Treaty of Detroit

[KnobbyWalsh]

Detroit is the Progressive Model City

And the answers you propose are.........................?

Never vote Democrat, never. Never, ever

Yea, a simple-ass like you needs to reduce this down to something you can understand - partisan politics. This is way over your head - go flame elsewhere.

 

[buckeye45_73]

Gone are the days - make way for the New Economy, wedge economics at its finest!

Treaty of Detroit Repealed - In These Times

New Economy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The UAW won comprehensive health insurance, pensions, cost-of-living adjustments and income protection during economic downturns.



Yep, that's what conseratives say and liberals act like they've never heard of it......they get paid and the company suffers and gee, it goes bankrupt....oh and those pensions for life....yeah that's worked out great, so people are getting paid (that's if the unions do raid their pensions for hookers and coke parties) are not producing any cars, and our cars tend to be more expensive and sell less....hmmmm something tells that's what happend in the 80s when movies like GungHo were made....

Well if what you described DID happen, you should be quite happy with the New Economy as the middle class gets eradicated while the rest of the world rises out of poverty at our expense. Real makings of maintaining our super power status, you know!

Look man, people get paid for various things. keeping the same job for a lifetime doesnt cut it, get promoted....

And whats funny is the reason the middle class is having issues, is because of people like you that make policies to raise energy, gas and food prices over stupid global warming and other bs crap.

And that's not to mention that everytime you raise the min wage....say from $5 to $10, all the people above min wage, the $6, $7, $8, $9, $10 an hour folks are now all making min wage, so yeah you just killed off tons of families from having a little bit extra to now having the bare min....and even if they get a small raise to compensate (good luck on that!) they still wont make the percentage above the min, so in other words, people have less purchasing power (ie they are falling behind) with higher costs(thanks ethanol and GE and global warming) and inflation created by min wage increases.....DONE!

 

[CrusaderFrank]

And the answers you propose are.........................?

Never vote Democrat, never. Never, ever

Yea, a simple-ass like you needs to reduce this down to something you can understand - partisan politics. This is way over your head - go flame elsewhere.

Democrats are dedicated to turning American cities into Eastern European shit holes.

It's no accident they targeted Detroit first. That was our model city, a shining example of American innovation and entrepreneurship and the Communists that run the Union and Democrat Party destroyed it

 

[TemplarKormac]

You dig that don't you? Oh, they're making profits hand over fist while paying what used to prop up the middle class half the pay. Suckers like you the politicians and 1% love. Thank God your kind wasn't around when this country was established - we would have been Third World decades if not centuries ago.

I'm sure the 99% would love this!

Detroit, the beacon of hope for Pro-Union liberals and 99 percenters everywhere!

Unions have the power to wreck entire cities? Why's eveyone think there's one simple answer to something this drastic? Where's that come from?

Ever see Stockton, CA? It can hardly pay all of it's unionized employees!

 

[buckeye45_73]

Never vote Democrat, never. Never, ever

Yea, a simple-ass like you needs to reduce this down to something you can understand - partisan politics. This is way over your head - go flame elsewhere.

Democrats are dedicated to turning American cities into Eastern European shit holes.

It's no accident they targeted Detroit first. That was our model city, a shining example of American innovation and entrepreneurship and the Communists that run the Union and Democrat Party destroyed it

I know and liberals are so blind, they blame republicans for it...HOW????

 

[CrusaderFrank]

And the answers you propose are.........................?

Never vote Democrat, never. Never, ever

Yea, a simple-ass like you needs to reduce this down to something you can understand - partisan politics. This is way over your head - go flame elsewhere.

Who ran Detroit for the last 60 year?

 

[TemplarKormac]

And the answers you propose are.........................?

Never vote Democrat, never. Never, ever

Yea, a simple-ass like you needs to reduce this down to something you can understand - partisan politics. This is way over your head - go flame elsewhere.

I noticed your sig, Walsh.

"The comfort of the rich depends upon an abundant supply of the poor."
— Voltaire

It's cool you like Voltaire but, he also said this:

"It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere"

— Voltaire

Yeah, nobody was flaming, you were trolling. Lets keep the roles to their respective players, okay?

 

[Erand7899]

"A generation ago, being average in America was the envy of many in the world. The American Dream was something rare: an attainable ideal, based on the notion that if you worked hard and played by the rules, you could earn a comfortable, secure livelihood, and enable the next generation to do even better."

BEST article about this topic online I've seen yet:

America's middle class: An endangered species?

Working hard and playing by the rules did not mean what you yahoes seem to think that it meant back in the fifties and sixties. Working hard also meant working hard at getting educated, and working smart. Working men and women knew they had to offer value to an employer to get the jobs they wanted.

