2 Cops shot dead by crazy gun nut Obama hater

[WorldAHope]

You know - multiple cop shootings are on the rise since these whackos started stocking up on guns. But hey, let's give them assault rifle permits and AK-47's so they can REALLY go out there and cause havoc!

I'm all for the right to bear arms, as in a gun or two around the house for self defensive measures. I also have zero problem with gun collectors. But I am not a fan of people having and using military grade weapons - especially when they outgun police officers.

This is just a HUGE pot of water that is leading up to a boil. The radicals like Sarah Palin and co. got the right wing fired up when they tried to peg Obama as someone who "pals around with terrorists." Crowds would shout "TERRORIST!" at McCain rallies when called upon to describe Obama... and even though Obama has not made one single solitary comment about guns since he was elected, the far right has stocked up on guns like toy trains.

We are due for a severely hot summer with the coming El Nino... if one of these right-wing fuckers gets a clear shot on Obama - you can expect massive riots this summer. Pig flu. Economy. Socialism. May Day protests....All of the ingredients are coming together nicely now for a Summer no one will forget. Wish I could just leave the country from June - September.

Your argument is a strawman. Palin didn't get anybody doing anything. The fact that Biden is his VP would have WAY more of an impact. The fact the anti-gun lobby feeds the Democratic machine would have WAY more impact.

The fact that the left and the media took the teaparties and blew them all out of proportion and starting making bullshit connections to armed revolution out of peaceful, lawful demonstrations would have WAY more of an impact.

Now try looking at the facts. This guy was supposed to be going to anger management on a court order was not. The court order was for domestic violence; which, unless something's changed REAL recently, is an AUTOMATIC disqualifier for owning or possessing a firearm.

Why isn't the court enforcing the law?

This guy was a walking bomb looking for a place to explode. The connection the author attempts to make to Obama is ridiculous at best, and is nothing but bullshit as implied in the thread title.

This guy was hit with a taser and came off the ground firing with a weapon the officers were unaware of. That means small handgun, not military-style weapon.

Let me know if I missed destroying anything.

Read the article. His WIFE said he was furious about Obama being elected, was concinvced the gov't. was conspiring to get him.
He was a walking time bomb. A powerful man who got up after being Taz'ed (?!?!) so that 2 cops were not enough tto subdue hi,m.
This is yet another incident that police departments across the country will review and modify their procedures. Those cops should have been notified he carried a weapon and they should have had him facedown, hand behind his back, cuffed, with a cop's knee between his shoulder blades,
cop's gun to his head.

His wife or familiy or friends who knew him saw the signs and should have taken preventative action.
Gun collector, angry, emotionally unbalanced, paranoid, prone to attack, violent.

Take away the guy's weapons, like you would take away a drunk's car keys,
before someone gets hurt.

Any arguments like "OH, well we shouldn't do that....it would be violating his rights..."
are sheer cowardice.
Take away crazy people's weapons, or you may be the one who is staring at that those wild eyes and into that gunbarrel.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Deputies Lopez and York found Cartwright in the parking lot there, according to the Sheriff's Office. They intended to arrest him on a misdemeanor charge of domestic battery.

I don't understand this...why was what he did to his wife only considered a misdemeanor?

Different levels of abuse can be different levels of charges, Misdemeanor or not ANY domestic violence charge automatically gets your weapons pulled till it is settled and a conviction even on the lowest charge possible permanently removes your right to own weapons.

His earlier charge was all that was needed to remove his weapons, FURTHER these two cops approached him at a GUN RANGE. THEY KNEW he was ARMED. As sad as it is they died, I would say they screwed up as well.

 

[Old Rocks]

You know - multiple cop shootings are on the rise since these whackos started stocking up on guns. But hey, let's give them assault rifle permits and AK-47's so they can REALLY go out there and cause havoc!

I'm all for the right to bear arms, as in a gun or two around the house for self defensive measures. I also have zero problem with gun collectors. But I am not a fan of people having and using military grade weapons - especially when they outgun police officers.

This is just a HUGE pot of water that is leading up to a boil. The radicals like Sarah Palin and co. got the right wing fired up when they tried to peg Obama as someone who "pals around with terrorists." Crowds would shout "TERRORIST!" at McCain rallies when called upon to describe Obama... and even though Obama has not made one single solitary comment about guns since he was elected, the far right has stocked up on guns like toy trains.

