Aircraft carriers are as useless as battleships in an all out war with China or Russia

[Dayton3]

LO

So why do we need carriers if there is no chance of war? The fact is that no carrier can ever attack Russia or China

Why would a carrier attack Russia or China anyway? In World War Two the U.S. had a massive virtually invincible carrier force.

yet U.S. carriers rarely attacked Japan. Japan was dealt with by B-29 bomber attacks and submarine attacks on its shipping.

LOL the American carrier force was not invincible in WW2 kid. See the war was larger than Pearl of Midway your fav movie of all time.

Why are you being stupid on purpose?

List of sunken aircraft carriers - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Princeton	Light carrier	45 aircraft	24 October 1944	Leyte Gulf	108	Sunk by land based Japanese bomber during the Battle of Leyte Gulf
	St. Lo	Escort carrier	28 aircraft	25 October 1944	Leyte Gulf	143	Sunk by Japanese kamikaze aircraft during the Battle off Samar
	Saratoga	Fleet carrier	91 aircraft	25 July 1946	Bikini Atoll	—	Sunk as target during Operation Crossroads
	Wasp	Fleet carrier	76 aircraft	15 September 1942	Southeast of San Cristobal Island	193	Sunk by the Japanese submarine I-19
	Yorktown	Fleet carrier	90 aircraft	7 June 1942	North of Midway Island	81	Crippled by Japanese dive bombers and torpedo bombers during the Battle of Midway later sunk by Japanese submarine I-168 while under tow.

Wow. two carriers sunk in actual combat.

 

[esalla]

So why do we need carriers if there is no chance of war? The fact is that no carrier can ever attack Russia or China, just camel jock countries.

Not needed anymore

They, and our other military might, is why there is no chance of an all-out war. As a result of World War-II, we are the leaders of the free world. As such we are the police of the world. If you don't think we should be the police of the world, specifically, who would better fill the void?

I think little people like you should serve as the police of the world yourself instead of requiring others to do so

Why do make such a big deal about the injuries to Americans who VOLUNTEERED to serve in the military? Knowing full well what price they might have to pay.

Look kid, the fact is that when any service member gets injured or killed that they and or their families should know exactly what they were fighting for. And this is just not the case

 

[esalla]

LO

So why do we need carriers if there is no chance of war? The fact is that no carrier can ever attack Russia or China

Why would a carrier attack Russia or China anyway? In World War Two the U.S. had a massive virtually invincible carrier force.

yet U.S. carriers rarely attacked Japan. Japan was dealt with by B-29 bomber attacks and submarine attacks on its shipping.

LOL the American carrier force was not invincible in WW2 kid. See the war was larger than Pearl of Midway your fav movie of all time.

Why are you being stupid on purpose?

List of sunken aircraft carriers - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Princeton	Light carrier	45 aircraft	24 October 1944	Leyte Gulf	108	Sunk by land based Japanese bomber during the Battle of Leyte Gulf
	St. Lo	Escort carrier	28 aircraft	25 October 1944	Leyte Gulf	143	Sunk by Japanese kamikaze aircraft during the Battle off Samar
	Saratoga	Fleet carrier	91 aircraft	25 July 1946	Bikini Atoll	—	Sunk as target during Operation Crossroads
	Wasp	Fleet carrier	76 aircraft	15 September 1942	Southeast of San Cristobal Island	193	Sunk by the Japanese submarine I-19
	Yorktown	Fleet carrier	90 aircraft	7 June 1942	North of Midway Island	81	Crippled by Japanese dive bombers and torpedo bombers during the Battle of Midway later sunk by Japanese submarine I-168 while under tow.

Wow. two carriers sunk in actual combat.

Count again kid, there were 4 by this accounting, are you saying that they wanted to be sunk and did not fight back. So were you TOTALLY wrong or did you LIE. Take your pick

 

[Markle]

So why do we need carriers if there is no chance of war? The fact is that no carrier can ever attack Russia or China, just camel jock countries.

Not needed anymore

They, and our other military might, is why there is no chance of an all-out war. As a result of World War-II, we are the leaders of the free world. As such we are the police of the world. If you don't think we should be the police of the world, specifically, who would better fill the void?

I think little people like you should serve as the police of the world yourself instead of requiring others to do so

You wimped out, not surprising. Deflected instead.

