LIBYIA: The biggest Obama blunder

[JRK]

Jihadists plot to take over Libya - Washington Times[/url

The resons we went intp Iraq after 9-11 become more obvious daily
with the find of a small mountain of "yellow cake"
That was just part of the reason
this was the real reason that we were obvious in sharing with the world

Allowing the internal melt-down of Libya is a huge mistake that we will pay for on the years to come

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

The resons we went intp Iraq after 9-11 become more obvious daily
with the find of a small mountain of "yellow cake"
That was just part of the reason
this was the real reason that we were obvious in sharing with the world

Allowing the internal melt-down of Libya is a huge mistake that we will pay for on the years to come.

The Iraq ‘yellow cake find’ was proven years ago as false:

snopes.com: Yellowcake Uranium Removed from Iraq

We ‘went into Iraq’ to ensure GWB’s re-election, and no other reason.

As for Libya becoming an ‘Islamist state,’ there’s no way for the US to control that, nor was there any way to prevent an ‘internal melt-down, ‘ as the Gadhafi government was doomed regardless.

Consequently this is a pointless and meaningless thread.

 

[JRK]

The resons we went intp Iraq after 9-11 become more obvious daily
with the find of a small mountain of "yellow cake"
That was just part of the reason
this was the real reason that we were obvious in sharing with the world

Allowing the internal melt-down of Libya is a huge mistake that we will pay for on the years to come.

The Iraq ‘yellow cake find’ was proven years ago as false:

snopes.com: Yellowcake Uranium Removed from Iraq

We ‘went into Iraq’ to ensure GWB’s re-election, and no other reason.

As for Libya becoming an ‘Islamist state,’ there’s no way for the US to control that, nor was there any way to prevent an ‘internal melt-down, ‘ as the Gadhafi government was doomed regardless.

Consequently this is a pointless and meaningless thread.

Your snopes link has been proven false, it is an opinion
The yellow cake had no record of being there prior to 3/2003
The yellow cake was discovered by US troops after the 2003 US invasion of Iraq at the Tuwaitha Nuclear Research Facility south of Baghdad, and was placed under the control of the International Atomic Energy Agency."
Evidence of WMDs presence in Iraq. - a knol by Luis T. Puig

Operation Opera - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Current stockpile None; programme was infiltrated, abandoned, destroyed by Israel and Iran in 1989. Officially program ended in 1990.

this information that exisited prior to the fact that it did exist prior to 2003 and when it was found was after the invasion as wikipedia notes herein
no stock piles as noted herein

Please provide accurate information thats up to dats on these matters
it is critical people do there DD prior to this election in stead of the way it was done in 08

 

[waltky]

Obama got Moammar onna run...

Panetta: Gadhafi ‘On the Run’
September 06, 2011 - Pentagon officials are among those guessing on the whereabouts of former Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi.

The question of where Moammar Gadhafi is followed U.S. Defense Secretary Leon Panetta Tuesday to New York, where he paid tribute to victims of the 2001 terrorist attacks as the 10th anniversary draws near. “I wish I knew. I don't have any information as to exactly where he's [i.e., Moammar Gadhafi] located. The best information we have is that he's on the run. But as to where he is, I don’t have any information,” he said.

In recent days, Pentagon officials have said they have no information to indicate that the former Libyan leader has left the country, despite speculation that he might have crossed the border into Algeria or Niger. U.S. aircraft are among the multi-national force enforcing a no-fly zone over Libya, helping Libyan insurgents with intelligence-gathering and other support.

Panetta on Tuesday toured the memorial to the New York terror victims and warned that the United States must remain vigilant in the face of continuing threats from al-Qaida. “They continue to plan attacks and I don’t think we can take anything for granted. The potential for that kind of attack remains very real,” he said. The defense secretary said Yemen has risen to the top of the list of countries to watch, following calls by al-Qaida there for new attacks on U.S. targets.