We are due for a severely hot summer with the coming El Nino... if one of these right-wing fuckers gets a clear shot on Obama - you can expect massive riots this summer. Pig flu. Economy. Socialism. May Day protests....All of the ingredients are coming together nicely now for a Summer no one will forget. Wish I could just leave the country from June - September.

You are ignorant of the facts and the LAW. In order to BE PROTECTED by the Second Amendment, a weapon MUST be of a type that is used by or useful to the military. That was a Supreme Court Decision in 1939. Texas Vs White as I recall.

Add in the recent decision that the 2nd is a PERSONAL INDIVIDUAL RIGHT and you do not get to grab weapons cause you do not like how they look.

Fully automatic weapons are illegal in 17 States and the other 33 require a FEDERAL license for every individual fully automatic weapon you own or possess. I believe the fee is 800 dollars a year now and includes a thorough investigation by the Federal and local authorities. You must keep the Government informed of exactly where you maintain said weapon and even if on a one night stay over have to report where you will have said weapon. If you are traveling it is YOUR responsibility to ensure you do not carry said weapon into a State where it is illegal, license doesn't apply in those States.

The only AK-47's you can buy are SEMI AUTOMATIC and no more powerful then a hunting rifle in the 30.06 range. ANd most of them are cheap ass Chinese knock offs and couldn't hit the broad side of Barn door. Had one for a short while the sights were so fucked you couldn't even adjust them to be close to accurate. Sold the damn worthless piece of shit.

OK. Here are your points. They are only semi-automatic. But they have clips that can hold as many as 100 bullets, and fire as fast as you can pull the trigger. Or you can put a spring behind the trigger, and really go to town.

They are not accurate. They don't have to be. These nutters are not shooting people at a hundred or more yards, they are shooting at point blank range, and often, into groups of people, not really caring who they hit.

As a gun owner, the callousness displayed to the ever increasing toll that gun violence is having in our society by the wingnuts, is appalling to me. We either take it seriously, and seek some solutions as to why it seems to be so endemic in our society, or people that do not own guns will take matters out of our hands. This is a simple statement of fact. But you will view it as another attempt to "get the guns". And that is why all of us will find our Second Amendment rights infringed on.

The hysteria greeted by any suggestion concerning guns, or the people that own them, and the current death toll, is already starting to create a backlash among the citizens of this nation. Enjoy it, fellows, you have created it.

 

[Ravi]

Deputies Lopez and York found Cartwright in the parking lot there, according to the Sheriff's Office. They intended to arrest him on a misdemeanor charge of domestic battery.

I don't understand this...why was what he did to his wife only considered a misdemeanor?

Different levels of abuse can be different levels of charges, Misdemeanor or not ANY domestic violence charge automatically gets your weapons pulled till it is settled and a conviction even on the lowest charge possible permanently removes your right to own weapons.

His earlier charge was all that was needed to remove his weapons, FURTHER these two cops approached him at a GUN RANGE. THEY KNEW he was ARMED. As sad as it is they died, I would say they screwed up as well.

Okay. Why was he allowed to stay in the Reserve?

 

[Gunny]

Deputies Lopez and York found Cartwright in the parking lot there, according to the Sheriff's Office. They intended to arrest him on a misdemeanor charge of domestic battery.

I don't understand this...why was what he did to his wife only considered a misdemeanor?

I DO know the law that states someone convicted of domestic violence cannot own nor possess firearms is Federal law because we had to deal with the issue in the Marines. I don't know if it's been changed or how it was handled after I retired, but we had a Marine that could not deploy with us my last float because he was not allowed to be issued a firearm.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

You know - multiple cop shootings are on the rise since these whackos started stocking up on guns. But hey, let's give them assault rifle permits and AK-47's so they can REALLY go out there and cause havoc!

I'm all for the right to bear arms, as in a gun or two around the house for self defensive measures. I also have zero problem with gun collectors. But I am not a fan of people having and using military grade weapons - especially when they outgun police officers.

This is just a HUGE pot of water that is leading up to a boil. The radicals like Sarah Palin and co. got the right wing fired up when they tried to peg Obama as someone who "pals around with terrorists." Crowds would shout "TERRORIST!" at McCain rallies when called upon to describe Obama... and even though Obama has not made one single solitary comment about guns since he was elected, the far right has stocked up on guns like toy trains.

We are due for a severely hot summer with the coming El Nino... if one of these right-wing fuckers gets a clear shot on Obama - you can expect massive riots this summer. Pig flu. Economy. Socialism. May Day protests....All of the ingredients are coming together nicely now for a Summer no one will forget. Wish I could just leave the country from June - September.