I served in Vietnam, yeah, I'm that old. My Ol' Man left the same leg in Germany serving under Patton in the Battle of the Bulge. He also won two front line promotions, two Bronze Stars and a Silver Star. My Ol' Man didn't drape himself in a flag, he came home after two years in VA hospitals and worked as an auto mechanic the rest of his life.

 

[Markle]

Radar was not entirely consequential in WW2, the British used it first and their huge land based units could see 80 miles. LOL what did that radar do to stop the buzz bombs.

Your ignorance about WW-II is not surprising. I bet you went to a relatively "modern" public school.

You should learn that the "buzz bomb" (V-1 for Vengence) was developed and used late in the war. (1944-1945) It served no strategic purpose but simple revenge. Germany had lost the war at that point.

Radar may be what saved England. Hermann Goring was the commander of the German Luftwaffe and he had assured Hitler that the German Luftwaffe could easily wipe out England's air force making a land invasion much easier.

England had radar banks set up strategically along their Eastern coastline. That information was sent to several centers which had phone banks to receive the information and a huge table map of England and Europe. Shortly after takeoff, the English radar picked up the Nazi aircraft and they began plotting them on the maps before they even started to cross the channel. The English air force was alerted and flew up to exactly where the Nazis were before they even reached the coast. Radar was able to enable the Royal Air Force to determine when, where, and direction of attack, a huge advantage.

 

[esalla]

So why do we need carriers if there is no chance of war? The fact is that no carrier can ever attack Russia or China, just camel jock countries.

Not needed anymore

They, and our other military might, is why there is no chance of an all-out war. As a result of World War-II, we are the leaders of the free world. As such we are the police of the world. If you don't think we should be the police of the world, specifically, who would better fill the void?

I think little people like you should serve as the police of the world yourself instead of requiring others to do so

You wimped out, not surprising. Deflected instead.

I served in Vietnam, yeah, I'm that old. My Ol' Man left the same leg in Germany serving under Patton in the Battle of the Bulge. He also won two front line promotions, two Bronze Stars and a Silver Star. My Ol' Man didn't drape himself in a flag, he came home after two years in VA hospitals and worked as an auto mechanic the rest of his life.

Too bad that Moms and Dads are now getting notified that their sons or daughters are dead, and they have no idea what they were fighting for.

Now about Vietnam, were the Vietcong digging holes alongside the Ho Chi Minh trail really posing a danger to any American carrier?

Sorry about your Dad, at least he knew what he was fighting for, you just know what they told you, all lies. Are you aware that JFK was going to end Nam before it started and would have after his success in Cuba. LOL Johnson's first meeting after JFK's brain aneurism was about going directly into Vietnam.

 

[esalla]

Radar was not entirely consequential in WW2, the British used it first and their huge land based units could see 80 miles. LOL what did that radar do to stop the buzz bombs.

Your ignorance about WW-II is not surprising. I bet you went to a relatively "modern" public school.

My Father landed on Okinawa in 1945 with the fifth Marine division, but the future does not live in the past, it is being invented now for tomorrows entangled weapons, keep up or fade away..........................

 

[AZrailwhale]

Actually kid a carrier could appear out of no where in WW2 because radar and satellite tech did not exist.

Rudimentary radar existed and saved England. It was new and many in charge did not trust the results, what they were seeing on their own screens.

Satellites you are right about.

Did the Japs have radar at Leyte Gulf

Yes

Does anyone else say this, or just you?

The IJN began putting radar on ships in 1942. Yamato had type 21 air and sea search radar installed in July 1943, Musashi had Type 22 and Type 13 radars installed in April of 1944. CV Junyo had Type 21 radar installed July 1942. CA Haguro had a Type 13 radar installed June 1944. CA Mogami had Type 21 radar installed in September 1942. CL Oyodo had a Type 22 radar installed in March 1944. That's just a few ships picked at random. The information is from the tabular ship movements posted on combinedfleet.com.

Did any of them work, and if so what was the maximum range and resolution

Do your own research, they were at least as good as early to mid war USN and RN radars. The IJN didn't have technological problems with radar, they had doctrinal problems with it as well as production problems.

Radar was not entirely consequential in WW2, the British used it first and their huge land based units could see 80 miles. LOL what did that radar do to stop the buzz bombs.

