American History that most Americans don't know

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Man of 1951, Oct 5, 2003.

  1. Man of 1951
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    1953: U.S. overthrows Prime Minister Mossadeq of Iran. U.S. installs Shah as dictator.

    1954: U.S. overthrows democratically-elected President Arbenz of Guatemala. 200,000 civilians killed.


    1963: U.S. backs assassination of South Vietnamese President Diem.

    1963-1975: American military kills 4 million civilians in Southeast Asia.


    September 11, 1973: U.S. stages coup in Chile. Democratically elected president Salvador Allende assassinated. Dictator Augusto Pinochet installed. 5,000 Chileans murdered.

    1977: U.S. backs military rulers of El Salvador. 70,000 Salvadorans and four American nuns killed.


    1980's: U.S. trains Osama bin Laden and fellow terrorists to kill Soviets. CIA gives them $3 billion.

    1980's: US gave money to the Contra's in Nicaragua, money which they recieved from Iran after illegally selling arms to them.

    July 1983: CIA trained the death squad, Battalion 316, who were trained to commit vast amounts of human rights abuses in Honduras

    1981: Reagan administration trains and funds "contras". 30,000 Nicaraguans die.

    1982: U.S. provides billions in aid to Saddam Hussein for weapons to kill Iranians.

    1983: White House secretly gives Iran weapons to help them kill Iraqis.

    1989: CIA agent Manuel Noriega (also serving as President of Panama) disobeys orders from Washington. U.S. invades Panama and removes Noriega. 3,000 Panamanian civilian casualties


    1990: Iraq invades Kuwait with weapons from U.S.

    1991: U.S. enters Iraq. Bush reinstates dictator of Kuwait.

    1998: Clinton bombs "weapons factory" in Sudan. Factory turns out to be making aspirin.

    1991 to present: American planes bomb Iraq on a weekly basis. U.N. estimates 500,000 Iraqi children die from bombing and sanctions.

    September 11, 2001: Osama Bin Laden uses his expert CIA training to murder 3,000 people.


    Thoughts?
     
  2. eric
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    What's your point?
     
  3. NightTrain
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    Where's your sources? Some of these points are really glossed over & are highly suspect.
     
  4. Man of 1951
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    "Without apologizing, Albright also acknowledged past American meddling in Iran, including:

    • "Significant" U.S. involvement in the 1953 overthrow of leftist Iranian premier Mohammed Mossadegh

    • Support for Shah Reza Pahlavi's "brutal repression" of political dissent

    • Washington's "shortsighted" support of Iraq during the Iran-Iraq war of the 1980s. "

    http://www.cnn.com/2000/WORLD/meast/03/17/us.iran.02/index.html

    Guatamala: http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB4/cia-guatemala5_a.html

    "The U.S. initially supported President Diem but six years later architected a coup d'etat
    using General Duong Van Minh, Mai Huu Xuan, Ton That Dinh, and others ... ).
    General Mai ordered the murder of President Diem, Advisor Nhu, Colonel Le Quang Tung,
    Colonel Ho Tan Quyen, LTC Le Quang Trieu and other Vietnamese Special Forces Staff.

    To cover up the blunder, US press reported that President Diem was corrupted.
    When he was assasinated, he owned only one very small and simple home."

    http://ngothelinh.web1000.com/NgoDinhDiem.html

    Vietnam: vietnam war...plenty of info on that

    Chile: "The violent overthrow of the democratically-elected Popular Unity government of Salvador Allende changed the course of the country that Chilean poet Pablo Neruda described as "a long petal of sea, wine and snow"; because of CIA covert intervention in Chile, and the repressive character of General Pinochet's rule, the coup became the most notorious military takeover in the annals of Latin American history."
    http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB8/nsaebb8i.htm

    El Salvador: "For many years, repression, torture and murder were carried on in El Salvador by dictators installed and supported by our government, a matter of no interest here. The story was virtually never covered. By the late 1970s, however, the US government began to be concerned about a couple of things.

    One was that Somoza, the dictator of Nicaragua, was losing control. The US was losing a major base for its exercise of force in the region. A second danger was even more threatening. In El Salvador in the 1970s, there was a growth of what were called "popular organizations" -- peasant associations, cooperatives, unions, Church-based Bible study groups that evolved into self-help groups, etc. That raised the threat of democracy.

    In February 1980, the Archbishop of El Salvador, Oscar Romero, sent a letter to President Carter in which he begged him not to send military aid to the junta that ran the country. He said such aid would be used to "sharpen injustice and repression against the people's organizations" which were struggling "for respect for their most basic human rights" (hardly news to Washington, needless to say).