You are ignorant of the facts and the LAW. In order to BE PROTECTED by the Second Amendment, a weapon MUST be of a type that is used by or useful to the military. That was a Supreme Court Decision in 1939. Texas Vs White as I recall.

Add in the recent decision that the 2nd is a PERSONAL INDIVIDUAL RIGHT and you do not get to grab weapons cause you do not like how they look.

Fully automatic weapons are illegal in 17 States and the other 33 require a FEDERAL license for every individual fully automatic weapon you own or possess. I believe the fee is 800 dollars a year now and includes a thorough investigation by the Federal and local authorities. You must keep the Government informed of exactly where you maintain said weapon and even if on a one night stay over have to report where you will have said weapon. If you are traveling it is YOUR responsibility to ensure you do not carry said weapon into a State where it is illegal, license doesn't apply in those States.

The only AK-47's you can buy are SEMI AUTOMATIC and no more powerful then a hunting rifle in the 30.06 range. ANd most of them are cheap ass Chinese knock offs and couldn't hit the broad side of Barn door. Had one for a short while the sights were so fucked you couldn't even adjust them to be close to accurate. Sold the damn worthless piece of shit.

OK. Here are your points. They are only semi-automatic. But they have clips that can hold as many as 100 bullets, and fire as fast as you can pull the trigger. Or you can put a spring behind the trigger, and really go to town.

They are not accurate. They don't have to be. These nutters are not shooting people at a hundred or more yards, they are shooting at point blank range, and often, into groups of people, not really caring who they hit.

As a gun owner, the callousness displayed to the ever increasing toll that gun violence is having in our society by the wingnuts, is appalling to me. We either take it seriously, and seek some solutions as to why it seems to be so endemic in our society, or people that do not own guns will take matters out of our hands. This is a simple statement of fact. But you will view it as another attempt to "get the guns". And that is why all of us will find our Second Amendment rights infringed on.

The hysteria greeted by any suggestion concerning guns, or the people that own them, and the current death toll, is already starting to create a backlash among the citizens of this nation. Enjoy it, fellows, you have created it.

Provide actual evidence that more people have been murdered this year then any other year. This is nothing more then the Press and the Government creating a situation to justify illegal action by said Government. First you demonize then you call for "restraint" then you break the law and violate the Constitution all for the "good" of the people.

 

[WorldAHope]

First YOUSaid this! After Posting a BIG AZZED HYSTERICAL HEADLINE


"

2 Cops shot dead by crazy gun nut Obama hater
Crazy disturbed people need to be separated from any access to weapons.
Take it upon yourselves, if you know of any person who is emotionally unstable, is paranoid and convinced that the government is conspitring to get him and to take away his guns, etc, etc,
Save some lives. Take away that crazy fucker's weapons before another cop is killed,or is forced to kill.
Separate crazy people from deadly weapon"



But the ARTICLEsaid " gunman reveals he was angry Saturday about a missing tube of Clearasil"




Now I think we know WHOthe crazy person is here!.

Did you read past teh first sentence in the f-infg news article, Willow ?
No.
You are such an air head. Empty, useless, dumb anb dull.
Please, go offer yourself up in place of our police next time a crazy gun nut has snapped and is shooting.
Die in a hail of bullets. Improve the world.

I read the entire article. You have made a dishonest, partisan presentation. One you will find I dismantled nicely for you.

Partisan ?
The news article said he was an unbalanced Obama hater afraind the government was conspiring to get him.
Plain and simple.
The newspaper nwf - North West Florida - partisan ?

2 cops are dead, Gunny. In that area, it is most likely they were registered Republicans.
What is partisan about their deaths, or the shooter's ?

One more log for the fire.
Police departments across the country are working this REPEATED phenomena,
talking this through - Republican and Democrat and non affiliated police officers.
Police experts and investigators are looking at the REPEATED mechanics: WHY and HOW and WHAT triggers this behavior
and what can be done to prevent it.

save a cop. take away crazy fuckers' weapons.

 

[Gunny]

You know - multiple cop shootings are on the rise since these whackos started stocking up on guns. But hey, let's give them assault rifle permits and AK-47's so they can REALLY go out there and cause havoc!

I'm all for the right to bear arms, as in a gun or two around the house for self defensive measures. I also have zero problem with gun collectors. But I am not a fan of people having and using military grade weapons - especially when they outgun police officers.