Nothing because radar meant nothing in WW2, shit the Jap invasion of Pearl was seen on radar and no one gave a shit because no one understood how it worked

You are a maroon. Radar allowed the RAF and USAAF to intercept most of the V-1s. It allowed the RAF to intercept and destroy large numbers of Luftwaffe fighters and bombers in the BOB despite being outnumbered and having raids coming in from a third of the compass. Without it the RAF would have been destroyed over its own airfields. It allowed the Cactus Air Force to intercept and destroy the Japanese raids aimed at the various reinforcement convoys for Guadalcanal. It allowed the Luftwaffe to kill hundreds of RAF night bombers that would have been invulnerable without it. It was literally one of the keys to the Pacific victory.

 

[AZrailwhale]

So why do we need carriers if there is no chance of war? The fact is that no carrier can ever attack Russia or China, just camel jock countries.

Not needed anymore

They, and our other military might, is why there is no chance of an all-out war. As a result of World War-II, we are the leaders of the free world. As such we are the police of the world. If you don't think we should be the police of the world, specifically, who would better fill the void?

I think little people like you should serve as the police of the world yourself instead of requiring others to do so

Why do make such a big deal about the injuries to Americans who VOLUNTEERED to serve in the military? Knowing full well what price they might have to pay.

I don’t know why he makes a big deal of it, but I believe that every American soldier, Marine, Airman or sailor injured or killed defending ME is a tragedy. That IS a big deal. Like me, they put their futures on the line to defend us.

 

[Damaged Eagle]

View attachment 419214

In a all out global conflict the whole of the US Navy is pretty much useless after the first hour.

Why?

Jets, drones, and missiles, are cheaper, and the navy will be at the bottom of the sea. That includes submarines. You can't hide that much metal moving through a magnetic field for long.

As for all that electronic equipment like; naval ships, jets, drones, missiles, computers, laser sights, light weight comm gear, solar panels, etc,... That'll all be so much useless junk after the first or second EMP pulse.

Low tech like a simple 9mm Beretta, a K-Bar, candles, or vacuum tube radio, will be more useful.

*****SMILE*****

You sound like the fool who posted just above you. An "all out global conflict" is not necessarily a nuclear war.

When did I state the it would be a nuclear exchange?

Do you think EMP pulses can only be made by nuclear blasts?

*****CHUCKLE*****

 

[Daryl Hunt]

So why do we need carriers if there is no chance of war? The fact is that no carrier can ever attack Russia or China, just camel jock countries.

Not needed anymore

They, and our other military might, is why there is no chance of an all-out war. As a result of World War-II, we are the leaders of the free world. As such we are the police of the world. If you don't think we should be the police of the world, specifically, who would better fill the void?

I think little people like you should serve as the police of the world yourself instead of requiring others to do so

Why do make such a big deal about the injuries to Americans who VOLUNTEERED to serve in the military? Knowing full well what price they might have to pay.

There are other jobs that are dangerous as well and those people just couldn't find themselves doing anything else. Cops, Firefighters, Nurses, Doctors, (Nurses and Doctors during Covid), High Steel Workers (not to worry, its' how far they are off the ground, not their drug intake.). But all these jobs gets volunteers even though they are dangerous. Each one person is tailor made for each job. A Serviceman or Woman isn't any different.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

So why do we need carriers if there is no chance of war? The fact is that no carrier can ever attack Russia or China, just camel jock countries.

Not needed anymore

They, and our other military might, is why there is no chance of an all-out war. As a result of World War-II, we are the leaders of the free world. As such we are the police of the world. If you don't think we should be the police of the world, specifically, who would better fill the void?

I think little people like you should serve as the police of the world yourself instead of requiring others to do so

Why do make such a big deal about the injuries to Americans who VOLUNTEERED to serve in the military? Knowing full well what price they might have to pay.

I don’t know why he makes a big deal of it, but I believe that every American soldier, Marine, Airman or sailor injured or killed defending ME is a tragedy. That IS a big deal. Like me, they put their futures on the line to defend us.

Salute, Brother. I am so many feelings on this. Feelings that someone that isn't tailor made for the job can NEVER fathom.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Face It, The Mighty U.S. Aircraft Carrier is Finished | The American Conservative

The first step is acknowledging that in a standoff, it could lose, and badly.

www.theamericanconservative.com

Why A New Study Warns That Aircraft Carriers May Be Obsolete (Thanks To Russia And China)

Inexpensive Russian and Chinese weapons, such as cyberwar and antiship missiles, threaten the West’s reliance on expensive arms such as aircraft carriers.

taskandpurpose.com

However is America still wants to invade third World nations like Vietnam and Afghanistan or Somalia a carrier could still be useful. However if the USA attacked China or Russia with a carrier the ship would be sunk in under an hour by land based anti ship missiles that number in the thousands

I think America should be working out how to protect the eventual Communist offensive against Taiwan, Japan and Australia rather than just their own offensive measures.

