CDZ A Moderate Maifesto

[JimBowie1958]

I am not attacking your character, Jim. As much as we may disagree, I happen to like you quite a bit.

My point is this - when you dismiss the arguments of someone else as no more than "canned thought", you are using that as a rhetorical weapon. You are making their opinion inferior than your own, in your head, by assigning to it the premise that it is not "original", and therefore lesser than your opinion.

Well, I am glad you like me Doc, in a Bro sort of way I'm sure. you and my mom and wife make three of you in the universe...oh yeah, and Jesus. lol

I guess the phrase 'canned thinking' is too harsh though I think it is a concise way of stating the idea.

I certainly dont mean to be dismissive.

Well, except for Marxism and Transgenderism; I am dismissive toward them, lol, like I am toward advocates of the Bhor atom and those who self identify with broken sticks.

 

[Natural Citizen]

I can see why you feel that way, but no, you do have a communal bond with those who are under the same system of laws, live in the same locale or use the same publicly provided services.

Like it or not, you have never had the opportunity to refuse to sign the social compact.

You were born into it, so you might as well deal with it honestly and stop trying to fool yourself.

Well. This is the Statist's narrative. The Statist needs for us to submit to that mindset in order for Statism to grow and to be accepted in minds.

But I intend to fight!

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I am not attacking your character, Jim. As much as we may disagree, I happen to like you quite a bit.

My point is this - when you dismiss the arguments of someone else as no more than "canned thought", you are using that as a rhetorical weapon. You are making their opinion inferior than your own, in your head, by assigning to it the premise that it is not "original", and therefore lesser than your opinion.

Well, I am glad you like me Doc, in a Bro sort of way I'm sure. you and my mom and wife make three of you in the universe...oh yeah, and Jesus. lol

I guess the phrase 'canned thinking' is too harsh though I think it is a concise way of stating the idea.

I certainly dont mean to be dismissive.

Well, except for Marxism and Transgenderism; I am dismissive toward them, lol, like I am toward advocates of the Bhor atom and those who self identify with broken sticks.

Yes, in a "Bro" sort of way. I'm a taken man.

Besides, you're not my type - you're not a woman, you're way too old, and you're probably taller than 5'3, and probably weigh more than 120 lbs.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Yes, in a "Bro" sort of way. I'm a taken man.

Besides, you're not my type - you're not a woman, you're way too old, and you're probably taller than 5'3, and probably weigh more than 120 lbs.

Yeah, I am a shade or two over 120 pounds, lol.

As well as male, 59 and totally hetero, just for the record.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I can see why you feel that way, but no, you do have a communal bond with those who are under the same system of laws, live in the same locale or use the same publicly provided services.

Like it or not, you have never had the opportunity to refuse to sign the social compact.

You were born into it, so you might as well deal with it honestly and stop trying to fool yourself.

Well. This is the Statist's narrative. The Statist needs for us to submit to that mindset in order for Statism to grow and to be accepted in minds.

But I intend to fight!

Do you buy things? Services?

How are you posting on this board? Did you build your computer from base metals you mined with your own hands?

What about your internet service? Did you get that from someone else, or did you make it yourself?

 

[Natural Citizen]

Do you buy things? Services?

How are you posting on this board? Did you build your computer from base metals you mined with your own hands?

What about your internet service? Did you get that from someone else, or did you make it yourself?

Freedom of choice in the free market. As well as exercising freedom of association when I choose service providers, if I do at all. Why?

Are you wanting to talk about muh roads? I'd like to see those privatized, too.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

No, I'm not having fun with you.

You have just stumbled upon exactly what my point is.

The term is meaningless, in the sense that you're trying to use it.

I disagree.

A systematic expression of connected/interrelated opinions of various schools of thought, however precisely defined or not is an ideology and strikingly different from say the collection of opinions expressed at any bar on a Friday night after the local high school team loses.

Thinking for yourself requires some effort and not all people are willing to put in that work.

So they subscribe to canned ideological thinking.

I see it a bit like buying something off the rack vs. making something from scratch. Most people buy their ideology off the rack, deciding first on the ideology and then going about the process of conforming to the specifics. This process is reinforced by others sharing the ideology through a system of rewards/punishment for uttering pure and impure thoughts. It is a process more of memetics than dialectics.

That is a far different matter than thinking of basic values first, and then arriving at one's position through a dialectic process applying them to real life situations. The end product may appear to be an ideology, and indeed, it can be looked upon as one, but it isn't a SHARED ideology, as it is being driven from within rather than from without.

 

[Natural Citizen]

I see it a bit like buying something off the rack vs. making something from scratch. Most people buy their ideology off the rack, deciding first on the ideology and then going about the process of conforming to the specifics. This process is reinforced by others sharing the ideology through a system of rewards/punishment for uttering pure and impure thoughts. It is a process more of memetics than dialectics.

That is a far different matter than thinking of basic values first, and then arriving at one's position through a dialectic process applying them to real life situations. The end product may appear to be an ideology, and indeed, it can be looked upon as one, but it isn't a SHARED ideology, as it is being driven from within rather than from without.