This is just a HUGE pot of water that is leading up to a boil. The radicals like Sarah Palin and co. got the right wing fired up when they tried to peg Obama as someone who "pals around with terrorists." Crowds would shout "TERRORIST!" at McCain rallies when called upon to describe Obama... and even though Obama has not made one single solitary comment about guns since he was elected, the far right has stocked up on guns like toy trains.

We are due for a severely hot summer with the coming El Nino... if one of these right-wing fuckers gets a clear shot on Obama - you can expect massive riots this summer. Pig flu. Economy. Socialism. May Day protests....All of the ingredients are coming together nicely now for a Summer no one will forget. Wish I could just leave the country from June - September.

Your argument is a strawman. Palin didn't get anybody doing anything. The fact that Biden is his VP would have WAY more of an impact. The fact the anti-gun lobby feeds the Democratic machine would have WAY more impact.

The fact that the left and the media took the teaparties and blew them all out of proportion and starting making bullshit connections to armed revolution out of peaceful, lawful demonstrations would have WAY more of an impact.

Now try looking at the facts. This guy was supposed to be going to anger management on a court order was not. The court order was for domestic violence; which, unless something's changed REAL recently, is an AUTOMATIC disqualifier for owning or possessing a firearm.

Why isn't the court enforcing the law?

This guy was a walking bomb looking for a place to explode. The connection the author attempts to make to Obama is ridiculous at best, and is nothing but bullshit as implied in the thread title.

This guy was hit with a taser and came off the ground firing with a weapon the officers were unaware of. That means small handgun, not military-style weapon.

Let me know if I missed destroying anything.

Read the article. His WIFE said he was furious about Obama being elected, was concinvced the gov't. was conspiring to get him.
He was a walking time bomb. A powerful man who got up after being Taz'ed (?!?!) so that 2 cops were not enough tto subdue hi,m.
This is yet another incident that police departments across the country will review and modify their procedures. Those cops should have been notified he carried a weapon and they should have had him facedown, hand behind his back, cuffed, with a cop's knee between his shoulder blades,
cop's gun to his head.

His wife or familiy or friends who knew him saw the signs and should have taken preventative action.
Gun collector, angry, emotionally unbalanced, paranoid, prone to attack, violent.

Take away the guy's weapons, like you would take away a drunk's car keys,
before someone gets hurt.

Any arguments like "OH, well we shouldn't do that....it would be violating his rights..."
are sheer cowardice.
Take away crazy people's weapons, or you may be the one who is staring at that those wild eyes and into that gunbarrel.

I read the article. He was furious over a missing tube of Clearasil. It says he was "severely disturbed" over Obama's election as one of several asides to show his mental instability. It does not state that was his motive for shooting the cops as you have tried to imply with your thread title.

This is case that isn't going to be reviewed more than any other and you're just trying to sensationalize. The guy was a gun range. How much more clue does one need than THAT?

Obviously YOU didn't read your own article or you'd know HE took two guns away from his wife. It is not his friends nor his wife's responsibility. She obviously filed charges of domestic violence against the guy.

Trying to take someone's guns away is not only stupid on your part, it's irresponsible of you to even suggest such a thing where someone might actually try such a stunt.

The court is who failed here. The guy was obviously a KNOWN whacko and a judge let him walk without a conviction.

 

[Gunny]

I don't understand this...why was what he did to his wife only considered a misdemeanor?

Different levels of abuse can be different levels of charges, Misdemeanor or not ANY domestic violence charge automatically gets your weapons pulled till it is settled and a conviction even on the lowest charge possible permanently removes your right to own weapons.

His earlier charge was all that was needed to remove his weapons, FURTHER these two cops approached him at a GUN RANGE. THEY KNEW he was ARMED. As sad as it is they died, I would say they screwed up as well.

Okay. Why was he allowed to stay in the Reserve?

Why shouldn't he be?

 

[Bfgrn]

Here is an article from a local Florida paper...

It is clear WAHope's headline is NOT misleading AND this right wing NUT shouldn't have been allowed to have a fucking squirt gun!


Shooting deaths: 'None of it makes sense'
The events that led to the shooting deaths of two Okaloosa County sheriff's deputies Saturday began in a small top-floor apartment in Fort Walton Beach - with an argument over a tube of Clearasil.

On Sunday, lawmen still were investigating why Joshua Cartwright, a 28-year-old U.S. Army Reserve soldier with a history of violence, killed Okaloosa County sheriff's deputies Burt Lopez and Warren "Skip" York at a gun range in Crestview.

