L.A. Launches Nation's First Israel Divestment Campaign

[blu]

Thanks.

I think.

With the exception of the mutually assured destruction of both rival superpowers during the cold war, do you believe this nation has faced any threat to its existence since the end of WWII?

No. But our allies and our interests have been threatened, and we stepped in militarily.

Let me guess: We don't have "the right" to do that.

nope we sure don't, those other countries can take care of themselves, and we should mind our own business.

 

[Trajan]

thank you Lindberg.

 

[georgephillip]

You're welcome, Sharon.

 

[daveman]

Thanks.

I think.

With the exception of the mutually assured destruction of both rival superpowers during the cold war, do you believe this nation has faced any threat to its existence since the end of WWII?

No. But our allies and our interests have been threatened, and we stepped in militarily.

Let me guess: We don't have "the right" to do that.

nope we sure don't, those other countries can take care of themselves, and we should mind our own business.

Yeah, that worked out so well in WWII, didn't it?

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to vote Democrat.

 

[Trajan]

No. But our allies and our interests have been threatened, and we stepped in militarily.

Let me guess: We don't have "the right" to do that.

nope we sure don't, those other countries can take care of themselves, and we should mind our own business.

Yeah, that worked out so well in WWII, didn't it?

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to vote Democrat.

the only time that exists for some is the time they are in.

 

[georgephillip]

No. But our allies and our interests have been threatened, and we stepped in militarily.

Let me guess: We don't have "the right" to do that.

I think the official (UN) position is we do not have the right to use force as a first resort in order to protect our interests and allies.

There also seems to be a violation of the moral principle of universality in that we are free to intervene in the Persian Gulf while rival powers don't have the same right in the Gulf of Mexico.

The UN is strangely silent when nations other than the US and Israel use military solutions to their problems. The UN has no credibility.

Do you remember Christmas of '79?

"The U.N. General Assembly passed a resolution protesting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan by a vote of 104-18."

 

[daveman]

nope we sure don't, those other countries can take care of themselves, and we should mind our own business.

Yeah, that worked out so well in WWII, didn't it?

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to vote Democrat.

the only time that exists for some is the time they are in.

Just like sheep -- wake up brand new every morning, startled by the sunrise.

 

[daveman]

I think the official (UN) position is we do not have the right to use force as a first resort in order to protect our interests and allies.

There also seems to be a violation of the moral principle of universality in that we are free to intervene in the Persian Gulf while rival powers don't have the same right in the Gulf of Mexico.

The UN is strangely silent when nations other than the US and Israel use military solutions to their problems. The UN has no credibility.

Do you remember Christmas of '79?

"The U.N. General Assembly passed a resolution protesting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan by a vote of 104-18."

And since then?

The UN is a bash-American, bash-Israel club of terrorists, thugs, and their appeasers.

 

[georgephillip]

The UN is strangely silent when nations other than the US and Israel use military solutions to their problems. The UN has no credibility.

Do you remember Christmas of '79?

"The U.N. General Assembly passed a resolution protesting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan by a vote of 104-18."

And since then?

The UN is a bash-American, bash-Israel club of terrorists, thugs, and their appeasers.

The UN supported Clinton's NATO air campaign against Yugoslavia in 1999, for better or worse.

Recently a UN special rapporteur, Rich Falk, suggested a possible Kosovo solution for Palestine:

"Lengthy negotiations have not resolved the issue of the status of Palestine, nor do they give any reasonable prospect that any resolution by negotiation or unilateral withdrawal will soon occur," he (Falk) said.

"Under these circumstances, it would seem that one option available to the Palestine Liberation Organization [the Oslo Agreement empowered the PLO to negotiate international status issues] acting on its own or by way of the Palestinian Authority under international law would be to issue a unilateral declaration of status, seeking independence, diplomatic recognition and membership in the United Nations.

"The recent Kosovo advisory opinion of the World Court in The Hague provides a well-reasoned legal precedent for such an option."

Do you have a viable replacement for the UN in mind or should we just roll over and let the rich bankers and generals bomb the hell out of everyone's children?

Formalizing Israel's Land Grab

 

[daveman]

Do you remember Christmas of '79?

"The U.N. General Assembly passed a resolution protesting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan by a vote of 104-18."

And since then?

The UN is a bash-American, bash-Israel club of terrorists, thugs, and their appeasers.

The UN supported Clinton's NATO air campaign against Yugoslavia in 1999, for better or worse.

Recently a UN special rapporteur, Rich Falk, suggested a possible Kosovo solution for Palestine:

"Lengthy negotiations have not resolved the issue of the status of Palestine, nor do they give any reasonable prospect that any resolution by negotiation or unilateral withdrawal will soon occur," he (Falk) said.

"Under these circumstances, it would seem that one option available to the Palestine Liberation Organization [the Oslo Agreement empowered the PLO to negotiate international status issues] acting on its own or by way of the Palestinian Authority under international law would be to issue a unilateral declaration of status, seeking independence, diplomatic recognition and membership in the United Nations.

