10 Reasons Not To Honor Israel

[strollingbones]

1- On June 8, 1967, Israeli air and naval forces suddenly and brutally attacked the USS Liberty, a US naval intelligence ship flying a large Old Glory in international waters on a clear summer day. Thirty-four American sailors were killed in the attack and another 174 were wounded.

Proof? I don't remember this happening, probably because you left out some major context.

2- In 2003 U.S. citizen and peace activist Rachel Corrie was run down with a bulldozer by an Israeli Occupation soldier while she was attempting to prevent a home demolition. The soldier was never charged with her death.

Good riddance. I remember this. She sided with the Palastinians all I have to say is:



What were they doing there? Context is important.



Good for Isreal.



That's an easy one. The UN is anti-semitic. Always has been.

6- Israel recently shunned a US president by refusing a settlement-freeze offer on stolen Palestinian land in return for a 10 billion dollar incentive (bribe.)

Because Obama the Idiot made them an offer that was absolutely rediculous and one he knew full well that they wouldn't accept. Shunning Obama alone, is worth praising them for.

7- Israel is the only Middle Eastern country where sodomy is not a crime nor punishable. Israel also allows abortion, has a “tramp tax” for prostitutes, an increasing rate of cohabitation and premarital sex, acceptance of party life and heavy drinking, immodest clothing, etc. Israeli media portrays Jesus Christ (peace be upon him) as a bastard and Mary as a whore. Why does Christians United for Israel prefer to be associated with a country whose hedonism rivals Sodom and Gomorrah?

You'll need to provide proof of this. The Israeli Media does no such thing. Interesting that you should be so worried about Jesus' reputation concidering your avie.


So yeah, Kudos to Isreal.

so you think cause you dont know about it...it didnt happen...you are truly an idiot

 

[theliq]

O YEAH "JUST ONE OF MANY ISRAELI ACCIDENTS" you really mean MURDERS don't you Stoney,course you do.

1- On June 8, 1967, Israeli air and naval forces suddenly and brutally attacked the USS Liberty, a US naval intelligence ship flying a large Old Glory in international waters on a clear summer day. Thirty-four American sailors were killed in the attack and another 174 were wounded.

Multiple US commisisons concluded an unintentional accident.

You're not the brightest bulb, puta.

 

[theliq]

WHAT A LOAD OF BOLLOCKS.....So I can deduce from your comment all current Americans are the sporn of illegal immigrants who invaded Native American Lands.

Fkuc you really are a silly bastard at times Stoney.

theliq

The second reason is because it was the home of the Palestinian Arabs. In 1948, it was the historical home of all the Jews and the present home of many of the Jews, but it was indisputably the present home of all the Palestinians.

Jews were Palestinians under the British Mandate prior to Israeli statehood in 1948. The Jerusalem Post was the Palestine Post.

Most of your Palestinians are recent invaders to Israel under the British Mandate who migrated to take advantage of Jewish prosperity.

Three common "Palestinian" surnames reflect their real place of origin: al-Masri [the Egyptian], al-Iraqi and Maghrebi [Maghreb, Africa]

John F. Kennedy, prior to Jewish immigration...

When the first Zionist conference met in 1897, Palestine was a neglected wasteland... I went to Palestine in 1939; and I saw there an unhappy land...For century after century, Romans, Turks, Christians, Moslems, Pagans, British – all had conquered the Holy Land – but none could make it prosper. In the words of Israel Zangwill: “The land without a people waited for the people without a land.” The realm where once milk and honey flowed, and civilization flourished, was in 1939 a barren realm – barren of hope and cheer and progress as well as crops and industries – a gloomy picture for a young man paying his first visit from the United States

Winston Churchill, Secretary of Palestine, to British Parliament, after Jewish immigration...


John F. Kennedy...

