B-2s over South Korea

[Indofred]

Maybe, but from what little I've seen, you seem to be a whinging pom with a very tenuous grasp of history. Trust me, I've seen it before.

Oddly enough, when I meet an Australians, I introduce myself as, Fred, whinging pom.
However, it is inaccurate in so much as I don't whinge, I do something about the problem.

For instance, it's not hot, it's just time for a drink of ice cold water under the shade of a palm tree.
Think happy thoughts, dude.

So what are you going to do about the brutality of America? Are you hatching a terrorist plot, or are you reduced to whining about it?

I like people too much to be a terrorist so I'll just have to try to educate you lot.
Start here - ask why North Korea is your enemy.
Did they ever invade America or do anything else against you until you entered a war against them?
Forget propaganda or BS, look for yourself.

You strike me as quite bright - have a read at history and why America was in South Korea.
A long time ago, I watched a film.
Basically, a martial arts student wanted a new master to teach him but he was full of his own ideas.
The master asked, How can I fill your glass if it's already full?

Empty your glass of preconceptions and start with an open mind.

 

[Meathead]

Oddly enough, when I meet an Australians, I introduce myself as, Fred, whinging pom.
However, it is inaccurate in so much as I don't whinge, I do something about the problem.

For instance, it's not hot, it's just time for a drink of ice cold water under the shade of a palm tree.
Think happy thoughts, dude.

So what are you going to do about the brutality of America? Are you hatching a terrorist plot, or are you reduced to whining about it?

I like people too much to be a terrorist so I'll just have to try to educate you lot.
Start here - ask why North Korea is your enemy.
Did they ever invade America or do anything else against you until you entered a war against them?
Forget propaganda or BS, look for yourself.

You strike me as quite bright - have a read at history and why America was in South Korea.
A long time ago, I watched a film.
Basically, a martial arts student wanted a new master to teach him but he was full of his own ideas.
The master asked, How can I fill your glass if it's already full?

Empty your glass of preconceptions and start with an open mind.

Cute.

I am pretty well-informed in history, especially that of the Cold War. Korea was in large part Kennan's Policy of Containment. It largely worked in Korea as the south became a buffer for Japan and a check on the Soviets and Chinese. These are not deep secrets here.

 

[Indofred]

The unconditional surrender of the Japanese Empire ending WWII comes to mind.

Yes - That was after the Korean war. Tell me, where did you learn history?

Do you guys realise, apart from a few places where you were fighting people who had no more than sharpened bananas to fight with, you've lost every war you've started and had thousands of dead troops to show for it?
Think I'm wrong, name an American victory against an armed force. You'll be hard pushed, there isn't one.

Yes, I not only think you are wrong, you don't even remember what you posted.

You were forced to stalemate but I suppose that's better than your defeats since then.

Sure do - Just that you didn't read it.

 

[Indofred]

Cute.

I am pretty well-informed in history, especially that of the Cold War. Korea was in large part Kennan's Policy of Containment. It largely worked in Korea as the south became a buffer for Japan and a check on the Soviets and Chinese. These are not deep secrets here.

Hang on - You were there to keep communism in check - in someone else's country, not America?
Toss in, the Soviets left in '48 but the Americans stayed to support Rhee, a virtual dictator who had political opponents arrested and left his own people to rot when NK finally invaded.
Rhee was corrupt and oppressive so had to 'fix' the constitution in order to regain power at the next election but the US still backed him.

Question you have to ask is, how did that make the North Koreans feel about America and, if America had stayed out of it, would NK be an enemy of America or just some loony communist state with a mad leader?

In my humble opinion, there is a better than average chance, NK would have failed as a state not so long after the Berlin wall fell. After all, even Cuba's leadership is failing now there is no further support from Moscow.
Americans can enter Vietnam these days without anyone much bothering them, why would that have been any different for Korea?

 

[Meathead]

Cute.

I am pretty well-informed in history, especially that of the Cold War. Korea was in large part Kennan's Policy of Containment. It largely worked in Korea as the south became a buffer for Japan and a check on the Soviets and Chinese. These are not deep secrets here.

Hang on - You were there to keep communism in check - in someone else's country, not America?
Toss in, the Soviets left in '48 but the Americans stayed to support Rhee, a virtual dictator who had political opponents arrested and left his own people to rot when NK finally invaded.
Rhee was corrupt and oppressive so had to 'fix' the constitution in order to regain power at the next election but the US still backed him.

Question you have to ask is, how did that make the North Koreans feel about America and, if America had stayed out of it, would NK be an enemy of America or just some loony communist state with a mad leader?

