.45 or 9MM?

[bill718]

Many years ago, I was a competition shooter. At my peak, placed 2nd in a local large bore pistol competition. My pistol of choice was a .45 Colt Gold Cup, and though I'm no longer a gun owner (I compete on a chessboard now) the .45 has always been my sentimental favorite.

If one loads their own .45 ammunition, a hot load .45 has more stopping power than any 9MM out there, and is at least as accurate, if not more so. Yet many still prefer the 9MM - - why?

 

[Mac-7]

No question about it - the .45 ACP

 

[1srelluc]

You might as well argue if chili should have beans or not.....But yeah, .45acp.

Just for the record....Chili without beans is just hotdog sauce.

 

[Zincwarrior]

If you are older than 90 - a .45.
If you aren't older than 90 - a 9mm.
Police departments, the FBI and militaries across the globe use 9mm. None use .45s.

 

[1srelluc]

If you are older than 90 - a .45.
If you aren't older than 90 - a 9mm.
Police departments, the FBI and militaries across the globe use 9mm. None use .45s.

The real hotness these days is 10mm.

 

[ReinyDays]

I'm no gun expert ... but a .38 is easier to handle and is more than enough for human-sized varmints ... we get a smaller sized and less aggressive black bear in these parts ... so only humans prey on humans ... and a .38 is good for both attack and defense ...

If you have brown bears about ... you need the .45 to get a head start running ... and you'll have keep shooting him because he's going to be mad ... shoot and run ... shoot and run ... and hope you reach safety before you run out of bullets ... I suggest the German Rheinmetall 120 mm L/44 so you can stay a few miles away while you're shooting ...

Go ahead and imagine me shooting a 10-guage shotgun ... pretty funny eh? ...

 

[Zincwarrior]

The real hotness these days is 10mm.

If 'these days' was 1989.

 

[1srelluc]

If 'these days' was 1989.

Yep, it's not very often a cartridge makes such a comeback.

 

[Zincwarrior]

Yep, it's not very often a cartridge makes such a comeback.

Um no. Again, no military or police entity uses 10mm in the year 2026.
They are not used in competition circles.
Does anyone even make a pistol with that caliber?

 

[1srelluc]

Um no. Again, no military or police entity uses 10mm in the year 2026.
They are not used in competition circles.
Does anyone even make a pistol with that caliber?

All the major manufacturers.....You should get out more.

Glock has made the G-20 for years. Even Rock island makes a 10mm M1911.

I've always wanted a EEA Witness 10mm.

I do own a RI 10mm M1911.

 

[Invisibleflash]

Many years ago, I was a competition shooter. At my peak, placed 2nd in a local large bore pistol competition. My pistol of choice was a .45 Colt Gold Cup, and though I'm no longer a gun owner (I compete on a chessboard now) the .45 has always been my sentimental favorite.

If one loads their own .45 ammunition, a hot load .45 has more stopping power than any 9MM out there, and is at least as accurate, if not more so. Yet many still prefer the 9MM - - why?

.45 is archaic. Low penetration. Low capacity. Move out of the stone age, bub.

Here are the final Uline catalog ammo penetration tests. Can't post them all. Too long, so cut out all rimfire and some .32. Test procedure: 12 inches of Uline catalogs were stacked and put in a cardboard box to test bullet penetration. Catalogs changed every 2 to 6 shots. Penetration measured to rear of bullet with a probe except for hi-power rifle tests.

.32 H&R Magnum Black Hills 85 grain JHP 1-7/8" barrel Ruger LCR snubnose.
Penetration:15/16"

.32 H&R Magnum Hornady FTX Critical Defense 80 grain JHP w/plastic 1-7/8" barrel Ruger LCR snubnose.
Penetration:1-1/8"

*.327 Federal Magnum

.327 Federal Magnum Underwood 95 grain Xtreme Defender solid copper 1500fps 1-7/8" barrel Ruger LCR snubnose.
Penetration:1-1/2"
Notes:Would not eject, jammed in cylinder. Gun cylinder was clean.