"The recent Kosovo advisory opinion of the World Court in The Hague provides a well-reasoned legal precedent for such an option."

Do you have a viable replacement for the UN in mind or should we just roll over and let the rich bankers and generals bomb the hell out of everyone's children?

Formalizing Israel's Land Grab

How is that any worse than what you want...letting dictators and terrorists have whatever they want?

Oh, and Commondreams?

As for Falk's 'solution", all that would do is give legitimacy to Palestinian violence against Israel. Of course, you don't see that as a bad thing.

 

[P F Tinmore]

And since then?

The UN is a bash-American, bash-Israel club of terrorists, thugs, and their appeasers.

The UN supported Clinton's NATO air campaign against Yugoslavia in 1999, for better or worse.

Recently a UN special rapporteur, Rich Falk, suggested a possible Kosovo solution for Palestine:

"Lengthy negotiations have not resolved the issue of the status of Palestine, nor do they give any reasonable prospect that any resolution by negotiation or unilateral withdrawal will soon occur," he (Falk) said.

"Under these circumstances, it would seem that one option available to the Palestine Liberation Organization [the Oslo Agreement empowered the PLO to negotiate international status issues] acting on its own or by way of the Palestinian Authority under international law would be to issue a unilateral declaration of status, seeking independence, diplomatic recognition and membership in the United Nations.

"The recent Kosovo advisory opinion of the World Court in The Hague provides a well-reasoned legal precedent for such an option."

Do you have a viable replacement for the UN in mind or should we just roll over and let the rich bankers and generals bomb the hell out of everyone's children?

Formalizing Israel's Land Grab

How is that any worse than what you want...letting dictators and terrorists have whatever they want?

Oh, and Commondreams?

As for Falk's 'solution", all that would do is give legitimacy to Palestinian violence against Israel. Of course, you don't see that as a bad thing.

The occupation is the cause of the violence. Ending the occupation will end the violence.

This isn't rocket science, folks.

 

[georgephillip]

And since then?

The UN is a bash-American, bash-Israel club of terrorists, thugs, and their appeasers.

The UN supported Clinton's NATO air campaign against Yugoslavia in 1999, for better or worse.

Recently a UN special rapporteur, Rich Falk, suggested a possible Kosovo solution for Palestine:

"Lengthy negotiations have not resolved the issue of the status of Palestine, nor do they give any reasonable prospect that any resolution by negotiation or unilateral withdrawal will soon occur," he (Falk) said.

"Under these circumstances, it would seem that one option available to the Palestine Liberation Organization [the Oslo Agreement empowered the PLO to negotiate international status issues] acting on its own or by way of the Palestinian Authority under international law would be to issue a unilateral declaration of status, seeking independence, diplomatic recognition and membership in the United Nations.

"The recent Kosovo advisory opinion of the World Court in The Hague provides a well-reasoned legal precedent for such an option."

Do you have a viable replacement for the UN in mind or should we just roll over and let the rich bankers and generals bomb the hell out of everyone's children?

Formalizing Israel's Land Grab

How is that any worse than what you want...letting dictators and terrorists have whatever they want?

Oh, and Commondreams?

As for Falk's 'solution", all that would do is give legitimacy to Palestinian violence against Israel. Of course, you don't see that as a bad thing.

Chris Hedges content republished in CommonDreams:

"In 1983, Hedges began his career reporting on the conflict in El Salvador. Following six years in Latin America, he took time off to study Arabic and then went to Jerusalem and later Cairo. He spent seven years in the Middle East, most of them as the Middle East Bureau Chief for The New York Times.

"During the first Gulf War he was taken prisoner by the Iraqi Republican Guard while covering the Shiite uprising in the southern Iraqi city of Basra. He was released after a week to the International Committee of the Red Cross.

"He left the Middle East in 1995 for Sarajevo to cover the war in Bosnia followed by the war in Kosovo. Later, he joined the investigative team of The New York Times, based in Paris, and covered terrorism."

Most of the planet believes Palestinians have a right to defend themselves from an illegal occupation.

Why don't you?

 

[daveman]

The UN supported Clinton's NATO air campaign against Yugoslavia in 1999, for better or worse.

Recently a UN special rapporteur, Rich Falk, suggested a possible Kosovo solution for Palestine:

"Lengthy negotiations have not resolved the issue of the status of Palestine, nor do they give any reasonable prospect that any resolution by negotiation or unilateral withdrawal will soon occur," he (Falk) said.

"Under these circumstances, it would seem that one option available to the Palestine Liberation Organization [the Oslo Agreement empowered the PLO to negotiate international status issues] acting on its own or by way of the Palestinian Authority under international law would be to issue a unilateral declaration of status, seeking independence, diplomatic recognition and membership in the United Nations.

"The recent Kosovo advisory opinion of the World Court in The Hague provides a well-reasoned legal precedent for such an option."

Do you have a viable replacement for the UN in mind or should we just roll over and let the rich bankers and generals bomb the hell out of everyone's children?

Formalizing Israel's Land Grab

How is that any worse than what you want...letting dictators and terrorists have whatever they want?