In my humble opinion, there is a better than average chance, NK would have failed as a state not so long after the Berlin wall fell. After all, even Cuba's leadership is failing now there is no further support from Moscow.
Americans can enter Vietnam these days without anyone much bothering them, why would that have been any different for Korea?

If America had stayed out of it, the Kims would have been the beloved leaders of all Koreans who would have enjoyed the blessings that only the North Koreans do today.

Grow up and stop whining ffs!

 

[Too Tall]

Yes - That was after the Korean war. Tell me, where did you learn history?

Yes, I not only think you are wrong, you don't even remember what you posted.

You were forced to stalemate but I suppose that's better than your defeats since then.

ended

Sure do - Just that you didn't read it.

I named a war that the US won. We have not had a declared war to 'win' since WWII.

Korea was a United Nations police action by definition, and hostilities were ended with a cease fire. North Korea invaded the South with the intent of defeating them and claiming the south as their country. Since they were forced back to their country and there is a South Korea today, I call it a victory.

The alternative to a cease fire was to invade and defeat the Chinese, and neither the US or the UN were prepared to enter into WWIII.

 

[Indofred]

Yes, I not only think you are wrong, you don't even remember what you posted.

You were forced to stalemate but I suppose that's better than your defeats since then.

ended

Sure do - Just that you didn't read it.

I named a war that the US won. We have not had a declared war to 'win' since WWII.

Korea was a United Nations police action by definition, and hostilities were ended with a cease fire. North Korea invaded the South with the intent of defeating them and claiming the south as their country. Since they were forced back to their country and there is a South Korea today, I call it a victory.

The alternative to a cease fire was to invade and defeat the Chinese, and neither the US or the UN were prepared to enter into WWIII.

But I clearly stated, "your defeats since then", in relation to Korea. Sorry if you can't understand or need to change the rules to find something you can argue with.

Are you saying, the Chinese entry was unlawful/unfair but the Americans were fighting the good fight?
Sounds like "six of one".

 

[Indofred]

Cute.

I am pretty well-informed in history, especially that of the Cold War. Korea was in large part Kennan's Policy of Containment. It largely worked in Korea as the south became a buffer for Japan and a check on the Soviets and Chinese. These are not deep secrets here.

Hang on - You were there to keep communism in check - in someone else's country, not America?
Toss in, the Soviets left in '48 but the Americans stayed to support Rhee, a virtual dictator who had political opponents arrested and left his own people to rot when NK finally invaded.
Rhee was corrupt and oppressive so had to 'fix' the constitution in order to regain power at the next election but the US still backed him.

Question you have to ask is, how did that make the North Koreans feel about America and, if America had stayed out of it, would NK be an enemy of America or just some loony communist state with a mad leader?

In my humble opinion, there is a better than average chance, NK would have failed as a state not so long after the Berlin wall fell. After all, even Cuba's leadership is failing now there is no further support from Moscow.
Americans can enter Vietnam these days without anyone much bothering them, why would that have been any different for Korea?

If America had stayed out of it, the Kims would have been the beloved leaders of all Koreans who would have enjoyed the blessings that only the North Koreans do today.

Grow up and stop whining ffs!

I think you're more intelligent than that post suggests.
Why not try to answer the questions posed?

As a note - I agree, Korea would probably have been ruled by the North and the Kims are clearly idiots but that doesn't change the basis of my argument, America created its own enemy where there was none. However, Vietnam suggest things may very well have been very different if America had stayed out.

Now, have a real go at the question.

 

[Meathead]

I think you're more intelligent than that post suggests.
Why not try to answer the questions posed?

As a note - I agree, Korea would probably have been ruled by the North and the Kims are clearly idiots but that doesn't change the basis of my argument, America created its own enemy where there was none. However, Vietnam suggest things may very well have been very different if America had stayed out.

Now, have a real go at the question.

I have no idea what the question was, but get over it. The Cold War is over and communism collapsed. That the United States succeeded doesn't into your world view, but who cares?

 

[Too Tall]

ended

Sure do - Just that you didn't read it.

I named a war that the US won. We have not had a declared war to 'win' since WWII.

Korea was a United Nations police action by definition, and hostilities were ended with a cease fire. North Korea invaded the South with the intent of defeating them and claiming the south as their country. Since they were forced back to their country and there is a South Korea today, I call it a victory.

The alternative to a cease fire was to invade and defeat the Chinese, and neither the US or the UN were prepared to enter into WWIII.

