Expel All Illegals...

[LuvRPgrl]

Just a question...are y'all willing to live with the massive tax raise on us that it would take so that we could do this? Not me.

The economic breakdown involves alot of things. When I hear people complain about how we are going bankrupt because we are paying all their medical for free, I usually find its someone who has THEIR MEDICAL INSURANCE paid for by their employer.

Medical services are not an option. When someone works, you either pay them enough to afford insurance, or pay cash for their medical bills, or you give them govt subsidized health care, either way we foot the bill.

If you think housing is expensive now, just imagine with no basically cheap labor force to build them, what the costs would be...

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Right. You're saying it isn't feasible based upon an unrealistic implementation timeline: OVERNIGHT. I think if you ceased with your alarmist hyperbole, you'd see it's not such a far out concept, man.

NO, you are wrong. Nuc wasnt saying deporting them all overnight isnt feasable, he was saying IF WE DID, then what would happen to the economy? He is merely pointing out that our day to day operations are as dependent on the Mexicans as any.

By the way, to see how well people know the REAL story, where exactly are MOST of the day laborers coming from these days?? NO CHEATING< see if anyone knows from PRESENT KNOWLEDGE.

BOTTOM line is, ALL WAVES OF IMMIGRATION CREATED CHEAP LABOR that our economy depended on, and continues to. If they are working, they are producing AND ARE NOT A NET DRAIN.

If some are collecting welfare, then the problem is WELFARE, get rid of it, we did just fine for 200 years without it.

If the problem is govt paid medical, get rid of it. We did just fine for 200 years without it.

If you dont like illegals, dont hire one. Fact is, the FREE MARKET is better at dictating this than government control and influence. Im actually ashamed that the conservatives who are suppose to support states rights and limited govt and FREEDOM and FREE MARKETS, want to BLOAT The govt even more, give the power to the FEDS, and close down free markets.

Im consistent in my libertarian view, those for deporting the Mexicans are not.

 

[nosarcasm]

on tv they interviewed illegals cleaning up New Orleans and pointed
out that Fema suspended the penalities on companies hiring illegals.

So it does not seem like this administration plans to do anything about
the masses of illegals in this country.

 

[Nuc]

very dubious things you've posted here before but this one takes the cake. America got on fine w/o them before and will so in the future. Besides this won't happen overnight. And should many of these illegals choose to go through a working visa in the future they will be welcome. However the days of "cross the border Jose and take advantage of the ignorant/willing Americans is OVER". It is curious to me why so many like yourself are blantantly defeatist in regard to the issue of illegal immigration. The United States has faced every obstacle in its past and overcome ('cept 'Nam thank you lib quitters). Why not now? I'm frankly confused by this. Please elaborate as to why this will be a failure.

I will elaborate. If we expel all illegal immigrants tomorrow half the restaurants in America will close, vegetables will cease to enter the marketplace, hotels will not be able to operate, a bunch of whining brats won't have their diapers changed and who knows what else. Good luck making it happen, because big business and the Republicans you probably voted for don't want it to happen. And there aren't enough patriotic neo-Nazis who are willing to shine shoes and wash dishes to pick up the slack. However if we can all eat bullshit that's posted on message boards we shouldn't starve. The focus is on the illegals themselves rather than on the businesses and their Republican supporters who create the problem. If nobody was hiring these people they wouldn't be able to survive. And as Vicente Fox put it so eloquently they do work "even the blacks" are not willing to do. Who's going to do it? Republicans?

The real impetus behind this is racism. People whine about the taxes these people don't pay. If we get rid of corporate welfare, that will more than make up for it.

In the end I agree with the idea that they should all be deported and then readmitted on a case by case basis. But with Republicans controlling the executive, the Senate, the House, and the Judiciary I guess it's not too hard to see who doesn't want any change in the status quo.

So if you voted Republican, just admit it. You've been hosed. Again. Don't blame this one on NAMBLA.

