Will Sweden Complete The Jump To Full Dhimmitude?

[Annie]

I guess time will tell? I don't share your pessimism.

You base your optimism on what? I've posted why my pessimism.

 

[ErikViking]

You base your optimism on what? I've posted why my pessimism.

A toughe one. It is actually feelings we talk about now. And I feel we are move one step back and two steps forward.

Blatant requests has been not only denied but not even taken up to considerations. Like the event starting this thread.

Other laws has been improved upon, clearly amied to (Not only Isam) ethincal groups that has a cultural pattern that is against the law, like honor related violence or forced marriages.

Also there is less of bias in media than it has been before. People has become alot more aware. (I.E. things like this are discussed openly in public radio - not done ten years ago)

As for instance a newspaper today had a full page (leader - correct?) about the stupidity of arguing for Iran having nuclear weapons while we ourselves has worked so hard against nuclear weapons throughout the world before.

So things are moving in a direction, hardley covered at all in media (which is about reporting events).

Not an easy or swift answer but the question wasn't as easy as it might seem. It is generally easier to recognize negative events rather than a positive flow.

 

[ErikViking]

This is so sick!
The Hamas representatives that visit Sweden doesn't get to meet with the Swedish government. Hamas is on EU's list of terror organisations. By strictly following the protocol it didn't stop Sweden to let persons from Hamas in to the country. For good or bad, sort of missing the purpous of the protocol even if following the letter of the law.
(Probably a good thing, now we can see what people need to be carefully monitored here in the future).

Now some old left (And when I say left it is further left than you probably can imagine) has decided to "talk" with the Hamas representatives anyway, but not as represtentatives of the Swedish government. (This by the way I find more to be Dhimmitude, since no one else with that status would have been "talked" to and it is done by someone who work with politics).

This is so naive. On the radio this idiot talked about how the relations with palestine and Isreal was important and that the fact that the visitor was linked to Hamas didn't say to "what depth" into the organisation he was linked. S o d a m n l a m e.

The only thing Hamas is required to do to get a diplomatic status is to accept the existance of its neigbour. Thats it. Then they can come to talk as it pleases them. This guy just undermines the preassure that is put on to Hamas.

Okay, now I am a bit upset, perhaps one good thing can come out from this:

The total loss of credibility of this idiot. Next time around he is probably back to where he was before growing his own vegetables and singing "we shall overcome".
And still, progression is good, this isn't done unnoticed.

 

[Annie]

Erik, it is good to know that good people are looking at what is going on there, in such hope lies.

 

[ErikViking]

Erik, it is good to know that good people are looking at what is going on there, in such hope lies.

Nice to hear!
Thanks.

 

[Matrixx8]

They seem surprised by the 'demand':

http://www.thelocal.se/article.php?ID=3674&date=20060428&PHPSESSID=151a20b729860e9bd580996d94743dff

The question is, 'why the surprise?' They've been on this road for quite awhile:

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/807

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/938

http://www.faithfreedom.org/oped/Fjordman50506.htm

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/510

Your post lacks some important context. While it is true that there is a minority of fanatics in Europe, they are by no means limited to Muslims.

There is evidence that some groups, especially neo-Nazis, skinheads and quasi racist groups are on the rise in Europe, using anti-immigration and especially anti-Islam as weapons of choice.

For over two decades, Europe has seen a rising tide of racism and xenophobia threatening to engulf its politics. Increasingly since 9/11, this has become particularized in the form of Islamophobia, coupled with an ideological anti-Semitism propagated by neo-Nazi parties. Since 1984, the political expression of this social disease has been the growth of neo-fascist and far-right parties; the two have fed off each other. Yet, to a degree, it has been held in check by the "historic memory" of the horrors of Hitler's Germany. However, this has begun to change, as recent events have triggered the perception that Christendom is at war with the Dar al Islam, allowing far-right parties to claim a popular resonance and repackage themselves in a way that jettisons much of their historical baggage. (Source)

The Guardian recently ran a series of articles on this topic.

