Who Owns Palestine?

[jwoodie]

Who owns Palestine? I ask this question in the context of defining Israel's geographical boundaries within the "river to the sea." I am beginning to think that without that answer, acceptance of Israel's "right to exist" is a false condition for lasting peace in that region.

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State? In that event, wouldn't that allow Israel to declare war on Palestine if it allowed attacks on Israel from within its borders? Wouldn't that place Israel's incursions on a sounder legal footing and place a burden of resolution of this conflict (rather than condemnation) on the UN?

I understand that a "two-state solution" is a dirty word to most Israelis, but what other description can fit the current situation? Unless Israel really wants to incorporate the entire area and a huge hostile population with it, what is the alternative? Perpetual warfare?

 

[progressive hunter]

Who owns Palestine? I ask this question in the context of defining Israel's geographical boundaries within the "river to the sea." I am beginning to think that without that answer, acceptance of Israel's "right to exist" is a false condition for lasting peace in that region.

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State? In that event, wouldn't that allow Israel to declare war on Palestine if it allowed attacks on Israel from within its borders? Wouldn't that place Israel's incursions on a sounder legal footing and place a burden of resolution of this conflict (rather than condemnation) on the UN?

I understand that a "two-state solution" is a dirty word to most Israelis, but what other description can fit the current situation? Unless Israel really wants to incorporate the entire area and a huge hostile population with it, what is the alternative? Perpetual warfare?

at this point its anyone that can keep it,,

one wants to be left alone the other wants the total destruction of the other,,

dont pick a fight you cant win,,

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Who owns Palestine? I ask this question in the context of defining Israel's geographical boundaries within the "river to the sea." I am beginning to think that without that answer, acceptance of Israel's "right to exist" is a false condition for lasting peace in that region.

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State? In that event, wouldn't that allow Israel to declare war on Palestine if it allowed attacks on Israel from within its borders? Wouldn't that place Israel's incursions on a sounder legal footing and place a burden of resolution of this conflict (rather than condemnation) on the UN?

I understand that a "two-state solution" is a dirty word to most Israelis, but what other description can fit the current situation? Unless Israel really wants to incorporate the entire area and a huge hostile population with it, what is the alternative? Perpetual warfare?

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State?

Like in Jordan.

 

[jackflash]

Who owns Palestine? I ask this question in the context of defining Israel's geographical boundaries within the "river to the sea." I am beginning to think that without that answer, acceptance of Israel's "right to exist" is a false condition for lasting peace in that region.

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State? In that event, wouldn't that allow Israel to declare war on Palestine if it allowed attacks on Israel from within its borders? Wouldn't that place Israel's incursions on a sounder legal footing and place a burden of resolution of this conflict (rather than condemnation) on the UN?

I understand that a "two-state solution" is a dirty word to most Israelis, but what other description can fit the current situation? Unless Israel really wants to incorporate the entire area and a huge hostile population with it, what is the alternative? Perpetual warfare?

It definitely will not be mankind that settles this issue once & for all.

 

[Shusha]

Who owns Palestine? I ask this question in the context of defining Israel's geographical boundaries within the "river to the sea." I am beginning to think that without that answer, acceptance of Israel's "right to exist" is a false condition for lasting peace in that region.

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State? In that event, wouldn't that allow Israel to declare war on Palestine if it allowed attacks on Israel from within its borders? Wouldn't that place Israel's incursions on a sounder legal footing and place a burden of resolution of this conflict (rather than condemnation) on the UN?

Unilateral withdrawal from Gaza produced a terrorist-run government largely supported by the population with intense investment of resources into building terrorist infrastructure, importing weapons, training with regional partners hostile to Israel.

The UN response (and global opinion) has created a situation where it is impossible for Israel to un-occupy Gaza (as in changing the legal definition of "occupation" so that whatever Israel does, she continues to occupy Gaza). There is every indication that a similar situation would arise in the "West Bank" should Israel disengage and relinquish her claims to that territory.

Also, Israel is on perfectly sound legal footing.

 

[Polishprince]

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State?

Like in Jordan.

Then, the Palestinians could concentrate their efforts on a smaller area in order to run the Jews out of Israel. An independent Pal State would give them a lot firmer base to work from.

 

[Shusha]

I understand that a "two-state solution" is a dirty word to most Israelis, but what other description can fit the current situation?

The problem is that there are not two (three, four) States, and, so far, the people who self-identify as Palestinians have been incapable of creating the necessary conditions to be welcomed into the global community in that capacity, not the least of those conditions being able to "live in peace with their neighbors" and to respect the right to self-determination of all other peoples.

So what does the international community DO with a peoples who is not (yet) capable of becoming a State? Nearly 100 years ago, the answer was a mandate system. Is that still a viable option? What are the possible alternatives?

 

[Stryder50]

Who owns Palestine? I ask this question in the context of defining Israel's geographical boundaries within the "river to the sea." I am beginning to think that without that answer, acceptance of Israel's "right to exist" is a false condition for lasting peace in that region.

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State? In that event, wouldn't that allow Israel to declare war on Palestine if it allowed attacks on Israel from within its borders? Wouldn't that place Israel's incursions on a sounder legal footing and place a burden of resolution of this conflict (rather than condemnation) on the UN?

