10 Traits Found In Socialists

[ScreamingEagle]

Nice sentiments but sentiments nonetheless. I think you miss the point of command economies (the pure model anyway). "Government" isn't running things, we run things, that's us, society, just like we do now, except that we don't have capitalist corporations.

You just....inadvertently i'm sure.... pointed out the main difference then between Australia and the U.S....

If "You" as a society run things such as corporations....that means you run them as a group or as a collective ....whereas Amercians run things as individuals...

That's the basic difference between socialism and capitalism...

Main difference? How about you're in the northern hemisphere and we're in the south?

That's not a difference, that's just a misunderstanding. “We” in my post was a reference to society itself, not here in my country. In this country we have an economy that is mixed, like the US economy, but it's more regulated than in the US in many aspects.

Your point about running things as a group or collective and running things as individuals....what's a corporation? The “corporation” can be composed of shareholders and managers or it can be composed of stakeholders and managers. The difference between the capitalist model and the socialist model in corporate body activity is that profit is socialised and not privatised, that's all. Essentially an organisation runs the same way under capitalism as it does under socialism.

Shit mon...that's yer problem...yer upside down...

The difference between a corporate model and a socialistic model is that an individual in the corporate model can opt out if he no longer wishes to be a shareholder, or manager, or employee....

Under a socialistic government model the individual must conform to the collective....he has no individual perogative...

Like our new socialistic healthcare program....an individual no longer has the right to opt out of buying healthcare for himself...

 

[Vanquish]

You people keep using the term socialist in its absolute form with NO concession that there are hybrid models of capitalism and socialism. In fact, some forms of socialism work better when everyone within the society benefits from capitalism as much as possible as long as the capitalism is controlled somehow by a centralized planning system.

99% of the people in this thread using the term socialism have no clue what they're talking about.

 

[Diuretic]

You just....inadvertently i'm sure.... pointed out the main difference then between Australia and the U.S....

If "You" as a society run things such as corporations....that means you run them as a group or as a collective ....whereas Amercians run things as individuals...

That's the basic difference between socialism and capitalism...

Main difference? How about you're in the northern hemisphere and we're in the south?

That's not a difference, that's just a misunderstanding. “We” in my post was a reference to society itself, not here in my country. In this country we have an economy that is mixed, like the US economy, but it's more regulated than in the US in many aspects.

Your point about running things as a group or collective and running things as individuals....what's a corporation? The “corporation” can be composed of shareholders and managers or it can be composed of stakeholders and managers. The difference between the capitalist model and the socialist model in corporate body activity is that profit is socialised and not privatised, that's all. Essentially an organisation runs the same way under capitalism as it does under socialism.

Shit mon...that's yer problem...yer upside down...

The difference between a corporate model and a socialistic model is that an individual in the corporate model can opt out if he no longer wishes to be a shareholder, or manager, or employee....

Under a socialistic government model the individual must conform to the collective....he has no individual perogative...

Like our new socialistic healthcare program....an individual no longer has the right to opt out of buying healthcare for himself...

Upside down? Hang on I'll see if I can just switch positions here.....jeez blood rushed to my head, got dizzy....might need a drink....no, too early even for me and JW

I'd really not want to see an unreasonable restriction on individual liberties in a socialist society. Something similar to the Titoist model that operated in the former Yugoslavia would be a good start, although I still think it could be tidied up a bit for the 21st C. I am not in favour of the Stalinist model that was adopted by the USSR and its satellites including the GDR. I still hold that an economy must serve us, not the other way around.

 

[☭proletarian☭]

What does that have to do with not allowing for a secret ballot? We all know that when a man cannot vote in secret he is open to the vagaries of thuggery to make him conform to the borg...

So you support secret ballots, like Obama and the Socialist party?

What do you think regulations are for....? Such regulations against inhumane treatment, btw, are not opposed by decent Christians...that is why Christian ethics combined with Capitalism works so well... We don't need to change over to Socialism in order to have a decent capitalistic economic system...