Source

See also:

Did Qaddafi flee to Niger? Libyan convoy in Niger is reminder of Sahel's close ties.
September 6, 2011 - Muammar Qaddafi may not be in Niger, but he has lots of friends to Libya's south.

Armored columns containing Libyan soldiers and top allies of former Libyan strongman Muammar Qaddafi, arriving in the West African country of Niger, set off speculation today that Mr. Qaddafi may be preparing to flee the country. Wishful thinking, perhaps. Eyewitnesses at the border and in the Nigerien capital of Niamey say that Qaddafi himself had not been seen in the convoy, although 12 senior Libyan officials including Qaddafi’s own security chief, Mansour Dao, had been sighted, along with Niger’s ethnic Tuareg rebel leader Rissa ag Boula, who had come to fight in Qaddafi’s defense.

Niger may simply be a stopover for the convoy on the way to Burkina Faso, where President Blaise Compaore – a longtime Qaddafi supporter and protégé – has reportedly offered Qaddafi asylum. But Qaddafi’s long-standing relationship with his neighbors in the African Sahel region – including Chad, Niger, Mali, and Burkina Faso – make it entirely plausible that Qaddafi might seek refuge there, if and when he makes the decision to flee.

“I don’t have specific information about this convoy, but what is clear is that all the Sahelian countries had relationships with Libya and benefited from Libya, and if Burkina Faso has offered asylum, it’s likely that some of Qaddafi’s people are moving to Burkina Faso,” says Thierry Vircoulon, a Sahel expert for the International Crisis Group’s office in Nairobi, Kenya.

Qaddafi’s ties with the arid nations south of the Saharan desert go deeper than mere financial support. They extend back several decades, when several of the present leaders of Sahelian countries were still rebel leaders, desperately seeking arms, logistical support, and training. Qaddafi provided these.

MORE

 

[JRK]

Obama got Moammar onna run...

Panetta: Gadhafi ‘On the Run’
September 06, 2011 - Pentagon officials are among those guessing on the whereabouts of former Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi.

The question of where Moammar Gadhafi is followed U.S. Defense Secretary Leon Panetta Tuesday to New York, where he paid tribute to victims of the 2001 terrorist attacks as the 10th anniversary draws near. “I wish I knew. I don't have any information as to exactly where he's [i.e., Moammar Gadhafi] located. The best information we have is that he's on the run. But as to where he is, I don’t have any information,” he said.

In recent days, Pentagon officials have said they have no information to indicate that the former Libyan leader has left the country, despite speculation that he might have crossed the border into Algeria or Niger. U.S. aircraft are among the multi-national force enforcing a no-fly zone over Libya, helping Libyan insurgents with intelligence-gathering and other support.

Panetta on Tuesday toured the memorial to the New York terror victims and warned that the United States must remain vigilant in the face of continuing threats from al-Qaida. “They continue to plan attacks and I don’t think we can take anything for granted. The potential for that kind of attack remains very real,” he said. The defense secretary said Yemen has risen to the top of the list of countries to watch, following calls by al-Qaida there for new attacks on U.S. targets.

Source

See also:

Did Qaddafi flee to Niger? Libyan convoy in Niger is reminder of Sahel's close ties.
September 6, 2011 - Muammar Qaddafi may not be in Niger, but he has lots of friends to Libya's south.

Armored columns containing Libyan soldiers and top allies of former Libyan strongman Muammar Qaddafi, arriving in the West African country of Niger, set off speculation today that Mr. Qaddafi may be preparing to flee the country. Wishful thinking, perhaps. Eyewitnesses at the border and in the Nigerien capital of Niamey say that Qaddafi himself had not been seen in the convoy, although 12 senior Libyan officials including Qaddafi’s own security chief, Mansour Dao, had been sighted, along with Niger’s ethnic Tuareg rebel leader Rissa ag Boula, who had come to fight in Qaddafi’s defense.

