White Flag war crimes?

Discussion in 'Israel and Palestine' started by PatRabbit, Jan 26, 2009.

  1. PatRabbit
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    PatRabbit Rookie

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    I was horrified at the details of this case from the Gaza invasion which is being pursued as a war crime. The family involved were peaceful people who had been unmolested by the Israelis during their last invasion.

    Because of fears of being shot the parents sent their little daughters out with white flags. An Israeli soldier machine gunned the girls down. He cut two of the children in half and badly wounded another. Nothing excuses this sort of violence against innocent people.

    In addition the family home was demolished; the father believes the Israelis want to take over the area as an extended buffer zone. This is a war crime pure and simple.
     
  2. RetiredGySgt
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    RetiredGySgt Platinum Member

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    Link, documentation, evidence?

    I know less then 15 posts no link but there are ways around that.
     
  3. editec
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    editec Mr. Forgot-it-All

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    A war zone in a heavily populated ghetto.

    There isn't a military on earth that would not end up killing innocent civilians under those circumstances.

    Do I doubt that some Israeli soldiers are killing civilians on purpose?

    No.

    Do I think that killing innocent civilians is the policy of the IDF?

    Absolutely not.

    Tragic things happen in wars.
     
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  4. José
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    José Gold Member

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    LOL

    The "policy" of the IDF is the same, old policy of the American Army in the 19th century and the South African army until 20 years ago:

    Killing the natives of the land who engage in armed struggle against the racial dictatorships that confine them in ethnic corrals.
     
  5. editec
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    editec Mr. Forgot-it-All

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    I doubt that but I do not doubt it based on some idealistic notion, José.

    I doubt it because were it made known that the IDF policy encouraged the willful murder of innocent civilians, Israel would become a pariah nation.

    While I do not doubt that there are no shortage of low ranking soldiers willing to carry out those orders to target civilians, I doubt they have those orders.

    Because, while I ALSO believe that there are high ranking Israeli officials who would LIKE to murder as many Arabs as they can, I suspect that the offical policy is to eschew the murder of innocents.

    I ALSO bel;ieve that the IDF will not to make too big a deal of it, when the IDF boots on the ground don't take any risks with their soldiers which inevitably will cause the death of innocent civilians, too.

    Make sense?

    That's basically the way it played out in Viet Nam, you know?

    We didn't specifically target innocents but no big deal was made when they died, either.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2009
  6. José
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    José Gold Member

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    Totally.

    My post wasn't intended to be a rebuttal of yours, by any stretch of the imagination, just a addendum:

    The IDF does not have an official policy nor encourages the intentional killing of peaceful palestinians who stay in their designated areas (as you correctly stated), just the ones who try to "immigrate" into Israel illegaly as well as those who oppose the jewish ethnocratic state through the use of violence.
     
  7. Amanda
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    Amanda Calm as a Hindu cow

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    I'd like to see a link to the story. It doesn't make sense to me to send your kids outside with or without white flags if there's a war going on. YOU, being the parent, should be putting out the flag if YOU think that needs to be done.

    I know it's not the same as war, and I don't mean to make that kind of analogy exactly, but I can see how this could happen from my experience playing paintball. When someone is shot and they are out they leave the field with their hands up. I shoot them all the time after they are "dead" or what could be considered innocent bystanders. Not because I want to inflict pain, but because of the adrenaline and that you have to react fast or you will be "killed". I'm not excusing anyone killing children or any civilians but I can understand how it happens.
     
  8. editec
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    editec Mr. Forgot-it-All

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    Yeah, I think that's what we're looking at for the most part.

    I had to deal with a LOT of Americans GIS who upon returning to "the world" had to deal with the fact that they killed people in the heat of battle whose ghosts were plaguing them.

    These guys didn't want to kill innocents, but in heat of a firefight, killing people first and asking questions later is pretty damned understandable.

    I have absolutely no doubt that the majority of Israeli soldiers no more want to shoot innocent children than you or I would.

    And I have very little doubt that their PTSD rates are going to be high just as ours were post Viet Nam.

    Good people (and most people are fairly good people) do NOT escape the guilt that comes from reflecting, once the shooting is over, the full magnitude of what they did.

    Now unless you're not completely human, killing people -- even armed people who would have killed you! -- comes with a psychic price that you will eventually end up paying.

    I am as sympathetic to those Israeli soldiers put in the position of having to make those hard decisions as I still am to the American boys who had to make those sorts of instant decisions.

    I am very glad I decided (for purely political reasons, at the time) that I choose to be a medical corpsman rather than seeking a billet where I might have had to make such choices.
     
  9. Godboy
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    Godboy Gold Member

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    Oh, apparently you didnt read the last part of the story, on page 2. It turns out thats what was reported at first, but in the end they discovered it was a lie. What REALLY happened was the Hamas terrorists went on a rampage, killing every child on that block by decapitating them with swords. They lined 300 children up that day, on their kness, and the Hamas soldiers took turns cutting their heads off. They made the parents watch too. After it was over, they burned the parents alive in dug out pit filled with gasoline (in spite of the high cost of gas in Gaza right now), and burned their homes to the ground.

    Later, the terrorists got drunk and played soccer with the childrens heads all night long. There were also reports of drinking blood and canabalism that night. It was very horrible and tragic.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2009
  10. Godboy
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    Godboy Gold Member

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    Its fun to make up horrific war stories. I dont see why the Palestinians should be the only ones allowed to do so.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2009

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