Yes, we did. That's why it's been done in every modern society.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

You people keep using the term socialist in its absolute form with NO concession that there are hybrid models of capitalism and socialism. In fact, some forms of socialism work better when everyone within the society benefits from capitalism as much as possible as long as the capitalism is controlled somehow by a centralized planning system.

99% of the people in this thread using the term socialism have no clue what they're talking about.

We understand that there are hybrid models...most are....frankly, most socialistic models cannot survive without capitalism....they someone to pay the bills...

even the U.S., as i've said before, has been heading down the socialism path for years.....However....there comes a point at which i think most Americans do not wish to cross....and this healthcare legislation that has been rammed down the throats of Americans is one of them.....about 60% of all Americans opposed this legislation...they don't want the government running their healthcare...

 

[ScreamingEagle]

What does that have to do with not allowing for a secret ballot? We all know that when a man cannot vote in secret he is open to the vagaries of thuggery to make him conform to the borg...

So you support secret ballots, like Obama and the Socialist party?

What part of this did you not understand...?

Obama believes that labor unions should be allowed to organize without a secret ballot. The Socialist Party USA calls for unions to be recognized without a secret ballot. (Hear Obama's words here.)

 

[JScott]

What does that have to do with not allowing for a secret ballot? We all know that when a man cannot vote in secret he is open to the vagaries of thuggery to make him conform to the borg...

So you support secret ballots, like Obama and the Socialist party?

What part of this did you not understand...?

Obama believes that labor unions should be allowed to organize without a secret ballot. The Socialist Party USA calls for unions to be recognized without a secret ballot. (Hear Obama's words here.)

When you understand the difference between socialists and democrats, you may post again.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

So you support secret ballots, like Obama and the Socialist party?

What part of this did you not understand...?

Obama believes that labor unions should be allowed to organize without a secret ballot. The Socialist Party USA calls for unions to be recognized without a secret ballot. (Hear Obama's words here.)

When you understand the difference between socialists and democrats, you may post again.

Where BO's concerned.....why don't you enlighten us....?

 

[Vanquish]

You people keep using the term socialist in its absolute form with NO concession that there are hybrid models of capitalism and socialism. In fact, some forms of socialism work better when everyone within the society benefits from capitalism as much as possible as long as the capitalism is controlled somehow by a centralized planning system.

99% of the people in this thread using the term socialism have no clue what they're talking about.

We understand that there are hybrid models...most are....frankly, most socialistic models cannot survive without capitalism....they someone to pay the bills...

even the U.S., as i've said before, has been heading down the socialism path for years.....However....there comes a point at which i think most Americans do not wish to cross....and this healthcare legislation that has been rammed down the throats of Americans is one of them.....about 60% of all Americans opposed this legislation...they don't want the government running their healthcare...

Well at least that's some progress...admitting that the two can co-exist. The extrapolation of that is that all the claims that Obama wants to get rid of capitalism or competitive markets is bunko.

We could go round and round about the popularity of the legislation. You say 60% hated it, yet you've cited no source for that. I could cite a source that shows the when you pulled the bill apart into its elements...the majority DID like it. That means that those 60% who hated "The Bill" weren't listening to the merits...just hated Obama, the Dems, and were following the party line. You probably wont accept that, nor will I require you to for this discussion's sake.

So we're to the point where whomever can get something done with brute force is getting it done. Pericles' ) tyranny of the majority.

That's what you get when two sides are so diametrically opposed and neither will compromise.

 

[JScott]

What part of this did you not understand...?

When you understand the difference between socialists and democrats, you may post again.

Where BO's concerned.....why don't you enlighten us....?

You still dont understand there is a difference between democrats and socialists....sad.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

You people keep using the term socialist in its absolute form with NO concession that there are hybrid models of capitalism and socialism. In fact, some forms of socialism work better when everyone within the society benefits from capitalism as much as possible as long as the capitalism is controlled somehow by a centralized planning system.