.327 Federal Magnum Federal Hydra-Shok 85 grain JHP w/pin 1-7/8" barrel Ruger LCR snubnose.
Penetration:1-1/4"
Notes:Ejected fine.

*.380 Auto

.380 Auto Underwood 68 grain Xtreme Defender solid copper 1300fps 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1-7/16"

.380 Auto Underwood 100 grain Hard Cast Flat Nose Black Cherry Coated 975fps 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:15/16"

.380 Auto Remington 95 grain FMJ 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:13/16"

.380 Auto Federal 90 grain Hydra-Shok JHP w/pin 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:7/8"

.380 Auto PPU 94 grain FMJ 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1"

.380 Auto S&W 84 grain JHP (blunt RN HP) 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1-1/4"
Notes: 1990's vintage - Bangor Punta era.

.380 Auto Cor Bon 90 grain 1050 fps JHP 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:15/16"
Notes: Dirty

.380 Auto Ruger ARX 56 grains composite 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1"

.380 Auto Hornady 90 grain XTP JHP 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:13/16"

.380 Auto Hornady FTX Critical Defense 90 grain JHP w/plastic 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:7/8"

.380 Auto Winchester 95 grain PDX1 Defender Bonded JHP 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1-1/8"

*.38 Special- 2-1/8 inch snubnose barrel.

.38 Special Underwood 100 grain Xtreme Defender Solid copper 1200fps 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1"

.38 Special Remington 130 grain FMJ 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"

.38 Special PPU 158 grains Lead RN 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"
Notesrivi Partizan, Serbia. Dirty load.

.38 Special Federal 130 grain FMJ 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1"

.38 Special Hornady 158 grain XTP JHP 800 fps 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"+

.38 Special Hornady 125 grain XTP JHP 900 fps 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"

.38 Special Federal Hydra-Shok JHP w/pin (Grains?) 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"

.38 Special Winchester Kinetic HE 110 grains 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:15/16"

.38 Special Hornady 110 grains FTX JHP w/plastic tip 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1-1/8"

.38 Special Hornady Pink Label 90 grains FTX Critical Defense JHP 1200 fps w/plastic tip 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"+
Penetration:13/16"
Notes:Tested 2x

.38 Special (?) grains? R-P Remington-Peters Lead HP 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4 inch.
Notesirty

*.38 Special - 4 inch barrel.

.38 Special Underwood 100 grain Xtreme Defender Solid copper 1200fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-1/8"

.38 Special 130 grain Federal FMJ 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-1/8"

.38 Special 158 grain PPU / Privi Partizan Lead RN 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:3/4"
Notesirty

.38 Special 130 grain R-P Remington Peters FMJ Flat Tip 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-3/16"

.38 Special 158 grain Magtech reloaded Lead RN 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:5/8"

.38 Special 110 grain Winchester Kinetic HE JHP 950 fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-3/8"
Penetration:1-3/8"
Notes:Tested 2x

.38 Special 150 grain Winchester Lead RN 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:7/8"

.38 Special 125 grain Hornady XTP JHP 900 fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:7/8"

.38 Special 158 grain Hornady XTP JHP 800 fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:7/8"

.38 Special 90 grain (Pink Label / Women's load) Hornady SPCL FTX w/plastic 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:7/8"
Penetration:7/8"
Notes:Tested 2x

*.38 Special +P - 4 inch barrel.