The BBC reported on one such incident that took place, interestingly, just prior to the publication of the infamous Danish cartoons last October:

A radio station in Copenhagen has had its broadcasting licence taken away for three months after calling for the extermination of Muslims.
In the controversial broadcast, Radio Holger presenter Kaj Wilhelmsen said: "There are only two possible reactions if you want to stop this bomb terrorism - either you expel all Muslims from Western Europe so they cannot plant bombs, or you exterminate the fanatical Muslims which would mean killing a substantial part of Muslim immigrants."

Racism in Belgium shows how bullets were used instead of words to get another racist's message across.

Just as a matter of interest, three of the four sources you provided are from the Brussels Journal, a Belgian blog by Paul Belien, whose wife is a member of the Flemish Interest, a quasi-racist political party in Belgium (formerly the Flemish Block, which was outlawed for inciting racial hatred). The Brussels government is apparently threatening to do the same thing to Mr. Belien's blog.

In my view, Europe has as much, if not more, to fear from a revival of Fascism that is fanning the flames of racial hatred and religious intolerance, as it does from a minority of radical Muslims.

 

[Annie]

Your post lacks some important context. While it is true that there is a minority of fanatics in Europe, they are by no means limited to Muslims.

There is evidence that some groups, especially neo-Nazis, skinheads and quasi racist groups are on the rise in Europe, using anti-immigration and especially anti-Islam as weapons of choice.


The Guardian recently ran a series of articles on this topic.

The BBC reported on one such incident that took place, interestingly, just prior to the publication of the infamous Danish cartoons last October:


Racism in Belgium shows how bullets were used instead of words to get another racist's message across.

Just as a matter of interest, three of the four sources you provided are from the Brussels Journal, a Belgian blog by Paul Belien, whose wife is a member of the Flemish Interest, a quasi-racist political party in Belgium (formerly the Flemish Block, which was outlawed for inciting racial hatred). The Brussels government is apparently threatening to do the same thing to Mr. Belien's blog.

In my view, Europe has as much, if not more, to fear from a revival of Fascism that is fanning the flames of racial hatred and religious intolerance, as it does from a minority of radical Muslims.

I've seen nothing in his writings that would lead one to the conclusion that Dr. Belien is racist, in fact the opposit if you were to read his journal. He did nothing to hide his background, found at the journal:

Bio:

Paul Belien (1959) has a Law degree (specialisations in Social Security Law and European Law) and a doctorate in International Studies. He worked as a professional journalist in both Belgium and the Netherlands from 1982 to 1994, when he founded the classical-liberal Brussels-based think tank Centre for the New Europe. He acted as CNE's first managing director and research director from 1994 to 2000, when he left to write his Ph.D. dissertation and homeschool his five children.

Paul Belien is the editor of the Flemish quarterly Secessie and the editor-in-chief of The Brussels Journal. He is a columnist at the Flemish weekly Pallieterke and at the Flemish monthly Doorbraak and a regular contributor to the Flemish conservative monthly Nucleus, which he co-founded in 1990.

Paul Belien is a member of the Mont Pelerin Society and was one of the nine "founding fathers" of the Flemish liberal party VLD in 1991-1992, but he did not join this party when it became obvious that its leader, Guy Verhofstadt, was steering it into a leftist and neutralist, rather than a hayekian/libertarian and Atlanticist direction. Paul Belien is married to Irish-born Dr. Alexandra Colen, a former lecturer in linguistics at the universities of Ghent and Antwerp, and an MP for the Flemish-secessionist party Vlaams Blok since 1995.

Paul Belien is the author of numerous articles, essays and books, including, most recently, A Throne in Brussels. He is the co-author - together with Lady Thatcher, Lord Tebbit, Philippe Seguin and others - Visions of Europe (Duckworth, 1994) and - with Harvard Business School's Prof. Regina Herzlinger - Consumer-Driven Health Care (Jossey-Bass, 2004). He has given lectures on European health care systems in various countries, including the U.S., Canada, Japan and Australia.

 

[Matrixx8]

I've seen nothing in his writings that would lead one to the conclusion that Dr. Belien is racist, in fact the opposit if you were to read his journal. He did nothing to hide his background, found at the journal:

Most recently, Belien published an inflammatory piece in his "journal" in which he made several "racist" statements.