At the end of the day, Individuals and groups of Individuals should be free to make rules for themselves so long as their rules aren't forced on other Individuals and other groups of Individuals. Leave me the heck alone is a pretty darn good philosophy.

 

[Picaro]

Do you buy things? Services?

How are you posting on this board? Did you build your computer from base metals you mined with your own hands?

What about your internet service? Did you get that from someone else, or did you make it yourself?

Freedom of choice in the free market. As well as exercising freedom of association when I choose service providers, if I do at all. Why?

Are you wanting to talk about muh roads? I'd like to see those privatized, too.

Toll roads never pay for themselves, and cost the users far more than public financed roads funded via gasoline taxes and the like. One the 'conservatives' had built around Austin went bankrupt in about three years, and like all such bankruptcies the 'private' interests get to walk away from it and leave taxpayers with more expenses than if they had just built the thing the normal way. Whenever 'conservatives' get around to handing out 'limited liability' status to corporations the way most of the Founders intended it to be used, then they can claim to be consistent and not total hypocrites.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Do you buy things? Services?

How are you posting on this board? Did you build your computer from base metals you mined with your own hands?

What about your internet service? Did you get that from someone else, or did you make it yourself?

Freedom of choice in the free market. As well as exercising freedom of association when I choose service providers, if I do at all. Why?

Are you wanting to talk about muh roads? I'd like to see those privatized, too.

What is a "free market", if not a social compact?

 

[Picaro]

'Free markets' are those markets where the gang with most weapons tells everybody else what they get to pay for something, or just rob everybody else and kill them if they object to the 'fair market price' they establish.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

No, I'm not having fun with you.

You have just stumbled upon exactly what my point is.

The term is meaningless, in the sense that you're trying to use it.

I disagree.

A systematic expression of connected/interrelated opinions of various schools of thought, however precisely defined or not is an ideology and strikingly different from say the collection of opinions expressed at any bar on a Friday night after the local high school team loses.

Thinking for yourself requires some effort and not all people are willing to put in that work.

So they subscribe to canned ideological thinking.

I see it a bit like buying something off the rack vs. making something from scratch. Most people buy their ideology off the rack, deciding first on the ideology and then going about the process of conforming to the specifics. This process is reinforced by others sharing the ideology through a system of rewards/punishment for uttering pure and impure thoughts. It is a process more of memetics than dialectics.

That is a far different matter than thinking of basic values first, and then arriving at one's position through a dialectic process applying them to real life situations. The end product may appear to be an ideology, and indeed, it can be looked upon as one, but it isn't a SHARED ideology, as it is being driven from within rather than from without.

This is exactly what I was referring to.

This is what you tell yourself to make your opinion superior, in your head, to your opponents. It's a way for you to feel better about yourself, nothing more.

 

[Natural Citizen]

What is a "free market", if not a social compact?

It is a choice.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Are you guys all socialists on this board or what? Why all of the hatred for Individual Liberty and freedom of choice? Freedom does not appear to be popular on this board.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

What is a "free market", if not a social compact?

It is a choice.

It is a choice to partake in it.

But you did not "choose" to live in a society that allows you to partake in it.

 

[eflatminor]

Moderation is difficult when the two sides of our political spectrum have vastly different views of the PURPOSE of the national government.

Perhaps a lack of moderation or differing views on the purpose of a federal government isn't the problem. Perhaps the problem is a national government, for everything it touches seems to turn to shit.

Stated differently, perhaps the anti-federalists were right.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Are you guys all socialists on this board or what? Why all of the hatred for Individual Liberty and freedom of choice? Freedom does not appear to be popular on this board.

You are asking the wrong questions, and assuming the wrong answers.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Well, wait a minute. Perhaps I might just need to provide some of you with a good old fashioned lesson on the traditional American philosophy.

Let's go...


A Democracy

The chief characteristic and distinguishing feature of a Democracy is: Rule by Omnipotent Majority. In a Democracy, The Individual, and any group of Individuals composing any Minority, have no protection against the unlimited power of The Majority. It is a case of Majority-over-Man.

This is true whether it be a Direct Democracy, or a Representative Democracy.


A Republic

A Republic, on the other hand, has a very different purpose and an entirely different form, or system, of government. Its purpose is to control The Majority strictly, as well as all others among the people, primarily to protect The Individual’s God-given, unalienable rights and therefore for the protection of the rights of The Minority, of all minorities, and the liberties of people in general. The definition of a Republic is: a constitutionally limited government of the representative type, created by a written Constitution--adopted by the people and changeable (from its original meaning) by them only by its amendment--with its powers divided between three separate Branches: Executive, Legislative and Judicial. Here the term "the people" means, of course, the electorate.

Source linked previously in the thread.

Umkay?

 

[Natural Citizen]

Are you guys all socialists on this board or what? Why all of the hatred for Individual Liberty and freedom of choice? Freedom does not appear to be popular on this board.

You are asking the wrong questions, and assuming the wrong answers.

How the heck did you become a moderator? Respectfully speaking, you've openly demonstrated yourself to be the most partisan hack I've seen on here. And you're so obtuse about it.

You clearly are not qualified to speak on such things. I'm sorry, but it's just true. It's observable.

 

[Chuz Life]

Way too many generalizations in the OP, as far as I am concerned.