.38 Special Underwood 100 grain Xtreme Defender Solid copper 1300fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-13/16"
Penetration:1-7/8"
Notes:Tested 2x

*.357 Magnum 2-1/8: barrel

.357 Magnum Underwood 120 grain Xtreme Hunter solid copper 1700 fps 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1-7/8"
Notes:Hurt hand

.357 Hornady grains (?) Critical Defense w/plastic 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1-3/8"

.357 125 grain Winchester Elite PDX1 Defender Bonded JHP 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1-3/16"

*.357 Magnum 4" barrel

.357 Magnum Underwood Xtreme Hunter solid copper 1700 fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:2-1/4"

.357 Hornady grains (?) Critical Defense w/plastic 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-7/16"

.357 125 grain Winchester Elite PDX1 Defender Bonded JHP 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-7/16"

*9mm Luger 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS

9mm Luger 90 grains Underwood XT Defender solid copper 1400 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2-1/8"
Penetration:2"
Notes:Tested 2x

9mm Luger 68 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1700 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2-1/8"

9mm Luger 115 grains Blazer FMJ 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-3/16"

9mm Luger 135 grains Hornady Critical Duty FlexLock HP w/plastic 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:15/16"

9mm Luger 115 grains PMC Bronze FMJ 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2"
Penetration:2"
Notes:Tested 2x

9mm Luger 115 grains Kinetic HE JHP Winchester 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-13/16"

9mm Luger 124 grains Winchester FMJ Target 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-1/16"

9mm Luger 115 grains Remington R-P FMJ 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-5/8"

9mm Luger+P 115 grains Barnes TAC XPD all copper HP coated 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:15/16"

9mm Luger 100 grains Team Never Quit JAG Frangible 1300 fps HP 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-7/8"

9mm Luger 115 grains Herter's nylon jacket solid bullet aluminum case 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2"

9mm Luger 65 grains Ruger ARX copper/ polymer blend composite bullets 1620 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-13/16"

9mm Luger 115 grains Sig Sauer V-Crown JHP 1185 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-9/16"

9mm Luger Hornady Critical Defense JHP w/plastic 1620 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-3/8"

*9mm Luger +P 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS

9mm Luger 68 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1800 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2-1/2"

*9mm Luger 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC

9mm Luger 68 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1700 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-5/8"

9mm Luger 90 grains Underwood XT Defender solid copper 1400 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-1/16"

9mm Luger 115 grains Blazer FMJ 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:1-7/16"

9mm Luger 124 grains Winchester FMJ Target single packed 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:1-1/4"
Notesirty

9mm Luger 115 grains Winchester FMJ Target bulk packed 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:1-3/8"
Notesirty

9mm Luger 115 grains Remington R-P FMJ 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2"
Penetration:2-1/8"
Penetration:2-1/16"
Notes: Tested 3X / slightly dirty

9mm Luger 115 grains Sig Sauer V-Crown JHP 1185 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-1/8"

9mm Luger 100 grains Team Never Quit JAG Frangible 1300 fps grains 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-1/8

*9mm Luger +P 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC

9mm Luger +P 68 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1800 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:3-1/8"
Penetration:3-1/16"
Penetration:3-1/16"
Notes:Tested 3X

*9mm Luger +P+ 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC

9mm Luger +P+ 90 grains Underwood XT Defender solid copper 1550 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-3/8"

9mm Luger +P+ 90 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1550 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-7/8"

*.45 Auto 4.5" barrel FN FNP-45

.45 230 grains Federal FMJ 4.5" barrel FN FNP-45
Penetration:1"

.45 118 grains Ruger ARX copper/ polymer blend composite bullets 1307fps 4.5" barrel FN FNP-45
Penetration:1-1/2"

*5.7x28mm 16" barrel FN PS90

5.7x28mm 40 grains Federal American Eagle FMJ 16" barrel FN PS90
Penetration:2-7/8"

5.7x28mm 40 grains FN Hornady V-Max 16" barrel FN PS90
Penetration:1-7/8"

*.5.56mm NATO 10" barrel Sig P556 Pistol

5.56mm NATO IMI (Israel) 55 grain FMJ 10 inch barrel Sig P556 pistol
Penetration:6-1/4"
Notes:Contact shot, no flash hider. Blew up the box! Debris in a 6' circle.

5.56mm NATO IMI (Israel) 55 grain FMJ 10 inch barrel Sig P556 pistol with Gemtech suppressor.
Penetration:4-1/4"
Notes:Comparison .223 with 10" barrel Sig P556 Pistol = 4-1/16" penetration.