99% of the people in this thread using the term socialism have no clue what they're talking about.

We understand that there are hybrid models...most are....frankly, most socialistic models cannot survive without capitalism....they someone to pay the bills...

even the U.S., as i've said before, has been heading down the socialism path for years.....However....there comes a point at which i think most Americans do not wish to cross....and this healthcare legislation that has been rammed down the throats of Americans is one of them.....about 60% of all Americans opposed this legislation...they don't want the government running their healthcare...

Well at least that's some progress...admitting that the two can co-exist. The extrapolation of that is that all the claims that Obama wants to get rid of capitalism or competitive markets is bunko.

We could go round and round about the popularity of the legislation. You say 60% hated it, yet you've cited no source for that. I could cite a source that shows the when you pulled the bill apart into its elements...the majority DID like it. That means that those 60% who hated "The Bill" weren't listening to the merits...just hated Obama, the Dems, and were following the party line. You probably wont accept that, nor will I require you to for this discussion's sake.

So we're to the point where whomever can get something done with brute force is getting it done. Pericles' ) tyranny of the majority.

That's what you get when two sides are so diametrically opposed and neither will compromise.

Here's an older CNN poll (March) which says 59% opposed the healthcare bill.
CNN Political Ticker: All politics, all the time Blog Archive - CNN poll: Americans don’t like health care bill - Blogs from CNN.com

Here's a newer CBS poll (April) that says most Americans are still against it.
Poll: Most Americans Remain Against Health Care Overhaul - Political Hotsheet - CBS News

You mean tyranny of the majority in Congress.....not the majority of the American people....who the legislators are SUPPOSED TO REPRESENT...but then socialist democrat elitists don't really care what the majority of the people think....they know better you know....

 

[ScreamingEagle]

When you understand the difference between socialists and democrats, you may post again.

Where BO's concerned.....why don't you enlighten us....?

You still dont understand there is a difference between democrats and socialists....sad.

Pretty sad you can't back up your contention....in the context of our discussion, that is...

I know the difference between old time democrats and socialist democrats....however I only asked where BO's concerned specifically.....cat got your tongue...?

 

[☭proletarian☭]

What does that have to do with not allowing for a secret ballot? We all know that when a man cannot vote in secret he is open to the vagaries of thuggery to make him conform to the borg...

So you support secret ballots, like Obama and the Socialist party?

What part of this did you not understand...?

Obama believes that labor unions should be allowed to organize without a secret ballot. The Socialist Party USA calls for unions to be recognized without a secret ballot. (Hear Obama's words here.)

It says they should be allowed to organize w/out a secret ballot- it doesn't say they can't use a secret ballot

 

[ScreamingEagle]

So you support secret ballots, like Obama and the Socialist party?

What part of this did you not understand...?

Obama believes that labor unions should be allowed to organize without a secret ballot. The Socialist Party USA calls for unions to be recognized without a secret ballot. (Hear Obama's words here.)

It says they should be allowed to organize w/out a secret ballot- it doesn't say they can't use a secret ballot

Yes....in other words.... a company can go union without a secret ballot.....meaning the unionizers can likely use thug tactics to get the employees to vote for them....

....real democratic...

...and that is what BO stands for...in its essence socialism is coercive....it uses force...

 

[☭proletarian☭]

So if they're to organize, they should be forced to hold their ballots in secret even if they were to wish otherwise?

'You were talking about coercion?

 

[ScreamingEagle]

So if they're to organize, they should be forced to hold their ballots in secret even if they were to wish otherwise?

'You were talking about coercion?

I'm talking about union organizers leaning on those who would vote against going union....thuggery....plain and simple...not to mention making it much easier for them to come into power...

You think a person should relinquish the secret ballot just because he is voting about a union...?