If they don't take Taiwan by force, they will just swallow them by squeezing them economically, denying them travel in various critical areas they require for trade, bribing and buying politicians (as they do to the West) etc.

China is probably just in wait for the right opportunity. They just took H.K and they are working on squeezing the Aussies and NZ economically right now also, keeping them dependent on them. Once done with these irritants, they will turn their sights elsewhere.

By the time China decides to go on the offensive, they could be too advanced, or too rapid in their activities. Worse, a passive, docile America that decides "it's not worth the economic 'benefit' we enjoy from cheap labour in China, so, unfortunately, you're on your own Taiwan".

China will know when to move, it won't be until they are in a much superior position, economically, geo-politically (they are in a great spot based on the U.N and WTO fiascos) and otherwise. They have to choose to eventually expand though with a focus on economics, but we saw their swift and deliberate move into H.K. 1.4B people and weak Western leadership? Just a matter of time...

Taiwan?

China has already taken over the USA, and they are training troops in Canada now

That's as stupid a claim as the one in this thread.

And carriers are not necessarily meant to attack China or Russia directly. They can and would perform a valuable function of keeping control of the SLOCs such as to the Persian Gulf.

Exactly so carriers can only attack camel equipped nations that do not have modern anti ship missiles.

Build 11 more and this will not change

FYI = the water covers over 70% of the the Earth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! do you understand the point????
..you obviously don't know shit about wars except what you play on your PC games...
..in REAL wars, you want to control the oceans/etc--AHHHHH!! that's what the carriers are for

How do you launch an air attack on China or Russia with a carrier without that carrier sinking by the following missile attack

Haven't played a PC game in twenty years as I prefer playing with numbskulls like you

Not sure where you're getting your info.

The absolute longest range Russian anti ship missile is about 500 miles. We can easily keep our carriers further offshore than that and refuel enroute with tankers for attack aircraft.

3M22 Zircon - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

.

While the range of a Chinese anti-ship missile can exceed 2000 miles, that would require very sophisticated ship finding capability. According to a senior political scientist at the RAND Corporation, Roger Cliff, an anti-ship ballistic missile is not useful without additional complex ship detection, data processing and communication systems, all of which, including the missile itself, could be jammed or spoofed.

Anti-ship ballistic missile - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Daryl Hunt]

LO

So why do we need carriers if there is no chance of war? The fact is that no carrier can ever attack Russia or China

Why would a carrier attack Russia or China anyway? In World War Two the U.S. had a massive virtually invincible carrier force.

yet U.S. carriers rarely attacked Japan. Japan was dealt with by B-29 bomber attacks and submarine attacks on its shipping.

LOL the American carrier force was not invincible in WW2 kid. See the war was larger than Pearl of Midway your fav movie of all time.

Why are you being stupid on purpose?

List of sunken aircraft carriers - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Princeton	Light carrier	45 aircraft	24 October 1944	Leyte Gulf	108	Sunk by land based Japanese bomber during the Battle of Leyte Gulf
	St. Lo	Escort carrier	28 aircraft	25 October 1944	Leyte Gulf	143	Sunk by Japanese kamikaze aircraft during the Battle off Samar
	Saratoga	Fleet carrier	91 aircraft	25 July 1946	Bikini Atoll	—	Sunk as target during Operation Crossroads
	Wasp	Fleet carrier	76 aircraft	15 September 1942	Southeast of San Cristobal Island	193	Sunk by the Japanese submarine I-19
	Yorktown	Fleet carrier	90 aircraft	7 June 1942	North of Midway Island	81	Crippled by Japanese dive bombers and torpedo bombers during the Battle of Midway later sunk by Japanese submarine I-168 while under tow.

Wow. two carriers sunk in actual combat.

What's it take to sink a modern Carrier? Here is the last Carrier to be built for WWII with the same construction that all carriers are built to today. It missed WWII but did serve in Korea and Vietnam.

the USS Orinskany.

 

[Silver Cat]

View attachment 419214

In a all out global conflict the whole of the US Navy is pretty much useless after the first hour.

Why?