*.5.56mm NATO 16" barrel AR-15 Stag Arms

5.56mm NATO IMI (Israel) 55 grain FMJ 16" barrel AR-15 Stag Arms with Gemtech suppressor.
Penetration: 4-7/8"

5.56mm Lake City Green Tip M866 62 grain 16" barrel AR-15 Stag Arms with Gemtech suppressor.
Penetration: 4-7/8"

*7.62×51mm & .308 16.5 inch barrel AR-10

7.62×51mm Lake City M80 NATO 149 grain FMJ dated 2020 16.5 inch barrel AR-10
Penetration:6-1/8"
Notes:Bullet held together but was curved like a banana and heavily flattened longitudinally.

.308 Winchester Power Point 150 grain JSP 2820 FPS 16.5 inch barrel AR-10
Penetration:3-7/8"
Notes:Bullet disintegrated into a small piece of lead.

End of tests.

 

[Zincwarrior]

If you want a 10mm thats fine. But its not the new hotness any more than .41 Mag.

 

[bill718]

You might as well argue if chili should have beans or not.....But yeah, .45acp.

Just for the record....Chili without beans is just hotdog sauce.

But yeah, .45acp.


This is because you have wisdom beyond your years.

 

[Mac-7]

If you are older than 90 - a .45.
If you aren't older than 90 - a 9mm.
Police departments, the FBI and militaries across the globe use 9mm. None use .45s.

Its called Follow the Leader

Even over a cliff

 

[Zincwarrior]

Its called Follow the Leader

Even over a cliff

Think what you want, but your split times will show the error of your ways.

 

[Mac-7]

Think what you want, but your split times will show the error of your ways.

The .45 auto was abandoned under pressure from NATO for conformity even though it was the best round

 

[Stryder50]

View attachment 1215207

.45 is archaic. Low penetration. Low capacity. Move out of the stone age, bub.

Here are the final Uline catalog ammo penetration tests. Can't post them all. Too long, so cut out all rimfire and some .32. Test procedure: 12 inches of Uline catalogs were stacked and put in a cardboard box to test bullet penetration. Catalogs changed every 2 to 6 shots. Penetration measured to rear of bullet with a probe except for hi-power rifle tests.

.32 H&R Magnum Black Hills 85 grain JHP 1-7/8" barrel Ruger LCR snubnose.
Penetration:15/16"

.32 H&R Magnum Hornady FTX Critical Defense 80 grain JHP w/plastic 1-7/8" barrel Ruger LCR snubnose.
Penetration:1-1/8"

*.327 Federal Magnum

.327 Federal Magnum Underwood 95 grain Xtreme Defender solid copper 1500fps 1-7/8" barrel Ruger LCR snubnose.
Penetration:1-1/2"
Notes:Would not eject, jammed in cylinder. Gun cylinder was clean.

.327 Federal Magnum Federal Hydra-Shok 85 grain JHP w/pin 1-7/8" barrel Ruger LCR snubnose.
Penetration:1-1/4"
Notes:Ejected fine.

*.380 Auto

.380 Auto Underwood 68 grain Xtreme Defender solid copper 1300fps 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1-7/16"

.380 Auto Underwood 100 grain Hard Cast Flat Nose Black Cherry Coated 975fps 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:15/16"

.380 Auto Remington 95 grain FMJ 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:13/16"

.380 Auto Federal 90 grain Hydra-Shok JHP w/pin 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:7/8"

.380 Auto PPU 94 grain FMJ 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1"

.380 Auto S&W 84 grain JHP (blunt RN HP) 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1-1/4"
Notes: 1990's vintage - Bangor Punta era.

.380 Auto Cor Bon 90 grain 1050 fps JHP 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:15/16"
Notes: Dirty

.380 Auto Ruger ARX 56 grains composite 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1"

.380 Auto Hornady 90 grain XTP JHP 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:13/16"

.380 Auto Hornady FTX Critical Defense 90 grain JHP w/plastic 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:7/8"

.380 Auto Winchester 95 grain PDX1 Defender Bonded JHP 2-3/4" barrel S&W Bodyguard 380
Penetration:1-1/8"

*.38 Special- 2-1/8 inch snubnose barrel.

