GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

[BluesLegend]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

Who's fault is it if they don't have coverage? Not mine, not Trump's, not the GOP's. Here's an idea, get a job pay your own damn bills.

 

[WillReadmore]

You didn't answer the question.

Can you?

Again, why is being an American citizen worse than being a Brit ... or anyone anywhere in Europe? Why is it worse than being a citizen of Japan?

Seriously - I want to know.

We are different countries, that's why.

Move to Europe or Japan.

Elections have consequences. You lost. Get in the back of the bus.

That's not the question.

The question is why is being an American citizen worse than being a citizen of any country in Europe, Japan, UK, Israel, or the rest?

It's not worse. It's just different.

If you are really unhappy, you should expatriate. It's not hard.....or you could win some elections. They do have consequences, Obama told me.

I don't have to worry about it. I have a top of the line, gold star plan that seems to want to find more ways to serve me. Providers are way happy to see me - and I'm sure my good looks can't explain that much happy.


But, as someone who cares about America I am NOT interested in seeing us decide that the price of MY policy is more important than whether tens of millions of Americans get ANY health care - that we're ready to dump people from health care coverage, because I just need my policy to be cheaper.


More than that, I am TOTALLY POed over this idea of killing what we have, what every family in America is depending on, without even knowing what's going to happen.

Congress can NOT get more irresponsible than that. It should be a crime.

And, yes, being an American citizen should be every bit as good as being some European or Japanese or whatever.

The unaca was not put into place overnight; undoing it will take time. The Dems made it intentionally difficult to undo. It has many long reaching tentacles.

I'll believe the Rs are willing to give up big gov't control over heathcare when I see it.

Well, they can do a LOT of damage without giving up any control.

The primary problem here is NOT what the ACA is today, but the FACT that R's want to kill it BEFORE knowing what comes next.

Their direction is PURELY partisan - or they would show the improvements they want to make.

How can ANY family in America tolerate that?

 

[teapartysamurai]

If they scrap it which is fine, keep the pre existing conditions part and kids on policies until age 26. Those make total sense. Then sit down and figure a new system out. Perhaps telling big pharma to reel in their costs is a start. Everyone wants to rail on the govt, but private industry for some reason should not be touched. I say bull to that.

You don't get that's part of why premiums are so high.

For most people, premiums have not increased any faster since the ACA went into effect than prior to it. 50% of American get their insurance through their employer where the average family plan premium has risen at only 3%/year. 39% get of the insured get their insurance through Medicaid and Medicare where premiums are not effected by the ACA. The remain 11% get individual policies through the healthcare exchanges or other sources. These premiums paid after any subsidy have had small to huge increases depending on family income and region. Thus less than only 1 in every 10 families have had large increases in premiums.

If Republicans concentrate on lowering premiums, they'll be missing the ball. The problem most people have is higher deductibles, coinsurance, and copays, particular in individual policies which are the result of increased coverage of plans, higher medical costs of covering sicker people and providing additional coverage required by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/26/upshot/rising-obamacare-rates-what-you-need-to-know.html

Yeah that's nice quoting a liberal rag that tried to cover for Hillary through the election and gave her a 95% chance of winning.

Reality is somewhat different.

Obamacare premiums to soar 22% on average

www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/10/19/Obamacare-Rate-Hikes-2017-Even-Bigger-Expected

It’s official: Double-digit rate hikes for Obamacare

New York times can say anything they want.

They can't hide the rate increases and there are reasons for them.

One of the big ones is no pre-existing conditions and keeping kids to age 26 on their policies.

Those are nice goals, I'm not against keeping those. But reality has to set in some time and reality is, that's part of the reason insurance has become so expensive and if you want it competitive again, then reality has to come back to insurance.

 

[WillReadmore]

If they scrap it which is fine, keep the pre existing conditions part and kids on policies until age 26. Those make total sense. Then sit down and figure a new system out. Perhaps telling big pharma to reel in their costs is a start. Everyone wants to rail on the govt, but private industry for some reason should not be touched. I say bull to that.

You don't get that's part of why premiums are so high.

For most people, premiums have not increased any faster since the ACA went into effect than prior to it. 50% of American get their insurance through their employer where the average family plan premium has risen at only 3%/year. 39% get of the insured get their insurance through Medicaid and Medicare where premiums are not effected by the ACA. The remain 11% get individual policies through the healthcare exchanges or other sources. These premiums paid after any subsidy have had small to huge increases depending on family income and region. Thus less than only 1 in every 10 families have had large increases in premiums.

If Republicans concentrate on lowering premiums, they'll be missing the ball. The problem most people have is higher deductibles, coinsurance, and copays, particular in individual policies which are the result of increased coverage of plans, higher medical costs of covering sicker people and providing additional coverage required by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/26/upshot/rising-obamacare-rates-what-you-need-to-know.html

Yeah that's nice quoting a liberal rag that tried to cover for Hillary through the election and gave her a 95% chance of winning.

Reality is somewhat different.

Obamacare premiums to soar 22% on average

www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/10/19/Obamacare-Rate-Hikes-2017-Even-Bigger-Expected

It’s official: Double-digit rate hikes for Obamacare

New York times can say anything they want.

They can't hide the rate increases and there are reasons for them.

One of the big ones is no pre-existing conditions and keeping kids to age 26 on their policies.

Those are nice goals, I'm not against keeping those. But reality has to set in some time and reality is, that's part of the reason insurance has become so expensive and if you want it competitive again, then reality has to come back to insurance.

Total health care spending in the US has been on a straight line of growth since the 1970s.

What we're seeing is insurance companies bouncing around as they try to be cost competitive with other insurance companies while earning maximum profit for shareholders.

And, cost saving features were cut from the ACA before passage in order to get every last wack job lefty Democrat to sign. Those cost saving measures still exist somewhere, and could be implemented - along with other ideas.

Taking care of pre-existing conditions is just as important as taking care of conditions that come up unexpectedly.