A few minutes after he killed the deputies, Cartwright was himself killed in a shootout with lawmen in DeFuniak Springs.

"None of it's logical, none of it makes sense," said interim Sheriff Ed Spooner on Sunday. "He'd obviously just got something else in his mind."

An offense report filed against Cartwright the day he died outlines an angry husband who threatened his wife, kept guns and knives on hand, was "severely disturbed" that Barack Obama had been elected president, and believed the U.S. government was conspiring against him.

According to the report, events spun out of control Saturday morning.

please review and adhere to the rules for posting copywritten material
thanks

 

[Ravi]

Different levels of abuse can be different levels of charges, Misdemeanor or not ANY domestic violence charge automatically gets your weapons pulled till it is settled and a conviction even on the lowest charge possible permanently removes your right to own weapons.

His earlier charge was all that was needed to remove his weapons, FURTHER these two cops approached him at a GUN RANGE. THEY KNEW he was ARMED. As sad as it is they died, I would say they screwed up as well.

Okay. Why was he allowed to stay in the Reserve?

Why shouldn't he be?

I don't know, that's why I'm asking. If he was charged with domestic violence and ordered to take anger management classes wouldn't that bit of information raise a red flag with the Reserve? Or must one be a convicted felon?

 

[Gunny]

Did you read past teh first sentence in the f-infg news article, Willow ?
No.
You are such an air head. Empty, useless, dumb anb dull.
Please, go offer yourself up in place of our police next time a crazy gun nut has snapped and is shooting.
Die in a hail of bullets. Improve the world.

I read the entire article. You have made a dishonest, partisan presentation. One you will find I dismantled nicely for you.

Partisan ?
The news article said he was an unbalanced Obama hater afraind the government was conspiring to get him.
Plain and simple.
The newspaper nwf - North West Florida - partisan ?

2 cops are dead, Gunny. In that area, it is most likely they were registered Republicans.
What is partisan about their deaths, or the shooter's ?

One more log for the fire.
Police departments across the country are working this REPEATED phenomena,
talking this through - Republican and Democrat and non affiliated police officers.
Police experts and investigators are looking at the REPEATED mechanics: WHY and HOW and WHAT triggers this behavior
and what can be done to prevent it.

save a cop. take away crazy fuckers' weapons.

You have been corrected already. I'm calling YOU, not the paper, not the shooter, not the cops, partisan. YOU wrote the thread title with no evidence whatsoever that this guy being severely disturbed over Obama's election had ANYTHING to do with the shooting.

The news article did NOT say he was an unbalanced Obama hater. That's YOU making connections that are not present.

Nothing can be done to prevent the behavior. That's what happens when you live in an allegedly free society. Cops are ALWAYS in reaction mode. The criminal ALWAYS dictates the action.

 

[xsited1]

The guy must've had really bad acne.

 

[WorldAHope]

Crazy disturbed people need to be separated from any access to weapons.
Take it upon yourselves, if you know of any person who is emotionally unstable, is paranoid and convinced that the government is conspitring to get him and to take away his guns, etc, etc,
Save some lives. Take away that crazy fucker's weapons before another cop is killed,
or is forced to kill.
Separate crazy people from deadly weapons.

http://www.nwfdailynews.com/news/cartwright_16963___article.html/elizabeth_deputies.html

Shooting deaths: 'None of it makes sense'
Comments 141 | Recommend 23
A day after two deputies died in Crestview, an offense report filed against the gunman reveals he was angry Saturday about a missing tube of Clearasil
April 26, 2009 - 4:24 PM
Andrew Gant
Daily News

The events that led to the shooting deaths of two Okaloosa County sheriff's deputies Saturday began in a small top-floor apartment in Fort Walton Beach - with an argument over a tube of Clearasil.

On Sunday, lawmen still were investigating why Joshua Cartwright, a 28-year-old U.S. Army Reserve soldier with a history of violence, killed Okaloosa County sheriff's deputies Burt Lopez and Warren "Skip" York at a gun range in Crestview.

A few minutes after he killed the deputies, Cartwright was himself killed in a shootout with lawmen in DeFuniak Springs.

"None of it's logical, none of it makes sense," said interim Sheriff Ed Spooner on Sunday. "He'd obviously just got something else in his mind."

An offense report filed against Cartwright the day he died outlines an angry husband who threatened his wife, kept guns and knives on hand, was "severely disturbed" that Barack Obama had been elected president, and believed the U.S. government was conspiring against him.