.38 Special Underwood 100 grain Xtreme Defender Solid copper 1200fps 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1"

.38 Special Remington 130 grain FMJ 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"

.38 Special PPU 158 grains Lead RN 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"
Notesrivi Partizan, Serbia. Dirty load.

.38 Special Federal 130 grain FMJ 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1"

.38 Special Hornady 158 grain XTP JHP 800 fps 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"+

.38 Special Hornady 125 grain XTP JHP 900 fps 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"

.38 Special Federal Hydra-Shok JHP w/pin (Grains?) 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"

.38 Special Winchester Kinetic HE 110 grains 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:15/16"

.38 Special Hornady 110 grains FTX JHP w/plastic tip 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1-1/8"

.38 Special Hornady Pink Label 90 grains FTX Critical Defense JHP 1200 fps w/plastic tip 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4"+
Penetration:13/16"
Notes:Tested 2x

.38 Special (?) grains? R-P Remington-Peters Lead HP 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:3/4 inch.
Notesirty

*.38 Special - 4 inch barrel.

.38 Special Underwood 100 grain Xtreme Defender Solid copper 1200fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-1/8"

.38 Special 130 grain Federal FMJ 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-1/8"

.38 Special 158 grain PPU / Privi Partizan Lead RN 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:3/4"
Notesirty

.38 Special 130 grain R-P Remington Peters FMJ Flat Tip 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-3/16"

.38 Special 158 grain Magtech reloaded Lead RN 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:5/8"

.38 Special 110 grain Winchester Kinetic HE JHP 950 fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-3/8"
Penetration:1-3/8"
Notes:Tested 2x

.38 Special 150 grain Winchester Lead RN 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:7/8"

.38 Special 125 grain Hornady XTP JHP 900 fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:7/8"

.38 Special 158 grain Hornady XTP JHP 800 fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:7/8"

.38 Special 90 grain (Pink Label / Women's load) Hornady SPCL FTX w/plastic 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:7/8"
Penetration:7/8"
Notes:Tested 2x

*.38 Special +P - 4 inch barrel.

.38 Special Underwood 100 grain Xtreme Defender Solid copper 1300fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-13/16"
Penetration:1-7/8"
Notes:Tested 2x

*.357 Magnum 2-1/8: barrel

.357 Magnum Underwood 120 grain Xtreme Hunter solid copper 1700 fps 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1-7/8"
Notes:Hurt hand

.357 Hornady grains (?) Critical Defense w/plastic 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1-3/8"

.357 125 grain Winchester Elite PDX1 Defender Bonded JHP 2-1/8" barrel S&W snubnose
Penetration:1-3/16"

*.357 Magnum 4" barrel

.357 Magnum Underwood Xtreme Hunter solid copper 1700 fps 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:2-1/4"

.357 Hornady grains (?) Critical Defense w/plastic 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-7/16"

.357 125 grain Winchester Elite PDX1 Defender Bonded JHP 4" barrel Ruger GP100
Penetration:1-7/16"

*9mm Luger 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS

9mm Luger 90 grains Underwood XT Defender solid copper 1400 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2-1/8"
Penetration:2"
Notes:Tested 2x

9mm Luger 68 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1700 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2-1/8"

9mm Luger 115 grains Blazer FMJ 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-3/16"

9mm Luger 135 grains Hornady Critical Duty FlexLock HP w/plastic 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:15/16"

9mm Luger 115 grains PMC Bronze FMJ 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2"
Penetration:2"
Notes:Tested 2x

9mm Luger 115 grains Kinetic HE JHP Winchester 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-13/16"

9mm Luger 124 grains Winchester FMJ Target 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-1/16"

9mm Luger 115 grains Remington R-P FMJ 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-5/8"