Niger may simply be a stopover for the convoy on the way to Burkina Faso, where President Blaise Compaore – a longtime Qaddafi supporter and protégé – has reportedly offered Qaddafi asylum. But Qaddafi’s long-standing relationship with his neighbors in the African Sahel region – including Chad, Niger, Mali, and Burkina Faso – make it entirely plausible that Qaddafi might seek refuge there, if and when he makes the decision to flee.

“I don’t have specific information about this convoy, but what is clear is that all the Sahelian countries had relationships with Libya and benefited from Libya, and if Burkina Faso has offered asylum, it’s likely that some of Qaddafi’s people are moving to Burkina Faso,” says Thierry Vircoulon, a Sahel expert for the International Crisis Group’s office in Nairobi, Kenya.

Qaddafi’s ties with the arid nations south of the Saharan desert go deeper than mere financial support. They extend back several decades, when several of the present leaders of Sahelian countries were still rebel leaders, desperately seeking arms, logistical support, and training. Qaddafi provided these.

MORE

My biggest concern is who ins up in charge. this is just like Carter and ran as it UN-folds

 

[GHook93]

We ‘went into Iraq’ to ensure GWB’s re-election, and no other reason.

Are you fucking serious? Where do you people come from. The unpopularity of Iraq War it extremely hard for Bush to get reelected. I think the Iraq War was a kneejerk reaction from a BAD President, to which the premises for war was built on faulty intelligence!

 

[JRK]

We ‘went into Iraq’ to ensure GWB’s re-election, and no other reason.

Are you fucking serious? Where do you people come from. The unpopularity of Iraq War it extremely hard for Bush to get reelected. I think the Iraq War was a kneejerk reaction from a BAD President, to which the premises for war was built on faulty intelligence!

faulty intel?

really
al-Qaeda in Iraq - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Defense.gov News Article: Munitions Found in Iraq Meet WMD Criteria, Official Says

The Uranium Joe Wilson Didn't Mention
By April 2003, when the U.S. invaded Iraq, Saddam Hussein had stockpiled 500 tons of yellowcake uranium at his al Tuwaitha nuclear weapons development plant south of Baghdad.
The Uranium Joe Wilson Didn't Mention

Perfect? no
faulty? some, but in general accurate
Saddam ha lied
he had WMDs
he had not adhered to UN resolutions and GWB had met all items that congress had put forth to make the invasion legal
There ARE 2 sides to this story

 

[pgm]

Libya will be the Obama Administration's biggest blunder? So far it looks like the perfect blue print for limited intervention. We'll see who arises from the ashes, but from a military perspective, it's been a success.

 

[rdean]

I can understand why Republicans think Libya was a debacle. He managed to remove a terrible terrorist dictator without a single American casualty. That's not how it's supposed to happen.

First, you send Americans there with old and rusty equipment.

Then you send in your friends to make billions.

Then you bring back dead Americans in "secret".

Then you let Moammar go scott free.

Then you hide the cost of the war.

Then you tell America how Democrats don't understand how to wage a proper war.

And there you have it. Finally, China ends up with the oil and Libya is now close friends with Iran.

How Republicans wage war.

 

[JRK]

I can understand why Republicans think Libya was a debacle. He managed to remove a terrible terrorist dictator without a single American casualty. That's not how it's supposed to happen.

First, you send Americans there with old and rusty equipment.

Then you send in your friends to make billions.

Then you bring back dead Americans in "secret".

Then you let Moammar go scott free.

Then you hide the cost of the war.

Then you tell America how Democrats don't understand how to wage a proper war.

And there you have it. Finally, China ends up with the oil and Libya is now close friends with Iran.