 

[Cellblock2429]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

/---- Where is your fake outrage over this?
Why 27 Million Are Still Uninsured Under Obamacare - Bloomberg
Why 27 Million Are Still Uninsured Under Obamacare
Oct 19, 2016 - Why 27 Million Are Still Uninsured Under Obamacare ... achieved a primary goal: reducing the number of people without health insurance. ... And there are a variety of reasons they're being left behind by the law's gains, ...

 

[BluesLegend]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

Who's fault is it if they don't have coverage? Not mine, not Trump's, not the GOP's. Here's an idea, get a job pay your own damn bills.

We know from decades of experience that our system has never before been set up to make that possible for a highly significant segment of our population.

And, I am NOT just talking about the tens of millions who have gotten insurance through the subsidy program. The changes concerning preexisting conditions are critical for large numbers who previously couldn't so much as switch jobs or start their own companies, because it meant losing health care. It affected those who got sick and were thus dumped by their insurance company. And, of course, it is affected by the rapidly increasing high tech of the medical world that is offering life saving solutions to those who would otherwise die - from new born infants and on through all age groups.

Through the ACA we made progress toward

If they scrap it which is fine, keep the pre existing conditions part and kids on policies until age 26. Those make total sense. Then sit down and figure a new system out. Perhaps telling big pharma to reel in their costs is a start. Everyone wants to rail on the govt, but private industry for some reason should not be touched. I say bull to that.

You don't get that's part of why premiums are so high.

For most people, premiums have not increased any faster since the ACA went into effect than prior to it. 50% of American get their insurance through their employer where the average family plan premium has risen at only 3%/year. 39% get of the insured get their insurance through Medicaid and Medicare where premiums are not effected by the ACA. The remain 11% get individual policies through the healthcare exchanges or other sources. These premiums paid after any subsidy have had small to huge increases depending on family income and region. Thus less than only 1 in every 10 families have had large increases in premiums.

If Republicans concentrate on lowering premiums, they'll be missing the ball. The problem most people have is higher deductibles, coinsurance, and copays, particular in individual policies which are the result of increased coverage of plans, higher medical costs of covering sicker people and providing additional coverage required by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/26/upshot/rising-obamacare-rates-what-you-need-to-know.html

Yeah that's nice quoting a liberal rag that tried to cover for Hillary through the election and gave her a 95% chance of winning.

Reality is somewhat different.

Obamacare premiums to soar 22% on average

www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/10/19/Obamacare-Rate-Hikes-2017-Even-Bigger-Expected

It’s official: Double-digit rate hikes for Obamacare

New York times can say anything they want.

They can't hide the rate increases and there are reasons for them.

One of the big ones is no pre-existing conditions and keeping kids to age 26 on their policies.

Those are nice goals, I'm not against keeping those. But reality has to set in some time and reality is, that's part of the reason insurance has become so expensive and if you want it competitive again, then reality has to come back to insurance.

Total health care spending in the US has been on a straight line of growth since the 1970s.

What we're seeing is insurance companies bouncing around as they try to be cost competitive with other insurance companies while earning maximum profit for shareholders.

And, cost saving features were cut from the ACA before passage in order to get every last wack job lefty Democrat to sign. Those cost saving measures still exist somewhere, and could be implemented - along with other ideas.

Taking care of pre-existing conditions is just as important as taking care of conditions that come up unexpectedly.

There was already bipartisan support for a dozen or so crucial healthcare reforms like the pre-existing conditions exclusions. Those reforms could have been implemented in a bipartisan bill 1/100th the size of the ACA bill at a fraction of the cost and without turning our existing healthcare industry upside down and putting the goddamn incompetent government in charge of it.

What Obama and the Dem's did is cram this gigantic pile of crap bill through as fast as possible before voters would have a chance to put the brakes on it. Its a bloated to the hilt big government power grab over 2,000 pages long. Well they crammed it through and now they paid the price. They lost the House, the Senate, the White House, the GOP now control 33 governorships, 69 of 99 state legislatures.

They paid a heavy price and now the ACA bill is going to be undone and replaced. Probably with the much smaller list of reforms there was already bipartisan support for, that was doable, and had a chance of not failing. ACA is on a glide path to choking on its own financial meltdown so people are going to lose the ACA one way or another. If the GOP does nothing it will die on its own.

 

[Cellblock2429]

stop people from going to the hospital with an insurance card in their wallet, and have an insurance company pay the bill ...

/---- If they first pay the $7,000 deductible.

 

[toomuchtime_]

If they scrap it which is fine, keep the pre existing conditions part and kids on policies until age 26. Those make total sense. Then sit down and figure a new system out. Perhaps telling big pharma to reel in their costs is a start. Everyone wants to rail on the govt, but private industry for some reason should not be touched. I say bull to that.

You don't get that's part of why premiums are so high.

For most people, premiums have not increased any faster since the ACA went into effect than prior to it. 50% of American get their insurance through their employer where the average family plan premium has risen at only 3%/year. 39% get of the insured get their insurance through Medicaid and Medicare where premiums are not effected by the ACA. The remain 11% get individual policies through the healthcare exchanges or other sources. These premiums paid after any subsidy have had small to huge increases depending on family income and region. Thus less than only 1 in every 10 families have had large increases in premiums.

If Republicans concentrate on lowering premiums, they'll be missing the ball. The problem most people have is higher deductibles, coinsurance, and copays, particular in individual policies which are the result of increased coverage of plans, higher medical costs of covering sicker people and providing additional coverage required by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/26/upshot/rising-obamacare-rates-what-you-need-to-know.html

Yeah that's nice quoting a liberal rag that tried to cover for Hillary through the election and gave her a 95% chance of winning.

Reality is somewhat different.

Obamacare premiums to soar 22% on average

www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/10/19/Obamacare-Rate-Hikes-2017-Even-Bigger-Expected

It’s official: Double-digit rate hikes for Obamacare

New York times can say anything they want.

They can't hide the rate increases and there are reasons for them.