Jets, drones, and missiles, are cheaper, and the navy will be at the bottom of the sea. That includes submarines. You can't hide that much metal moving through a magnetic field for long.

As for all that electronic equipment like; naval ships, jets, drones, missiles, computers, laser sights, light weight comm gear, solar panels, etc,... That'll all be so much useless junk after the first or second EMP pulse.

Low tech like a simple 9mm Beretta, a K-Bar, candles, or vacuum tube radio, will be more useful.

*****SMILE*****

No one mentioned all out nuclear war. The fact is that if a carrier merely defends Taiwan against attack and fires upon chinese aircraft that the carrier will be sunk before it's own aircraft can land. Since the USA knows this the carrier can not be used for this. SO THE CARRIER IS USELESS

This is not really rocket science

No. Even if carriers are useless in the hypothetical "Battle For Taiwan" (I'm still not convinced of it), it does not mean that they are totally useless.

 

[esalla]

Actually kid a carrier could appear out of no where in WW2 because radar and satellite tech did not exist.

Rudimentary radar existed and saved England. It was new and many in charge did not trust the results, what they were seeing on their own screens.

Satellites you are right about.

Did the Japs have radar at Leyte Gulf

Yes

Does anyone else say this, or just you?

The IJN began putting radar on ships in 1942. Yamato had type 21 air and sea search radar installed in July 1943, Musashi had Type 22 and Type 13 radars installed in April of 1944. CV Junyo had Type 21 radar installed July 1942. CA Haguro had a Type 13 radar installed June 1944. CA Mogami had Type 21 radar installed in September 1942. CL Oyodo had a Type 22 radar installed in March 1944. That's just a few ships picked at random. The information is from the tabular ship movements posted on combinedfleet.com.

Did any of them work, and if so what was the maximum range and resolution

Do your own research, they were at least as good as early to mid war USN and RN radars. The IJN didn't have technological problems with radar, they had doctrinal problems with it as well as production problems.

Radar was not entirely consequential in WW2, the British used it first and their huge land based units could see 80 miles. LOL what did that radar do to stop the buzz bombs.

Nothing because radar meant nothing in WW2, shit the Jap invasion of Pearl was seen on radar and no one gave a shit because no one understood how it worked

You are a maroon. Radar allowed the RAF and USAAF to intercept most of the V-1s. It allowed the RAF to intercept and destroy large numbers of Luftwaffe fighters and bombers in the BOB despite being outnumbered and having raids coming in from a third of the compass. Without it the RAF would have been destroyed over its own airfields. It allowed the Cactus Air Force to intercept and destroy the Japanese raids aimed at the various reinforcement convoys for Guadalcanal. It allowed the Luftwaffe to kill hundreds of RAF night bombers that would have been invulnerable without it. It was literally one of the keys to the Pacific victory.

No German rocket drone was ever intercepted, there would never even have been time to get a plane in the air. So like the child that you are, you are applying interception as the term is known today to WW2.

Nothing even deterred the Germans slightly until the USA landed.

LOL

 

[esalla]

View attachment 419214

In a all out global conflict the whole of the US Navy is pretty much useless after the first hour.

Why?

Jets, drones, and missiles, are cheaper, and the navy will be at the bottom of the sea. That includes submarines. You can't hide that much metal moving through a magnetic field for long.

As for all that electronic equipment like; naval ships, jets, drones, missiles, computers, laser sights, light weight comm gear, solar panels, etc,... That'll all be so much useless junk after the first or second EMP pulse.

Low tech like a simple 9mm Beretta, a K-Bar, candles, or vacuum tube radio, will be more useful.

*****SMILE*****

No one mentioned all out nuclear war. The fact is that if a carrier merely defends Taiwan against attack and fires upon chinese aircraft that the carrier will be sunk before it's own aircraft can land. Since the USA knows this the carrier can not be used for this. SO THE CARRIER IS USELESS

This is not really rocket science

No. Even if carriers are useless in the hypothetical "Battle For Taiwan" (I'm still not convinced of it), it does not mean that they are totally useless.

Useless is a relative term, sure they can scare camels. However having 150 billion dollars worth of ships that can never attack the other 2 major World powers is just silly which is why Russia does not rely on this type of warfare.

