What the TEA Parties Want...

[Samson]

That's always the issue. Its also why nothing gets done. Talking higher principles is fine, but at some point you have to move on to specific details.

Interesting.

I wonder how my employer would react, if I told him that, well, I understand you need to balance your budget, and that this year I won't get a bonus, but I have my OWN budget, and, well, I need to talk to you about the details regarding the braces that my kid needs before you decide not to give out bonuses this year.

I suppose he would react: "OH MY GOD, SAMSON, we hadn't even considered those specific details!!! Well, There's clearly no way in hell you can cut your budget!!! We'll just need to make sure you get your bonus this year!!!"

Your analogy fails because your employer's budget is made by him, without the need to consult with you.

The Federal budget is made up by, and voted on by, the very folks that would have to accept a cut in Federal Monies. Federal Monies that fund jobs, hospitals, and other popular projects back home that get them elected.

So, who do you think employs the Federal Government?

US Citizens.

Why is it that we cannot "make a budget" within which our public employees must live?

Why should I even need to explain such a simple concept?

 

[Si modo]

Of course they will. But, the bigger picture is who supports balancing the budget. You get hung up on details where the bigger picture is the point.

That's always the issue. Its also why nothing gets done. Talking higher principles is fine, but at some point you have to move on to specific details.

And, still taking the balanced budget as an example, the Tea Party provides one solution in thse principles. Now, no other solution is part of the principles. Set the actual goal and agree on that and allow for numerous avenues in achieving it.

Hell, this country isn't even united on the goal. It is silly to get specific when there isn't even unity on the goal. Kennedy said, 'get to the moon', and we did.

 

[Samson]

Of course they will. But, the bigger picture is who supports balancing the budget. You get hung up on details where the bigger picture is the point.

That's always the issue. Its also why nothing gets done. Talking higher principles is fine, but at some point you have to move on to specific details.

And, still taking the balanced budget as an example, the Tea Party provides one solution in thse principles. Now, no other solution is part of the principles. Set the actual goal and agree on that and allow for numerous avenues in achieving it.

Hell, this country isn't even united on the goal. It is silly to get specific when there isn't even unity on the goal. Kennedy said, 'get to the moon', and we did.

I think it is absolutely astonishing that asking our Government to provide services within a limited budget of the US population X US median income X 10% would even be debateable!

WTF????

300,000,000 X $40,000 X 10% isn't ENOUGH????? FOR CHRISTSAKES????

 

[rightwinger]

It would be hard. Not impossible. We used to be able to do hard. "We go to the moon, not because it is easy, but because it is hard". John Fitzgerald Kennedy.

When did we become a nation of whiners who want everything to be handed to them? We have to make hard decisions. We have to stop spending money we don't have. We really must not be mortgaging our country, and future generations, to other countries.

Ok, I'm putting a 5% per year cut in defense spending, for 10 years, on the table. You accept that, and then you can put something on the table.

Go!

I haven't looked at the defense budget but I would say 5% would be a conservative estimate on waste within it. We can cut crap out of that without doing impacting on the effectiveness or safety of our service personnel just by controlling the out of control spiraling costs etc.

The private sector see defense contracts as a cash cow. Control that, you got more than the 5%.

The TP Manifesto completely ignores the impact Defense spending has on the budget

Why don't they attack Social Security (other than the fact that the TP is comprised mainly of those 50+) Why don't they advocate raising the retirement age to 70??

Once again...the Manifesto is high on generalities and low on specific recommendations

 

[Dr.Traveler]

So, who do you think employs the Federal Government?

US Citizens.

Why is it that we cannot "make a budget" within which our public employees must live?

Why should I even need to explain such a simple concept?

Because voters like Pork. Especially when its in their district.

We rail and rant and cry about how wasteful the Federal government is, but guess who gets relected time and time and time and time and time and time again. Its the guy that brings the most Federal Money to his district.

That's why the budget doesn't get balanced, and that is the primary point that you have to educate the voters on. Do you want a balanced budget and managable public debt? Then you'll have to stop taking Federal Money for your roads, defense related jobs, education, healthcare, and parks.

Run on that at the ballot box and see what happens. I legitimately hope you win, but I know the voters well enough to assure you that you won't.

 

[rightwinger]

That's always the issue. Its also why nothing gets done. Talking higher principles is fine, but at some point you have to move on to specific details.

And, still taking the balanced budget as an example, the Tea Party provides one solution in thse principles. Now, no other solution is part of the principles. Set the actual goal and agree on that and allow for numerous avenues in achieving it.