I understand that a "two-state solution" is a dirty word to most Israelis, but what other description can fit the current situation? Unless Israel really wants to incorporate the entire area and a huge hostile population with it, what is the alternative? Perpetual warfare?

There was a "two-state" solution @76 years ago with the U.N. partition into a Jewish State=Israel and an Arab/Islam 'State' = "Palestine".

Arab/Islam nations in the region rejected that solution, attacked Israel to eliminate it and the Jews, hence the first "conflict"/"war", in 1948.

Essentially that has continued, been on-going, and resolution will not be pleasant, or acceptable to Islam.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Who owns Palestine? I ask this question in the context of defining Israel's geographical boundaries within the "river to the sea." I am beginning to think that without that answer, acceptance of Israel's "right to exist" is a false condition for lasting peace in that region.

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State? In that event, wouldn't that allow Israel to declare war on Palestine if it allowed attacks on Israel from within its borders? Wouldn't that place Israel's incursions on a sounder legal footing and place a burden of resolution of this conflict (rather than condemnation) on the UN?

I understand that a "two-state solution" is a dirty word to most Israelis, but what other description can fit the current situation? Unless Israel really wants to incorporate the entire area and a huge hostile population with it, what is the alternative? Perpetual warfare?

It's not that two state solution is a dirty word, the problem is that it is a ridiculous idea. There are absolutely no indications the Palestinians are willing to live in peace with Israel or that they will be in the foreseeable future. It is not even clear the Palestinians are willing to live in peace with each other.

The idea that the Palestinians would be willing to live in peace with Jews/Israel was first proposed in 1947 by the UN and after the Palestinians rejected it, the Europeans, for unfathomable reasons decided it was a good idea and then Clinton adopted it, but the Palestinians have never supported it.

The polls show that the overwhelming majority of Palestinians still support destroying Israel, to the notion there can be a one state solution is also ridiculous. The term, solution, means peace and there simply is no political arrangement that will persuade the Palestinians to live in peace with Israel.

 

[Failzero]

Palestine ended in 1948 ( Prior to that is was a British Mandate region )

 

[toomuchtime_]

Then, the Palestinians could concentrate their efforts on a smaller area in order to run the Jews out of Israel. An independent Pal State would give them a lot firmer base to work from.

An independent Palestinian state would last for about an hour. The only reason Hamas, PIJ haven't overthrown the PA is that Israel exercises security control over the West Bank and is constantly arresting them. If the IDF withdrew from this independent Palestinian state, Hamas, etc. would quickly take over and use all the resources to attack Israel and Israel would be compelled to launch a devastating war in the West Bank.

 

[Sunni Man]

What if Israel publicly disclaimed any territory outside of its borders and recognized a Palestinian State?

The apartheid state of Israel has never declared or defined its borders.
As it continues for decades to invade and steal parts of its neighbors land.

 

[Kondor3]

Jews own part of the old Roman and Ottoman province of Palestine...their part is called Israel.

Muslims own part of the old Roman and Ottoman province of Palestine... their part is called Jordan.

 

[Zebra]

An independent Palestinian state would last for about an hour. The only reason Hamas, PIJ haven't overthrown the PA is that Israel exercises security control over the West Bank and is constantly arresting them. If the IDF withdrew from this independent Palestinian state, Hamas, etc. would quickly take over and use all the resources to attack Israel and Israel would be compelled to launch a devastating war in the West Bank.

true!

 

[Shusha]

The apartheid state of Israel has never declared or defined its borders.

Israel's borders are established by international customary law and treaties.

As it continues to invade and steal parts of its neighbors land for decades.

Israel has never established (permanent) control over land to which she has no legal (and moral) claim.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The apartheid state of Israel has never declared or defined its borders.
As it continues for decades to invade and steal parts of its neighbors land.

Which neighbors?

 

[Sunni Man]

Israel's borders are established by international customary law and treaties.

Israel has never established (permanent) control over land to which she has no legal (and moral) claim.

You might want spend some time researching what exactly are Israel's borders?
Hint: there aren't any.

Fact: Israel stole the Golan Heights from Syria.
The entire International community, with the exception of the US and Israel, regards the Golan Heights as belonging to Syria and under Israeli military occupation.

 

[Shusha]

You might want spend some time researching what exactly are Israel's borders?
Hint: there aren't any.

Of course there are. Uti possidetis juris (customary international law) and take a look at the peace treaties between Israel and Jordan and Israel and Egypt for confirmation.

Fact: Israel stole the Golan Heights from Syria.
The entire International community, with the exception of the US and Israel, regards the Golan Heights as belonging to Syria and under Israeli military occupation.

Yeah, I'll give you Golan Heights. Sovereign Syria.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

You might want spend some time researching what exactly are Israel's borders?
Hint: there aren't any.

Fact: Israel stole the Golan Heights from Syria.
The entire International community, with the exception of the US and Israel, regards the Golan Heights as belonging to Syria and under Israeli military occupation.

You might want spend some time researching what exactly are Israel's borders?
Hint: there aren't any.

Israel has border treaties with Egypt and Jordan.

Fact: Israel stole the Golan Heights from Syria.

I know! That was awesome.

The entire International community, with the exception of the US and Israel, regards the Golan Heights as belonging to Syria and under Israeli military occupation.

Tough titty.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Yeah, I'll give you Golan Heights. Sovereign Syria.

FAFO