Oh, and Commondreams?

As for Falk's 'solution", all that would do is give legitimacy to Palestinian violence against Israel. Of course, you don't see that as a bad thing.

Chris Hedges content republished in CommonDreams:

"In 1983, Hedges began his career reporting on the conflict in El Salvador. Following six years in Latin America, he took time off to study Arabic and then went to Jerusalem and later Cairo. He spent seven years in the Middle East, most of them as the Middle East Bureau Chief for The New York Times.

"During the first Gulf War he was taken prisoner by the Iraqi Republican Guard while covering the Shiite uprising in the southern Iraqi city of Basra. He was released after a week to the International Committee of the Red Cross.

"He left the Middle East in 1995 for Sarajevo to cover the war in Bosnia followed by the war in Kosovo. Later, he joined the investigative team of The New York Times, based in Paris, and covered terrorism."

Most of the planet believes Palestinians have a right to defend themselves from an illegal occupation.

Why don't you?

By killing children?

Oh, yeah, they're only Jews, so who cares?

I don't give a shit what most of the planet believes. Are you so weak-minded you have to go along with the majority? Most of the planet hates America, too. Is that why you do as well?

 

[Trajan]

I think the official (UN) position is we do not have the right to use force as a first resort in order to protect our interests and allies.

There also seems to be a violation of the moral principle of universality in that we are free to intervene in the Persian Gulf while rival powers don't have the same right in the Gulf of Mexico.

The UN is strangely silent when nations other than the US and Israel use military solutions to their problems. The UN has no credibility.

Do you remember Christmas of '79?

"The U.N. General Assembly passed a resolution protesting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan by a vote of 104-18."

george, having to reach back 30 years won't help.

 

[Trajan]

The occupation is the cause of the violence. Ending the occupation will end the violence.

the occupation of what?

This isn't rocket science, folks.

tell that to Hamas.

 

[georgephillip]

The UN is strangely silent when nations other than the US and Israel use military solutions to their problems. The UN has no credibility.

Do you remember Christmas of '79?

"The U.N. General Assembly passed a resolution protesting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan by a vote of 104-18."

george, having to reach back 30 years won't help.

Do you think it's accurate to say that over the last 30 years the UN has helped the US government achieve its foreign policy objectives more often than not?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Do you remember Christmas of '79?

"The U.N. General Assembly passed a resolution protesting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan by a vote of 104-18."

george, having to reach back 30 years won't help.

Do you think it's accurate to say that over the last 30 years the UN has helped the US government achieve its foreign policy objectives more often than not?

Well, they are "securing" Haiti after the US coup there... when was that...about 5 or 6 years ago.

 

[georgephillip]

george, having to reach back 30 years won't help.

Do you think it's accurate to say that over the last 30 years the UN has helped the US government achieve its foreign policy objectives more often than not?

Well, they are "securing" Haiti after the US coup there... when was that...about 5 or 6 years ago.

Haiti really deserves a thread all its own.
Between the US, France, and the UN its amazing there are any Haitians left alive.
I guess someone has to stitch up all those baseballs and Disney Dolls.

Right after the US kidnapped Aristite and shipped him off to Africa, Bush turned to the UN to sanitize the crime scene.

The Haitians sealed their fate when they pulled off the only successful slave revolution in history during the 19th century.

The rich really get nervous when the slaves win a gunfight.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Do you think it's accurate to say that over the last 30 years the UN has helped the US government achieve its foreign policy objectives more often than not?

Well, they are "securing" Haiti after the US coup there... when was that...about 5 or 6 years ago.

Haiti really deserves a thread all its own.
Between the US, France, and the UN its amazing there are any Haitians left alive.
I guess someone has to stitch up all those baseballs and Disney Dolls.

Right after the US kidnapped Aristite and shipped him off to Africa, Bush turned to the UN to sanitize the crime scene.

The Haitians sealed their fate when they pulled off the only successful slave revolution in history during the 19th century.

The rich really get nervous when the slaves win a gunfight.

FYI:

Reports on the Haiti coup starting a couple of weeks before the coup.

Democracy Now! | Haiti

 

[georgephillip]

...cripple Israeli banks.

"Banking is the lifeblood of any economy."

In the 1980s the international banking sanctions campaign against apartheid South Africa focused on New York banks to bring about a nonviolent end to South African apartheid.

"The campaign culminated in President FW de Klerk's announcement in February 1990, releasing Nelson Mandela and other political prisoners, and the beginning of constitutional negotiations towards a non-racial and democratic society."

Today Belgium, not New York, most directly affects Israel's access to the international banking system since the Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Telecommunication (SWIFT) is located there.

"SWIFT links 8,740 financial institutions in 209 countries. Without access to SWIFT and its interbank payment network, countries are unable either to pay for imports or to receive payment for exports.

"In short, no payment -- no trade.

"Should it come to a point where trade sanctions are imposed on Israel, it may be able to evade them. Instead of chasing trade sanctions-busters and plugging loopholes, it is both faster and much more effective to suspend the payment system."

To end the occupation...