No employer owes any worker more than the value that the worker brings to the job. That vague term "a living wage", is a political term and has no applicability in any market place. Workers sell their knowledge, skills and muscles, in an open market, and deserve to be paid what those attributes are worth to another person. The market sets the rates of pay and benefits.

 

[martinjlm]

Detroit Riverfront then.....

Detroit Riverfront now....

My Detroit Neighborhood then......

My Detroit Neighborhood now....

No doubt all is not peachy keen in Detroit, but it is not all hell and warfare either. I could probably go to any large city where the population is shrinking and take pictures of abandoned and dilapidated buildings. I could also write volumes about the various levels of corruption in city, county, and state politics here.

But I can also write volumes about all the efforts going into reviving the city, including

• installation of an Emergency Financial Manager to fix the city's debt problems and right size the infrastructure
• A massive cooperative effort on the part of major businesses to provide the city new EMS units and police vehicles
• Investment in businesses and real estate by influential billionaires (Dan Gilbert, CEO of Quicken Loans, owner of Cleveland Cavaliers, has purchased 17 buildings downtown and laid out a comprehensive plan to bring businesses into downtown to occupy them. I doubt he's doing that with the expectation of losing money in a dying city. Hard to become a billionaire thinking like that)

The point is to achieve accuracy and balance.

As for the original point of the thread....here's my opinion.....

Labor unions were necessary and very useful in the early 1900s, on through to the late 1980s. They were responsible for a lot of the societal gains that to this day make life pleasant for families that have benefitted from fair wages and benefits. But in the mid to late 1980s, something very significant happened. The US was forced to compete....REALLY compete, on a global basis. First the steel industry was lost to the Japanese steel industry. Then the camera, copier, and television industries. Then the garment industry was lost to Hong Kong and China.

US companies could not compete with companies from overseas who did not have to play by the same rules that the home team had to play by. That created an immediate and unfair disadvantage for the American industry. At first, the typical labor union approach was to call plays from the same playbook that worked during days of greater prosperity and US dominance in the world marketplace. Sorta like calling a blitz in the 7th inning. Great play, wrong sport.

So then the BIG unions morphed. They branched out and started to grow by entwining themselves into different industries, to compensate for shrinkage in their primary industries. The "A" in UAW went from "Automobile" to include Aerospace, and Agricultural. BIG unions also became, in my opinion, too involved in the strategic running of the business. It's one thing to protect the rights and benefits of workers. It's a completely different thing to TELL companies what products to build and where to build them, or what products they cannot get rid of because a handful of dues paying members might have to relocate.

 

[eflatminor]

You mean the liberal Democrat stronghold that is Detroit isn't working out so well? Well color me shocked...

Probably ran out of other people's money.

 

[KnobbyWalsh]

The UAW won comprehensive health insurance, pensions, cost-of-living adjustments and income protection during economic downturns.



Yep, that's what conseratives say and liberals act like they've never heard of it......they get paid and the company suffers and gee, it goes bankrupt....oh and those pensions for life....yeah that's worked out great, so people are getting paid (that's if the unions do raid their pensions for hookers and coke parties) are not producing any cars, and our cars tend to be more expensive and sell less....hmmmm something tells that's what happend in the 80s when movies like GungHo were made....

Well if what you described DID happen, you should be quite happy with the New Economy as the middle class gets eradicated while the rest of the world rises out of poverty at our expense. Real makings of maintaining our super power status, you know!

Look man, people get paid for various things. keeping the same job for a lifetime doesnt cut it, get promoted....

And whats funny is the reason the middle class is having issues, is because of people like you that make policies to raise energy, gas and food prices over stupid global warming and other bs crap.

And that's not to mention that everytime you raise the min wage....say from $5 to $10, all the people above min wage, the $6, $7, $8, $9, $10 an hour folks are now all making min wage, so yeah you just killed off tons of families from having a little bit extra to now having the bare min....and even if they get a small raise to compensate (good luck on that!) they still wont make the percentage above the min, so in other words, people have less purchasing power (ie they are falling behind) with higher costs(thanks ethanol and GE and global warming) and inflation created by min wage increases.....DONE!

What's this "people like you" stuff? Again, you're resorting to needless partisan references that are beside the point. Do you read the links? Do you have any idea what we're talking about here? I'll grant to anyone that this is a massive topic to get your head around and I'm still studying it. This has nothing to do with global warming. It's what's been happening since the 70's that led to a global economy and how the lobby "profession" have tilted the playing field in their favor and against the majority of Americans - by buying politicians. You think there's NO good reason that LOBBYISTS write the legislation? Bone up some - you're missing the point here and I understand - it's complex, but no need to even think in partisan terms since all major politicians for the last three to four decades are complicit.