One of the big ones is no pre-existing conditions and keeping kids to age 26 on their policies.

Those are nice goals, I'm not against keeping those. But reality has to set in some time and reality is, that's part of the reason insurance has become so expensive and if you want it competitive again, then reality has to come back to insurance.

Total health care spending in the US has been on a straight line of growth since the 1970s.

What we're seeing is insurance companies bouncing around as they try to be cost competitive with other insurance companies while earning maximum profit for shareholders.

And, cost saving features were cut from the ACA before passage in order to get every last wack job lefty Democrat to sign. Those cost saving measures still exist somewhere, and could be implemented - along with other ideas.

Taking care of pre-existing conditions is just as important as taking care of conditions that come up unexpectedly.

Comprehensive healthcare for people with preesxisting conditions and the poor has been available for many years under a state federal partnership program, HRSA, which runs thousands of clinics nationwide.

Official Web site of the U.S. Health Resources & Services Administration

Obamacare was a political scam from the beginning, driven by ideology and not by need.

 

[WillReadmore]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

Who's fault is it if they don't have coverage? Not mine, not Trump's, not the GOP's. Here's an idea, get a job pay your own damn bills.

We know from decades of experience that our system has never before been set up to make that possible for a highly significant segment of our population.

And, I am NOT just talking about the tens of millions who have gotten insurance through the subsidy program. The changes concerning preexisting conditions are critical for large numbers who previously couldn't so much as switch jobs or start their own companies, because it meant losing health care. It affected those who got sick and were thus dumped by their insurance company. And, of course, it is affected by the rapidly increasing high tech of the medical world that is offering life saving solutions to those who would otherwise die - from new born infants and on through all age groups.

Through the ACA we made progress toward

If they scrap it which is fine, keep the pre existing conditions part and kids on policies until age 26. Those make total sense. Then sit down and figure a new system out. Perhaps telling big pharma to reel in their costs is a start. Everyone wants to rail on the govt, but private industry for some reason should not be touched. I say bull to that.

You don't get that's part of why premiums are so high.

For most people, premiums have not increased any faster since the ACA went into effect than prior to it. 50% of American get their insurance through their employer where the average family plan premium has risen at only 3%/year. 39% get of the insured get their insurance through Medicaid and Medicare where premiums are not effected by the ACA. The remain 11% get individual policies through the healthcare exchanges or other sources. These premiums paid after any subsidy have had small to huge increases depending on family income and region. Thus less than only 1 in every 10 families have had large increases in premiums.

If Republicans concentrate on lowering premiums, they'll be missing the ball. The problem most people have is higher deductibles, coinsurance, and copays, particular in individual policies which are the result of increased coverage of plans, higher medical costs of covering sicker people and providing additional coverage required by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/26/upshot/rising-obamacare-rates-what-you-need-to-know.html

Yeah that's nice quoting a liberal rag that tried to cover for Hillary through the election and gave her a 95% chance of winning.

Reality is somewhat different.

Obamacare premiums to soar 22% on average

www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/10/19/Obamacare-Rate-Hikes-2017-Even-Bigger-Expected

It’s official: Double-digit rate hikes for Obamacare

New York times can say anything they want.

They can't hide the rate increases and there are reasons for them.

One of the big ones is no pre-existing conditions and keeping kids to age 26 on their policies.

Those are nice goals, I'm not against keeping those. But reality has to set in some time and reality is, that's part of the reason insurance has become so expensive and if you want it competitive again, then reality has to come back to insurance.

Total health care spending in the US has been on a straight line of growth since the 1970s.

What we're seeing is insurance companies bouncing around as they try to be cost competitive with other insurance companies while earning maximum profit for shareholders.

And, cost saving features were cut from the ACA before passage in order to get every last wack job lefty Democrat to sign. Those cost saving measures still exist somewhere, and could be implemented - along with other ideas.

Taking care of pre-existing conditions is just as important as taking care of conditions that come up unexpectedly.

There was already bipartisan support for a dozen or so crucial healthcare reforms like the pre-existing conditions exclusions. Those reforms could have been implemented in a bipartisan bill 1/100th the size of the ACA bill at a fraction of the cost and without turning our existing healthcare industry upside down and putting the goddamn incompetent government in charge of it.

What Obama and the Dem's did is cram this gigantic pile of crap bill through as fast as possible before voters would have a chance to put the brakes on it. Its a bloated to the hilt big government power grab over 2,000 pages long. Well they crammed it through and now they paid the price. They lost the House, the Senate, the White House, the GOP now control 33 governorships, 69 of 99 state legislatures.

They paid a heavy price and now the ACA bill is going to be undone and replaced. Probably with the much smaller list of reforms there was already bipartisan support for, that was doable, and had a chance of not failing. ACA is on a glide path to choking on its own financial meltdown so people are going to lose the ACA one way or another. If the GOP does nothing it will die on its own.

The ACA is an addition of regulation. It is still the insurance companies who determine what policies they offer, how those policies are priced, what providers are offering services for acceptable fees, etc., and they manage the actual payment, determining what costs are covered.

Suggesting the government has "taken over" is a gross overstatement.

I'd point out that the government has regulations on just about every cubic centimeter of you car and on the insurance coverage for your car and for requiring that you BUY that coverage. Yet, Ford, Toyota, Chevy and the rest of the manufacturers are healthy as are the insurance companies - and you, too.

If the GOP has something better, fine. I'm not an ACA fan.

BUT, they are claiming they are going to kill the ACA without anything to replace it.

And, that is criminally irresponsible.

If they want to change our system, they have a responsibility to state the changes. Just killing our health care coverage is NOT acceptable. Not even slightly.

 

[teapartysamurai]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

Who's fault is it if they don't have coverage? Not mine, not Trump's, not the GOP's. Here's an idea, get a job pay your own damn bills.

We know from decades of experience that our system has never before been set up to make that possible for a highly significant segment of our population.