12 years later, in 1951, I traveled again to the land by the River Jordan – this time as a Member of the Congress of the United States – and this time to see first-hand the new State of Israel. The transformation which had taken place could not have been more complete. For between the time of my visit in 1939 and my visit in 1951, a nation had been reborn – a desert had been reclaimed – and a national integrity had been redeemed, after 2,000 years of seemingly endless waiting. Zion had at least been restored – and she had promptly opened her arms to the homeless and the weary and the persecuted. It was the “Ingathering of the Exiles” – they had heard the call of their homeland; and they had come, brands plucked from the burning – they had come from concentration camps and ghettoes, from distant exile and dangerous sanctuary, from broken homes in Poland and lonely huts in Yemen, like the ancient strangers in a strange land they had come. And Israel received them all, fed them, housed them, cared for them, bound up their wounds, and enlisted them in the struggle to build a new nation.

John F. Kennedy...

The technical skills and genius of Israel have already brought their blessings to Burma and to Ethiopia. Still other nations in Asia and in Africa are eager to benefit from the special skills available in that bustling land

Palestinians are the illegal Mexican aliens of the Middle East.

 

[pgm]

Both sides of the negotiators do not see it that way. Thankfully they have been past that for a good many years.

The way I see it, The only way anyone born in Jordan has any claim at all to a right of return is if his/her grandfather/great-grandfather/great-great-grandfather was born in Israel. Essentially, those in Israel before the Nakba.

That's why people want to keep going back. They don't want to move forward or they are willing to just go back for the sake of going back.

I don't think either side is guilt free on this.

If we are going to go back, then the time of Abraham is good.

Plenty of others will try to dismiss the claim, but I don't see how anyone can deny there is a 3000-year-old connection between the Jews and Israel. Not only was there a Jewish Kingdom, Jews have lived there this entire time. But you also can't deny that there has been a huge Arab population since the 8th Century or so or that the land was primarily Arab from the middle ages until 1948.

I prefer today though as then I can deal with the issue of the West Bank and Gaza with East Jerusalem as a Capital. If Israel is attacked and if a war comes, then my mind will go back to total ownership of Judea and Samaria and who knows what else. So I don't go into the future much either.

Abbas has offered to have UN Peace Keepers in the future Palestinian state. Things are much more uncertain with Gaza, of course. Then again, Gaza is far, far poorer.

So, why would I go back to when Israel held Judea and Samaria? To reminisce? OK.

But the reality stands and I believe you are further away from it than both sides of the negotiations with regard to return and land swaps.

I agree. I don't think it helps that both sides have hardliners pulling them away from compromise.

Still, I think what makes Israel, Israel is that it is a Jewish democracy in the middle east. (The closest thing to a democracy in the Arab middle east is Lebanon, so obviously, it has a while to go). If there is no Palestinian state this will cease to be. Israel cannot remain a true democracy if there is such a large percentage of its population that are not citizens (meaning the Arabs of the occupied territories). Israel cannot remain a Jewish state if the Arabs are given citizenship to keep the land as a part of Israel. I advocate a Palestinian state not just for the sake of the Palestinians, but to save Israel as well.

 

[JStone]

fools who believe the foreign government over their own sailors


USS Liberty - Israeli Pilot Speaks Up

The US government concluded the Liberty incident an accident.

 

[JStone]

Still, I think what makes Israel, Israel is that it is a Jewish democracy in the middle east. (The closest thing to a democracy in the Arab middle east is Lebanon, so obviously, it has a while to go). If there is no Palestinian state this will cease to be. Israel cannot remain a true democracy if there is such a large percentage of its population that are not citizens (meaning the Arabs of the occupied territories).

The occupation is Palestinians occupying Israel. Open a law book and try to get acquainted with the facts. Israel in its entirety is a sovereign state and so-called Palestinians are illegal aliens. The 1.5 million Israeli Arabs are Israeli citizens.

 

[Ropey]

Both sides of the negotiators do not see it that way. Thankfully they have been past that for a good many years.

The way I see it, The only way anyone born in Jordan has any claim at all to a right of return is if his/her grandfather/great-grandfather/great-great-grandfather was born in Israel. Essentially, those in Israel before the Nakba.

That's why people want to keep going back. They don't want to move forward or they are willing to just go back for the sake of going back.

I don't think either side is guilt free on this.

Which is why I said "People". Far better than Muzzies or Pigs isn't it?