 

[insein]

I will elaborate. If we expel all illegal immigrants tomorrow half the restaurants in America will close, vegetables will cease to enter the marketplace, hotels will not be able to operate, a bunch of whining brats won't have their diapers changed and who knows what else. Good luck making it happen, because big business and the Republicans you probably voted for don't want it to happen. And there aren't enough patriotic neo-Nazis who are willing to shine shoes and wash dishes to pick up the slack. However if we can all eat bullshit that's posted on message boards we shouldn't starve. The focus is on the illegals themselves rather than on the businesses and their Republican supporters who create the problem. If nobody was hiring these people they wouldn't be able to survive. And as Vicente Fox put it so eloquently they do work "even the blacks" are not willing to do. Who's going to do it? Republicans?

The real impetus behind this is racism. People whine about the taxes these people don't pay. If we get rid of corporate welfare, that will more than make up for it.

In the end I agree with the idea that they should all be deported and then readmitted on a case by case basis. But with Republicans controlling the executive, the Senate, the House, and the Judiciary I guess it's not too hard to see who doesn't want any change in the status quo.

So if you voted Republican, just admit it. You've been hosed. Again. Don't blame this one on NAMBLA.

North American Marlen Brando Look Alikes? What do they have to do with illegals?

Your emphasis on Republicans and big business misses the point. Your trying to make this a blame game instead of seeing a way to a solution. Clinton did the same thing as did Bush before him and Reagan and Carter. They all turned their heads when it involved cheap labor. We need to hold these politician's feet to the flame. Throwing generic "It was Republicans" accusations doesnt do the problem justice. Just as many Democrats have done the same thing.

As for your doomsday assessment on the economy. IT wouldnt happen. Even if ALL illegals were deported overnight, businesses would adapt. Those that couldnt adapt would go under. Businesses would offer wages that people are willing to work at. IF that means highering less people to do more work, then so be it. You seem to think that these businesses will just say "Oh well, no more mexicans, i cant run my business anymore so whats the point." They would change their practices or lose their livelihood.

You seem to have a very negative outlook on people and a lack of world experience. Businessmen, especially sole proprietors, receive 90-100% of their income from their business. IF that fails, then they lose their means to make a living. To think that someone will just give up their livelihood over something as trivial as a shortage of cheap labor is ludicrous. They would adapt kicking and screaming if need be in order to survive. If they had 20 illegals working at $4/hr and lost them, then they'd adjust and pay 10 new people $7.50/hr to get them into the job. Sure productivity would drop off alittle, but the business would survive.

This woe is us and "Republicans did it" attitude is typical of a liberal mindset which i thought you were above, nuc. You need to see the whole picture before declaring defeat.

 

[Nuc]

As for your doomsday assessment on the economy. IT wouldnt happen. Even if ALL illegals were deported overnight, businesses would adapt. Those that couldnt adapt would go under. Businesses would offer wages that people are willing to work at. IF that means highering less people to do more work, then so be it. You seem to think that these businesses will just say "Oh well, no more mexicans, i cant run my business anymore so whats the point." They would change their practices or lose their livelihood.

You seem to have a very negative outlook on people and a lack of world experience.

I like your idea that we could try that and watch a bunch of businesses go under or survive. Of course its fair to say that's what would happen. I just wonder who's going to do some of this work. Americans have become so spoiled they don't even want to work.

As far as my lack of world experience, I have my own business, which has been operating for over 25 years. I have business in more than 30 countries. But all my workers are legal, so don't blame me!!! I pay them way over minimum wage.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

I will elaborate. If we expel all illegal immigrants tomorrow half the restaurants in America will close, vegetables will cease to enter the marketplace, hotels will not be able to operate, a bunch of whining brats won't have their diapers changed and who knows what else. Good luck making it happen, because big business and the Republicans you probably voted for don't want it to happen. And there aren't enough patriotic neo-Nazis who are willing to shine shoes and wash dishes to pick up the slack. However if we can all eat bullshit that's posted on message boards we shouldn't starve. The focus is on the illegals themselves rather than on the businesses and their Republican supporters who create the problem. If nobody was hiring these people they wouldn't be able to survive. And as Vicente Fox put it so eloquently they do work "even the blacks" are not willing to do. Who's going to do it? Republicans?

The real impetus behind this is racism. People whine about the taxes these people don't pay. If we get rid of corporate welfare, that will more than make up for it.

