Top Ten Battles of All Time

[5stringJeff]

I find it odd that there is no battle on here prior to 1066. An interesting list nonetheless.

http://www.historyplace.com/worldhistory/topten/index.html

 

[freeandfun1]

I find it odd that there is no battle on here prior to 1066. An interesting list nonetheless.

http://www.historyplace.com/worldhistory/topten/index.html

I am not much of a tactician myself, but it appears as if many of those battles are rated on historical significance than anything else. I can think of many other battles that from a tactical standpoint, were probably much better.

An interesting read none the less.

Thanks!

 

[USViking]

I find it odd that there is no battle on here prior to 1066. An interesting list nonetheless.

http://www.historyplace.com/worldhistory/topten/index.html

This looks like a really interesting link; I'll have to take some time with it.

Why don't we list some important battles pre-1066?

I would include Marathon-Salamis-Platea, since they ensured the survival of the preeminently important ancient Greek civilization.

 

[SmarterThanYou]

can't believe thermopolae isn't there.

 

[5stringJeff]

http://www.militaryhistoryonline.com/ancient/articles/kadesh.aspx

Here's a writeup on teh Battle of Kadesh, in which the Egyptians got their butts handed to them by the Hittites. Happened c. 1275 BC.

 

[JayW]

Any list that doesn't include Tonya Harding vs. Paula Jones isn't worth its salt

 

[Zhukov]

Kursk is the most important battle in history and it doesn't even make the top ten?

That list is atrocious.

 

[Hobbit]

Battle # 7 Atomic Bombing of Japan?!?!?!?!?!? WTF?

That wasn't even a battle, it was an unopposed bombing.

At least they listed a Chinese battle, but they passed over the three kingdoms era, probably the most famous war era of Chinese history. They could have mentioned the battle of Qingzhou, where a surprise attack led by the warlords and generals Cao Cao, Liu Bei, and Sun Jian broke the seige around Qingzhou and ended the Yellow Scarves Rebellion and led to the end of the Han Dynasty as the warlords began to wield more power. If they wanted a more definitive one, they could have gone with the battle of Hu Lao Gate, where Dong Zuo, Han emporer, was killed, along with his finest warrior, Lu Bu, whose legendary status has nearly reached that of Achilles. This led to 100 years of Chinese civil war.

If they wanted to replace #7 up there, what about the batte of Okinawa, where the U.S. finally seized originally Japanese territory and where the famous Suribachi picture came from.

They didn't mention the Macabee rebellion, in which untrained, outnumbered, and poorly armed Judean rebels reclaimed the Temple of Solomon from Roman invaders.

They mentioned Antietem, but not Gettysburg. What's the logic in that. Antietem was a skirmish compared to Gettysburg, and Gettysburg had more effect on the war, too.

I could go on and on, but I'd rather not.

 

[Zhukov]

I could go on and on, but I'd rather not.

Exactly.

 

[5stringJeff]

I didn't say it was accurate, I just said it was interesting.

 

[Zhukov]

I didn't say it was accurate, I just said it was interesting.

Wasn't taking shots at you.

The list is just all wrong.

Revisionist and western-centric.

It is interesting....for the purposes of ripping apart.


But let's revive the thread, shall we?

Please list, in your (whoever's) opinion, the top ten (or fewer, or more) most historically important military engagements in history.

Not whole lengthy campaigns (example= Napoleon's Russia Campaign), but instead particular battles (example= Borodino).

And......go!

 

[USViking]

Limiting it for the present to WW2, I would say the battles around Moscow in 12/41 and D-Day were most critical in the eventual German defeat, and Midway most so in the eventual Japanese defeat.

 

[Hobbit]

The Defeat of the Spanish Armada

Waterloo

Normandy

Midway

Gettysburg

Hu Lao Gate

Jericho

Bannock Burn

Can't remember the name, but the battle where Constantine saw the cross.

Battle over Britain

These are the top ten out of what I know.

 

[padisha emperor]

Can't remember the name, but the battle where Constantine saw the cross.

in french the name is Pont Milvius



only 10 battles is hard..some are world famous, other not, but really important too... since 1066

these are some ideas of main battles since 1066, it's not a classification.

D-Day (1944)

Verdun (1916)

Yorktown (1781)

Hastings (1066)

La Marne (1914)

Stalingrad (1942)

Orléans (1429) (or Formigny, 1450, and Castillon, 1453)

Waterloo (1815)

Jerusalem (1099)

Constantinople (1453)

Austerlitz (1805)

Grenade (1492)

Defeat of the monghol fleet with the Kamikaze

defeat of the invincible Armada (1588)

Denain (1712)

Quebec (1759)

Midway (1942) and Coral Sea (1942)

Gettysburg (1863)

Tsushima (1905)

Bouvines (1214)

Valmy (1792)





And before 1066 :

Poitiers (732)

Marathon (-490)

Gaugamèles (-331)

Alesia (-52)

Catalaunic Fields (around 400)

Vouillé (507)




But the idea of classement of 10 battles in the world HIstory is not realy bright : it depends of the conception of each country, of their point of view, etc... (for me Poitiers is more decisive than spanish invincible armada's defeat...La Marne, or Castillon are more important than Gettysburg...)

That's why only 10 is not possible, lot are forgotten.