 

[esalla]

Face It, The Mighty U.S. Aircraft Carrier is Finished | The American Conservative

The first step is acknowledging that in a standoff, it could lose, and badly.

www.theamericanconservative.com

Why A New Study Warns That Aircraft Carriers May Be Obsolete (Thanks To Russia And China)

Inexpensive Russian and Chinese weapons, such as cyberwar and antiship missiles, threaten the West’s reliance on expensive arms such as aircraft carriers.

taskandpurpose.com

However is America still wants to invade third World nations like Vietnam and Afghanistan or Somalia a carrier could still be useful. However if the USA attacked China or Russia with a carrier the ship would be sunk in under an hour by land based anti ship missiles that number in the thousands

I think America should be working out how to protect the eventual Communist offensive against Taiwan, Japan and Australia rather than just their own offensive measures.

If they don't take Taiwan by force, they will just swallow them by squeezing them economically, denying them travel in various critical areas they require for trade, bribing and buying politicians (as they do to the West) etc.

China is probably just in wait for the right opportunity. They just took H.K and they are working on squeezing the Aussies and NZ economically right now also, keeping them dependent on them. Once done with these irritants, they will turn their sights elsewhere.

By the time China decides to go on the offensive, they could be too advanced, or too rapid in their activities. Worse, a passive, docile America that decides "it's not worth the economic 'benefit' we enjoy from cheap labour in China, so, unfortunately, you're on your own Taiwan".

China will know when to move, it won't be until they are in a much superior position, economically, geo-politically (they are in a great spot based on the U.N and WTO fiascos) and otherwise. They have to choose to eventually expand though with a focus on economics, but we saw their swift and deliberate move into H.K. 1.4B people and weak Western leadership? Just a matter of time...

Taiwan?

China has already taken over the USA, and they are training troops in Canada now

That's as stupid a claim as the one in this thread.

And carriers are not necessarily meant to attack China or Russia directly. They can and would perform a valuable function of keeping control of the SLOCs such as to the Persian Gulf.

Exactly so carriers can only attack camel equipped nations that do not have modern anti ship missiles.

Build 11 more and this will not change

FYI = the water covers over 70% of the the Earth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! do you understand the point????
..you obviously don't know shit about wars except what you play on your PC games...
..in REAL wars, you want to control the oceans/etc--AHHHHH!! that's what the carriers are for

How do you launch an air attack on China or Russia with a carrier without that carrier sinking by the following missile attack

Haven't played a PC game in twenty years as I prefer playing with numbskulls like you

Not sure where you're getting your info.

The absolute longest range Russian anti ship missile is about 500 miles. We can easily keep our carriers further offshore than that and refuel enroute with tankers for attack aircraft.

3M22 Zircon - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

.

While the range of a Chinese anti-ship missile can exceed 2000 miles, that would require very sophisticated ship finding capability. According to a senior political scientist at the RAND Corporation, Roger Cliff, an anti-ship ballistic missile is not useful without additional complex ship detection, data processing and communication systems, all of which, including the missile itself, could be jammed or spoofed.

Anti-ship ballistic missile - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Another fool mentioning Russia and ignoring China


The DF-26B and the DF-21D are both understood to have maneuvering reentry vehicles capable at least of hitting large ships, such as aircraft carriers or large amphibious assault ships. The DF-21D has a maximum range in excess of 932 miles (1,500 kilometers), according to the Pentagon, while DF-26-series missiles can reportedly strike targets out to 2,500 miles.

Chinese media outlets, including the Hong Kong-based South China Morning Post, refer to the DF-21D, specifically, as a "carrier killer." The longer-range DF-26 is nicknamed the "Guam Express or Guam Killer," a reference to the strategic U.S. island territory in the western Pacific, which is home to major air and naval bases, but the B model with its maneuverable warhead also often gets referred to as a carrier killer missile, as well. Guam would be an important target for Chinese forces during any large-scale conflict.

Chinese Long-Range Ballistic Missiles Struck Moving Ship In South China Sea: Report (thedrive.com)

Not sure where you get your info junior.

PS China also has more subs than America, so your hypothetical 500 miles from China meaning something is just ignorance

 

[harmonica]

Face It, The Mighty U.S. Aircraft Carrier is Finished | The American Conservative

The first step is acknowledging that in a standoff, it could lose, and badly.

www.theamericanconservative.com

Why A New Study Warns That Aircraft Carriers May Be Obsolete (Thanks To Russia And China)

Inexpensive Russian and Chinese weapons, such as cyberwar and antiship missiles, threaten the West’s reliance on expensive arms such as aircraft carriers.

taskandpurpose.com

However is America still wants to invade third World nations like Vietnam and Afghanistan or Somalia a carrier could still be useful. However if the USA attacked China or Russia with a carrier the ship would be sunk in under an hour by land based anti ship missiles that number in the thousands

I think America should be working out how to protect the eventual Communist offensive against Taiwan, Japan and Australia rather than just their own offensive measures.