Hell, this country isn't even united on the goal. It is silly to get specific when there isn't even unity on the goal. Kennedy said, 'get to the moon', and we did.

I think it is absolutely astonishing that asking our Government to provide services within a limited budget of the US population X US median income X 10% would even be debateable!

WTF????

300,000,000 X $40,000 X 10% isn't ENOUGH????? FOR CHRISTSAKES????

It is completely arbitrary and ignores an analysis of what services need to be provided by the Government

 

[Si modo]

And, still taking the balanced budget as an example, the Tea Party provides one solution in thse principles. Now, no other solution is part of the principles. Set the actual goal and agree on that and allow for numerous avenues in achieving it.

Hell, this country isn't even united on the goal. It is silly to get specific when there isn't even unity on the goal. Kennedy said, 'get to the moon', and we did.

I think it is absolutely astonishing that asking our Government to provide services within a limited budget of the US population X US median income X 10% would even be debateable!

WTF????

300,000,000 X $40,000 X 10% isn't ENOUGH????? FOR CHRISTSAKES????

It is completely arbitrary and ignores an analysis of what services need to be provided by the Government

Already covered with the priciple of adhering to the Constitution.

 

[Samson]

And, still taking the balanced budget as an example, the Tea Party provides one solution in thse principles. Now, no other solution is part of the principles. Set the actual goal and agree on that and allow for numerous avenues in achieving it.

Hell, this country isn't even united on the goal. It is silly to get specific when there isn't even unity on the goal. Kennedy said, 'get to the moon', and we did.

I think it is absolutely astonishing that asking our Government to provide services within a limited budget of the US population X US median income X 10% would even be debateable!

WTF????

300,000,000 X $40,000 X 10% isn't ENOUGH????? FOR CHRISTSAKES????

It is completely arbitrary and ignores an analysis of what services need to be provided by the Government

LMAO

Yes, its much better to have a bottomless pit.

 

[Si modo]

Ok, I'm putting a 5% per year cut in defense spending, for 10 years, on the table. You accept that, and then you can put something on the table.

Go!

I haven't looked at the defense budget but I would say 5% would be a conservative estimate on waste within it. We can cut crap out of that without doing impacting on the effectiveness or safety of our service personnel just by controlling the out of control spiraling costs etc.

The private sector see defense contracts as a cash cow. Control that, you got more than the 5%.

The TP Manifesto completely ignores the impact Defense spending has on the budget

Why don't they attack Social Security (other than the fact that the TP is comprised mainly of those 50+) Why don't they advocate raising the retirement age to 70??

Once again...the Manifesto is high on generalities and low on specific recommendations

As it should be. We get specific and your particular solution, a viable one, may be excluded. Or an even better one may be.

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

You're already hung up on specifics when we can't even agree on the goal. Something about horses and carts comes to mind right now.

 

[Samson]

I haven't looked at the defense budget but I would say 5% would be a conservative estimate on waste within it. We can cut crap out of that without doing impacting on the effectiveness or safety of our service personnel just by controlling the out of control spiraling costs etc.

The private sector see defense contracts as a cash cow. Control that, you got more than the 5%.

The TP Manifesto completely ignores the impact Defense spending has on the budget

Why don't they attack Social Security (other than the fact that the TP is comprised mainly of those 50+) Why don't they advocate raising the retirement age to 70??

Once again...the Manifesto is high on generalities and low on specific recommendations

As it should be. We get specific and your particular solution, a viable one, may be excluded. Or an even better one may be.

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

Your already hung up on specifics when we can't even agree on the goal. Something about horses and carts comes to mind right now.

[youtube]GWr_eSfTtIw&feature=player_embedded#![/youtube]

 

[rightwinger]

I haven't looked at the defense budget but I would say 5% would be a conservative estimate on waste within it. We can cut crap out of that without doing impacting on the effectiveness or safety of our service personnel just by controlling the out of control spiraling costs etc.

The private sector see defense contracts as a cash cow. Control that, you got more than the 5%.

The TP Manifesto completely ignores the impact Defense spending has on the budget

Why don't they attack Social Security (other than the fact that the TP is comprised mainly of those 50+) Why don't they advocate raising the retirement age to 70??

Once again...the Manifesto is high on generalities and low on specific recommendations

As it should be. We get specific and your particular solution, a viable one, may be excluded. Or an even better one may be.