Plenty of others will try to dismiss the claim, but I don't see how anyone can deny there is a 3000-year-old connection between the Jews and Israel. Not only was there a Jewish Kingdom, Jews have lived there this entire time. But you also can't deny that there has been a huge Arab population since the 8th Century or so or that the land was primarily Arab from the middle ages until 1948.

No need to deny what is known.

I prefer today though as then I can deal with the issue of the West Bank and Gaza with East Jerusalem as a Capital. If Israel is attacked and if a war comes, then my mind will go back to total ownership of Judea and Samaria and who knows what else. So I don't go into the future much either.

Abbas has offered to have UN Peace Keepers in the future Palestinian state. Things are much more uncertain with Gaza, of course. Then again, Gaza is far, far poorer.

Gaza is more than poorer. It is a hotbed...

It doesn't matter what is tried. It matters what is accomplished imo.

It will be contiguous and there will be open borders between Egypt, Jordan and of course the sea that the Jews were never pushed into and who still would rather not see that happen. You understand this I can easily see just as I understand that the babies born on both the sides are bonded to the land regardless of the past machinations of both sides.

So, why would I go back to when Israel held Judea and Samaria? To reminisce? OK.

But the reality stands and I believe you are further away from it than both sides of the negotiations with regard to return and land swaps.

I agree. I don't think it helps that both sides have hardliners pulling them away from compromise.

Still, I think what makes Israel, Israel is that it is a Jewish democracy in the middle east. (The closest thing to a democracy in the Arab middle east is Lebanon, so obviously, it has a while to go). If there is no Palestinian state this will cease to be. Israel cannot remain a true democracy if there is such a large percentage of its population that are not citizens (meaning the Arabs of the occupied territories). Israel cannot remain a Jewish state if the Arabs are given citizenship to keep the land as a part of Israel. I advocate a Palestinian state not just for the sake of the Palestinians, but to save Israel as well.

It depends. If it is a Democratic state, then it's better than it is now. But you do need to entertain the possibility of a new Islamic state. I mean the possibility of a Muslim Democracy turning into a Muslim theocracy is pretty short and linear. It is a palpable worry to Jews. If these people can not get along together long enough to decide that they want to make peace with the Jews rather than to continue killing and fighting each other over their ideology.

Soon we will see I can see movement towards this when decades of peace will have the ceasing of the hate teaching. If that does not stop, then what's the real long term use pgm?

If Muslims continue to teach their young (all over the UMMA) how to treat Jews, what will change pgm?

 

[JStone]

Quote: Originally Posted by pgm
I advocate a Palestinian state not just for the sake of the Palestinians, but to save Israel as well.

My message to the loathed Jews is that there is no god but allah, we will chase you everywhere We are a nation that drinks blood, and we know that there is no better blood than the blood of the Jews. We will not leave you alone until we have quenched our thirst with your blood, and our children's thirst with your blood, we will not rest until you leave the Muslim countries.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rleFpY402vM]Palestinian - Terrorism - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Xotov]

Wow. 7.5 million people surrounded by 300 million, most of whom want them all dead, just because of who they are. And yet they are not only surviving, but thriving. And you bitch about checkpoints... God bless Israel, please.

 

[pgm]

Wow. 7.5 million people surrounded by 300 million, most of whom want them all dead, just because of who they are. And yet they are not only surviving, but thriving. And you bitch about checkpoints... God bless Israel, please.

Most of 300 million Arabs want all the Jews dead? Care to back that up with a poll or something? I agree that most have an unfavorable opinion, but that's hardly the same thing.

The occupation is Palestinians occupying Israel. Open a law book and try to get acquainted with the facts. Israel in its entirety is a sovereign state and so-called Palestinians are illegal aliens. The 1.5 million Israeli Arabs are Israeli citizens.

I use the term "occupied territories" because that is how they are internationally recognized under international law (you can't really acquire territory through war in the current international system, but you can occupy it. However, Jordan relinquished all claims to it, so it's land that isn't internationally recognized as belonging to any sovereign state).