If they don't take Taiwan by force, they will just swallow them by squeezing them economically, denying them travel in various critical areas they require for trade, bribing and buying politicians (as they do to the West) etc.

China is probably just in wait for the right opportunity. They just took H.K and they are working on squeezing the Aussies and NZ economically right now also, keeping them dependent on them. Once done with these irritants, they will turn their sights elsewhere.

By the time China decides to go on the offensive, they could be too advanced, or too rapid in their activities. Worse, a passive, docile America that decides "it's not worth the economic 'benefit' we enjoy from cheap labour in China, so, unfortunately, you're on your own Taiwan".

China will know when to move, it won't be until they are in a much superior position, economically, geo-politically (they are in a great spot based on the U.N and WTO fiascos) and otherwise. They have to choose to eventually expand though with a focus on economics, but we saw their swift and deliberate move into H.K. 1.4B people and weak Western leadership? Just a matter of time...

Taiwan?

China has already taken over the USA, and they are training troops in Canada now

That's as stupid a claim as the one in this thread.

And carriers are not necessarily meant to attack China or Russia directly. They can and would perform a valuable function of keeping control of the SLOCs such as to the Persian Gulf.

Exactly so carriers can only attack camel equipped nations that do not have modern anti ship missiles.

Build 11 more and this will not change

FYI = the water covers over 70% of the the Earth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! do you understand the point????
..you obviously don't know shit about wars except what you play on your PC games...
..in REAL wars, you want to control the oceans/etc--AHHHHH!! that's what the carriers are for

How do you launch an air attack on China or Russia with a carrier without that carrier sinking by the following missile attack

Haven't played a PC game in twenty years as I prefer playing with numbskulls like you

Not sure where you're getting your info.

The absolute longest range Russian anti ship missile is about 500 miles. We can easily keep our carriers further offshore than that and refuel enroute with tankers for attack aircraft.

3M22 Zircon - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

.

While the range of a Chinese anti-ship missile can exceed 2000 miles, that would require very sophisticated ship finding capability. According to a senior political scientist at the RAND Corporation, Roger Cliff, an anti-ship ballistic missile is not useful without additional complex ship detection, data processing and communication systems, all of which, including the missile itself, could be jammed or spoofed.

Anti-ship ballistic missile - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Another fool mentioning Russia and ignoring China


The DF-26B and the DF-21D are both understood to have maneuvering reentry vehicles capable at least of hitting large ships, such as aircraft carriers or large amphibious assault ships. The DF-21D has a maximum range in excess of 932 miles (1,500 kilometers), according to the Pentagon, while DF-26-series missiles can reportedly strike targets out to 2,500 miles.

Chinese media outlets, including the Hong Kong-based South China Morning Post, refer to the DF-21D, specifically, as a "carrier killer." The longer-range DF-26 is nicknamed the "Guam Express or Guam Killer," a reference to the strategic U.S. island territory in the western Pacific, which is home to major air and naval bases, but the B model with its maneuverable warhead also often gets referred to as a carrier killer missile, as well. Guam would be an important target for Chinese forces during any large-scale conflict.

Chinese Long-Range Ballistic Missiles Struck Moving Ship In South China Sea: Report (thedrive.com)

Not sure where you get your info junior.

PS China also has more subs than America, so your hypothetical 500 miles from China meaning something is just ignorance

YOU are the fool playing your video games

 

[esalla]

Face It, The Mighty U.S. Aircraft Carrier is Finished | The American Conservative

The first step is acknowledging that in a standoff, it could lose, and badly.

www.theamericanconservative.com

Why A New Study Warns That Aircraft Carriers May Be Obsolete (Thanks To Russia And China)

Inexpensive Russian and Chinese weapons, such as cyberwar and antiship missiles, threaten the West’s reliance on expensive arms such as aircraft carriers.

taskandpurpose.com

However is America still wants to invade third World nations like Vietnam and Afghanistan or Somalia a carrier could still be useful. However if the USA attacked China or Russia with a carrier the ship would be sunk in under an hour by land based anti ship missiles that number in the thousands

I think America should be working out how to protect the eventual Communist offensive against Taiwan, Japan and Australia rather than just their own offensive measures.

