30 year old decides not to buy health insurance

[rightwinger]

I'd let a gangbanger die in the streets - I wouldn't help that person.

They're swiss cheese because they made a decision to join a gang and with that comes the consequences.

Gangbangers are a liability to society, taxpayers either pay to incarcerate them or the hospitals eat their medical bills from the lead they caught.....

Not to mention they're collecting welfare...

Not to mention the welfare....

Nobody really gives a shit about your gangbangers when we have 35 million uninsured

last week someone said it was close to 50 million......another time it was 25 million.....will the real number please stand up?.....

How about......"a lot of fucking Americans do not have health insurance"

 

[Greenbeard]

Again: HI should revert back to it's original intent: Catastrophic Insurance only, along with being non-profit. Take out the profit, HMOs, shareholders, contracts with providers, etc, and what the consumer will find is health care costs that are much lower.
If we have to make a co-pay at the Doc's office, logic would dictate the co-pay would cover the actual visit to begin with.

Well, one way to shift away from profit-driven insurance would be to foster strong non-profit competitors. That's why non-profit, member-driven CO-OPs are being seeded right now. Expectations for their impact are being kept low but it would be nice to be pleasantly surprised.

High deductible plans are allowed right now and they're likely to become even more prevalent. This year, high deductible plans have a minimum deductible of $1,200 (and a maximum out-of-pocket of $5,950). KFF commissioned three consulting firms to get an idea of what deductibles for single coverage might look like in the health insurance exchanges launching in states in 2014:

In a new study we just released, we commissioned three different actuarial consulting firms to estimate what deductibles may look like for people buying coverage in the new health insurance exchanges beginning in 2014. The analysis is complex because the levels of coverage in the ACA are specified using an "actuarial value" (the percentage of health care expenses the plan is expected to cover for a typical population of enrollees). Needless to say, actuarial value is not exactly a concept that makes a whole lot of sense to most people. The combination of deductible and coinsurance amounts that satisfy an actuarial value -- which determine how much someone with a given level of health expenses will pay out-of-pocket -- will vary from plan to plan and can only be estimated at this point. That's the reason we used three firms -- to surround a difficult technical task.

The three firms produced a wide range of estimates (a notable result in itself, and one that has implications for consumers and for federal policymakers now writing the regulations that will guide how state exchanges operate). But significantly, in all cases, the deductibles were high -- ranging from $2,750 with 30% coinsurance to $6,350 with no coinsurance for an individual policy for the basic Bronze plan in 2014, which is the minimum people can buy and satisfy the so-called "individual mandate." Patient out-of-pocket costs would be capped at $6,350, an amount that's specified in the ACA. All of these amounts would be double for a family policy. ​

That is, we're moving in exactly the direction you'd like. I'm not sure how you'd get rid of insurer contracts with provider organizations.

Again: competition that crosses state lines is a win for consumers. Of course all states would have to agree to same state over-sites, such as Maine currently has.

The call for interstate sales is generally aimed at either 1) facilitating more health plan offerings, or 2) providing a vehicle for undermining state regulations. In the political sphere, the intent is usually the latter. Since you recognize the need for common baselines regulations, it sounds like your intent is the former. The recent reforms offer several pathways to increasing plan offerings in states (allowing interstate sales, subject to baseline regulations):

• The creation of multi-state health plans that will be sold in every state
• Regs for interstate health care choice compacts that allow insurers in participating states to sell products in other participating states
• Multi-state exchanges (i.e. insurance markets covering more than one state)

Again: ZERO states have deregulated the sale (and acceptence of sold HI) of HI across state lines.

States can't force other states to accept the sale of policies issues in their states; they can, however, allow policies issued in other states to be sold within their borders. That's what I'm referring to. And I'll repeat the examples I already mentioned:

• Wyoming's Enrolled Act 61 (signed in 2010) allows health insurance plans issued in certain other states to be sold in Wyoming
• Georgia's H.B. 47 (signed in May of this year) allows for the sale of individual health insurance policies issued in other states
• Maine's LD290 (passed in May of this year) allows out-of-state insurers access to the state's health insurance market

 

[Maple]

Like everyone who tries to keep us in this mess so they can have more money.

I dont care who they are.

Can have more money??????????????? What??????????? It's the money we sweated, worked for and earned, it is not yours, you did not earn it, we did. You have absolutely no right to sit on your duff and demand that others pay for you or your irresponsibility.

 

[Rozman]

Lets just take all the money away from people.Government knows how to spend it better then we do anyway.

 

[FA_Q2]

Sure I will be paying the bill, just like now

OK ... so whats the difference? Why is the health care bill needed ... oh so they can CONTROL it and they do so good when they control things!!

with the health care bill, he will be forced to buy insurance....so the 6 months cost will not come on down to you and me....?