9mm Luger+P 115 grains Barnes TAC XPD all copper HP coated 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:15/16"

9mm Luger 100 grains Team Never Quit JAG Frangible 1300 fps HP 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-7/8"

9mm Luger 115 grains Herter's nylon jacket solid bullet aluminum case 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2"

9mm Luger 65 grains Ruger ARX copper/ polymer blend composite bullets 1620 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-13/16"

9mm Luger 115 grains Sig Sauer V-Crown JHP 1185 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-9/16"

9mm Luger Hornady Critical Defense JHP w/plastic 1620 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:1-3/8"

*9mm Luger +P 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS

9mm Luger 68 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1800 fps 4.9" barrel Beretta 92 FS
Penetration:2-1/2"

*9mm Luger 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC

9mm Luger 68 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1700 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-5/8"

9mm Luger 90 grains Underwood XT Defender solid copper 1400 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-1/16"

9mm Luger 115 grains Blazer FMJ 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:1-7/16"

9mm Luger 124 grains Winchester FMJ Target single packed 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:1-1/4"
Notesirty

9mm Luger 115 grains Winchester FMJ Target bulk packed 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:1-3/8"
Notesirty

9mm Luger 115 grains Remington R-P FMJ 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2"
Penetration:2-1/8"
Penetration:2-1/16"
Notes: Tested 3X / slightly dirty

9mm Luger 115 grains Sig Sauer V-Crown JHP 1185 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-1/8"

9mm Luger 100 grains Team Never Quit JAG Frangible 1300 fps grains 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-1/8

*9mm Luger +P 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC

9mm Luger +P 68 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1800 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:3-1/8"
Penetration:3-1/16"
Penetration:3-1/16"
Notes:Tested 3X

*9mm Luger +P+ 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC

9mm Luger +P+ 90 grains Underwood XT Defender solid copper 1550 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-3/8"

9mm Luger +P+ 90 grains Underwood XT Defender Platinum coated solid copper 1550 fps 16.25" barrel S&W M&P FPC
Penetration:2-7/8"

*.45 Auto 4.5" barrel FN FNP-45

.45 230 grains Federal FMJ 4.5" barrel FN FNP-45
Penetration:1"

.45 118 grains Ruger ARX copper/ polymer blend composite bullets 1307fps 4.5" barrel FN FNP-45
Penetration:1-1/2"

*5.7x28mm 16" barrel FN PS90

5.7x28mm 40 grains Federal American Eagle FMJ 16" barrel FN PS90
Penetration:2-7/8"

5.7x28mm 40 grains FN Hornady V-Max 16" barrel FN PS90
Penetration:1-7/8"

*.5.56mm NATO 10" barrel Sig P556 Pistol

5.56mm NATO IMI (Israel) 55 grain FMJ 10 inch barrel Sig P556 pistol
Penetration:6-1/4"
Notes:Contact shot, no flash hider. Blew up the box! Debris in a 6' circle.

5.56mm NATO IMI (Israel) 55 grain FMJ 10 inch barrel Sig P556 pistol with Gemtech suppressor.
Penetration:4-1/4"
Notes:Comparison .223 with 10" barrel Sig P556 Pistol = 4-1/16" penetration.

*.5.56mm NATO 16" barrel AR-15 Stag Arms

5.56mm NATO IMI (Israel) 55 grain FMJ 16" barrel AR-15 Stag Arms with Gemtech suppressor.
Penetration: 4-7/8"

5.56mm Lake City Green Tip M866 62 grain 16" barrel AR-15 Stag Arms with Gemtech suppressor.
Penetration: 4-7/8"

*7.62×51mm & .308 16.5 inch barrel AR-10

7.62×51mm Lake City M80 NATO 149 grain FMJ dated 2020 16.5 inch barrel AR-10
Penetration:6-1/8"
Notes:Bullet held together but was curved like a banana and heavily flattened longitudinally.