 

[KarlMarx]

http://www.militaryhistoryonline.com/ancient/articles/kadesh.aspx

Here's a writeup on teh Battle of Kadesh, in which the Egyptians got their butts handed to them by the Hittites. Happened c. 1275 BC.

Good ol' Ramses II (who also, by the way, is widely believed to be the Pharaoh of the Exodus) if he weren't such a boaster, we would not have had such a detailed account of the battle. He never seemed to pass up an opportunity to post it on a temple wall (I suppose if he were alive today and a member of USMB, he'd be telling us all about it)

I believe that it the most detailed account of an ancient battle that exists.

 

[Zhukov]

But the idea of classement of 10 battles in the world HIstory is not realy bright : it depends of the conception of each country, of their point of view, etc... (for me Poitiers is more decisive than spanish invincible armada's defeat...La Marne, or Castillon are more important than Gettysburg...)

It doesn't depend of the conception of each country, it depends on which were most significant , as in: had it turned out the other way the world as we know it would be a very different place.



The Battle of Thermopylae, 5th Century BC, What if the Spartan's hadn't been able to hold back the Persians? Hellenic culture might not have survived, there may never have been an Alexander. Western Civilization as we know it would not exist.

The Battle of Tours, 732 AD, What if the Moslem's had won? Again Western Civilization as we know it would not exist.

The Battle of Borodino, 1812, Technically a victory for Napoleon, but at great loss. What if Napoleon had routed the Russians and maintained sufficient military capacity to march on St. Petersburg? With the Russians out of the game, and his Grand Armee intact, would he have ever lost?

The Battle of Kursk, 1943, the largest armored engagement in human history, that last offensive action of the German armor on the eastern front for the rest of the war. What if the Germans had crushed the Red Army? At this point the war was still winnable for the Germans, afterwards it was not. A Cold War between the USA and England on one side and a greater Germania on the other?





Incidentally, the destruction of the Chinese invasion fleet by the Kamikazee wasn't a military engagement, but it certainly was historically important. Same with the Spanish Armada.

 

[padisha emperor]

Agree with that Zukhov

732 is for you "Tours" ? we call it "Poitiers"

But it's for this reason, the consequence of these battles, that I put Orléans (and then Formigny and Castillon), because wihtout them, maybe Enlgand would have won the 100 years war...imagine the conequences ?

Imagine also the consequences of a french defat at La Marne for the WWI ! WWI ended in 1914 !
of a US defeat at midway ??? it would be a disaster.

Quebec, 1759 : imagine that France would have won this battle...

I also forget one very important battle :

Manzikert, 1071 (sometimes its name is Malazgerd) : the byzantine Empire lost in Armenia : the end of the posibility of a great Empire : this battle show the end of Byzance.

 

[Hobbit]

Am I the only one who sees the significance of Hu Lao Gate (actually, it's kinda obscure in western culture). Most of these battles take place in the west, but Hu Lao was one of the most significant battles in Chinese history. Following the suppression of the Yellow Scarves Rebellion, one of the heroes, Dong Zuo, advisor to the emporer of the Han Dynasty, took power. He locked away the emporer and claimed to speak for him. Under his rule, his friends grew fat and decadent while his enemies grew hungry. Eventually, the three greatest leaders from the battle against the Yellow Scarves, Liu Bei, Cao Cao (Tsao Tsao), and Sun Jian, formed an alliance and attack Dong Zuo, first routing his armies at Si Shui Gate, then finally catching and killing him at Hu Lao Gate. The resulting power vacuum led to the Three Kingdoms era, about which there is a famous fantasy novel. Liu Bei conquored the Shu kingdom and, under the advice of the brilliant strategist, Zhuge Liang, implemented the three kingdoms strategy which would cause the Wu and Shu to unite againt Cao Cao's more powerful Wei, then Shu would attack Wu. The strategy worked fairly well, but did not completely crush the Wei, who finally reunited the three kingdoms almost 100 years after Hu Lao gate. Most of the famous heroes of the entire era had died in battle, though most of the warlords and strategists lived to see old age.

Now, while there were many decisive battles in that era, such as the crushing blow the Shu and Wu dealt to the Wei at Chi Bi, Hu Lao Gate was the defining one as it ended the Han Dynasty. This era is similar in significance to the American Civil war, in that, after it ended, gave the country a sense of unity.

[Edited because I can never keep the Sun family straight]

 

[5stringJeff]

I'm ashamed to say that I don't know much Asian military history.

 

[Zhukov]

Am I the only one who sees the significance of Hu Lao Gate (actually, it's kinda obscure in western culture). Most of these battles take place in the west,

The fact that they take place in the west makes them more significant because Western Civilization dominates this world.

A battle that occured in Thailand a thousand years ago that may have been a pivotal event in Thai history may be important to Thais, but since Thailand itself is a relatively insignificant world player, the event would not rank very high with respect to historical importance.


If Hu Lao Gate was a pivotal moment in the unification of China, then yes, that is certainly historically important considering the importance of China, as a global power, in the world today.

Most of what I know of Asian military history is limited to Japan, so I can't directly comment on Hu Lao Gate, but it only doesn't seem that significant the way you described it.

What do you think would have happened had Duong won?

Wasn't China unified under the Han dynasty?

How did the fracturing of China lead to a sense of unity?