But that was your POINT - the 6 month cost WOULD come down on you and me. That is the entire point of the lefts push, they want to make sure that we all are paying for everyone else and the number one excuse they use to push that is.... we are paying for everyone else!! Does anyone else see the logic circle here...

And it is for people like you that I make this post.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/4154020-post49.html

Your premiums are jacked because some people are not paying anything. They are not all bad actors either. Staying in the hospital for 3-4 days starts to rack up debt into the tens of thousands.

The hospitals can't "dump" or refuse to care for patient's because of federal EMTALA laws.

So people like you are stuck in the middle.

And hilariously fight tooth and nail against any sort of reform while bitching that your premiums are going up.

BTW, guess who wins with Tort Reform? I'll give you a hint: It's not the patients, the rest of the policy holders, or the doctors.

My premiums were jacked because of namby pamby cry babies that think insurance should cover all of their wants. This brand of insurance is not allowed to act like insurance. I insure against accidents not for subsidizing an office visit.................

Apparently it does. What, did you think you were going to be immune from the cost of treating the whole group of insured patients under your plan when you threw your money in the kitty?

How do you think insurance works? Might as well do some preventative care and get your money's worth.

At any rate, your complaint is specific to your provider. Not the nation at large.

That was not his point. His premiums, as all our premiums, are ever increasing in part because of asinine coverage requirements that we simply do not want. I do not need coverage for hundreds of things that my health insurance may cover but I am still REQUIRED to have coverage for those things if I get any type of coverage at all. That is completely asinine. There is no reason that I should not be able to acquire simple insurance plans that cover catastrophic hospitalization events but not the average doctors visit. I can pay cash if I get the sniffles.

Simple analogy here...

Which costs more...getting regular oil changes or driving until the car blows up and buying a new engine?

That has nothing to do with what we are talking about. Preventative care needs to be improved in this nation, I don't think that anyone would argue otherwise.

I find it weird that you guys think waiting for a catastrophic event is more cost effective then regular health maintenance.

No one said anything of the sort. The point is that those minor events should be PAID FOR BY THE CONSUMER, not by insurance. No one is saying that you should not get a colonoscopy rather the point is that the insurance company has no business being involved in that procedure. It is cheap and easy for the consumer to pay that directly. I would venture that there should be some benefit to making sure you get those preventative measures accomplished like premium deductions for coverage but they should not be covering the bill directly.

That 30 year old who decides not to buy health insurance ends up needing 6-months of hospitalization. Who should pay?

The 30 year old, his family, and then, if necessary, a charity.

Let's stop pretending that this man didn't have a responsibility to take care of himself.

So a horrible car accident is his fault? Him getting cancer is his fault? His liver not functioning correctly is his fualt?

Do you have any idea how idiotic you sound?

Do you have any idea how idiotic you sound? No one said cancer was their own fault. Not having medical insurance on the other hand IS his fault and there is no way around that.

 

[Ravi]

You already have insurance. How does forcing the uninsured to carry insurance effect your bottom line?

 

[OODA_Loop]

16,000 new enforcement agents is a start of effecting my bottom line.

 

[rightwinger]

Lets just take all the money away from people.Government knows how to spend it better then we do anyway.

In many cases, the government does know how to spend it better than you do. You are not very good at building roads and bridges. You were never very good at forming a Navy or inspecting food or drugs.

That is why we pay taxes

 

[chanel]

And most people have no problem with that rightwinger. Hell, I was all for the stimulus when I believed it would be used to fix the bridges. A trillion dollars later, how many have been brought up to safety standards?

 

[editec]

And most people have no problem with that rightwinger. Hell, I was all for the stimulus when I believed it would be used to fix the bridges. A trillion dollars later, how many have been brought up to safety standards?

A trillion dollars spent on bridge repair?

News to me.

Got a link?

 

[Harry Dresden]

Nobody really gives a shit about your gangbangers when we have 35 million uninsured

last week someone said it was close to 50 million......another time it was 25 million.....will the real number please stand up?.....

How about......"a lot of fucking Americans do not have health insurance"

and how many of those "fucking Americans".....choose not to have it?.....how many Illegals are included in with those Americans?......and please dont tell me they are not included.....because out here they seem to be counted in many things....

 

[rightwinger]

last week someone said it was close to 50 million......another time it was 25 million.....will the real number please stand up?.....

How about......"a lot of fucking Americans do not have health insurance"

and how many of those "fucking Americans".....choose not to have it?.....how many Illegals are included in with those Americans?......and please dont tell me they are not included.....because out here they seem to be counted in many things....

Illegals do not count as Americans, they are below the radar

All 30 million "choose" not to have health insurance. They "choose" to pay the rent, electric bill, car payments over a healthcare plan they do not currently need

 

[Harry Dresden]

Lets just take all the money away from people.Government knows how to spend it better then we do anyway.

In many cases, the government does know how to spend it better than you do. You are not very good at building roads and bridges. You were never very good at forming a Navy or inspecting food or drugs.