    A few weeks later, Archbishop Romero was assassinated while saying a mass."

    http://www.zmag.org/chomsky/sam/sam-2-02.html

    Bin Laden: "[Bin Laden] Trained by the U.S. war experts to fight the Russians in Afghanistan in the 1980s, bin Laden now trains and finances terrorist groups, an accusation he denies but refuses to surrender himself for a trial."

    http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2001/1/3/214858.shtml

    Contra's Nicaragua: "In what became known as the Iran-Contra Affair, US President Ronald Reagan's administration secretly sold arms to Iran, which was engaged in a bloody war with its neighbor Iraq from 1980 to 1988 (see Iran-Iraq War), and diverted the proceeds to the Contra rebels fighting to overthrow the leftist Sandinista government of Nicaragua."

    http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran-Contra_Affair

    Death Squads: http://www.serendipity.li/cia/death_squads.htm

    "Now, there is compelling evidence to show that for over 30 years, members
    of the US military and the CIA have helped organize, train, and fund death
    squad activity in El Salvador.

    In the past eight years, six Salvadoran military deserters have publicly
    acknowledged their participation in the death squads. Their stories are
    notable because they not only confirm suspicions that the death squads are made
    up of members of the Salvadoran military, but also because each one implicates
    US personnel in death squad activity.

    The term "death squad," while appropriately vivid, can be misleading
    because it obscures their fundamental identity. Evidence shows that "death
    squads" are primarily military or paramilitary units carrying out political
    assassinations and intimidation as part of the Salvadoran government's
    counterinsurgency strategy. Civilian death squads do exist but have often been
    comprised of off-duty soldiers financed by wealthy Salvadoran businessmen.

    It is important to point out that the use of death squads has been a
    strategy of US counterinsurgency doctrine. For example, the CIA's "Phoenix
    Program" was responsible for the "neutralization" of over 40,000 Vietnamese
    suspected of working with the National Liberation Front. [2]"

    http://www.skepticfiles.org/socialis/usdeaths.htm

    "In 1982, Alvarez was promoted to general and named commander of the army. That same year Battalion 316, a secret army intelligence unit in Honduras trained and supported by the CIA, came into existence. Battalion 316 became notorious for committing human rights abuses."

    http://www.fas.org/irp/congress/1997_rpt/soarpt.htm

    US-Iraq: According to a 1994 Senate report, private American suppliers, licensed by the U.S. Department of Commerce, exported a witch's brew of biological and chemical materials to Iraq from 1985 through 1989. Among the biological materials, which often produce slow, agonizing death, were:

    * Bacillus Anthracis, cause of anthrax.


    * Clostridium Botulinum, a source of botulinum toxin.


    * Histoplasma Capsulatam, cause of a disease attacking lungs, brain, spinal cord, and heart.


    * Brucella Melitensis, a bacteria that can damage major organs.


    * Clostridium Perfringens, a highly toxic bacteria causing systemic illness.


    * Clostridium tetani, a highly toxigenic substance.

    Also on the list: Escherichia coli (E. coli), genetic materials, human and bacterial DNA, and dozens of other pathogenic biological agents. "These biological materials were not attenuated or weakened and were capable of reproduction," the Senate report stated. "It was later learned that these microorganisms exported by the United States were identical to those the United Nations inspectors found and removed from the Iraqi biological warfare program."

    http://www.progressive.org/0901/anth0498.html

    Noriega: "Then as now, the villain of the moment was an old ally. In 1984, the U.S. government welcomed the electoral fraud that gave Noriega’s military dictatorship a veneer of "democracy." That’s because Noriega was allowing the use of Panamanian planes and airfields to aid the U.S.-backed contras in their dirty war against the democratically elected government in Nicaragua--a war that took the lives of more than 30,000 people.

    But when Noriega--a longtime CIA "asset"--outlived his usefulness, his former backers turned on him.

    Noriega’s connections to drugs --which the U.S. had known about for years--was the pretext for a December 1989 invasion. During the operation, U.S. tanks leveled the poor neighborhood of El Chorrillo in Panama City, leaving 15,000 homeless, killing thousands and wounding 3,000 more."

    http://www.socialistworker.org/2001/380/380_06_RogueState.shtml

    Sudan Factory: "On Aug. 20, President Clinton personally ordered the leveling of the Al-Shifa pharmaceutical plant on the outskirts of Khartoum."

    http://www.salon.com/news/1998/09/23news.html

    Iraq Sanctions Deaths: "According to Unicef, the United Nations Children’s Fund, 4,000 more children under five are dying every month in Iraq than would have died before Western sanctions were imposed. Over the eight years that these sanctions have been in place, 500,000 extra children under five are estimated to have died."

    http://www.zmag.org/edwinthalliday.htm

    Sept. 11....i dont think i'll have to give info on that.

    There is a lot of info about these things on the net, just search "death sqauds" or something like that and a lot of info will pop up.