And, I am NOT just talking about the tens of millions who have gotten insurance through the subsidy program. The changes concerning preexisting conditions are critical for large numbers who previously couldn't so much as switch jobs or start their own companies, because it meant losing health care. It affected those who got sick and were thus dumped by their insurance company. And, of course, it is affected by the rapidly increasing high tech of the medical world that is offering life saving solutions to those who would otherwise die - from new born infants and on through all age groups.

Through the ACA we made progress toward

You don't get that's part of why premiums are so high.

For most people, premiums have not increased any faster since the ACA went into effect than prior to it. 50% of American get their insurance through their employer where the average family plan premium has risen at only 3%/year. 39% get of the insured get their insurance through Medicaid and Medicare where premiums are not effected by the ACA. The remain 11% get individual policies through the healthcare exchanges or other sources. These premiums paid after any subsidy have had small to huge increases depending on family income and region. Thus less than only 1 in every 10 families have had large increases in premiums.

If Republicans concentrate on lowering premiums, they'll be missing the ball. The problem most people have is higher deductibles, coinsurance, and copays, particular in individual policies which are the result of increased coverage of plans, higher medical costs of covering sicker people and providing additional coverage required by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/26/upshot/rising-obamacare-rates-what-you-need-to-know.html

Yeah that's nice quoting a liberal rag that tried to cover for Hillary through the election and gave her a 95% chance of winning.

Reality is somewhat different.

Obamacare premiums to soar 22% on average

www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/10/19/Obamacare-Rate-Hikes-2017-Even-Bigger-Expected

It’s official: Double-digit rate hikes for Obamacare

New York times can say anything they want.

They can't hide the rate increases and there are reasons for them.

One of the big ones is no pre-existing conditions and keeping kids to age 26 on their policies.

Those are nice goals, I'm not against keeping those. But reality has to set in some time and reality is, that's part of the reason insurance has become so expensive and if you want it competitive again, then reality has to come back to insurance.

Total health care spending in the US has been on a straight line of growth since the 1970s.

What we're seeing is insurance companies bouncing around as they try to be cost competitive with other insurance companies while earning maximum profit for shareholders.

And, cost saving features were cut from the ACA before passage in order to get every last wack job lefty Democrat to sign. Those cost saving measures still exist somewhere, and could be implemented - along with other ideas.

Taking care of pre-existing conditions is just as important as taking care of conditions that come up unexpectedly.

There was already bipartisan support for a dozen or so crucial healthcare reforms like the pre-existing conditions exclusions. Those reforms could have been implemented in a bipartisan bill 1/100th the size of the ACA bill at a fraction of the cost and without turning our existing healthcare industry upside down and putting the goddamn incompetent government in charge of it.

What Obama and the Dem's did is cram this gigantic pile of crap bill through as fast as possible before voters would have a chance to put the brakes on it. Its a bloated to the hilt big government power grab over 2,000 pages long. Well they crammed it through and now they paid the price. They lost the House, the Senate, the White House, the GOP now control 33 governorships, 69 of 99 state legislatures.

They paid a heavy price and now the ACA bill is going to be undone and replaced. Probably with the much smaller list of reforms there was already bipartisan support for, that was doable, and had a chance of not failing. ACA is on a glide path to choking on its own financial meltdown so people are going to lose the ACA one way or another. If the GOP does nothing it will die on its own.

The ACA is an addition of regulation. It is still the insurance companies who determine what policies they offer, how those policies are priced, what providers are offering services for acceptable fees, etc., and they manage the actual payment, determining what costs are covered.

Suggesting the government has "taken over" is a gross overstatement.

I'd point out that the government has regulations on just about every cubic centimeter of you car and on the insurance coverage for your car and for requiring that you BUY that coverage. Yet, Ford, Toyota, Chevy and the rest of the manufacturers are healthy as are the insurance companies - and you, too.

If the GOP has something better, fine. I'm not an ACA fan.

BUT, they are claiming they are going to kill the ACA without anything to replace it.

And, that is criminally irresponsible.

If they want to change our system, they have a responsibility to state the changes. Just killing our health care coverage is NOT acceptable. Not even slightly.

Um, Trump has said with what he will replace Obama care.

Healthcare savings accounts, opening up competition between insurance companies so they are not restricted by state lines.

That's a damn good start.

 

[imawhosure]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

This is the problems with liberals.

They just never get there isn't a perfect utopian solution for every problem.

If there is a problem out there, the only answer (for liberals) is throw money at it until a perfect utopia exists.

Only problem is, it's impossible.

They have tried to cover everyone. They can't.

Hell *I* don't have insurance right now because Obamacare was going to cost me $400 a month with a $6000 deductible. That's paying $400 a month (an amount I can't pay) just so Obama can SAY I have insurance.

I would NEVER reach a $6000 deductible in a year UNLESS I was dying of cancer!

In an attempt to make a one-size fits all insurance for everyone, they could not do it, and it made the premiums and the deductibles just beyond many people's budget.

Was the old system perfect, absolutely no.

Has Obama care made it 10 times worse? ABSOLUTELY.

Getting rid of a "solution" that didn't work is not going to solve all the problems.

But it's a first step.

And that is the problem with Republicans. When it comes to a problem they don't even want to try to figure it out unless it involves tax cuts for needy billionaires.

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

This is the problems with liberals.

They just never get there isn't a perfect utopian solution for every problem.

If there is a problem out there, the only answer (for liberals) is throw money at it until a perfect utopia exists.

Only problem is, it's impossible.

They have tried to cover everyone. They can't.

Hell *I* don't have insurance right now because Obamacare was going to cost me $400 a month with a $6000 deductible. That's paying $400 a month (an amount I can't pay) just so Obama can SAY I have insurance.

I would NEVER reach a $6000 deductible in a year UNLESS I was dying of cancer!

In an attempt to make a one-size fits all insurance for everyone, they could not do it, and it made the premiums and the deductibles just beyond many people's budget.

Was the old system perfect, absolutely no.