That is why we pay taxes

the last Roads that were built here were i am at RW.....a private Company was contracted to do it.....

 

[rightwinger]

Lets just take all the money away from people.Government knows how to spend it better then we do anyway.

In many cases, the government does know how to spend it better than you do. You are not very good at building roads and bridges. You were never very good at forming a Navy or inspecting food or drugs.

That is why we pay taxes

the last Roads that were built here were i am at RW.....a private Company was contracted to do it.....

So were the bridges. The government is not allowed to compete with private companies. But tax dollars pay for it

 

[Harry Dresden]

How about......"a lot of fucking Americans do not have health insurance"

and how many of those "fucking Americans".....choose not to have it?.....how many Illegals are included in with those Americans?......and please dont tell me they are not included.....because out here they seem to be counted in many things....

Illegals do not count as Americans, they are below the radar

All 30 million "choose" not to have health insurance. They "choose" to pay the rent, electric bill, car payments over a healthcare plan they do not currently need

bull fucking shit.....in California they are considered part of this State Legal or otherwise....and for anyone to tell me different ill tell them the same dam thing.....

 

[chanel]

When all of these factors are put together, the 2003 BlueCross BlueShield study determined that 8.2 million Americans are actually without coverage for the long haul, because they are too poor to purchase health care but earn too much to qualify for government assistance. Even being without insurance still doesn't mean they won't have access to care, because federal law forbids hospitals from denying treatment to patients who show up at the emergency rooms.

The American Spectator : The Myth of the 46 Million

I'm sure that number is up from 2003, but the article explains the "myth" behind the numbers. Many are illegals and many are young and healthy and choose not to buy. Maybe like that hypothetical 30 year old in the OP?

 

[Full-Auto]

No, the point is that sooner or later you will need medical care. Are you married? Plan on having children?

Sooner or later? Is true. I am married I raised 4 children. The last child, we used a mid wife to save money. Couldnt afford insurance then. I paid my bills out of pocket, made payments etc.

I should not be forced into coverage I do not want or need. This entire premise by the left is for someone else to pay. Mandated coverages prove that point.

What would you have done if your wife needed an emergency c-section?

You gambled, it all came out okay, but that simply is not the case for everyone.

There wasnt the need. Maybe you missed that using A MID WIFE STILL REQUIRES ALL THE SAME DOCTOR VISITS. Plus his final approval. Had she gone past the due date it becomes speculative on any ones part. This saved me 5k

I should also mention once again this was our fourth. This isnt rocket science.

 

[geauxtohell]

Sooner or later? Is true. I am married I raised 4 children. The last child, we used a mid wife to save money. Couldnt afford insurance then. I paid my bills out of pocket, made payments etc.

I should not be forced into coverage I do not want or need. This entire premise by the left is for someone else to pay. Mandated coverages prove that point.

What would you have done if your wife needed an emergency c-section?

You gambled, it all came out okay, but that simply is not the case for everyone.

There wasnt the need. Maybe you missed that using A MID WIFE STILL REQUIRES ALL THE SAME DOCTOR VISITS. Plus his final approval. Had she gone past the due date it becomes speculative on any ones part. This saved me 5k

I should also mention once again this was our fourth. This isnt rocket science.

What? You realize that emergency c-sections are for unforeseen complications that can't be sussed out in routine prenatal visits. I mean, until the placenta is out and their bleeding is stopped, you can't rule out the need for a possible surgical procedure. C-sections aren't just elective.

Yeah, Pregnancies are simple until they aren't. Then you have a hell of a mess on your hands. You most likely have never been in the middle of something like that, but it happens all the time. As I said, Pregnancy has traditionally been the number one mortality factor for women. It's a natural process, that is frought with various possible complications.

It sounds like your wife had a certified midwife who was overseen by an OB who was on call in case of emergencies. That's a common practice, and the OB still billed for overseeing the pregnancy. You just saved money by not having them actively manage it. It's the same principle for Nurse Practitioners and Physician's Assisstants and primary care docs (with the added acuity factor of possibly needing surgery).

That's a different scenario then some of the other types of midwives who are not certified "Lay Midwives" and who tend to be involved in the more hokier practices (water births, home births, etc). No OB/GYN will touch those midwives and women who choose to utilize them for their management, do so at their own risk.

More on that:

ACOG Statement of Policy -- Midwifery Education and Certification

 

[Harry Dresden]

In many cases, the government does know how to spend it better than you do. You are not very good at building roads and bridges. You were never very good at forming a Navy or inspecting food or drugs.

That is why we pay taxes

the last Roads that were built here were i am at RW.....a private Company was contracted to do it.....

So were the bridges. The government is not allowed to compete with private companies. But tax dollars pay for it

so then who is the "YOU" in your paragraph above?....i took it to mean Private Enterprise.....

 

[Baron]

Who should pay?

Barry Hussein Obama!