Solar and Oregon

[Old Rocks]

The manufacturing process that uses basically an ink jet process, and had the potential to exceed the best silicon efficiency, which at present is 24%, by double.

Solar short takes: Solexant eyes Oregon, Abound bounds forward, Westinghouse goes solar, and more - Photovoltaics International

Beaver State scores again. Solexant has chosen the greater Portland area to build its first commercial-scale thin-film PV manufacturing plant, according to a news story in the Oregonian. The company joins SolarWorld, Sanyo, Solaicx, and other companies that have chosen to build production facilities in the state.

Solexant’s process synthesizes and functionalizes nanometer-scale binary semiconductors in solutions or inks and then prints them as films on a flexible, inexpensive metal-foil substrate in a nonvacuum deposition process, according to the CEO. Micron-sized crystals grown from those films become photoactive materials capable of absorbing a cross-spectrum range of light.

 

[Mr. H.]

You said Beaver.

 

[Big Fitz]

Very nice. And in 75 years they may be able to supply 50% of Oregon's power needs...

...during clear daylight hours.

Of course, that'll take up a few million square acres of land too. But... we must be green!

 

[Old Rocks]

What's matter, Fritz, your great good budds don't like the idea of individuals having their own power? The idea that a person can be both a consumer and a producer scare the bejeebers out of you?

It is happening and will increase by orders of magnitudes over the next decade.

Germany now produces over 8 Gw of solar.

 

[Big Fitz]

You obviously don't remember many other threads where I'm very fine with having personal solar cells on individual consumer houses. What I don't agree with is that pinwheels and mirrors and moonshine are the basis for an industrial scale grid like you seem to believe. If I ever build I fully plan to look at incorporating solar panels for heating air and water as well as electricity. Why? Because I know it works on SMALL SCALE.

Good for Germany. What's their electrical energy demand again? 200-300 Gws? How do they handle that much of their grid shutting down about an hour or so before sundown and after sunrise? Lots of nuclear and coal and gas plants?

Solar will always be a situational power source until a dramatic change in technology occurs that can provide uninterrupted power. The best thing is to realize this, quit trying to make it industrial scale and focus on consumer/commercial support usage in which helps cut down load on real power generation found in Coal and Nuclear and Hydro.

 

[Old Rocks]

Fritz, it is the 21st century. Solar thermal, and, concerning pv solar, we have our greatest use of electricity during the day.

 

[Mad Scientist]

What's matter, Fritz, your great good budds don't like the idea of individuals having their own power? The idea that a person can be both a consumer and a producer scare the bejeebers out of you?

It is happening and will increase by orders of magnitudes over the next decade. Germany now produces over 8 Gw of solar.

You think the gubamint isn't gonna put a meter on yer' solar panels? Guess again.

And if your Solar Power turns out to be more efficient and you actually use less, that means the gubamint will lose money in taxes.

So you know what they will do?



























Wait for it.

























































Raise taxes on your solar equipment to make up for the losses.

 

[Big Fitz]

Fritz, it is the 21st century. Solar thermal, and, concerning pv solar, we have our greatest use of electricity during the day.

Still doesn't work in the dark, unless you want to start using orbital power.
Now THERE'S a danger to life limb and lilac.

 

[Mr. H.]

If solar power collection materials can be made more cheaply, efficiently, and are able to retain more energy from the sun- I'm all for it. The process sounds fascinating.

But....



...you still said Beaver.

 

[Big Fitz]

If solar power collection materials can be made more cheaply, efficiently, and are able to retain more energy from the sun- I'm all for it. The process sounds fascinating.

But....



...you still said Beaver.

If any power source does it cheaper better faster stronger the world will beat a path to it's door. The problem is ALL green energies don't do that. They only do it 'cleaner' and then worst in pretty much all other aspects, and sometimes with added flaws too. Hence why the resilience to go totally green.

Cue self righteous moralizing in 3...2...1....

 

[Old Rocks]

Fritz, it is the 21st century. Solar thermal, and, concerning pv solar, we have our greatest use of electricity during the day.

