough money, that things would hold together until the November elections. Problem is, they're not. All they did was add to the debt, and now there's just all the more to pay back. What they did was foolish beyond comprehension, all orchestrated by a little community organizer that didn't know jack shit when he stepped into the White House about running a business or the economy. All he knew was what he had been taught as he grew up... RADICAL SOCIALISM. So that's what he's trying to implement, at a fever pitch, and there wasn't a single dem with enough guts to stand up to him. They were all afraid of being called a RACIST. Well, seems there's a few dems now that are sick of his agenda. They're finally starting to see that what he's doing is political suicide, and anyone that stays on board with him to the end, will go down with the ship with him.

What did we get from Republican spending?

Two Wars
A $2 Trillion tax cut for the wealthy


I'd rather have Healthcare thankyou

 

[Old Rocks]

But Rabbi would rather kill foriegn babies than provide health care for american babies.