How Republicans wage war.

to start with the dems voted in a majority to attack

The companies the served us in Iraq have served us 4 ever. there 3-5% profits are little in compared to the service there employees provided

Americans were brought back to a plaace that is meant for them, not you

Mommar? I have no idea what he had to do with Sadddams lies

The cost of the war was less than the failed stimulus as of last year, the only people trying to hide that is Obama

The war in Iraq was a huge success, I wish it never would have happened, as well as 9-11. Saddam had years to do the right thing
by the way
get a grip. Being against the war is your right. Making up reasons that are not true to justify it is not

 

[rdean]

I can understand why Republicans think Libya was a debacle. He managed to remove a terrible terrorist dictator without a single American casualty. That's not how it's supposed to happen.

First, you send Americans there with old and rusty equipment.

Then you send in your friends to make billions.

Then you bring back dead Americans in "secret".

Then you let Moammar go scott free.

Then you hide the cost of the war.

Then you tell America how Democrats don't understand how to wage a proper war.

And there you have it. Finally, China ends up with the oil and Libya is now close friends with Iran.

How Republicans wage war.

to start with the dems voted in a majority to attack

The companies the served us in Iraq have served us 4 ever. there 3-5% profits are little in compared to the service there employees provided

Americans were brought back to a plaace that is meant for them, not you

Mommar? I have no idea what he had to do with Sadddams lies

The cost of the war was less than the failed stimulus as of last year, the only people trying to hide that is Obama

The war in Iraq was a huge success, I wish it never would have happened, as well as 9-11. Saddam had years to do the right thing
by the way
get a grip. Being against the war is your right. Making up reasons that are not true to justify it is not

Blackwater didn't even exist before Iraq.

Democrats voted with Republicans who lied.

There was nothing Saddam could do. Bush knew he was invading Iraq the day he was sworn into office.

If you call putting the female half of the population into burkas and forcing them to live under a hard core, right wing religious theocracy, by Constitution, a "success", then what else can you say?

Just stop.

 

[JRK]

I can understand why Republicans think Libya was a debacle. He managed to remove a terrible terrorist dictator without a single American casualty. That's not how it's supposed to happen.

First, you send Americans there with old and rusty equipment.

Then you send in your friends to make billions.

Then you bring back dead Americans in "secret".

Then you let Moammar go scott free.

Then you hide the cost of the war.

Then you tell America how Democrats don't understand how to wage a proper war.

And there you have it. Finally, China ends up with the oil and Libya is now close friends with Iran.

How Republicans wage war.

to start with the dems voted in a majority to attack

The companies the served us in Iraq have served us 4 ever. there 3-5% profits are little in compared to the service there employees provided

Americans were brought back to a plaace that is meant for them, not you

Mommar? I have no idea what he had to do with Sadddams lies

The cost of the war was less than the failed stimulus as of last year, the only people trying to hide that is Obama

The war in Iraq was a huge success, I wish it never would have happened, as well as 9-11. Saddam had years to do the right thing
by the way
get a grip. Being against the war is your right. Making up reasons that are not true to justify it is not

Blackwater didn't even exist before Iraq.

Democrats voted with Republicans who lied.

There was nothing Saddam could do. Bush knew he was invading Iraq the day he was sworn into office.

If you call putting the female half of the population into burkas and forcing them to live under a hard core, right wing religious theocracy, by Constitution, a "success", then what else can you say?

Just stop.

what does black water have to do with anything/
what lies?
WMDs have been found
Yellow cake has been found
Saddam lied
UN resolutions were not being adhered to, in fact the UN and Saddam were the only liars in the whole bunch in all reality
Saddam could have done the right thing in 1991, this was not about just 2001
And asfar as women go? there are senator in Iraq that are women and they are allowed to vote, your kidding right?

 

[JRK]

I can understand why Republicans think Libya was a debacle. He managed to remove a terrible terrorist dictator without a single American casualty. That's not how it's supposed to happen.

First, you send Americans there with old and rusty equipment.

Then you send in your friends to make billions.

Then you bring back dead Americans in "secret".

Then you let Moammar go scott free.

Then you hide the cost of the war.

Then you tell America how Democrats don't understand how to wage a proper war.

And there you have it. Finally, China ends up with the oil and Libya is now close friends with Iran.