In the end I agree with the idea that they should all be deported and then readmitted on a case by case basis. But with Republicans controlling the executive, the Senate, the House, and the Judiciary I guess it's not too hard to see who doesn't want any change in the status quo.

So if you voted Republican, just admit it. You've been hosed. Again. Don't blame this one on NAMBLA.

You are badly misinformed on some of the portions of the issue. To paint a broad brush that its the Republicans is extremely naive.

First, the Republicans DONT control Congress nor the Senate. They may have a majority, IN NAME, but its a slim one at best.

Second, unions hire a very large percentage of the illegals, unions are in the Dems camps.

Third, small business hires many of the illegals, those guys standing around the corner are not hired by big business, they are hired by joe homeowner, dems and repubs, and those labor stands are everywhere, hundreds of thousands of illegals.


Fourth, its the democrat, liberal, the ACLU that goes to court to protect "their rights"

Fifth, CALIFORNIA is NOT Republican controlled, nay, the Dems have had a seizure grip on the state for some time, and illegals in California are treated by the State as citizens.

Yes, its racism, but its not the normal form of racism, its the racism that occurs anywhere, anytime in history when there is a large exodus of peoples from one country to another.

Lastly, those WHINING punks who need their diapers changed, are that way cuz of the liberals, they have control of the schools, and heaven forbid we should treat them like kids, nooooooooooo, the libs say we should respect their right to express themselves, right to privacy, right to....whatever....

The liberals are as much at fault as anyone, for the "perceived" problem.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

North American Marlen Brando Look Alikes? What do they have to do with illegals?

Your emphasis on Republicans and big business misses the point. Your trying to make this a blame game instead of seeing a way to a solution. Clinton did the same thing as did Bush before him and Reagan and Carter. They all turned their heads when it involved cheap labor. We need to hold these politician's feet to the flame. Throwing generic "It was Republicans" accusations doesnt do the problem justice. Just as many Democrats have done the same thing.

As for your doomsday assessment on the economy. IT wouldnt happen. Even if ALL illegals were deported overnight, businesses would adapt. Those that couldnt adapt would go under. Businesses would offer wages that people are willing to work at. IF that means highering less people to do more work, then so be it. You seem to think that these businesses will just say "Oh well, no more mexicans, i cant run my business anymore so whats the point." They would change their practices or lose their livelihood.

You seem to have a very negative outlook on people and a lack of world experience. Businessmen, especially sole proprietors, receive 90-100% of their income from their business. IF that fails, then they lose their means to make a living. To think that someone will just give up their livelihood over something as trivial as a shortage of cheap labor is ludicrous. They would adapt kicking and screaming if need be in order to survive. If they had 20 illegals working at $4/hr and lost them, then they'd adjust and pay 10 new people $7.50/hr to get them into the job. Sure productivity would drop off alittle, but the business would survive.

This woe is us and "Republicans did it" attitude is typical of a liberal mindset which i thought you were above, nuc. You need to see the whole picture before declaring defeat.

although its a moot point, as its physically impossilbe to deport all the illegals, in even say a months time, if they simply dissappeared, ala twilight zone episode 768, the economy would seize. To say business's would adapt is incredibily simplistic. The blow would be severe. Yes, we would adapt, but it would take along, LONG time. Its like a wound, small cut heals in a few days, larger cut requires longer, too deep a cut and scars will occur.

 

[insein]

I like your idea that we could try that and watch a bunch of businesses go under or survive. Of course its fair to say that's what would happen. I just wonder who's going to do some of this work. Americans have become so spoiled they don't even want to work.

As far as my lack of world experience, I have my own business, which has been operating for over 25 years. I have business in more than 30 countries. But all my workers are legal, so don't blame me!!! I pay them way over minimum wage.

You could understand then. If all of a sudden people wouldnt work for your wage anymore and would only work for twice what you pay, would you just say "Oh well, guess im done" or would you adjust your business plan to adapt to the changing climate? I assume that you would adjust in order to survive.

The American people are spoiled have become spoiled over the last 40 years thanks to economic success. If times became hard though, someone would fill the void. Most likely it would be legal mexicans coming in and doing the same jobs but for higher pay. I have nothing against mexicans. They are hard working and can be a great asset to America. I have a major problem with the welfare programs for ALL individuals but more specifically for people that arent even citizens of this country.