According to the report, events spun out of control Saturday morning.

It's a tragic story, but what are you suggesting?

Take away someone's guns because they seem a little bit odd or have an opinion that is fundamentally different to your own? What qualifies the general public to determine whether someone is dangerous?

Report them to the cops? Unless they have a reason to remove someone's weapons there's not much they'd be able to do.

Until laws are tightened up in this regard there's no proactive way of getting at the problem within the legal framework.

The hypocrisy IS rather obvious. You can't arrest criminals for what they are thinking -- only after they commit a crime. Yet when it comes to gun owners, lefties always presume guilt simply by reason of ownership and want to go flailing around in the dark trying to be preemptive about THAT.

As a noncom in the military, was it not your responsibility to stay alert to the mental and emotional state of the troops under your command, especially if they can access live ammunition ?
Wouldn't it be remiss for a Sgt. to ignore, fail to act with a guy like this who was under their command, especially if his platoon mates said "Hey, this guy's got serious issues......" ?
I speak from my own experience.

 

[Gunny]

Okay. Why was he allowed to stay in the Reserve?

Why shouldn't he be?

I don't know, that's why I'm asking. If he was charged with domestic violence and ordered to take anger management classes wouldn't that bit of information raise a red flag with the Reserve? Or must one be a convicted felon?

The military can give waivers for a lot of things. That depends on the service, its needs, and its rules.

This guy was out of the military. That means he had what was left of 8 years to spend in the inactive reserve. If he was in the active reserve, he chose to go that route. In any event, the domestic violence charge was last year. If he was already in, they'd still most likely let him finish his current enlistment.

Even a conviction for domestic violence, or a felony for that matter, is no guarantee it will be even acted upon by the military. And vice-versa. Military people are legally punished all the time by the military with no knowledge nor action by civilian authority.

 

[WorldAHope]

Your argument is a strawman. Palin didn't get anybody doing anything. The fact that Biden is his VP would have WAY more of an impact. The fact the anti-gun lobby feeds the Democratic machine would have WAY more impact.

The fact that the left and the media took the teaparties and blew them all out of proportion and starting making bullshit connections to armed revolution out of peaceful, lawful demonstrations would have WAY more of an impact.

Now try looking at the facts. This guy was supposed to be going to anger management on a court order was not. The court order was for domestic violence; which, unless something's changed REAL recently, is an AUTOMATIC disqualifier for owning or possessing a firearm.

Why isn't the court enforcing the law?

This guy was a walking bomb looking for a place to explode. The connection the author attempts to make to Obama is ridiculous at best, and is nothing but bullshit as implied in the thread title.

This guy was hit with a taser and came off the ground firing with a weapon the officers were unaware of. That means small handgun, not military-style weapon.

Let me know if I missed destroying anything.

Read the article. His WIFE said he was furious about Obama being elected, was concinvced the gov't. was conspiring to get him.
He was a walking time bomb. A powerful man who got up after being Taz'ed (?!?!) so that 2 cops were not enough tto subdue hi,m.
This is yet another incident that police departments across the country will review and modify their procedures. Those cops should have been notified he carried a weapon and they should have had him facedown, hand behind his back, cuffed, with a cop's knee between his shoulder blades,
cop's gun to his head.

His wife or familiy or friends who knew him saw the signs and should have taken preventative action.
Gun collector, angry, emotionally unbalanced, paranoid, prone to attack, violent.

Take away the guy's weapons, like you would take away a drunk's car keys,
before someone gets hurt.

Any arguments like "OH, well we shouldn't do that....it would be violating his rights..."
are sheer cowardice.
Take away crazy people's weapons, or you may be the one who is staring at that those wild eyes and into that gunbarrel.

I read the article. He was furious over a missing tube of Clearasil. It says he was "severely disturbed" over Obama's election as one of several asides to show his mental instability. It does not state that was his motive for shooting the cops as you have tried to imply with your thread title.

This is case that isn't going to be reviewed more than any other and you're just trying to sensationalize. The guy was a gun range. How much more clue does one need than THAT?

Obviously YOU didn't read your own article or you'd know HE took two guns away from his wife. It is not his friends nor his wife's responsibility. She obviously filed charges of domestic violence against the guy.

Trying to take someone's guns away is not only stupid on your part, it's irresponsible of you to even suggest such a thing where someone might actually try such a stunt.

The court is who failed here. The guy was obviously a KNOWN whacko and a judge let him walk without a conviction.