But I clearly stated, "your defeats since then", in relation to Korea. Sorry if you can't understand or need to change the rules to find something you can argue with.

Are you saying, the Chinese entry was unlawful/unfair but the Americans were fighting the good fight?
Sounds like "six of one".

You also clearly made this statement, which is the one I responded to.

Think I'm wrong, name an American victory against an armed force.

I thought that even you could understand this statement.

The alternative to a cease fire was to invade and defeat the Chinese, and neither the US or the UN were prepared to enter into WWIII.

The answer to the 'good fight' smear is yes. Here is the reason that any fool can understand.

The United Nations Security Council Resolution 84 was adopted on July 7, 1950. Having determined that the invasion of the Republic of Korea by the forces from North Korea constituted a breach of the peace, the Council recommended that the members of the United Nations furnish such assistance to the Republic of Korea as may be necessary to repel the attack and restore peace and security to the area. The Council further recommended that all members providing military forces and other assistance to The Republic make these forces and assistance available to a unified command under the United States of America. The Council then requested that the United States designate the commander of such forces and authorized said commander to use the Flag of the United Nations at his discretion in the course of operations against North Korean forces. Finally, The Council requested that the United States provide it with reports as appropriate on the course of action taken by the unified command.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Translated - Bugger, I can't name a US victory so I'd better insult him instead.

We won WW2, We stopped MILLIONS of Chinese in Korea and soundly defeated the North Koreans, Militarily we won in Vietnam, we won in Grenada, Panama, 1st Gulf war and the Iraq war.

Now name for us a single war the Muslims have won in the last 200 years?

Another one who thinks the Korean war was before WWII.
You won where.
NK - you were forced to a standstill.
Vietnam is a communist country where a good few of your invading troops are burred and was a sound defeat. You got your arses kicked out. Hardly a victory.

Granada - You invaded a country to interfere in their politics. The country was poorly defended by a few Cubans and a few Soviets.
As I said - real victories - not a football match were you field 200 players against the opposing team's five players, one with a limp.

Panama - Another invasion - You were pissed off because Noriega, an ex CIA asset had taken over his own country. This really bugged you because you didn't like him any more.
Mostly because you were really red faced over the Iran-Contra affair, where you were caught red handed doing a bit of drug trafficking. You needed someone to blame so the CIA seemed clean, thus you invaded to get rid of the communist.
You sent 20,000 troops to fight a rag tag army but only managed to kill 150 Panamanian troops.
Still, you murdered 500 unarmed civilians so that may be a victory.

First Iraq war - you won a battle - not a war.

Second one - You won the first battles but managed to do nothing except destabilised the country and allow militant groups to multiply.
You gained nothing but lost 4,488 troops before "mission accomplished" and, after your victory, lost another 3627 to the defeated army.
You even managed to lose another 300 or so after you handed the country back.
Some victory.

As for Muslims winning wars, we don't seem to be planning an invasion of North Korea so it hardly matters.

For the record, we were not forced to a standstill in North Korea. MacArthur had effectively won the war in North Korea despite the presence of hundreds of thousands of Chinese troops, and publicly called on China to admit it. This created a political crisis back home, and it resulted in him being relieved of command by an unpopular president. It also resulted in a truce where we pretended that China had never been involved in the war.

 

[jasonnfree]

50 million US-citizens are dependent on food stamps, but that doesn´t matter.

The two issues are utterly unrelated, you ridiculous little emo-clown.

Are you this insulting to people in person? Probably more like Walter Mitty.

 

[Unkotare]

50 million US-citizens are dependent on food stamps, but that doesn´t matter.

The two issues are utterly unrelated, you ridiculous little emo-clown.

Are you this insulting to people in person? .

I don't often meet such ridiculous little emo-clowns, but on the rare occasions that I do, they need to know it for their own good.

 

[Bleipriester]

I don't often meet such ridiculous little emo-clowns, but on the rare occasions that I do, they need to know it for their own good.

Its you who behavior like a clown. Talking about humanity, than - in the next thread you fall in - hailing war and bombardments.
If we don´t agree, you start to insult us.
This is what a fucking clown would do.

 

[Indofred]

We won WW2, We stopped MILLIONS of Chinese in Korea and soundly defeated the North Koreans, Militarily we won in Vietnam, we won in Grenada, Panama, 1st Gulf war and the Iraq war.

Now name for us a single war the Muslims have won in the last 200 years?