Still doesn't work in the dark, unless you want to start using orbital power.
Now THERE'S a danger to life limb and lilac.

Ah, Fritzy, your ignorance is once again so evident.

List of solar thermal power stations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is a list of solar thermal power stations. These include the 354 megawatt (MW) Solar Energy Generating Systems power plant in the USA, Nevada Solar One (USA, 64 MW), Andasol solar power station (Spain, 100 MW), PS20 solar power tower (Spain, 20 MW), and the PS10 solar power tower (Spain, 11 MW).

The solar thermal power industry is growing rapidly with 1.2 GW under construction as of April 2009 and another 13.9 GW announced globally through 2014. Spain is the epicenter of solar thermal power development with 22 projects for 1,037 MW under construction, all of which are projected to come online by the end of 2010.[1] In the United States, 5,600 MW of solar thermal power projects have been announced.[2] In developing countries, three World Bank projects for integrated solar thermal/combined-cycle gas-turbine power plants in Egypt, Mexico, and Morocco have been approved.[3]

 

[Old Rocks]

What's matter, Fritz, your great good budds don't like the idea of individuals having their own power? The idea that a person can be both a consumer and a producer scare the bejeebers out of you?

It is happening and will increase by orders of magnitudes over the next decade. Germany now produces over 8 Gw of solar.

You think the gubamint isn't gonna put a meter on yer' solar panels? Guess again.

And if your Solar Power turns out to be more efficient and you actually use less, that means the gubamint will lose money in taxes.

So you know what they will do?



























Wait for it.

























































Raise taxes on your solar equipment to make up for the losses.

Really? Surely does not seem to be the case now.

Renewable Resources Residential Energy Tax Credits for Solar

Even the utilities are helping

Oregon solar power and solar energy rebates, tax credits, and incentives. Cost breakdown for photovoltaic panels and solar water heaters

Any other silliness to contribute?

 

[Big Fitz]

Fritz, it is the 21st century. Solar thermal, and, concerning pv solar, we have our greatest use of electricity during the day.

Still doesn't work in the dark, unless you want to start using orbital power.
Now THERE'S a danger to life limb and lilac.

Ah, Fritzy, your ignorance is once again so evident.

List of solar thermal power stations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is a list of solar thermal power stations. These include the 354 megawatt (MW) Solar Energy Generating Systems power plant in the USA, Nevada Solar One (USA, 64 MW), Andasol solar power station (Spain, 100 MW), PS20 solar power tower (Spain, 20 MW), and the PS10 solar power tower (Spain, 11 MW).

The solar thermal power industry is growing rapidly with 1.2 GW under construction as of April 2009 and another 13.9 GW announced globally through 2014. Spain is the epicenter of solar thermal power development with 22 projects for 1,037 MW under construction, all of which are projected to come online by the end of 2010.[1] In the United States, 5,600 MW of solar thermal power projects have been announced.[2] In developing countries, three World Bank projects for integrated solar thermal/combined-cycle gas-turbine power plants in Egypt, Mexico, and Morocco have been approved.[3]

Wish in one hand... shit in the other.... which is gonna fill first again? I am fairly certain that the Spanish, once bankrupt, will be dropping this expensive green folderol for more practical uses of money and jobs.

 

[Big Fitz]

Still doesn't work in the dark, unless you want to start using orbital power.
Now THERE'S a danger to life limb and lilac.

Ah, Fritzy, your ignorance is once again so evident.

List of solar thermal power stations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is a list of solar thermal power stations. These include the 354 megawatt (MW) Solar Energy Generating Systems power plant in the USA, Nevada Solar One (USA, 64 MW), Andasol solar power station (Spain, 100 MW), PS20 solar power tower (Spain, 20 MW), and the PS10 solar power tower (Spain, 11 MW).

