A third party signed up 15,000 voters in Arizona. Democrats worry that’s enough for a Biden spoiler

[martybegan]

Remember, in the nation that brags to the world about being the "Land of the Free" and a standard-bearer of democracy worldwide, you should only be allowed two choices. Everyone else is a "spoiler." Your only choices should be Bad and Worse.

A third party signed up 15,000 voters in Arizona. Democrats worry that's enough for a Biden spoiler

More than 15,000 people in Arizona have registered to join a new political party floating a possible bipartisan “unity ticket” against Joe Biden and Donald Trump.

apnews.com

It's the way the Electoral College works as long as "winner take all" is the system. Want to change it, change Presidential voting methods. Enjoy your Constitutional convention.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

It's the way the Electoral College works as long as "winner take all" is the system.

That has nothing to do with it.

 

[dblack]

It's the way the Electoral College works as long as "winner take all" is the system. Want to change it, change Presidential voting methods. Enjoy your Constitutional convention.

The electoral system doesn't create a binary system. We do that voluntarily, mostly because we fall for the fear-mongering.

 

[Blaster]

Instead of one choice as N Korea and Russia have we enjoy two.

Dumb and Dumber.

 

[Billiejeens]

Whatever. You don't seem to take voting very seriously anyway.

Okay

 

[martybegan]

That has nothing to do with it.

it has everything to do with it. It's a simple mathematical certainty due to the constraints of the EC added to winner take all voting in most of the States.

Especially when "top down" third parties try it, instead of working from the ground up to supplant one of the existing parties.

 

[martybegan]

The electoral system doesn't create a binary system. We do that voluntarily, mostly because we fall for the fear-mongering.

The math says otherwise. Unless the 3rd party is larger than one or the other of the two main parties, and/or it isn't designed to mimic one of the other parties, all it does is act as a spoiler.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

it has everything to do with it. It's a simple mathematical certainty due to the constraints of the EC added to winner take all voting in most of the States.

There is nothing intrinsic about the EC that herds people into a two party system. Nothing. If we elected by popular vote nothing would change.

Especially when "top down" third parties try it, instead of working from the ground up to supplant one of the existing parties.

Which also has nothing to do with the structure of the EC.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

The math says otherwise. Unless the 3rd party is larger than one or the other of the two main parties, and/or it isn't designed to mimic one of the other parties, all it does is act as a spoiler.

Which, again, has nothing to do with the Electoral College and everything to do with the mindset of voters.

 

[Billiejeens]

it has everything to do with it. It's a simple mathematical certainty due to the constraints of the EC added to winner take all voting in most of the States.

Especially when "top down" third parties try it, instead of working from the ground up to supplant one of the existing parties.

That is not true.

 

[martybegan]

There is nothing intrinsic about the EC that herds people into a two party system. Nothing. If we elected by popular vote nothing would change.


Which also has nothing to do with the structure of the EC.

Popular vote gives you a better chance because it's one vote siphon instead of 50 that skew all votes to one side with a 1 person majority needed.

People are finite, as are voters. Ones that vote for the 3rd party would have voted for one of the others most of the time. So until the 3rd party can cross the threshold of one of the two established ones and take over, they are spoilers.

 

[martybegan]

Which, again, has nothing to do with the Electoral College and everything to do with the mindset of voters.

The EC gives the mechanism and strengthens it due to the first past the post get all the votes mechanism.

We've seen it in 1860 and 1992.

 

[martybegan]

That is not true.

It's been true since the EC's been around. The most glaring examples are 1860 and 1992.

 

[dblack]

The math says otherwise.

Nope. Only brainwashed partisan idiots say that.

Unless the 3rd party is larger than one or the other of the two main parties, and/or it isn't designed to mimic one of the other parties, all it does is act as a spoiler.

Providing alternatives to the SHIT that Ds and Rs foist on us doesn't spoil anything. It's the one thing might may save us.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

The EC gives the mechanism and strengthens it due to the first past the post get all the votes mechanism.

We've seen it in 1860 and 1992.

If that logic was sound then you'd be seeing third party candidates getting more votes in heavily partisan states like California or Wyoming, where voters of the minority party know they have no chance of winning and vice versa, voters in the majority could freely vote third party knowing the candidate of the majority will still win anyway without their vote.

We don't see that, phenomenon, however.

 

[Billiejeens]

Nope. Only brainwashed partisan idiots say that.

Providing alternatives to the SHIT that Ds and Rs foist on us doesn't spoil anything. It's the one thing might may save us.

Honestly, I think that unicorns have a better chance.

 

[Billiejeens]

It's been true since the EC's been around. The most glaring examples are 1860 and 1992.

Explain your logic for the 1992 one.

1860 for sure is not applicable.

 

[dblack]

Honestly, I think that unicorns have a better chance.

I don't give a single fuck about what "chance" there is. It's not a bet or a horse race. I'm going to vote for the best candidate, regardless of what the mass of frightened morons do. That's my civic duty. I'm not going to cast a fraudulent vote in a ham-handed attempt to manipulate the outcome for my "party".

 

[Billiejeens]

I don't give a single fuck about what "chance" there is. It's not a bet or a horse race. I'm going to vote for the best candidate, regardless of what the mass of frightened morons do. That's my civic duty. I'm not going to cast a fraudulent vote in a ham-handed attempt to manipulate the outcome for my "party".

Then why post this -?

Providing alternatives to the SHIT that Ds and Rs foist on us doesn't spoil anything. It's the one thing might may save us.

 

[dblack]

Then why post this -?

Providing alternatives to the SHIT that Ds and Rs foist on us doesn't spoil anything. It's the one thing might may save us.

Because it's true.