.308 Winchester Power Point 150 grain JSP 2820 FPS 16.5 inch barrel AR-10
Penetration:3-7/8"
Notes:Bullet disintegrated into a small piece of lead.

End of tests.

16.25" long barrel in 9mm Luger ammo. ???
That's a large pistol for concealed carry, or any carry.
More like a carbine.

 

[Stryder50]

Many years ago, I was a competition shooter. At my peak, placed 2nd in a local large bore pistol competition. My pistol of choice was a .45 Colt Gold Cup, and though I'm no longer a gun owner (I compete on a chessboard now) the .45 has always been my sentimental favorite.

If one loads their own .45 ammunition, a hot load .45 has more stopping power than any 9MM out there, and is at least as accurate, if not more so. Yet many still prefer the 9MM - - why?

A lot depends upon the situation one is planning for, expecting; along with other factors.

My usual conceal carry is a 9mm, a single stack and compact size which I can tuck inside waistband and not show much if any imprint. I expect I may need to double tap in some cases. Also usually have a spare mag or two.

My Glock, which is more a challenge for conceal carry - need a shirt/jacket/vest that covers over - I got in .40 cal. Years ago and IIRC, many LEO used such then. I'm very pleased with it on the range for accuracy, penetration, and ease of use.

I also have a .357/.38 Special which is a six shot revolver, but with a 6 1/4" barrel is a large frame and I need either a shoulder or side of leg holster. It is a joy to shoot despite size and weight of the pistol itself. This is the one I keep "under the bed" for home defense(intruder) use. First couple rounds are frangible.

 

[Captain Creeper]

I carry a 9mm because of the small frame and ease of carrying. But, if I knew I had a good chance of having to use force to defend myself, I would carry one of my .357 mag revolvers because I shoot the shit out of them and, therefore, am confident with them. However, if the comparison is just a general "9mm vs. .45 ACP", then the obvious answer is .45 ACP.

When my son was younger and we would go to the range to shoot (outdoor at my gun club), we would always have a little competition before we packed up to leave. We would usually stop at a convenience store near the range on the way there to get a couple bottles of water. Our competition was to set our two water bottles out about 10 -15 yards and see who would knock it over first. Of course, my son always won. LOL! But one day, while picking up the water bottles after shooting, I noticed a slug inside one of the bottles. We were both shooting 9mms. I thought about this. The 9mm had the power to enter the plastic bottle, but not to exit?!?!? I rationalized. It must be an aberration. Maybe the bullet hit the ground first, then entered the bottle, causing much of the energy to be discharged prior to it even entering the bottle. IDK. This happened 2-3 more times afterward when shooting a 9mm. This made me have some concern over the penetrative capabilities over standard pressure 9mm factory loads. Now I load Underwood +P in my carry piece (Sig P365).

A .45 ACP is superior because, even though it is not necessarily a deep penetrating round, and the FPS is similar to standard 9MM, the weight of the .45 ACP bullet is substantially heavier, resulting in way higher energy transfer to the target ("knockdown power"). Thus, it is a much better choice to put down a bad guy. But a .45 ACP is a real drag to carry due to weight. About the only pistol I would consider carrying in this caliber is a Glock 30. But even that was a little heavy for me. However, one of my loaded-and-ready, home defense pistols is a .45 ACP HK USP Expert. The other 2 are both Smith .357 revolvers.

 

[Hafar1014]

Many years ago, I was a competition shooter. At my peak, placed 2nd in a local large bore pistol competition. My pistol of choice was a .45 Colt Gold Cup, and though I'm no longer a gun owner (I compete on a chessboard now) the .45 has always been my sentimental favorite.

If one loads their own .45 ammunition, a hot load .45 has more stopping power than any 9MM out there, and is at least as accurate, if not more so. Yet many still prefer the 9MM - - why?

45 is to powerful to carry in a compact. I prefer 40S&W for a semi or 357 Magnum when I carry a revolver. 9 MM just doesnt have the stopping power. Watch police videos and you can see attackers shot multiple times still in the fight