Has Obama care made it 10 times worse? ABSOLUTELY.

Getting rid of a "solution" that didn't work is not going to solve all the problems.

But it's a first step.

You think Obamacare was a Utopian solution. It was compromise after compromise. It increased the number of insured by 20 million, did away with preexisting conditions, allowed young people to stay on the parents insurance, and eliminated partial coverage policies. However it increased deductibles to a point that most people hardly used their policy benefits for routine medical care, force people to purchase coverage they didn't believe they needed, and reduced choice for most people. I certainly wouldn't call that Utopian.

The closest thing to Utopian will be single payer which I figure will come after the Republicans present their botched up healthcare plan.

Health insurance is not a right.

Get over it.

Well that's what these lefty idiots think. They also think the rest of us should pay for those that can't pay for themselves.

Hell. I need a new car. Any of these lefty idiots going to pony up to buy me one?? I ain't holding my breath.

H/C is not a right and it never has been. You want H/C then you better have the money to pay for it.

The ACA is a disaster. A very expensive disaster except for those the rest of us are forced to pay for.

And the tax penalty (burden on the poor) gets higher every year for those of us who can't afford to buy Obamacare!

That's just wrong!

These people, and everyone on this board, knew Ocare could NOT do what Obama said it would.

Are any of you leftists business people or managers? Well if you are, explain how you give healthcare to more people, remove lifetime spending caps, and keep deductibles where they were for the same amount of money spent before.......or less according to Obama. Can't happen, impossible, is not even logical. That is why they needed a mandate to FORCE (sounds like Marxism, force, doesn't it) young people into the plan. Problem was, they didn't have the money.....and most of those that did, just paid the fine.

You are now talking about single payer, which is where you always wanted to go anyway.........but here is the catch...............you know those other countries that have single payer you always talk about.............well the government has control of how much doctors and nurses make, and it is a whole lot less than ours make. Have you told the medical people that yet?

Oh, and another thing, their drug costs are waaaaaaaaay lower than ours. Have you told the drug companies this yet that YOU are going to tell THEM how much YOU are going to pay for their products!

What you need know is WHY their drug costs are so much lower. Think it might surprise you, but let me say this since there is no thread for it--------->if YOUR plan was in effect over the last 25 years, then AIDS would still be a quick death sentence, along with a whole lot of illnesses that were prevalent as much worse sickness those 25 years ago. So you decide if you basically want to FREEZE healthcare where it is today, because if you do single payer, that is what is going to happen, or at least slow down progress to a snails pace.

 

[WillReadmore]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

Who's fault is it if they don't have coverage? Not mine, not Trump's, not the GOP's. Here's an idea, get a job pay your own damn bills.

We know from decades of experience that our system has never before been set up to make that possible for a highly significant segment of our population.

And, I am NOT just talking about the tens of millions who have gotten insurance through the subsidy program. The changes concerning preexisting conditions are critical for large numbers who previously couldn't so much as switch jobs or start their own companies, because it meant losing health care. It affected those who got sick and were thus dumped by their insurance company. And, of course, it is affected by the rapidly increasing high tech of the medical world that is offering life saving solutions to those who would otherwise die - from new born infants and on through all age groups.

Through the ACA we made progress toward

For most people, premiums have not increased any faster since the ACA went into effect than prior to it. 50% of American get their insurance through their employer where the average family plan premium has risen at only 3%/year. 39% get of the insured get their insurance through Medicaid and Medicare where premiums are not effected by the ACA. The remain 11% get individual policies through the healthcare exchanges or other sources. These premiums paid after any subsidy have had small to huge increases depending on family income and region. Thus less than only 1 in every 10 families have had large increases in premiums.

If Republicans concentrate on lowering premiums, they'll be missing the ball. The problem most people have is higher deductibles, coinsurance, and copays, particular in individual policies which are the result of increased coverage of plans, higher medical costs of covering sicker people and providing additional coverage required by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/26/upshot/rising-obamacare-rates-what-you-need-to-know.html

Yeah that's nice quoting a liberal rag that tried to cover for Hillary through the election and gave her a 95% chance of winning.

Reality is somewhat different.

Obamacare premiums to soar 22% on average

www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/10/19/Obamacare-Rate-Hikes-2017-Even-Bigger-Expected

It’s official: Double-digit rate hikes for Obamacare

New York times can say anything they want.

They can't hide the rate increases and there are reasons for them.

One of the big ones is no pre-existing conditions and keeping kids to age 26 on their policies.

Those are nice goals, I'm not against keeping those. But reality has to set in some time and reality is, that's part of the reason insurance has become so expensive and if you want it competitive again, then reality has to come back to insurance.

Total health care spending in the US has been on a straight line of growth since the 1970s.

What we're seeing is insurance companies bouncing around as they try to be cost competitive with other insurance companies while earning maximum profit for shareholders.

And, cost saving features were cut from the ACA before passage in order to get every last wack job lefty Democrat to sign. Those cost saving measures still exist somewhere, and could be implemented - along with other ideas.

Taking care of pre-existing conditions is just as important as taking care of conditions that come up unexpectedly.

There was already bipartisan support for a dozen or so crucial healthcare reforms like the pre-existing conditions exclusions. Those reforms could have been implemented in a bipartisan bill 1/100th the size of the ACA bill at a fraction of the cost and without turning our existing healthcare industry upside down and putting the goddamn incompetent government in charge of it.

What Obama and the Dem's did is cram this gigantic pile of crap bill through as fast as possible before voters would have a chance to put the brakes on it. Its a bloated to the hilt big government power grab over 2,000 pages long. Well they crammed it through and now they paid the price. They lost the House, the Senate, the White House, the GOP now control 33 governorships, 69 of 99 state legislatures.

They paid a heavy price and now the ACA bill is going to be undone and replaced. Probably with the much smaller list of reforms there was already bipartisan support for, that was doable, and had a chance of not failing. ACA is on a glide path to choking on its own financial meltdown so people are going to lose the ACA one way or another. If the GOP does nothing it will die on its own.