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

You're already hung up on specifics when we can't even agree on the goal. Something about horses and carts comes to mind right now.

Another way of saying "We like the sound of our own voice"

 

[Samson]

The TP Manifesto completely ignores the impact Defense spending has on the budget

Why don't they attack Social Security (other than the fact that the TP is comprised mainly of those 50+) Why don't they advocate raising the retirement age to 70??

Once again...the Manifesto is high on generalities and low on specific recommendations

As it should be. We get specific and your particular solution, a viable one, may be excluded. Or an even better one may be.

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

You're already hung up on specifics when we can't even agree on the goal. Something about horses and carts comes to mind right now.

Another way of saying "We like the sound of our own voice"

Well, you're obviously listening....

 

[Si modo]

The TP Manifesto completely ignores the impact Defense spending has on the budget

Why don't they attack Social Security (other than the fact that the TP is comprised mainly of those 50+) Why don't they advocate raising the retirement age to 70??

Once again...the Manifesto is high on generalities and low on specific recommendations

As it should be. We get specific and your particular solution, a viable one, may be excluded. Or an even better one may be.

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

You're already hung up on specifics when we can't even agree on the goal. Something about horses and carts comes to mind right now.

Another way of saying "We like the sound of our own voice"

Typing phrases irrelevant to anything does not make any point. I suspect you have no point at this juncture.

 

[Dr.Traveler]

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

Agreed, but "Balance the Budget" has been a goal for going on 16 years now. At some point, we have to start talking details. Getting to the Moon required revitalizing Education (New Math!), revitalizing research, building infrastructure, etc.

 

[Si modo]

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

Agreed, but "Balance the Budget" has been a goal for going on 16 years now. At some point, we have to start talking details. Getting to the Moon required revitalizing Education (New Math!), revitalizing research, building infrastructure, etc.

Again, why would anyone start talking details when we are not agreed on the goal? I'm really wondering that.

 

[Samson]

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

Agreed, but "Balance the Budget" has been a goal for going on 16 years now. At some point, we have to start talking details. Getting to the Moon required revitalizing Education (New Math!), revitalizing research, building infrastructure, etc.

WOO HOO!

Someone else that wants to dance!

Thus the need for a large groundswell of popular support for it.



Can we dance around in circles a little more: I need the exercise?

May I dance with you Samson?

 

[rightwinger]

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

Agreed, but "Balance the Budget" has been a goal for going on 16 years now. At some point, we have to start talking details. Getting to the Moon required revitalizing Education (New Math!), revitalizing research, building infrastructure, etc.

"Get to the Moon" also included details on what needed to be done, when it needed to be accomplished and how much it was going to cost.

The TP goals of "Balance the Budget' without any details is just rhetoric that looks good on a protest sign

 

[Samson]

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

Agreed, but "Balance the Budget" has been a goal for going on 16 years now. At some point, we have to start talking details. Getting to the Moon required revitalizing Education (New Math!), revitalizing research, building infrastructure, etc.

Again, why would anyone start talking details when we are not agreed on the goal? I'm really wondering that.

Wondering?

Its because there isn't any arguement: The Budget should be balanced, and it should be based on a simple-to-understand equation using the US population and Average Income as the only variables.

How the budget is DIVIDED is a strawman designed to continue to justify the bottomless pit budget status quo.

 

[Dr.Traveler]

'Get the the moon' was a goal. If the specifics were included in that goal when it was made, we would not have achieved the goal.

Agreed, but "Balance the Budget" has been a goal for going on 16 years now. At some point, we have to start talking details. Getting to the Moon required revitalizing Education (New Math!), revitalizing research, building infrastructure, etc.

Again, why would anyone start talking details when we are not agreed on the goal? I'm really wondering that.

I'm not sure who's disagreeing on the goal here. I'd put down money that if you polled the public 85% of Americans, if not more, are in favor of the goal "Balance the Budget." They've been in favor of that for years.

Its time to talk details. Well past time in fact.

 

[Samson]

Agreed, but "Balance the Budget" has been a goal for going on 16 years now. At some point, we have to start talking details. Getting to the Moon required revitalizing Education (New Math!), revitalizing research, building infrastructure, etc.

Again, why would anyone start talking details when we are not agreed on the goal? I'm really wondering that.

I'm not sure who's disagreeing on the goal here. I'd put down money that if you polled the public 85% of Americans, if not more, are in favor of the goal "Balance the Budget." They've been in favor of that for years.

Its time to talk details. Well past time in fact.

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