So now its the "Court's" fault, it was the "court's' responsibility - nobody else ?

What ever happened to government (court is a governmental body) staying out of people's lives, not interfering ?
You can't get your arguments straight, they are twisting all around your feet.

We can take care of our selves, without governmental intervention.
Take away crazy fuckers' weapons.
Don't count on a court order, don't fall back on its "the court's fault...oh where is the court when you need them..."
Only lib wimp pussies talk or think like that.

 

[Gunny]

It's a tragic story, but what are you suggesting?

Take away someone's guns because they seem a little bit odd or have an opinion that is fundamentally different to your own? What qualifies the general public to determine whether someone is dangerous?

Report them to the cops? Unless they have a reason to remove someone's weapons there's not much they'd be able to do.

Until laws are tightened up in this regard there's no proactive way of getting at the problem within the legal framework.

The hypocrisy IS rather obvious. You can't arrest criminals for what they are thinking -- only after they commit a crime. Yet when it comes to gun owners, lefties always presume guilt simply by reason of ownership and want to go flailing around in the dark trying to be preemptive about THAT.

As a noncom in the military, was it not your responsibility to stay alert to the mental and emotional state of the troops under your command, especially if they can access live ammunition ?
Wouldn't it be remiss for a Sgt. to ignore, fail to act with a guy like this who was under their command, especially if his platoon mates said "Hey, this guy's got serious issues......" ?
I speak from my own experience.

The scenario you present has NOTHING to do with the events reported in the article. In your scenario, as SNCOIC, I have authority and responsibility. None such exists with this guy except with the court that apparently let him walk from a domestic violence charge with a promise to attend anger management; which, he quit attending.

So if anyone is at fault here, it's a lenient court, and a failure by the court to follow up and ensure he is fulfilling his commitment.

 

[tigerbob]

Crazy disturbed people need to be separated from any access to weapons.
Take it upon yourselves, if you know of any person who is emotionally unstable, is paranoid and convinced that the government is conspitring to get him and to take away his guns, etc, etc,
Save some lives. Take away that crazy fucker's weapons before another cop is killed,
or is forced to kill.
Separate crazy people from deadly weapons.

http://www.nwfdailynews.com/news/cartwright_16963___article.html/elizabeth_deputies.html

Shooting deaths: 'None of it makes sense'
Comments 141 | Recommend 23
A day after two deputies died in Crestview, an offense report filed against the gunman reveals he was angry Saturday about a missing tube of Clearasil
April 26, 2009 - 4:24 PM
Andrew Gant
Daily News

The events that led to the shooting deaths of two Okaloosa County sheriff's deputies Saturday began in a small top-floor apartment in Fort Walton Beach - with an argument over a tube of Clearasil.

On Sunday, lawmen still were investigating why Joshua Cartwright, a 28-year-old U.S. Army Reserve soldier with a history of violence, killed Okaloosa County sheriff's deputies Burt Lopez and Warren "Skip" York at a gun range in Crestview.

A few minutes after he killed the deputies, Cartwright was himself killed in a shootout with lawmen in DeFuniak Springs.

"None of it's logical, none of it makes sense," said interim Sheriff Ed Spooner on Sunday. "He'd obviously just got something else in his mind."

An offense report filed against Cartwright the day he died outlines an angry husband who threatened his wife, kept guns and knives on hand, was "severely disturbed" that Barack Obama had been elected president, and believed the U.S. government was conspiring against him.

According to the report, events spun out of control Saturday morning.

It's a tragic story, but what are you suggesting?

Take away someone's guns because they seem a little bit odd or have an opinion that is fundamentally different to your own? What qualifies the general public to determine whether someone is dangerous?

Report them to the cops? Unless they have a reason to remove someone's weapons there's not much they'd be able to do.

Until laws are tightened up in this regard there's no proactive way of getting at the problem within the legal framework.

Ahh yes, the old "tighten" up the law routine. I have a thread about this shooting and it asks just what the intent was of the lean on the story, the intent of course is to lend credence to the claim military veterans are dangerous and might be terrorists and it aids the current spin by the press and the Liberals to find someway to restrict weapons access . All of course, again, for our own good.


By the way DUMB ASS, if someone is functioning just fine but has a paranoid problem with thinking the Government is out to take his weapons, the assured way to start a shooting is to arrive to TAKE AWAY his weapons.