The ACA is an addition of regulation. It is still the insurance companies who determine what policies they offer, how those policies are priced, what providers are offering services for acceptable fees, etc., and they manage the actual payment, determining what costs are covered.

Suggesting the government has "taken over" is a gross overstatement.

I'd point out that the government has regulations on just about every cubic centimeter of you car and on the insurance coverage for your car and for requiring that you BUY that coverage. Yet, Ford, Toyota, Chevy and the rest of the manufacturers are healthy as are the insurance companies - and you, too.

If the GOP has something better, fine. I'm not an ACA fan.

BUT, they are claiming they are going to kill the ACA without anything to replace it.

And, that is criminally irresponsible.

If they want to change our system, they have a responsibility to state the changes. Just killing our health care coverage is NOT acceptable. Not even slightly.

Um, Trump has said with what he will replace Obama care.

Healthcare savings accounts, opening up competition between insurance companies so they are not restricted by state lines.

That's a damn good start.

Well, two problems. First, that's not a plan. Second, it is congress that writes bills, not the president.

From there, remember that there are several states that DO allow insurance companies to sell to their citizens across state lines. And, insurance companies are doing that. So, THAT idea is rubbish.

I know the GOP is attracted to savings accounts. But, that assumes people can pay their health care AND put savings away for health care. Given that about half of America makes little enough that they do not even pay taxes, it's a little absurd to suggest that anything related to taxes is going to make a significant difference.

So, no, that is not even a start toward having IDEAS, let alone having a plan.

Even Ryan stated that Republicans have "ideas", NOT a plan.

Killing our health care payment system with only IDEAS of what might come next is GROSSLY irresponsible. We're talking about the health care of American families all across our nation.

 

[WillReadmore]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

This is the problems with liberals.

They just never get there isn't a perfect utopian solution for every problem.

If there is a problem out there, the only answer (for liberals) is throw money at it until a perfect utopia exists.

Only problem is, it's impossible.

They have tried to cover everyone. They can't.

Hell *I* don't have insurance right now because Obamacare was going to cost me $400 a month with a $6000 deductible. That's paying $400 a month (an amount I can't pay) just so Obama can SAY I have insurance.

I would NEVER reach a $6000 deductible in a year UNLESS I was dying of cancer!

In an attempt to make a one-size fits all insurance for everyone, they could not do it, and it made the premiums and the deductibles just beyond many people's budget.

Was the old system perfect, absolutely no.

Has Obama care made it 10 times worse? ABSOLUTELY.

Getting rid of a "solution" that didn't work is not going to solve all the problems.

But it's a first step.

And that is the problem with Republicans. When it comes to a problem they don't even want to try to figure it out unless it involves tax cuts for needy billionaires.

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

This is the problems with liberals.

They just never get there isn't a perfect utopian solution for every problem.

If there is a problem out there, the only answer (for liberals) is throw money at it until a perfect utopia exists.

Only problem is, it's impossible.

They have tried to cover everyone. They can't.

Hell *I* don't have insurance right now because Obamacare was going to cost me $400 a month with a $6000 deductible. That's paying $400 a month (an amount I can't pay) just so Obama can SAY I have insurance.

I would NEVER reach a $6000 deductible in a year UNLESS I was dying of cancer!

In an attempt to make a one-size fits all insurance for everyone, they could not do it, and it made the premiums and the deductibles just beyond many people's budget.

Was the old system perfect, absolutely no.

Has Obama care made it 10 times worse? ABSOLUTELY.

Getting rid of a "solution" that didn't work is not going to solve all the problems.

But it's a first step.

You think Obamacare was a Utopian solution. It was compromise after compromise. It increased the number of insured by 20 million, did away with preexisting conditions, allowed young people to stay on the parents insurance, and eliminated partial coverage policies. However it increased deductibles to a point that most people hardly used their policy benefits for routine medical care, force people to purchase coverage they didn't believe they needed, and reduced choice for most people. I certainly wouldn't call that Utopian.

The closest thing to Utopian will be single payer which I figure will come after the Republicans present their botched up healthcare plan.

Health insurance is not a right.

Get over it.

Well that's what these lefty idiots think. They also think the rest of us should pay for those that can't pay for themselves.

Hell. I need a new car. Any of these lefty idiots going to pony up to buy me one?? I ain't holding my breath.

H/C is not a right and it never has been. You want H/C then you better have the money to pay for it.

The ACA is a disaster. A very expensive disaster except for those the rest of us are forced to pay for.

And the tax penalty (burden on the poor) gets higher every year for those of us who can't afford to buy Obamacare!

That's just wrong!

These people, and everyone on this board, knew Ocare could NOT do what Obama said it would.

Are any of you leftists business people or managers? Well if you are, explain how you give healthcare to more people, remove lifetime spending caps, and keep deductibles where they were for the same amount of money spent before.......or less according to Obama. Can't happen, impossible, is not even logical. That is why they needed a mandate to FORCE (sounds like Marxism, force, doesn't it) young people into the plan. Problem was, they didn't have the money.....and most of those that did, just paid the fine.

You are now talking about single payer, which is where you always wanted to go anyway.........but here is the catch...............you know those other countries that have single payer you always talk about.............well the government has control of how much doctors and nurses make, and it is a whole lot less than ours make. Have you told the medical people that yet?

Oh, and another thing, their drug costs are waaaaaaaaay lower than ours. Have you told the drug companies this yet that YOU are going to tell THEM how much YOU are going to pay for their products!

What you need know is WHY their drug costs are so much lower. Think it might surprise you, but let me say this since there is no thread for it--------->if YOUR plan was in effect over the last 25 years, then AIDS would still be a quick death sentence, along with a whole lot of illnesses that were prevalent as much worse sickness those 25 years ago. So you decide if you basically want to FREEZE healthcare where it is today, because if you do single payer, that is what is going to happen, or at least slow down progress to a snails pace.