By way of example:

(Referring to the recent murder of a young Belgian by two other Belgians, whose parents came from Morocco) Belien: "The Moroccan thugs do not care about life and they are used to slitting throats – a procedure they get to practice on sheep from a very young age."

Not thugs, mind you, but Moroccan thugs.

One doesn't haven't to be the proverbial rocket scientist to understand such coded language. A quick analysis reveals the following inferences behind Belien's words: All people from Morocco are thugs. All people from Morocco do not care about life. And, since the practice of slitting the throats of animals in religious ceremonies is illegal in Europe, all Moroccans who live in Europe commit crimes.

Clearly, Mr. Belien does not think there is anything wrong with this. He evidently believes that it is not only his right but his duty to bash any group that does not fit in his narrow definition of right thinking: including homosexuals, women who believe they -- and not Mr. Belien -- should have the last say over their bodies and reproductive rights and the vast majority of citizens of European countries who fought for centuries to create secular societies in which people of many different religions and cultures could live side by side in peace.

At least, that is my interpretation from this interview (in Dutch) that Belien gave to another Belgian journalist.

You won't find the "thugs" quote at the Brussels Journal anymore, by the way. If you read Dutch, you will find that quote and some others at this site.

The reason is because Dr. Belien recently received the following letter. (In case you don't speak Dutch, I've translated the opening paragraph):

Belien: This text was removed at the request of the Centre for Equality of Opportunity and for Combating Racism, which was sent to us by registered mail on May 10 last, stating that our “comments constitute an incitement to violence against a group because of national or ethnic origins (section 1, subsection 3, under 3, of the Act of 07/30/1981. Consequently, we ask that you remove the disputed text or have it removed. If you fail to do so, the Centre for Equality of Opportunity and for Combating Racism reserves the right to take legal action.”

Further, Bielen says he is not guilty, but proceeded to remove the disputed comments from his blog and asked other blogs who posted his comments to remove them.

A case of civilization triumphing, perhaps, instead of clashing?

 

[Annie]

Most recently, Belien published an inflammatory piece in his "journal" in which he made several "racist" statements.

By way of example:


Not thugs, mind you, but Moroccan thugs.

One doesn't haven't to be the proverbial rocket scientist to understand such coded language. A quick analysis reveals the following inferences behind Belien's words: All people from Morocco are thugs. All people from Morocco do not care about life. And, since the practice of slitting the throats of animals in religious ceremonies is illegal in Europe, all Moroccans who live in Europe commit crimes.

Clearly, Mr. Belien does not think there is anything wrong with this. He evidently believes that it is not only his right but his duty to bash any group that does not fit in his narrow definition of right thinking: including homosexuals, women who believe they -- and not Mr. Belien -- should have the last say over their bodies and reproductive rights and the vast majority of citizens of European countries who fought for centuries to create secular societies in which people of many different religions and cultures could live side by side in peace.

At least, that is my interpretation from this interview (in Dutch) that Belien gave to another Belgian journalist.

You won't find the "thugs" quote at the Brussels Journal anymore, by the way. If you read Dutch, you will find that quote and some others at this site.

The reason is because Dr. Belien recently received the following letter. (In case you don't speak Dutch, I've translated the opening paragraph):



A case of civilization triumphing, perhaps, instead of clashing?

Perhaps, I'll keep an eye on that, thanks for the headsup.

 

[Relay]

Some people have woke up and resists.
The page is only useful if you know Swedish of course.
http://www.fomi.nu/

 

[ErikViking]

Some people have woke up and resists.
The page is only useful if you know Swedish of course.
http://www.fomi.nu/

I know swedish and had a look. This site seems just stupid. Here is the explanation of what FOMI is: (I translated it)

NOT a political party
NOT against forigners
NOT against immigration
NOT against a multicultural society
Does NOT hate muslims (Only Islam)
Does NOT have a secret agenda(!)
Represent western opinions.

I guess everyone can join in and share the same opinion.