Another one who thinks the Korean war was before WWII.
You won where.
NK - you were forced to a standstill.
Vietnam is a communist country where a good few of your invading troops are burred and was a sound defeat. You got your arses kicked out. Hardly a victory.

Granada - You invaded a country to interfere in their politics. The country was poorly defended by a few Cubans and a few Soviets.
As I said - real victories - not a football match were you field 200 players against the opposing team's five players, one with a limp.

Panama - Another invasion - You were pissed off because Noriega, an ex CIA asset had taken over his own country. This really bugged you because you didn't like him any more.
Mostly because you were really red faced over the Iran-Contra affair, where you were caught red handed doing a bit of drug trafficking. You needed someone to blame so the CIA seemed clean, thus you invaded to get rid of the communist.
You sent 20,000 troops to fight a rag tag army but only managed to kill 150 Panamanian troops.
Still, you murdered 500 unarmed civilians so that may be a victory.

First Iraq war - you won a battle - not a war.

Second one - You won the first battles but managed to do nothing except destabilised the country and allow militant groups to multiply.
You gained nothing but lost 4,488 troops before "mission accomplished" and, after your victory, lost another 3627 to the defeated army.
You even managed to lose another 300 or so after you handed the country back.
Some victory.

As for Muslims winning wars, we don't seem to be planning an invasion of North Korea so it hardly matters.

For the record, we were not forced to a standstill in North Korea. MacArthur had effectively won the war in North Korea despite the presence of hundreds of thousands of Chinese troops, and publicly called on China to admit it. This created a political crisis back home, and it resulted in him being relieved of command by an unpopular president. It also resulted in a truce where we pretended that China had never been involved in the war.

So the American voters beat you?
Any excuse is acceptable.

 

[Indofred]

I think you're more intelligent than that post suggests.
Why not try to answer the questions posed?

As a note - I agree, Korea would probably have been ruled by the North and the Kims are clearly idiots but that doesn't change the basis of my argument, America created its own enemy where there was none. However, Vietnam suggest things may very well have been very different if America had stayed out.

Now, have a real go at the question.

I have no idea what the question was, but get over it. The Cold War is over and communism collapsed. That the United States succeeded doesn't into your world view, but who cares?

Most of the daft communist states have gone.
Frankly, hardly a shock as the stupid end of politics, right or left, tend to fail after a while.
Tell me, if your theory is correct, why did the countries you actually attacked remain communist?

Did the US kick the commies out of Cuba.
Is Vietnam, a supposed victory according to one poster, still a communist country and how are things in North Korea?
Now to Russia, the hub of the old USSR, when did you invade that country to destroy communism?
Then you can move on to American military victories in Eastern Europe and so on.

My question to remind you.
Would NK still have been an enemy of America, if America had stayed out of the way?
I firmly believe, they would have withered and died exactly as East Germany did.
At worst, they would have been a semi capitalist state, a bit poor and worse for wear, supported by China but not actually doing a lot else.
A lot like Vietnam but, just like Vietnam, no longer an enemy.

 

[Indofred]

The greatest loses would have been my nice Samsung galaxy note phone and no [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CH1XGdu-hzQ"]Gangnam style[/ame].

Far more acceptable than thousands of dead and injured.

 

[Indofred]

BBC News - Viewpoint: What is driving North Korea's threats?

More than 40,000 US and South Korean troops are currently conducting military manoeuvres on the Korean Peninsula, as part of the annual Foal Eagle exercise.

US bombers, fighter aircraft and submarines have made their way to the region in an effort to "enhance the security and readiness" of South Korea....

....International coverage of tensions with North Korea creates the impression that their recent threats in response to military exercises come out of the blue. In fact, Pyongyang has loudly objected to joint manoeuvres for decades.

Just as a note - you guys do realise you started the latest round of threats, not North Korea....don't you?

 

[Unkotare]

I don't often meet such ridiculous little emo-clowns, but on the rare occasions that I do, they need to know it for their own good.

Its you who behavior like a clown. Talking about humanity, than - in the next thread you fall in - hailing war and bombardments...

Try again in English, Dieter.

 

[Meathead]

My question to remind you.
Would NK still have been an enemy of America, if America had stayed out of the way?
I firmly believe, they would have withered and died exactly as East Germany did.
At worst, they would have been a semi capitalist state, a bit poor and worse for wear, supported by China but not actually doing a lot else.
A lot like Vietnam but, just like Vietnam, no longer an enemy.

Your question is in the conditional is can only be answered with a conditional, as you have done. Sorry kid, it is a waste of time.

Anyway, enjoy your special day.