Some of the largest BigPharma research centers are not in the USA.

Your scare tactic can't be substantiated. I don't know what your motive is here, but your logic is phony.

And, it certainly isn't an excuse for congress preventing carriers from shopping for good drug prices to protect these corporations.

 

[WillReadmore]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

This is the problems with liberals.

They just never get there isn't a perfect utopian solution for every problem.

If there is a problem out there, the only answer (for liberals) is throw money at it until a perfect utopia exists.

Only problem is, it's impossible.

They have tried to cover everyone. They can't.

Hell *I* don't have insurance right now because Obamacare was going to cost me $400 a month with a $6000 deductible. That's paying $400 a month (an amount I can't pay) just so Obama can SAY I have insurance.

I would NEVER reach a $6000 deductible in a year UNLESS I was dying of cancer!

In an attempt to make a one-size fits all insurance for everyone, they could not do it, and it made the premiums and the deductibles just beyond many people's budget.

Was the old system perfect, absolutely no.

Has Obama care made it 10 times worse? ABSOLUTELY.

Getting rid of a "solution" that didn't work is not going to solve all the problems.

But it's a first step.

And that is the problem with Republicans. When it comes to a problem they don't even want to try to figure it out unless it involves tax cuts for needy billionaires.

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

This is the problems with liberals.

They just never get there isn't a perfect utopian solution for every problem.

If there is a problem out there, the only answer (for liberals) is throw money at it until a perfect utopia exists.

Only problem is, it's impossible.

They have tried to cover everyone. They can't.

Hell *I* don't have insurance right now because Obamacare was going to cost me $400 a month with a $6000 deductible. That's paying $400 a month (an amount I can't pay) just so Obama can SAY I have insurance.

I would NEVER reach a $6000 deductible in a year UNLESS I was dying of cancer!

In an attempt to make a one-size fits all insurance for everyone, they could not do it, and it made the premiums and the deductibles just beyond many people's budget.

Was the old system perfect, absolutely no.

Has Obama care made it 10 times worse? ABSOLUTELY.

Getting rid of a "solution" that didn't work is not going to solve all the problems.

But it's a first step.

You think Obamacare was a Utopian solution. It was compromise after compromise. It increased the number of insured by 20 million, did away with preexisting conditions, allowed young people to stay on the parents insurance, and eliminated partial coverage policies. However it increased deductibles to a point that most people hardly used their policy benefits for routine medical care, force people to purchase coverage they didn't believe they needed, and reduced choice for most people. I certainly wouldn't call that Utopian.

The closest thing to Utopian will be single payer which I figure will come after the Republicans present their botched up healthcare plan.

Health insurance is not a right.

Get over it.

Well that's what these lefty idiots think. They also think the rest of us should pay for those that can't pay for themselves.

Hell. I need a new car. Any of these lefty idiots going to pony up to buy me one?? I ain't holding my breath.

H/C is not a right and it never has been. You want H/C then you better have the money to pay for it.

The ACA is a disaster. A very expensive disaster except for those the rest of us are forced to pay for.

And the tax penalty (burden on the poor) gets higher every year for those of us who can't afford to buy Obamacare!

That's just wrong!

These people, and everyone on this board, knew Ocare could NOT do what Obama said it would.

Are any of you leftists business people or managers? Well if you are, explain how you give healthcare to more people, remove lifetime spending caps, and keep deductibles where they were for the same amount of money spent before.......or less according to Obama. Can't happen, impossible, is not even logical. That is why they needed a mandate to FORCE (sounds like Marxism, force, doesn't it) young people into the plan. Problem was, they didn't have the money.....and most of those that did, just paid the fine.

You are now talking about single payer, which is where you always wanted to go anyway.........but here is the catch...............you know those other countries that have single payer you always talk about.............well the government has control of how much doctors and nurses make, and it is a whole lot less than ours make. Have you told the medical people that yet?

Oh, and another thing, their drug costs are waaaaaaaaay lower than ours. Have you told the drug companies this yet that YOU are going to tell THEM how much YOU are going to pay for their products!

What you need know is WHY their drug costs are so much lower. Think it might surprise you, but let me say this since there is no thread for it--------->if YOUR plan was in effect over the last 25 years, then AIDS would still be a quick death sentence, along with a whole lot of illnesses that were prevalent as much worse sickness those 25 years ago. So you decide if you basically want to FREEZE healthcare where it is today, because if you do single payer, that is what is going to happen, or at least slow down progress to a snails pace.

Let's remember that the cost of health care in America has risen at a straight line rate since 1970.

Cost savings elements in the ACA were removed before the bill was passed in order to get the votes of every last wack job lefty Democrat. I don't know where they are now, but those measures (and probably others) could be added back in.

Also, we're saving an amazing amount by not having those without coverage heading for the ER. Plus, analysts are pointing out that insurance companies are being encouraged by nature of the ACA to move toward paying for results rather than paying for procedures - a direction that is broadly agreed is a cost savings that will take a while to fully be realized (since it involves changes by providers as well).

I'm not a fan of the ACA, but let's be real on this.

And, for God's sake, killing what we have with NO PLAN to move to is grossly irresponsible. How does ANYONE know that what we're going to move to will be acceptable to us? How do we know how it will impact middle income families that can't afford to put money into special purpose savings accounts AND pay current health care bills? How will it affect those who don't pay taxes - nearly half of America? What happens to those whose insurance companies will be allowed to simply reject due to age, gender, preexisting conditions, medications/procedures they see you using by examining your bills, those diagnosed with disease that is expensive to treat, etc.???

There may be a better way.

BUT, we need to know this stuff before we kill what we have. Let's remember that the GOP was unwilling to address health coverage AT ALL before it became a partisan political issue.

 

[bripat9643]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

Does Obamacare cover everyone? No? Then what are you whining about, you enormous hypocrite?

 

[bripat9643]

Health insurance is not a right.

Get over it.

It is in every other country.

So, why is being an American citizen so much worse?