If they don't take Taiwan by force, they will just swallow them by squeezing them economically, denying them travel in various critical areas they require for trade, bribing and buying politicians (as they do to the West) etc.

China is probably just in wait for the right opportunity. They just took H.K and they are working on squeezing the Aussies and NZ economically right now also, keeping them dependent on them. Once done with these irritants, they will turn their sights elsewhere.

By the time China decides to go on the offensive, they could be too advanced, or too rapid in their activities. Worse, a passive, docile America that decides "it's not worth the economic 'benefit' we enjoy from cheap labour in China, so, unfortunately, you're on your own Taiwan".

China will know when to move, it won't be until they are in a much superior position, economically, geo-politically (they are in a great spot based on the U.N and WTO fiascos) and otherwise. They have to choose to eventually expand though with a focus on economics, but we saw their swift and deliberate move into H.K. 1.4B people and weak Western leadership? Just a matter of time...

Taiwan?

China has already taken over the USA, and they are training troops in Canada now

That's as stupid a claim as the one in this thread.

And carriers are not necessarily meant to attack China or Russia directly. They can and would perform a valuable function of keeping control of the SLOCs such as to the Persian Gulf.

Exactly so carriers can only attack camel equipped nations that do not have modern anti ship missiles.

Build 11 more and this will not change

FYI = the water covers over 70% of the the Earth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! do you understand the point????
..you obviously don't know shit about wars except what you play on your PC games...
..in REAL wars, you want to control the oceans/etc--AHHHHH!! that's what the carriers are for

How do you launch an air attack on China or Russia with a carrier without that carrier sinking by the following missile attack

Haven't played a PC game in twenty years as I prefer playing with numbskulls like you

Not sure where you're getting your info.

The absolute longest range Russian anti ship missile is about 500 miles. We can easily keep our carriers further offshore than that and refuel enroute with tankers for attack aircraft.

3M22 Zircon - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

.

While the range of a Chinese anti-ship missile can exceed 2000 miles, that would require very sophisticated ship finding capability. According to a senior political scientist at the RAND Corporation, Roger Cliff, an anti-ship ballistic missile is not useful without additional complex ship detection, data processing and communication systems, all of which, including the missile itself, could be jammed or spoofed.

Anti-ship ballistic missile - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Another fool mentioning Russia and ignoring China


The DF-26B and the DF-21D are both understood to have maneuvering reentry vehicles capable at least of hitting large ships, such as aircraft carriers or large amphibious assault ships. The DF-21D has a maximum range in excess of 932 miles (1,500 kilometers), according to the Pentagon, while DF-26-series missiles can reportedly strike targets out to 2,500 miles.

Chinese media outlets, including the Hong Kong-based South China Morning Post, refer to the DF-21D, specifically, as a "carrier killer." The longer-range DF-26 is nicknamed the "Guam Express or Guam Killer," a reference to the strategic U.S. island territory in the western Pacific, which is home to major air and naval bases, but the B model with its maneuverable warhead also often gets referred to as a carrier killer missile, as well. Guam would be an important target for Chinese forces during any large-scale conflict.

Chinese Long-Range Ballistic Missiles Struck Moving Ship In South China Sea: Report (thedrive.com)

Not sure where you get your info junior.

PS China also has more subs than America, so your hypothetical 500 miles from China meaning something is just ignorance

YOU are the fool playing your video games

Chinese Long-Range Ballistic Missiles Struck Moving Ship In South China Sea: Report (thedrive.com)


The DF-26B and the DF-21D are both understood to have maneuvering reentry vehicles capable at least of hitting large ships, such as aircraft carriers or large amphibious assault ships. The DF-21D has a maximum range in excess of 932 miles (1,500 kilometers), according to the Pentagon, while DF-26-series missiles can reportedly strike targets out to 2,500 miles.

Chinese media outlets, including the Hong Kong-based South China Morning Post, refer to the DF-21D, specifically, as a "carrier killer." The longer-range DF-26 is nicknamed the "Guam Express or Guam Killer," a reference to the strategic U.S. island territory in the western Pacific, which is home to major air and naval bases, but the B model with its maneuverable warhead also often gets referred to as a carrier killer missile, as well. Guam would be an important target for Chinese forces during any large-scale conflict.