Anyway, how do you call a Palestinian who was born in Safed (had his parents born in Safed, his grandparents born in Safed, etc.) an alien. I'd be curious to hear that explanation.

 

[pgm]

Gaza is more than poorer. It is a hotbed...

It doesn't matter what is tried. It matters what is accomplished imo.

It will be contiguous and there will be open borders between Egypt, Jordan and of course the sea that the Jews were never pushed into and who still would rather not see that happen. You understand this I can easily see just as I understand that the babies born on both the sides are bonded to the land regardless of the past machinations of both sides.

Gaza is a mess and hopelessly complicates the situation. Looking back, I'm a bit surprised that Israel pulled its troops out of Gaza, but left its presence in the West Bank. You would think it would do the opposite.

It depends. If it is a Democratic state, then it's better than it is now. But you do need to entertain the possibility of a new Islamic state. I mean the possibility of a Muslim Democracy turning into a Muslim theocracy is pretty short and linear. It is a palpable worry to Jews. If these people can not get along together long enough to decide that they want to make peace with the Jews rather than to continue killing and fighting each other over their ideology.

There is worry. In hindsight, one wishes that Israel would have encouraged the creation of a secular state to nip Hamas in the bud. Now, it is definitely too late. Hamas's support doesn't come entirely from the religious extremists, though. Many views Fatah as corrupt and theorize that a religious party will be less likely to fall to such corruptions (seems like s stretch to me). Others simply feel Fatah will end up as a potential puppet for Israel and can't truly represent the Palestinian interests. Israel could helps sway those groups by negotiating with Fatah and not undermining Fatah's credibility with checkpoints and settlement expansions. There are already a large number of people who think Hamas is a disaster for Palestinians because they constantly invoke Israeli retaliation. If you show these people that Fatah is legitimately a better option, they will come back.

Soon we will see I can see movement towards this when decades of peace will have the ceasing of the hate teaching. If that does not stop, then what's the real long term use pgm?

If Muslims continue to teach their young (all over the UMMA) how to treat Jews, what will change pgm?

Anti-semitism is a slowly retreating tide throughout the world. It's taking longer in the Muslim world in part because people try to claim their antisemitism is antizionism, which is only sometimes true. Legitimate political disagreements with Israel feed into existing prejudices about Jews. Attitudes will eventually change, but not while the Palestinian question tarnishes Israel. That's why Syria, Lebanon, Jordan and Egypt have left the Palestinian refugee camps around instead of integrating the Palestinians (besides the fact that they simply did not want them). The camps are the Arab world's best PR attack against Israel.

 

[JStone]

Anti-semitism is a slowly retreating tide throughout the world.

You just make that up as you go along, Pinocchio?

 

[JStone]

There is worry. In hindsight, one wishes that Israel would have encouraged the creation of a secular state to nip Hamas in the bud.

Er, Israel is a secular state, a parliamentary democracy.

If you ever get anything right, the Earth will cease to spin on its axis.

 

[pgm]

Anti-semitism is a slowly retreating tide throughout the world.

You just make that up as you go along, Pinocchio?

I compare it to what it was in the 19th Century. There are a lot less uprisings where large numbers of Jews are killed because of an economic downturn. When was the last Pogrom in Russia?

 

[pgm]

There is worry. In hindsight, one wishes that Israel would have encouraged the creation of a secular state to nip Hamas in the bud.

Er, Israel is a secular state, a parliamentary democracy.

If you ever get anything right, the Earth will cease to spin on its axis.

I was talking about Israel encouraging the creation of a secular Palestinian state so the Palestinians didn't turn to Hamas. I thought it was pretty clear from the context of the part you edited out.

Did the earth stop spinning yet? Things are going to get pretty cold in Jerusalem after a while if they don't get day any more.

 

[JStone]

There is worry. In hindsight, one wishes that Israel would have encouraged the creation of a secular state to nip Hamas in the bud.

Er, Israel is a secular state, a parliamentary democracy.

If you ever get anything right, the Earth will cease to spin on its axis.

I was talking about Israel encouraging the creation of a secular Palestinian state so the Palestinians didn't turn to Hamas. I thought it was pretty clear from the context of the part you edited out.