How Republicans wage war.

to start with the dems voted in a majority to attack

The companies the served us in Iraq have served us 4 ever. there 3-5% profits are little in compared to the service there employees provided

Americans were brought back to a plaace that is meant for them, not you

Mommar? I have no idea what he had to do with Sadddams lies

The cost of the war was less than the failed stimulus as of last year, the only people trying to hide that is Obama

The war in Iraq was a huge success, I wish it never would have happened, as well as 9-11. Saddam had years to do the right thing
by the way
get a grip. Being against the war is your right. Making up reasons that are not true to justify it is not

Blackwater didn't even exist before Iraq.

Democrats voted with Republicans who lied.

There was nothing Saddam could do. Bush knew he was invading Iraq the day he was sworn into office.

If you call putting the female half of the population into burkas and forcing them to live under a hard core, right wing religious theocracy, by Constitution, a "success", then what else can you say?

Just stop.

what does black water have to do with anything/
what lies?
WMDs have been found
Yellow cake has been found
Saddam lied
UN resolutions were not being adhered to, in fact the UN and Saddam were the only liars in the whole bunch in all reality
Saddam could have done the right thing in 1991, this was not about just 2001
And as far as women go? there are senator in Iraq that are women and they are allowed to vote, your kidding right?

 

[Sallow]

what does black water have to do with anything/
what lies?
WMDs have been found
Yellow cake has been found
Saddam lied
UN resolutions were not being adhered to, in fact the UN and Saddam were the only liars in the whole bunch in all reality
Saddam could have done the right thing in 1991, this was not about just 2001
And as far as women go? there are senator in Iraq that are women and they are allowed to vote, your kidding right?

You're beating a dead horse with bullshit.

Still stinks.

 

[JRK]

what does black water have to do with anything/
what lies?
WMDs have been found
Yellow cake has been found
Saddam lied
UN resolutions were not being adhered to, in fact the UN and Saddam were the only liars in the whole bunch in all reality
Saddam could have done the right thing in 1991, this was not about just 2001
And as far as women go? there are senator in Iraq that are women and they are allowed to vote, your kidding right?

You're beating a dead horse with bullshit.

Still stinks.

You call it bull shit? back it up dude
what is bull shit?
This thread was about Obama's blunder, not the US success In Iraq
The way Libya has been dealt with has left a vacuum in power that will not end good

 

[GHook93]

Libya will be the Obama Administration's biggest blunder? So far it looks like the perfect blue print for limited intervention. We'll see who arises from the ashes, but from a military perspective, it's been a success.

Afghanistan and Iraq went really well during the fighting! Reconstruction was the hard part!

Defeating ragtag Arab government armies is a pretty easy thing, but builting up the country from ashes, fighting the guerrilla insurgent troops, trying to bring the waring clans together is the hard part.

Libya before the civil war had bands of clans there weren't exactly friends. Gaddiff's central government kept the country relatively stable (as did Sadam's government). Much like after the toppling of Sadam, there is no a power vacuum. It's unlikely these clans will just submit to the other ones!

 

[JRK]

Libya will be the Obama Administration's biggest blunder? So far it looks like the perfect blue print for limited intervention. We'll see who arises from the ashes, but from a military perspective, it's been a success.

Afghanistan and Iraq went really well during the fighting! Reconstruction was the hard part!

Defeating ragtag Arab government armies is a pretty easy thing, but builting up the country from ashes, fighting the guerrilla insurgent troops, trying to bring the waring clans together is the hard part.

Libya before the civil war had bands of clans there weren't exactly friends. Gaddiff's central government kept the country relatively stable (as did Sadam's government). Much like after the toppling of Sadam, there is no a power vacuum. It's unlikely these clans will just submit to the other ones!

The facts can be no better presented than that. Iraq was not about fighting Iraqis as mush as it was fighting the same guerrilla insurgents you speak of that now have Libya to set up up camp