    Michael Moore's site is good too, it provides good links to some of them. http://www.bowlingforcolumbine.com/library/wonderful/index.php
     
  5. Man of 1951
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    My point is that while America continues to intervene with countries without support of the UN, the information you recieve from your media wouldn't always reflect the truth. Time and time again, the US has shown that it doesn't always stand for peace and democracy, but instead death and authoritarian governments. If you go back to the time period that these things occurred, nobody would know anything of the topic (sometimes), because the real information is always revealed after several decades. My point is, with America in Iraq, supporting Israel and in Afghanistan, Americans aren't always told the truth of whats happening. Who knows, maybe several decades from now, the truth will be revealed, and the truth won't necessarily be pretty. My point is to show people america's history, and why americans are hated around the world. America is hated not because they 'stand for democracy' or because they are 'peace loving', as much as Bush wants you to think, but because of America's history of intervening in countries and destroying any hope for peace and stability. Im not saying that this is the case all the time, but america's history of interferring with the affairs of other countries is filled with blood and anger. This anger has thus turned into hatred towards America. So, while Bush calls the people involved with sept. 11, terrorists (which they are), America too should acknowledge the fact that they too are terrorists for having done and doing so many unspeakable acts. So this war on terrorism shouldn't be a war to kill all terrorists, but a war to end reasons why terrorists exist. These reasons include desperate living conditions (palestine), oppression (palestine, currently iraq), intervening with countries (read my first post), supporting 'good' regimes, only to call them evil when the regime isn't beneficial to them (iraq, and many others check my first post), and lies lies and more lies (afghanistan......where's the democracy????). If america continues to solve the problem of terrorism with war (which is a form of terrorism), the real problem will never be solved.
     
  6. Bry
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    these are some fantastic posts, Man. I've been working up something similar, but you beat me to it. The fact is, the US has supplied more arms and more backing for more terrorists organizations than any other country on the planet, and that includes Mr. bin Laden. I just referenced another article in the Pre-emptive strike thread which gives alot of the details on the Iran-Iraq war, and I'll put that here again if you're interested.

    http://www.counterpunch.org/boyle1214.html

    As I said in the other post, this article is very tedious. Counterpunch, like the nation, is a great source for those of us who spin to the left. ;)
     
  7. Spirit_Soul
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    It is true that U.S.A has been a trouble maker and has been protecting its 'interests'
    Now, when we are bombed we cry. However, the poster missed a very important point. Two wrongs does not make it right.

    The whole world has been a mess and it is time that it starts to reform and reorganize itself before everything destroys everything.

    The best way to do it is through a diplomatic approach, more war would only mean more death.
     
  8. Bry
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    Well said, Spirit Soul.

    two points:
    1. I'm not convinced that the administration to set it right is one which has several members of the old cabinents that did so much to make it wrong. I'm not buyin' it NT! :D
    2. Both sides are thinkin, wouldn't it be great if we could make the world a better place AND get the last laugh?

    Diplomacy, as far as I'm concerned, would have been far preferable to plastering a starving and under equiped Iraqi army. It's just that we've caused so many problems, it's hard to talk our way out of them now...
     
  9. eric
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    Spirit is right, two wrong do not make a right. What I would like to know is why America is held to a different standard than the rest of the world? Please do not even try to tell me that all world powers do not have a closet full of skeletons. Now I'll be the first to admit that America is no saint and has slept with many brutal regimes. I do not think though, that you or I are qualified to judge the necessity of such actions and none of the links accurately reflect the mindset or thinking behind the them. It is easy to sit and judge the past with knowledge of the present but it may not have been so easy to make decisions at the time.
     
  10. Bry
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    QUOTE]Originally posted by eric
    Spirit is right, two wrong do not make a right. What I would like to know is why America is held to a different standard than the rest of the world? Please do not even try to tell me that all world powers do not have a closet full of skeletons. Now I'll be the first to admit that America is no saint and has slept with many brutal regimes. I do not think though, that you or I are qualified to judge the necessity of such actions and none of the links accurately reflect the mindset or thinking behind the them. It is easy to sit and judge the past with knowledge of the present but it may not have been so easy to make decisions at the time. [/QUOTE]

    And so saying, all conversation ends.

    I'll be the first to acknowledge that my understanding does not encompass the intentions and machinations of the US Government. But, being a big man myself, I've learned to walk carefully so as not to step on any feet. That I slip or grow careless on occasion is not the concern, but that I use my advantage to procure privelege, that is the danger. It is the obligation of power to be aware of the gift and not hurt others through carelessness or intent. These links are an indication that somewhere along the way, we have forgotten the obligations of greatness, and have replaced them with willfullness and conceit. We have trusted too much in our leaders and they have led us astray.

    We are citizens of a democracy, or something like it. In a country in which the people are hypothetically empowered to make that all-important decision of electing a leader, that people must take part in the dialogue. They must strive to make their understanding as perfect as their reason permits. It is not my fault our government sees fit to hide their motives as a dog hides it's bones. It may be that we are nothing but bone collectors condemned to pick up fragments and chips and piece them together as we may, yet that is our obligation, and I intend to fulfill it.

    And finally, I prefer to miss by being overly critical, than to miss by being overly accepting. It is the function of the critic to always complain, that we may always be on the road to something better.



    How's that for a piece of self-important condescending crap? Oh well. It's what I believe, as surely as jeff believes in God.
     

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