The solar thermal power industry is growing rapidly with 1.2 GW under construction as of April 2009 and another 13.9 GW announced globally through 2014. Spain is the epicenter of solar thermal power development with 22 projects for 1,037 MW under construction, all of which are projected to come online by the end of 2010.[1] In the United States, 5,600 MW of solar thermal power projects have been announced.[2] In developing countries, three World Bank projects for integrated solar thermal/combined-cycle gas-turbine power plants in Egypt, Mexico, and Morocco have been approved.[3]

Wish in one hand... shit in the other.... which is gonna fill first again? I am fairly certain that the Spanish, once bankrupt, will be dropping this expensive green folderol for more practical uses of money and jobs.

Really? Surely does not seem to be the case now.

Renewable Resources Residential Energy Tax Credits for Solar

What's the percentage of subsidies received by Solar Power again? 30% 50%... more? Till it's profitable without subsidies... it's not viable as a technology on mass scale. This is painfully obvious to anyone not pushing a fucking agenda.

 

[Old Rocks]

Now Fritzy, no reason to wax more stupid than ussual. What are the subsidies for Petroleum? How about those for coal producers? Once the very efficient and low cost solar manufacturing plants are up and running, then the subsidies will cease. And they are just around the corner, being built as we post.

 

[Mad Scientist]

Really? Surely does not seem to be the case now. Renewable Resources Residential Energy Tax Credits for Solar
Even the utilities are helpingOregon solar power and solar energy rebates, tax credits, and incentives. Cost breakdown for photovoltaic panels and solar water heatersAny other silliness to contribute?

OPB News The Switch: Is Solar Power Only A Rich Man's Renewable Source?

Osborn says upfront installation costs can make projects like the Pro Logis lease too expensive.
“We invited three solar installers to come out and do bids, and when we looked at the bids, we decided that even though we’d really like to do this, it didn’t make financial sense, it didn’t pencil out, because it would be nearly 30 years before we'd get our money back.”
Pengilly says his system would have cost him $14,000 up front, and later, he’d get up to $10,000 of that back - over a few years - through tax incentives.
The last four grand he'd recover - very slowly - by cutting his electric bill by about $25 a month

You have to admit that's too much money up front to save a measly 25 bucks. Some friends of ours who live in sunny Southern California bought a complete solar system from the electric company (So Cal Edison). The nice part is that they have no electric bill (except for the taxes) but they do have to pay the bill for financing the whole installation over 20 years. So the whole thing is just a wash.
And apparently there is a problem with giving tax breaks to businesses in Oregon as well:

The Problem With Oregon’s Business Energy Tax Credit | Triple Pundit: People, Planet, Profit

Walmart “raked in $11 million by taking advantage of it—without ever touching a solar panel or a wind turbine.”The Weyerhaeuser Paper Mill received $3.3 million in Oregon energy credits in 2008 for revamping a biomass plant that burned wood waste for heat and steam, and capturing the heat to dry paper. The company then sold energy tax credits to Walmart for $2.3 million in cash. Walmart is able to deduct the full $3.3 million from its Oregon income tax over five years. Last year, International Paper bought the mill and shut down production. Walmart is benefiting from energy tax credits even though the mill is no longer in operation.
"The problem is, we’re taking taxpayer money that is supposed to be accomplishing energy efficiency or power generation and instead we’re putting it into the financial market,”

Wow, all that tax money wasted, but hey, your energy bill may fall 25 bucks a month.
Sounds like yer typical Green Jobs scam. Business benefits while the taxpayer gets screwed.

But you would just consider that "silliness" right?

​

 

[Big Fitz]

Now Fritzy, no reason to wax more stupid than ussual. What are the subsidies for Petroleum? How about those for coal producers? Once the very efficient and low cost solar manufacturing plants are up and running, then the subsidies will cease. And they are just around the corner, being built as we post.

And how much of the subsidies is made back in taxes and rent costs from the federal government? All of it? More?

You try to play this game, but you just can't be anything but a partisan hack who won't be honest.

"Around the corner"? ROFL... you're right... in 75+ years, for residential and low energy commercial only. Not industrial.