 

[KnobbyWalsh]

Never vote Democrat, never. Never, ever

Yea, a simple-ass like you needs to reduce this down to something you can understand - partisan politics. This is way over your head - go flame elsewhere.

Democrats are dedicated to turning American cities into Eastern European shit holes.

It's no accident they targeted Detroit first. That was our model city, a shining example of American innovation and entrepreneurship and the Communists that run the Union and Democrat Party destroyed it

Again, simple minds need simple answers. Get on a thread you can understand.

 

[KnobbyWalsh]

You mean the liberal Democrat stronghold that is Detroit isn't working out so well? Well color me shocked...

Probably ran out of other people's money.

Dude, it's springtime and you're STILL wearing those fucked up skis?

 

[yidnar]

Gone are the days - make way for the New Economy, wedge economics at its finest!

Treaty of Detroit Repealed - In These Times

New Economy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

sounds to me like some union workers may be actually required to work !!

 

[KnobbyWalsh]

Detroit Riverfront then.....

Detroit Riverfront now....

My Detroit Neighborhood then......

My Detroit Neighborhood now....

No doubt all is not peachy keen in Detroit, but it is not all hell and warfare either. I could probably go to any large city where the population is shrinking and take pictures of abandoned and dilapidated buildings. I could also write volumes about the various levels of corruption in city, county, and state politics here.

But I can also write volumes about all the efforts going into reviving the city, including

• installation of an Emergency Financial Manager to fix the city's debt problems and right size the infrastructure
• A massive cooperative effort on the part of major businesses to provide the city new EMS units and police vehicles
• Investment in businesses and real estate by influential billionaires (Dan Gilbert, CEO of Quicken Loans, owner of Cleveland Cavaliers, has purchased 17 buildings downtown and laid out a comprehensive plan to bring businesses into downtown to occupy them. I doubt he's doing that with the expectation of losing money in a dying city. Hard to become a billionaire thinking like that)

The point is to achieve accuracy and balance.

As for the original point of the thread....here's my opinion.....

Labor unions were necessary and very useful in the early 1900s, on through to the late 1980s. They were responsible for a lot of the societal gains that to this day make life pleasant for families that have benefitted from fair wages and benefits. But in the mid to late 1980s, something very significant happened. The US was forced to compete....REALLY compete, on a global basis. First the steel industry was lost to the Japanese steel industry. Then the camera, copier, and television industries. Then the garment industry was lost to Hong Kong and China.

US companies could not compete with companies from overseas who did not have to play by the same rules that the home team had to play by. That created an immediate and unfair disadvantage for the American industry. At first, the typical labor union approach was to call plays from the same playbook that worked during days of greater prosperity and US dominance in the world marketplace. Sorta like calling a blitz in the 7th inning. Great play, wrong sport.

So then the BIG unions morphed. They branched out and started to grow by entwining themselves into different industries, to compensate for shrinkage in their primary industries. The "A" in UAW went from "Automobile" to include Aerospace, and Agricultural. BIG unions also became, in my opinion, too involved in the strategic running of the business. It's one thing to protect the rights and benefits of workers. It's a completely different thing to TELL companies what products to build and where to build them, or what products they cannot get rid of because a handful of dues paying members might have to relocate.

Thanks!!!! Your post made putting up with haters, flamers, hijackers and simple minded partisans worth it. Hope to get a chance to reply later.......

 

[Mr. Peepers]

Urban Farming Is Growing a Green Future
Detroit's precarious recovery: 'It just feels like something is happening here' | World news | guardian.co.uk

Actually, some cool things are happening in Detroit.

 

[martinjlm]

Urban Farming Is Growing a Green Future
Detroit's precarious recovery: 'It just feels like something is happening here' | World news | guardian.co.uk

Actually, some cool things are happening in Detroit.

I'm tryna tell ya!

 

[KnobbyWalsh]

Urban Farming Is Growing a Green Future
Detroit's precarious recovery: 'It just feels like something is happening here' | World news | guardian.co.uk

Actually, some cool things are happening in Detroit.

Even though this thread isn't about Detroit today, yea, despite the backward winner-take-all New Economy, there are some great things happening. It's a new Gilded Age for the world so it's interesting to speculate through NON partisan information where it could be headed for the United States, another purpose of this thread.

 

[eflatminor]

You mean the liberal Democrat stronghold that is Detroit isn't working out so well? Well color me shocked...

Probably ran out of other people's money.

Dude, it's springtime and you're STILL wearing those fucked up skis?

I get you don't want to admit just how fucked up the central planners have made things...doesn't exactly support your agenda, does it?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Detroit's best hope is to force UAW to lease space downtown and to only pay pensions to people living in downtown

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