And as a matter of fact if he was charged with domestic violence or convicted he already lost his right to own weapons. So start asking why the local cops did not seize his weapons the last time he was in JAIL. Either they failed to enforce the law or the wife said no and took responsibility for those weapons.

It's amazing how someone can jump to a conclusion just because the term "tightening up" is mentioned. Allow me to expand because "tighten up" has clearly taken on unintended meaning by the time it reached the cheap seats.

I don't give a crap what the "lean" of the story is, but you're assuming that because I say "tighten up" that I must have been influenced by this "lean". I don't think military vets are a danger. I've never said that once on this board. Where the hell did you get that from??? I do think that restricting weapons access is correct for those that have shown that they should not have access to weapons. But that's not changing the law - that's "tightening up" the current law, or its application. There are far too many cases where people who should not have access to firearms actually have easy access to them.

By the way DUMB ASS, if someone is functioning just fine but has a paranoid problem with thinking the Government is out to take his weapons, the assured way to start a shooting is to arrive to TAKE AWAY his weapons.

Hardly a blinding insight. I agree with you. Does that make neither of us dumb asses, or both of us?

And as a matter of fact if he was charged with domestic violence or convicted he already lost his right to own weapons. So start asking why the local cops did not seize his weapons the last time he was in JAIL. Either they failed to enforce the law or the wife said no and took responsibility for those weapons

The article says he was an angry husband who threatened his wife, but doesn't make clear whether he had ever been convicted of or charged with domestic violence. It does say that he has a "history of violence", but not whether he has ever been convicted. If he has been convicted, then he should have had his weapons confiscated. However, there are a lot of cases that slip through the system. This is the kind of tightening up I was talking about. I wasn't talking about banning guns. I wasn't talking about confiscating weapons purely on suspicion of malicious intent (as I thought I'd made clear). I was talking about a tightening up the law so that it is as certain as possible that such people (i.e. people with a violent record) have their guns removed before they are able to kill with them (i.e. proactively). And you raise a good example - if he had been convicted and he owned the guns, I'm not sure that his wife should have the right to take responsibility for them. We have no idea whether she knows a firing pin from a rolling pin. If they were his guns and he's been jailed for violence they he should lose them, period.

Your assumption is less about what I have said and more about what I've not said. You've read "tighten up" and assumed I mean change the law to remove guns from all sorts of people "for our own good". That's neither what I said, nor what I meant.

 

[DiamondDave]

And we take it that this liberal dork would do a write-up that is partisan party bashing when discussing a crazy "nut" like John Wayne Gacy, because he strongly supported the DEM party

No... yet again.. this is another whacko partisan newbie poster who simply wants to point out minor details like this in a feeble attempt to bash anyone who supports the REP party at all... or to bash those who don't blindly support Obama... for if we don't blindly support Obama and support gun rights, we MUST be exactly like the disturbed person that did this

Pitiful

 

[NOBama]

Crazy disturbed people need to be separated from any access to weapons.
Take it upon yourselves, if you know of any person who is emotionally unstable, is paranoid and convinced that the government is conspitring to get him and to take away his guns, etc, etc,
Save some lives. Take away that crazy fucker's weapons before another cop is killed,
or is forced to kill.
Separate crazy people from deadly weapons.

http://www.nwfdailynews.com/news/cartwright_16963___article.html/elizabeth_deputies.html

Shooting deaths: 'None of it makes sense'
Comments 141 | Recommend 23
A day after two deputies died in Crestview, an offense report filed against the gunman reveals he was angry Saturday about a missing tube of Clearasil
April 26, 2009 - 4:24 PM
Andrew Gant
Daily News

The events that led to the shooting deaths of two Okaloosa County sheriff's deputies Saturday began in a small top-floor apartment in Fort Walton Beach - with an argument over a tube of Clearasil.

On Sunday, lawmen still were investigating why Joshua Cartwright, a 28-year-old U.S. Army Reserve soldier with a history of violence, killed Okaloosa County sheriff's deputies Burt Lopez and Warren "Skip" York at a gun range in Crestview.

A few minutes after he killed the deputies, Cartwright was himself killed in a shootout with lawmen in DeFuniak Springs.

"None of it's logical, none of it makes sense," said interim Sheriff Ed Spooner on Sunday. "He'd obviously just got something else in his mind."

An offense report filed against Cartwright the day he died outlines an angry husband who threatened his wife, kept guns and knives on hand, was "severely disturbed" that Barack Obama had been elected president, and believed the U.S. government was conspiring against him.

According to the report, events spun out of control Saturday morning.