Why don't more companies oust their union(s)?

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by manifold, May 23, 2011.

  1. manifold
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    manifold Diamond Member

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    A lot of this union talk got me wondering what other nonsense might be bouncing around in the vacuous minds of many of our 'esteemed' colleagues here at USMB.

    Please explain why you think more companies don't oust the union(s) they are contractually beholden to when those contracts expire.

    The correct answer is simple and obvious, the value of the collective union labor force is too great to risk it. But I'd love to see what knd of utter bullshit some of you douchewagons can come up with on the subject. I dare you. :lol:
     
  2. Baruch Menachem
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    Baruch Menachem '

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    It is very very very hard to do so. I think the only way to do so is through bankruptcy.

    The Union is certified as bargaining agent once they get more than 50% of the employees at a workplace to agree to it. Employers are not allowed to promote decertification. Only employees can initiate decertification petitions, may not do it on company premises, on company time, or have any company assistance. Any assistance given by the employer is considered coercion and is a sanctioned unfair labor practice.

    The employer does not have to agree with the union on a contract. That is negotiated between the parties. However, Bad faith on the part of an employer is considered an unfair labor practice, and can be sanctioned by the NLRB.

    After the contract expires, the employer still has to deal with the union as the sanctioned representative. Sometimes in cases of difficult negotiations both sides will continue with the old contract, but the union is still the employees union and there is nothing the employer can do about it.

    What has been happening is that Union shops have been either going broke and out of business, or the companies have been moving the business out from under the union. A union shop in Ohio is represented by the local in Ohio. If the company moves the factory to Alabama, the workers and the union are left stranded in Ohio.

    Also, many states have "right to work." laws. this means you are not obliged to join the union as a condition of employment, and the union can't extract dues from non members. In states without "right to work" laws, you pay dues to the union member or not. And in some states, the unions can require membership as condition of employment.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2011
  3. manifold
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    manifold Diamond Member

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    The point is they do have recourse, and some exercise it as you have described. So either more and more will do similarly, to the point that unions become a thing of the past, or they won't. And which way it goes will be dictated by market forces. So I'm left wondering why so many people seem to want to interfere with the market sorting itself out on this one over time.
     
  4. Baruch Menachem
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    Baruch Menachem '

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    What recourse is that?
     
  5. manifold
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    manifold Diamond Member

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    I still maintain that union contracts do not run in effective perpetuity as you argue they do. And a company willing to take the risk can wind-down existing contracts if they so choose. But regardless, you already outlined other potential avenues of recourse in your first post, such as moving the business elsewhere.
     
  6. syrenn
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    syrenn BANNED

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    Ever see what happens if you just try to re negotiate the "contract"? I give you the teachers union for an example. I hope you have been watching the news.
     
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  7. Baruch Menachem
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    You build a 20 million dollar factory, fill it full of equipment, arrange all kinds of logistics, and you move the whole thing on a whim?

    Contracts are not perpetual. Representation is. Unless the membership is very fed with the union, and elect to decertify themselves, there is no recourse for the employer. The employer is not a party to the union representation of their staff.

    Decertification elections do happen. I found a goofy website that says there are several hundred of them per year. And 65% of the time the union is decertified.
     
  8. manifold
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    manifold Diamond Member

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    :lol:

    you're funny
     
  9. manifold
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    manifold Diamond Member

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    Who said anything about a whim? Certainly not me.

    I said their investment decisions will be dictated by market forces. And the first rule of investment analysis is to ignore sunk costs. I'm sure these companies have one or two senior level finance people that have taken Finance 101.
     
  10. daveman
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    Union Membership in U.S. Fell to a 70-Year Low Last Year
     

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