There are no genuine rights that exist in some places and not others.

 

[Flopper]

If they scrap it which is fine, keep the pre existing conditions part and kids on policies until age 26. Those make total sense. Then sit down and figure a new system out. Perhaps telling big pharma to reel in their costs is a start. Everyone wants to rail on the govt, but private industry for some reason should not be touched. I say bull to that.

You don't get that's part of why premiums are so high.

For most people, premiums have not increased any faster since the ACA went into effect than prior to it. 50% of American get their insurance through their employer where the average family plan premium has risen at only 3%/year. 39% get of the insured get their insurance through Medicaid and Medicare where premiums are not effected by the ACA. The remain 11% get individual policies through the healthcare exchanges or other sources. These premiums paid after any subsidy have had small to huge increases depending on family income and region. Thus less than only 1 in every 10 families have had large increases in premiums.

If Republicans concentrate on lowering premiums, they'll be missing the ball. The problem most people have is higher deductibles, coinsurance, and copays, particular in individual policies which are the result of increased coverage of plans, higher medical costs of covering sicker people and providing additional coverage required by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/26/upshot/rising-obamacare-rates-what-you-need-to-know.html

Yeah that's nice quoting a liberal rag that tried to cover for Hillary through the election and gave her a 95% chance of winning.

Reality is somewhat different.

Obamacare premiums to soar 22% on average

www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/10/19/Obamacare-Rate-Hikes-2017-Even-Bigger-Expected

It’s official: Double-digit rate hikes for Obamacare

New York times can say anything they want.

They can't hide the rate increases and there are reasons for them.

One of the big ones is no pre-existing conditions and keeping kids to age 26 on their policies.

Those are nice goals, I'm not against keeping those. But reality has to set in some time and reality is, that's part of the reason insurance has become so expensive and if you want it competitive again, then reality has to come back to insurance.

Who's premiums are increasing 22%, not the 50% of the people who are covered by their employer's plan, and not the 39% that are covered by Medicare and Medicaid. This projected 22% increase is for silver policies sold on the exchange which will effect less 10% of the insured.

Of the 39 states that have reported projected premiums for silver plan polices sold on the exchanges, the average projected increase is 22%. As in the past, actual premium increases will be far less than the projected increases. Just look at 2016. Projections were 18%. The actual average was 10.6% and the weighted average was only 3.6%. However what people are interested in is what they have to pay after subsidies which was an average on -.7% decrease.

Analysis of 2016 Premium Changes in the Affordable Care Act’s Health Insurance Marketplaces

 

[bripat9643]

Health insurance is not a right.

Get over it.

It is in every other country.

So, why is being an American citizen so much worse?

Move. Cuba is calling you!! Perhaps Venezuela? Just bring your own toilet paper.

To paraphrase the outgoing POTUS...."elections have consequences.. Get in the back of the bus".

You didn't answer the question.

Can you?

Again, why is being an American citizen worse than being a Brit ... or anyone anywhere in Europe? Why is it worse than being a citizen of Japan?

Seriously - I want to know.

It's not worse, moron. At least, it wasn't before Obama.

 

[bripat9643]

If they scrap it which is fine, keep the pre existing conditions part and kids on policies until age 26. Those make total sense. Then sit down and figure a new system out. Perhaps telling big pharma to reel in their costs is a start. Everyone wants to rail on the govt, but private industry for some reason should not be touched. I say bull to that.

You don't get that's part of why premiums are so high.

For most people, premiums have not increased any faster since the ACA went into effect than prior to it. 50% of American get their insurance through their employer where the average family plan premium has risen at only 3%/year. 39% get of the insured get their insurance through Medicaid and Medicare where premiums are not effected by the ACA. The remain 11% get individual policies through the healthcare exchanges or other sources. These premiums paid after any subsidy have had small to huge increases depending on family income and region. Thus less than only 1 in every 10 families have had large increases in premiums.

If Republicans concentrate on lowering premiums, they'll be missing the ball. The problem most people have is higher deductibles, coinsurance, and copays, particular in individual policies which are the result of increased coverage of plans, higher medical costs of covering sicker people and providing additional coverage required by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/26/upshot/rising-obamacare-rates-what-you-need-to-know.html

Yeah that's nice quoting a liberal rag that tried to cover for Hillary through the election and gave her a 95% chance of winning.

Reality is somewhat different.

Obamacare premiums to soar 22% on average

www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/10/19/Obamacare-Rate-Hikes-2017-Even-Bigger-Expected

It’s official: Double-digit rate hikes for Obamacare

New York times can say anything they want.

They can't hide the rate increases and there are reasons for them.

One of the big ones is no pre-existing conditions and keeping kids to age 26 on their policies.

Those are nice goals, I'm not against keeping those. But reality has to set in some time and reality is, that's part of the reason insurance has become so expensive and if you want it competitive again, then reality has to come back to insurance.

Who's premiums are increasing 22%, not the 50% of the people who are covered by their employer's plan, and not the 39% that are covered by Medicare and Medicaid. This projected 22% increase is for silver policies sold on the exchange which will effect less 10% of the insured.

Of the 39 states that have reported projected premiums for silver plan polices sold on the exchanges, the average projected increase is 22%. As in the past, actual premium increases will be far less than the projected increases. Just look at 2016. Projections were 18%. The actual average was 10.6% and the weighted average was only 3.6%. However what people are interested in is what they have to pay after subsidies which was an average on -.7% decrease.

Analysis of 2016 Premium Changes in the Affordable Care Act’s Health Insurance Marketplaces

Those claims about premium increases ignore the fact that Obamacare is almost worthless. When you have a $6500 deductible per family member, and it doesn't cover your prescriptions, what good is it?

 

[LeftofLeft]

GOP won't promise ObamaCare fix will cover all

How many Americans left without coverage will Republicans find unacceptable? Half? Three quarters?

Define "all". At that same time, define "Americans"? Nowhere do you say, "American Citizens". You are "all" full of shit.