I agree that the laws need to change to allow people to come here easier but the problem still exists in its current state. Make it so that people weigh their options and find that coming here legally is the choice with the least amount of problems.

 

[insein]

although its a moot point, as its physically impossilbe to deport all the illegals, in even say a months time, if they simply dissappeared, ala twilight zone episode 768, the economy would seize. To say business's would adapt is incredibily simplistic. The blow would be severe. Yes, we would adapt, but it would take along, LONG time. Its like a wound, small cut heals in a few days, larger cut requires longer, too deep a cut and scars will occur.

Anytime a drastic change occurs, a period of adjustment is expected. A sharp loss would occur but it would not be as debilitating as you think. Those confronted with the loss of their livelihood would not go quietly into the night. They would adjust quickly or would lose their business'.

Its the same argument people have for drugs. They always say that if you legalized drugs, their would be an outbreak of OD's and drug addictions. In the short term yes. As time went on though, drugs would become commonplace and mundane. Regulations on them would limit the amount of addictive and lethal ingredients would be placed in them and eventually they would be as harmful as alcohol. Lethal in heavy doses but in moderate amounts fine. But people don't want to change because they are too afraid of the transition period.

 

[OCA]

are employing illegals and short changing Americans of a decent waged job?

No short changing happening.

Americans were offered and have up to this point said no thanks. Read the article I posted, most of the former citizens of New Orleans aren't even going to return, why should they? They've found new jobs in new cities and sure as hell aren't going to go back to that shithole which offers them promises of nothing.

Anyway if you can find any Americans who are willing to go there and endure the type of horrid work and conditions that are found there i'll tell you what, i'll buy you and I plane tickets and we'll join them, whadda ya say?

 

[OCA]

Here's a rough idea of a plan. Take all the people currently receiving welfare and/or any gov't subsidies and tell them they do the jobs these illegals do that supposedly no one else will, or no more handouts.

Ok i'm with ya but can we include ablebodied American citizens who are currently freeloading off of yours and my paychecks in this mix too?

Fuck it, i'm advocating a total abolishment of any and all welfare programs, food stamps to medicaid and all that is in between, its time for people to pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

 

[Nuc]

You are badly misinformed on some of the portions of the issue. To paint a broad brush that its the Republicans is extremely naive.

Not naive, I just like to razz Republicans. Can't I have any fun?
:whip3: :whip3: :whip3: :whip3:

 

[no1tovote4]

Not naive, I just like to razz Republicans. Can't I have any fun?
:whip3: :whip3: :whip3: :whip3:

Are you kidding?

:2guns:

No.

 

[Nuc]

Are you kidding?

:2guns:

No.

Look no1, Republicans are in power, yet they like to invoke a victim mentality about almost everything. So I'm just saying, you have the power, do something about it, or stop whining. Which is exactly what people on this board usually say about every subject or group of people. What's wrong with that?

 

[no1tovote4]

Look no1, Republicans are in power, yet they like to invoke a victim mentality about almost everything. So I'm just saying, you have the power, do something about it, or stop whining. Which is exactly what people on this board usually say about every subject or group of people. What's wrong with that?

Wow, sensitive aren't ye?

Now stop teasing republicans, it is against executive order number 11363!

 

[Nuc]

Wow, sensitive aren't ye?

Now stop teasing republicans, it is against executive order number 11363!

OK I will stop typing right now because I am stunned by the wonderful smile Tom Delay produced for his mug shot. Good for him!

 

[no1tovote4]

OK I will stop typing right now because I am stunned by the wonderful smile Tom Delay produced for his mug shot. Good for him!

LOL. He probably made fun of another republican....

 

[Nuc]

LOL. He probably made fun of another republican....

He looked great! Seems like this harassment is the fountain of youth for him.

 

[no1tovote4]

He looked great! Seems like this harassment is the fountain of youth for him.

I think he is unworried and will end up with the last laugh. Of course, from now until the end of time the news will always include that photo in every single news report with his name in it regardless of the outcome of this indictment. This arrest is such a silly little petty political move...