Did the earth stop spinning yet? Things are going to get pretty cold in Jerusalem after a while if they don't get day any more.

You want Jews to instruct Muslim homicidal maniacs to become secular? How has that worked out with the Sunnis and Shiites slaughtering each other for 1400 yrs?

 

[Shogun]

Oh shit! Jstone earned so many shekels in this thread that his JIDF paycheck this week might not require that his wife suck my goyim dick for cash to make ends meet this month!


GOOD JOB JSTONE!

 

[JStone]

Oh shit! Jstone earned so many shekels in this thread that his JIDF paycheck this week might not require that his wife suck my goyim dick for cash to make ends meet this month!


GOOD JOB JSTONE!

Little man, you still driving a Smart car to look taller?

 

[Ropey]

Gaza is more than poorer. It is a hotbed...

It doesn't matter what is tried. It matters what is accomplished imo.

It will be contiguous and there will be open borders between Egypt, Jordan and of course the sea that the Jews were never pushed into and who still would rather not see that happen. You understand this I can easily see just as I understand that the babies born on both the sides are bonded to the land regardless of the past machinations of both sides.

Gaza is a mess and hopelessly complicates the situation. Looking back, I'm a bit surprised that Israel pulled its troops out of Gaza, but left its presence in the West Bank. You would think it would do the opposite.

There's no possible pull out of the West Bank. Too many cities that were once called settlements. This is one reason for the land swapping to create contiguity.

It depends. If it is a Democratic state, then it's better than it is now. But you do need to entertain the possibility of a new Islamic state. I mean the possibility of a Muslim Democracy turning into a Muslim theocracy is pretty short and linear. It is a palpable worry to Jews. If these people can not get along together long enough to decide that they want to make peace with the Jews rather than to continue killing and fighting each other over their ideology.

There is worry. In hindsight, one wishes that Israel would have encouraged the creation of a secular state to nip Hamas in the bud. Now, it is definitely too late. Hamas's support doesn't come entirely from the religious extremists, though. Many views Fatah as corrupt and theorize that a religious party will be less likely to fall to such corruptions (seems like s stretch to me). Others simply feel Fatah will end up as a potential puppet for Israel and can't truly represent the Palestinian interests. Israel could helps sway those groups by negotiating with Fatah and not undermining Fatah's credibility with checkpoints and settlement expansions. There are already a large number of people who think Hamas is a disaster for Palestinians because they constantly invoke Israeli retaliation. If you show these people that Fatah is legitimately a better option, they will come back.

Time will tell. When I see the Palestinian young being taught acceptance and tolerance of others (including Israel and Jews) I will have more reason for belief. At this time I know what is being taught.

Do you?

Anti-semitism is a slowly retreating tide throughout the world. It's taking longer in the Muslim world in part because people try to claim their antisemitism is antizionism, which is only sometimes true. Legitimate political disagreements with Israel feed into existing prejudices about Jews. Attitudes will eventually change, but not while the Palestinian question tarnishes Israel. That's why Syria, Lebanon, Jordan and Egypt have left the Palestinian refugee camps around instead of integrating the Palestinians (besides the fact that they simply did not want them). The camps are the Arab world's best PR attack against Israel.

Until they aren't. Then we shall see.

 

[pgm]

There's no possible pull out of the West Bank. Too many cities that were once called settlements. This is one reason for the land swapping to create contiguity.

I guess I have a weird view on the settlements that's the minority viewpoint for the Israelis, Palestinians and Western mediators. I believe if there could be some guarantee that the rights of minorities could be protected, it would make sense to give administrative control (and taxation) of the Israeli settlements to the Palestinians, even if the settlers retain Israeli citizenship. There are Arabs living in Israel as both citizens and legal residents. I could see this as the reciprocal gesture. I realize this is unpopular on all sides.

Time will tell. When I see the Palestinian young being taught acceptance and tolerance of others (including Israel and Jews) I will have more reason for belief. At this time I know what is being taught.

Do you?

Yeah, I have a fairly good idea. I'll admit that I have a better idea about Egyptians than Palestinians, though.